The Future of Alex Cora in Boston

simplicio · Jun 8, 2023

Why would a WS-winning MLB manager go coach a college team?

scottyno · Jun 8, 2023

No one watches college baseball, so I'm sure the manager of one of the most well known franchises in sports is dying to leave for a college job. Leaving as pitching coach of a small market team to move to college isn't exactly comparable.

soxhop411 · Jun 8, 2023

RedOctober3829 said:
With the way things are going on the field, this is a fair discussion. Alex Cora is a proud UMiami alum and the head baseball coaching position just opened up. Money is no object with booster John Ruiz involved. I think it is a legitimate discussion as to whether Cora thinks long and hard about whether to make a long-term move like this.

It would be unprecedented move to leave an MLB dugout for a college one, but this is a unique situation. Recently, Wes Johnson left as Twins pitching coach to take the same job at LSU(now just took the UGA head job).

https://miamihurricanes.com/news/2023/06/08/dimare-stepping-down-as-miami-baseball-coach/

simplicio said:
Why would a WS-winning MLB manager go coach a college team?

Yup...

Also Joe Girardi turned down this job already. Its one thing for someone on the Twins (or any small market team) to do this., you don't see large market managers/ coaches do it
View: https://twitter.com/Feinsand/status/1666888267013210113

Minneapolis Millers · Jun 8, 2023

soxhop411 said:
…Its one thing for someone on the Twins (or any small market team) to do this., you don't see large market managers/ coaches do it…

Hey now, hold on there. Mid-market to you…!

Patriot_Reign · Jun 8, 2023

Hard to see him back with this awful Sox team next year though I don't think college is the escape plan.

Ale Xander · Jun 8, 2023

Why would a MLB WS winning manager put up with the recruiting part of college baseball (especially with lack of complete scholarshipping?)

scottyno · Jun 8, 2023

RedOctober3829 said:
Because it’s not just any college team. It’s his alma mater. He can make a boatload of money and have a job for life.

One that requires him to travel around recruiting teenagers all year. Do you have any inkling at all that has any desire to do that? While also taking a massive pay cut and becoming far less relevant in the sport he's been part of for decades.

Humphrey · Jun 8, 2023

Who says coaching college baseball pays anywhere near what a third base coach or a bench coach in MLB makes, never mind the manager himself?

John Marzano Olympic Hero · Jun 8, 2023

scottyno said:
One that requires him to travel around recruiting teenagers all year. Do you have any inkling at all that has any desire to do that? While also taking a massive pay cut and becoming far less relevant in the sport he's been part of for decades.

The head coach doesn’t do the majority of recruiting or scouting, that’s something that his coaches do. Does he go on trips to snag a big recruit? Yeah probably, but he’s not crisscrossing the country beating the bushes and eating rhubarb pie at some high school kid’s house every night.

Also the University of Miami name does a lot of the heavy lifting. You say you’re from UM or LSU or another big time college baseball school and kids are practically ready to give you a toe to play for them. You add the Alex Cora name to the mix and this would be the easiest job he’s ever had.

I don’t think Cora will go to Miami, but it wouldn’t surprise me if he did. He loved his time there (he talks about it with great fondness often) and it seems to me that he doesn’t love the last two years here in Boston. (But that could be me just projecting.)

AlNipper49 · Jun 8, 2023

Plus with the high school super teams out there a coach of a top college baseball team isn’t traveling to 40 of the 50 states every offseason. They’re either in FL, GA or CA. (And maybe TX, but one doesn’t come to mind)

Jimbodandy · Jun 8, 2023

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The_Powa_of_Seiji_Ozawa · Jun 8, 2023

RedOctober3829 said:
Because it’s not just any college team. It’s his alma mater. He can make a boatload of money and have a job for life.

and there's Lionel Messi

deythur · Jun 8, 2023

I think you also need to consider the rest of the league may not feel the same way about Cora's involvement in the Astros cheating fiasco. If Cora's doesn't like his current situation or feels like the brass may not be liking him too much then The U could be seen as a good option for this and all the other reasons listed above.

I don't think he goes but who knows.

8slim · Jun 8, 2023

I’m not sure money is no object. Ruiz’s business looks to be on pretty shaky ground, and I believe he’s mostly been burning his money via NIL, not on coaches. Plus Ruiz does the NIL thing for the publicity, and I’m not sure college baseball gets him that after the 24 hour news cycle of Cora being hired.

Plus, most importantly, Cora’s gonna be in the Sox dugout in 2024.

canderson · Jun 8, 2023

Humphrey said:
Who says coaching college baseball pays anywhere near what a third base coach or a bench coach in MLB makes, never mind the manager himself?

David Pierce makes a base salary of $1.2 million at Texas.

Febles appears to make $200,000 as Boston’s third base coach.

Bergs · Jun 8, 2023

I wanted Cora in the middle of Farrell's last season (and there's game thread posts to prove it, though I'll be damned if I'm gonna try to find them).

I was delighted to hire Cora back after the year "suspension."

But it ain't working.

Trying to light a spark by firing a manager is as old as time, and rarely works, but I'd have no problem doing it here.

As for Bloom...man, the farm looks good, and the only albatross contract we have is Devers, and I wouldn't be surprised to find out Henry forced that. I'd give him one more year.

DeadlySplitter · Jun 8, 2023

I don’t think Cora is the issue or much of the solution, if that makes sense.

Bergs · Jun 8, 2023

DeadlySplitter said:
I don’t think Cora is the issue or much of the solution, if that makes sense.

It makes complete sense to me.

Bob Montgomerys Helmet Hat · Jun 8, 2023

DeadlySplitter said:
I don’t think Cora is the issue or much of the solution, if that makes sense.

This pretty much sums up my feelings about just about every manager, non-Valentine division.

DisgruntledSoxFan77 · Jun 8, 2023

Bergs said:
I wanted Cora in the middle of Farrell's last season (and there's game thread posts to prove it, though I'll be damned if I'm gonna try to find them).

I was delighted to hire Cora back after the year "suspension."

But it ain't working.

Trying to light a spark by firing a manager is as old as time, and rarely works, but I'd have no problem doing it here.

As for Bloom...man, the farm looks good, and the only albatross contract we have is Devers, and I wouldn't be surprised to find out Henry forced that. I'd give him one more year.

Sale?

Ferm Sheller · Jun 8, 2023

DisgruntledSoxFan77 said:
Sale?

And, I fear, Story's, too.

DisgruntledSoxFan77 · Jun 8, 2023

Ferm Sheller said:
And, I fear, Story's, too.

Plenty of time for Story to turn it around. His injury has been addressed, we’ll know more when he starts playing again.

*God I hope he’s not an albatross…*

Ferm Sheller · Jun 8, 2023

DisgruntledSoxFan77 said:
Plenty of time for Story to turn it around. His injury has been addressed, we’ll know more when he starts playing again.

*God I hope he’s not an albatross…*

We'll see, but it's been 1.5 years since he signed and I can't even tell you what number he wears.

Sandy Leon Trotsky · Jun 9, 2023

Ferm Sheller said:
We'll see, but it's been 1.5 years since he signed and I can't even tell you what number he wears.

Story was 100% Bloom. Sale obviously was DD’s.
Devers (while not looking good now) was probably Henry’s after the media driven January 6 level insanity that overtook Sox fandom last offseason. I suspect it was a good move and the right one still but he’s really looking like a 37 year old with bad eyesight up there right now.

BravesField · Jun 9, 2023

8slim said:
Plus, most importantly, Cora’s gonna be in the Sox dugout in 2024.

I'm not so confident as you appear to be.

John Farrell was fired by Sox, so why do you think Cora won't be?

Both guys won a World Series in their first year as manager, but Farrell did it with a team that finished 5th in 2012. Cora inherited a team with first place finishes in 2016 and 2017, and then of course won in 2018. But what has he done lately?

Both guys have 5 years under their belt as the Sox manager. Farrell finished first 3 times and 5th place twice. Cora, finished first, then third, then second and is on his way to 2 fifth place finishes.

I think the Sox are a better team than what we see on the field. Frankly, I'd remove Cora today. I have zero confidence with him as a field manager.

8slim · Jun 9, 2023

BravesField said:
I'm not so confident as you appear to be.

John Farrell was fired by Sox, so why do you think Cora won't be?

Both guys won a World Series in their first year as manager, but Farrell did it with a team that finished 5th in 2012. Cora inherited a team with first place finishes in 2016 and 2017, and then of course won in 2018. But what has he done lately?

Both guys have 5 years under their belt as the Sox manager. Farrell finished first 3 times and 5th place twice. Cora, finished first, then third, then second and is on his way to 2 fifth place finishes.

I think the Sox are a better team than what we see on the field. Frankly, I'd remove Cora today. I have zero confidence with him as a field manager.

I’m ambivalent about him. But it seems that the front office loves him.

sezwho · Jun 9, 2023

8slim said:
I’m ambivalent about him. But it seems that the front office loves him.

I have zero idea how to measure, but I wonder if Cora might be a good 'get the strong team over the top' manager...but not a remedial Bad News Bears manager at this point of his career.

HangingW/ScottCooper · Jun 9, 2023

Alex Cora isn't the issue here. The front office built a starting staff around #3 starters and question marks and failed to acquire a championship caliber 2B, SS or CF. How is that on Cora?

Lose Remerswaal · Jun 9, 2023

BravesField said:
I'm not so confident as you appear to be.

John Farrell was fired by Sox, so why do you think Cora won't be?

Both guys won a World Series in their first year as manager, but Farrell did it with a team that finished 5th in 2012. Cora inherited a team with first place finishes in 2016 and 2017, and then of course won in 2018. But what has he done lately?

Both guys have 5 years under their belt as the Sox manager. Farrell finished first 3 times and 5th place twice. Cora, finished first, then third, then second and is on his way to 2 fifth place finishes.

I think the Sox are a better team than what we see on the field. Frankly, I'd remove Cora today. I have zero confidence with him as a field manager.

How come John Farrell never got another noteworthy job after the Sox let him go? And I don’t count “Scout with the Reds” as another noteworthy job.

If Cora is let go he will have another job as soon as he wants one.

canderson · Jun 9, 2023

HangingW/ScottCooper said:
Alex Cora isn't the issue here. The front office built a starting staff around #3 starters and question marks and failed to acquire a championship caliber 2B, SS or CF. How is that on Cora?

Agreed - this franchise has many, many problems and Cora isn't on that list.

That said Cora will one day be the sacrificial lamb to Chaim's failures. This team is hardly competitive and the needs far outweigh assets, so if it's not this year I'll be somewhat surprised.

8slim · Jun 9, 2023

HangingW/ScottCooper said:
Alex Cora isn't the issue here. The front office built a starting staff around #3 starters and question marks and failed to acquire a championship caliber 2B, SS or CF. How is that on Cora?

Agreed. The biggest job an MLB manager has is running the clubhouse, and Cora seems to excel there. There isn't a manager on Earth that people here won't crucify constantly for their in-game decisions.

Most MLB managers can win when provided good talent. This ain't the NFL or NBA. The Sox are clearly lacking in the talent department.

TFisNEXT · Jun 9, 2023

I'll echo that Cora isn't the problem. This team as constructed just isn't that good. They need a lot of injury luck from injury-prone veterans and need some developmental leaps from the younger guys if they want to be a playoff team and most of those are beyond Cora's control. I'm not saying Cora is perfect, but I'm not under some delusion that this team would be 38-23 with a different manager.

sezwho · Jun 9, 2023

HangingW/ScottCooper said:
Alex Cora isn't the issue here. The front office built a starting staff around #3 starters and question marks and failed to acquire a championship caliber 2B, SS or CF. How is that on Cora?

At least from where I sit, its not on him. I'm thinking more from his perspective in that yes, there are a very limited number of jobs, but I just don't know how much Cora fits here if there's not a winning opportunity. Maybe '24 looks different, that's what we're all (ok, not you Yankee fans : ) hoping for.

Yankeessuck4ever · Jun 9, 2023

Bergs said:
It makes complete sense to me.

Makes sense to me too. He can not manage a pitching staff, period.

Bob Montgomerys Helmet Hat · Jun 9, 2023

Lose Remerswaal said:
How come John Farrell never got another noteworthy job after the Sox let him go? And I don’t count “Scout with the Reds” as another noteworthy job.

If Cora is let go he will have another job as soon as he wants one.

It's all speculation including your statement that Cora will get another job as soon as he wants one. He interviewed for plenty before he got his first.

But my speculation has always been that Farrell is an old school hard-ass that is out of vogue in today's MLB. Like Joe Girardi.
Players want "player's managers" so teams hire "player's managers." That's been Dusty Baker's reputation since the day he started managing, and no doubt is part of the reason why he's kept getting jobs into his 70's, despite a bad reputation for adjusting in the post-season.

TFisNEXT · Jun 9, 2023

Bob Montgomerys Helmet Hat said:
It's all speculation including your statement that Cora will get another job as soon as he wants one. He interviewed for plenty before he got his first.

But my speculation has always been that Farrell is an old school hard-ass that is out of vogue in today's MLB. Like Joe Girardi.
Players want "player's managers" so teams hire "player's managers." That's been Dusty Baker's reputation since the day he started managing, and no doubt is part of the reason why he's kept getting jobs into his 70's, despite a bad reputation for adjusting in the post-season.

A little off topic, but I will forever be grateful to John Farrell for giving us this instant SOSH classic.....

John Marzano Olympic Hero · Jun 9, 2023

canderson said:
That said Cora will one day be the sacrificial lamb to Chaim's failures. This team is hardly competitive and the needs far outweigh assets, so if it's not this year I'll be somewhat surprised.

This is exactly right. I have a feeling that if the team continues to sputter and flat line, again, Bloom is going to scapegoat it all on Cora. And I'm pretty sure that Cora knows this too. I have no idea whether John Henry will take Bloom or Cora's side, so I guess it all depends how he's feeling that particular day.

E5 Yaz · Jun 9, 2023

John Marzano Olympic Hero said:
This is exactly right. I have a feeling that if the team continues to sputter and flat line, again, Bloom is going to scapegoat it all on Cora. And I'm pretty sure that Cora knows this too. I have no idea whether John Henry will take Bloom or Cora's side, so I guess it all depends how he's feeling that particular day.

I agree with this; isn't it rare for the GM to go before the manager? That said, the Verdugo stuff this week and the handling of the Pivetta/Kluber moves to the bullpen seem to indicate there's stuff going on behind the scenes than has leaked out

canderson · Jun 9, 2023

E5 Yaz said:
I agree with this; isn't it rare for the GM to go before the manager? That said, the Verdugo stuff this week and the handling of the Pivetta/Kluber moves to the bullpen seem to indicate there's stuff going on behind the scenes than has leaked out

Sorry I have paid no attention to this team except the scores the past week and half. What Verdugo stuff?

Mueller's Twin Grannies · Jun 9, 2023

canderson said:
Sorry I have paid no attention to this team except the scores the past week and half. What Verdugo stuff?

He didn't run hard on on a play where he was out at 2B, so Cora benched him last night

LogansDad · Jun 9, 2023

canderson said:
Sorry I have paid no attention to this team except the scores the past week and half. What Verdugo stuff?

He got benched yesterday for not running hard to second on a ground ball that he got thrown out on. It was a weird play, and he was definitely in the wrong on it, but I don't think it deserved a benching or public shaming(he scrambled when he realized the play was coming his way, the ball was behind him with 2 outs, so I think he thought the play was going to go to first).

DisgruntledSoxFan77 · Jun 9, 2023

Ferm Sheller said:
We'll see, but it's been 1.5 years since he signed and I can't even tell you what number he wears.

Good god I can’t either.

canderson · Jun 9, 2023

Mueller's Twin Grannies said:
He didn't run hard on on a play where he was out at 2B, so Cora benched him last night

LogansDad said:
He got benched yesterday for not running hard to second on a ground ball that he got thrown out on. It was a weird play, and he was definitely in the wrong on it, but I don't think it deserved a benching or public shaming(he scrambled when he realized the play was coming his way, the ball was behind him with 2 outs, so I think he thought the play was going to go to first).

Thank you both. I'll go find the replay - public shaming can be good sometimes but yea sometimes isn't net positive.

Bob Montgomerys Helmet Hat · Jun 9, 2023

Just for some closure, Story wears number 10

E5 Yaz · Jun 9, 2023

canderson said:
Thank you both. I'll go find the replay - public shaming can be good sometimes but yea sometimes isn't net positive.

In addition, Cora pulled him from the game where the played happened -- between innings, so not Jackson-Martin like, but his spot in the order did come up again

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