The Ultimate Fighting Championship (MMA) Thread

Talon

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Well Dana claims that they legally owe Mark Hunt fights because of the PRIDE situation.

ANYWAYS

UFC 121 looks like it may be the card of the year

Brock vs Cain
Jake Shields vs Martin Kampmann

Forrest and Tito are both rumored to be on the card, Forrest/Tito 3 anybody?
 

rembrat

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I doubt it. UFC 116 is the clear cut card of the year so far.

Carwin comes with in a few punches of finishing Brock. Brock comes back to win via arm triangle.
Akiyama and Leben just trade blows standing up. I'm talking straight up zombie mode fighting and then Leben snaps on a triangle with seconds left in the final round.
Lytle displays some serious groundwork and transitioning in his submission win over Brown.
Bonnar getting absolutely destroyed comes back to win via TKO.
Sot just outclasses a very game Pellegrino.

Even the Pre-lims were sick.
Seth comes out throwing everything but the kitchen sink at Romero until he is armbarred.
And Schaub comes out and does what he does, knock dudes out in a few minutes.
Oh, and who could forget that crazy slam by Harris to knock out Branch.

Brock vs Cain is going to be specatuclar and I think Kampmann destroys Shields even with Sheilds trying to dry hump his way to another decision. Kampmann's grappling is underrated. And Forrest/Tito III? Ehh. No interest in seeing two pillow-fisted 205ers go at it for the 3rd time. I'd rather see Hamill vs Tito and Forrest vs Jason Brilz or Cyrille Diabate.
 

Myt1

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I don't think I'm exaggerating when I say that UFC 116 was probably the fight night of the decade.
 

rembrat

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Time to stop babying Jon Jones, get him in there against Forrest, Machida, Rampage, Bader or Lil Nog.
 

Curtis_Lesspanic

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Time to stop babying Jon Jones, get him in there against Forrest, Machida, Rampage, Bader or Lil Nog.
I am glad I am not the only one that thought Jones vs. Matyushenko was a squash match better suited on a saturday morning wrestling card.

Jones is legit. I wish he would fight Evans so I could relish the screams of his oh so annoying wife as he elbowed him back to Machidaville. But in the mean time he should simply be fed the best the UFC can offer him. Thiago Silva will miss his scheduled fight with Tim Boesch this Saturday. Why not put these two in the cage and enjoy about 2:30 of over the top violence?
 

rembrat

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That would be another easy win for Jones. His ground game appears to be legit and Silva lacks one. But yea, Dana said he is now top 8 in the world at 205 and "after the dust settles" he'll be matching up with one of these guys.
 

Curtis_Lesspanic

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OK folks, UFC 117. Who do you got?
* Middleweight Championship bout: Anderson Silva vs. Chael Sonnen
* Welterweight bout: Jon Fitch vs. Thiago Alves
* Lightweight bout: Clay Guida vs. Rafael dos Anjos
* Welterweight bout: Matt Hughes vs. Ricardo Almeida
* Heavyweight bout: Roy Nelson vs. Junior dos Santos
* Welterweight bout: Dustin Hazelett vs. Rick Story
* Light Heavyweight bout: Phil Davis vs. Rodney Wallace
* Light Heavyweight bout: Tim Boetsch vs. Todd Brown
* Welterweight bout: Johny Hendricks vs. Charlie Brenneman
* Heavyweight bout: Stefan Struve vs. Christian Morecraft
* Welterweight bout: Ben Saunders vs. Dennis Hallman

I think Silva defends Lance Armstrong's Honor admirably and absolutely crushes Sonnen. At this point I got to believe that Dana is paying the Sonnen-bot to keep his yap running in an attempt to anger Silva into a murderous rage.

I like Alves' freakish athleticism and explosiveness over Fitch. I hope this bout doesn't devolve into Fitch simply trying to hold down Alves for 3 rounds but that is my overwhelming suspicion.

I have to go with Guida over dos Anjos. If dos Anjos couldn't prevent Jeremy Stevens from turning him into a human bobblehead with the most telegraphed uppercut since Mortal Kombat, Guida is going to run roughshod.

I like Matt Hughes over Ricardo Almeida and I really would have liked this bout if it happened 5 years ago.

In my opinion the Dos Santos/Nelson fight isn't even close based on what we have seen from these two guys so far. Nelson will be game but Dos Santos has looked like one of the best heavyweights in the Division recently. I see another highlight reel KO for Junior.

I also like Hazlett, Davis, Boetsch, Hendricks, Struve and I really like Ben Saunders.

edited because me sucks at engrish.
 

rembrat

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Excellent.

Silva vs Sonnen, I'm actually rooting for Sonnen. I want to see what happens when Silva has a wrestler of Sonnen's caliber on top of him, he might sub him, but I want to see a fight. I don't want to see Anderson standing up pulling his shit. Sonnen is being totally overlooked by everyone. If he can get his hands on Anderson he is taking him down. Sonnen made Okami look like a child and Okami's TDD is incredible. Mark Munoz this past Sunday could not get Okami down to the mat and he is considered to be a top flight wrestler. FWIW, Mark Munoz is the guy that got Anderson ready for this fight, wrestling wise.

Silva might win, but I think he is going to have to earn this one, and I think he gets taken down at least 3 times in startling fashion.

I got Nelson over Dos Santos because I believe in Nelson's ground game.
I got Fitch over Alves because I believe in Fitch's wrestling and control game. Plus, there is talk that Alves is having trouble cutting weight and he might actually not make weight. This remind anyone of anything?
Guida and Dos Anos is a toss up in my opinion but I'll side with Guida since he is such a hard worker.
And I got Hughes over Almeida.

Weigh ins are at 7 PM.
 

rembrat

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I just realized I have USA over Brazil in all 5 bouts. :buddy:

EDIT: This GIF is at the press conference that took place yesterday.



Sonnen, officially in Silva's head. Or, Silva, officially pissed off.
 

Curtis_Lesspanic

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How funny is that clip. Could the Sonnen-bot look like any more android-esque?

And I think Silva is pissed. You combine all the crap he took for acting goofy in the last two rounds of the Maia fight with all the monotone junk Sonnen has ejected and you have a very agitated P4P best fighter.

I'm sorry but unless Sonnen has been working on his flying heel hook with Ryo Chonan I am going with Silva.
 

rembrat

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The last time Anderson used his guard was against Henderson, right? That's roughly over 2 years ago. Anyways, great main event. I can't wait.
 

mikeford

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Anderson Silva is so entertaining to me by being an asshole. I hope he rips Sonnen's head off and uses it as a breakdancing prop.
 

rembrat

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Yup. Alves over by half a pound.

EDIT: Second attempt and Alves is still at 171.5. What a joke. So unprofessional. He'll forfeit 20% of his purse. They really need to increase that to about 50%.
 

kelpapa

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Unreal. Injury or not, I can't believe Silva pulled that off. At the beginning of every round, it seemed like Silva was pissed and going to pick Sonnen apart. Chael put him on his ass every time. There has to be a rematch soon.
 

Commander Shears

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Unreal. Injury or not, I can't believe Silva pulled that off. At the beginning of every round, it seemed like Silva was pissed and going to pick Sonnen apart. Chael put him on his ass every time. There has to be a rematch soon.
Have you not seen Sonnen before? This was Chael Sonnen 101, as Goldie would say. The guy has never learned submission defense and this was Sonnen/Filho Redux as a result - complete with brief denial of his tap.
 

Commander Shears

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So...rematch -- or no?
Hell ya. He's still a nightmare match-up for Silva, he just needs to learn how to pay attention when he's running out the clock.

EDIT: Can you imagine St-Pierre's face while he watched this fight? He must be on his way to 185 as we type.
 

MikeM

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Unreal. Injury or not, I can't believe Silva pulled that off. At the beginning of every round, it seemed like Silva was pissed and going to pick Sonnen apart. Chael put him on his ass every time. There has to be a rematch soon.
Unreal is right. That freaking close to your Buster Douglass moment, and gets caught in a triangle. Sonnen put up a good front afterwards, but that's gotta be devastating.

Finch looked good.

Pissed i missed the Hughes fight, even if his time has past.
 

Infield Infidel

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Sonnen was so strange, he'd get top position so easily, but outside of the occasional standing-drop bomb, he was mainly landing ticky-tack punches and elbows and looking busy, and hardly attempting any subs, while defending against a bunch of attempted kimoras and arm bars. Silva only looked hurt for that one punch in the first.

He had no clue that triangle was coming. Even after Silva started to apply it, Sonnen had a chance to defend it because Silva didn't have it totally tight, and Sonnen did nothing. Then Silva clamped it. I hand it to him for battling, but Sonnen would have had a better chance surviving that last round standing up, or at least going for Silva's back.
 

MikeM

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So...rematch -- or no?
Of course, although i'd expect things to go a lot differently. I actually watched that first round tonight somewhat with the feeling that Anderson was holding back and playing a little possum, over-confident in his ability to simply come out the second round and dictate the rest of the fight. Almost like he was trying to take a page out of Brock's last fight in some twisted attempt to score some points with his fans/critics. Which just went on to be a perfect storm kinda night night for Sonnen. No way we see a repeat imo.

Silva playing the bitch card after the fight was weak though.
 

kelpapa

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I thought he did a pretty good job defending submissions. Silva had several sprints of 30-45 seconds which had Chael defending against a variety of potential submissions. For the most part Chael kept both soldiers inside Silva's guard, and IIRC he used his position to pass when he did slip one of his shoulder's out. Yes, after 22 minutes of fighting, Sonnen got caught in a triangle that he should have seen coming and could have postured out of. However, he did try to defend against it, but he left his arm vulnerable when he threw his legs over Silva, a black belt in jiu jitsu. To say he has never learned submission defense is a bit unfair IMO.

In the press conference after the fight, Dana said he was unsure whether a rematch with Chael or a fight with Vitor is next for Silva.
 

Commander Shears

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To say he has never learned submission defense is a bit unfair IMO.
It isn't about defending most submission attempts, it's about maintaining focus and avoiding unnecessarily dangerous positions - and he continues to fail on both of those fronts. Twice now, he's dominated an unbeatable champ, been in a position where he is just running out the clock and he's left himself vulnerable to the only weapon his opponent had. (With Filho it was at 4:55 of the second, after which he briefly denied tapping - Sound familiar?)

Sonnen now has eight submission losses in eight years because he's crippled by the same mental lapses that were costing him fights in 2003. Since he lacks finishing power (last finish was Kyacey Uscola) and spends almost the entirety of his fights in the guard, there is no excuse for him to still have a fatal weakness of technique and focus. At some point it becomes about him and not his opponent.
 

rembrat

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This is getting ridiculous. Anderson fanboys are saying that Anderson allowed himself to get beat up for 4 rounds before deciding it was time to finish it. I do not buy that for one fucking second. This is like when Hardy didn't tape to GSP's kimura and armbar attempts and people said GSP didn't want to break his arm in the holds so he let go.

EDIT: Also, major props to Hughes and Fitch. If Sonnen had sealed the deal it would have been a dominating night for good old fashion 'rassling. Oh and Guida too.
 

MikeM

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This is getting ridiculous. Anderson fanboys are saying that Anderson allowed himself to get beat up for 4 rounds before deciding it was time to finish it. I do not buy that for one fucking second. This is like when Hardy didn't tape to GSP's kimura and armbar attempts and people said GSP didn't want to break his arm in the holds so he let go.

EDIT: Also, major props to Hughes and Fitch. If Sonnen had sealed the deal it would have been a dominating night for good old fashion 'rassling.
I don't think Silva has many fanboys left, at least those regularly follow the sport, after his last few fights. He just has that "can't wait to see this guy get his ass kicked" aura surrounding him now imo, which no doubt happened most of that fight too. That said, i still say that first round seemed pretty shady though, especially towards the end. Half the bar where i watched it (who were all rooting Sonnen) was in an uproar at the end of that 1st, screaming that he was throwing the fight just to fuck them all over on a whole new level lol.

Still pissed i missed Hughes. Trying to find a clip of it now.
 

rembrat

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Yea, throwing the fight or making it appear as if Sonnen is incredible just to come back and win is a bit much. Like, no one is that big of a troll.

Go here, dude, www.mma-core.com

All the fights form last night are up, get'em before they are taken down.
 

MikeM

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Thanks man. Forgot the Dos Santos/Nelson fight was on that card too, so happy i got to catch that as well. Dos Santos's stand up looked sharp, but still pretty skeptical on his ability to hang with Brock/Cain in the upcoming fight.

Bet Liddell would trade his soul for Big Country's fatass chin right about now :lol:
 

Curtis_Lesspanic

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Well we certainly got our money's worth Saturday!

I don't know if it was just me but I couldn't help but think that the Nelson fight was real life equivalent of the Simpsons episode where Homer used his extra dense skull to exhaust his opponents as they tee'd off on him to no effect.
If only Nelson had the energy of a Hobo.

Dos Santos looked good, but not great. He's going to have to be great to hang with Brock or Cain or Carwin. And we still haven't seen this guys ground game. But in his defense, he was trying to KO a cinder block, If he connects with that type of onslaught against anyone else this side of Cabbage, they are stopping the fight.

I knew Hughes has something left. I think he can be a good fighter for a long time if he wants to. Like a 170lb Randy Couture. But saying he was going to take the next 6 months off isn't going to help him maintain his skill set in the most cut throat division in the UFC.

Guida looked like Guida. Imagine if that guy took speed? Unfortunately, moving like he's in one of those Benny Hill fast forward montages isn't going to make him a contender anytime soon.

I really don't like watching John Fitch fight. He's boring. really really boring. Great fighter but really dull. And Alves needs to give up cutting 30lbs and go up to 185. He looked listless and spent in that fight.

The title fight was awesome. Give the Sonnen-bot some credit. before he shorted out in the 5th, he was doing exactly what he said he would and he even labeled Anderson on his feet. I know his tap was almost Paulo Filho I redux but he was caught and he knew it. I was kind of surprised that he didn't see it coming. If I am a wrestler and I am in the guard of a competent BJJ practitioner and I feel one of his legs slip over my shoulder I a thinking triangle right away. Sonnen's CPU was a little slow processing that data.

Say what ever you want about Silva but he's still the best pound for pound fighter on the planet. To take the amount of punishment he did and still pull out a win was amazing. As soon as this fight started I began to remember how much trouble the immortal Travis Lutter gave him in the first round of their canceled title fight. Hopefully, this is the fight that re-ignites his fires and they disinterested Anderson will be a thing of the past.
 

rembrat

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I kinda of disagree with a few of your comments. I've actually grown to appreciate the wrestling aspect of MMA. What Jon Fitch does is impressive and it's on his opponent to stop it from happening. Thiago knew what he was going to get into and didn't work hard enough on his TDD, plus the cut had to drain him. And there is no moving up to 185 for him because of his height and his reach, he wouldn't make it with the 185lbers who are monsters. He is a great talent who has to reevaluate his lifestyle. Either get on a diet or substitute lifting for size for lifting for strength and muscle endurance.

And I love how Matt Hughes made a point to say he won with a good wrestling move, again. Gracie BJJ dudes must hate that guy.
 

Curtis_Lesspanic

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I'm not saying what Fitch does isn't impressive. He's a great fighter. I just wish he could try ending a fight once in a while. He hasn't stopped anyone in almost three years. I think it's a fair criticism given his obvious skill level. Don't get me wrong, he's not at Koscheck levels yet. BTW how great would it be to see Kos forced to face Fitch and get out snuggied for 3 rounds?

Alves is moving up. Dana says he needs to and I agree with him. Alves can't make this weight consistently and as he gets older it will get harder and harder. So he either needs to move up or lose some mass.

And Hughes loves to talk junk. Loves it. And this just gives him more material. I say get Hughes and Serra back in there again. Just the build up would be priceless.
 

kelpapa

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And Hughes loves to talk junk. Loves it. And this just gives him more material. I say get Hughes and Serra back in there again. Just the build up would be priceless.

I haven't heard any talk from either guy since, but they seemed to squash their feud after their last fight. I doubt the build up would be the same. I would also be surprised if Hughes took that fight. He has nothing to gain from it, and I don't think he has the desire to kick Serra's ass anymore.
 

Myt1

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I thought he did a pretty good job defending submissions. Silva had several sprints of 30-45 seconds which had Chael defending against a variety of potential submissions. For the most part Chael kept both soldiers inside Silva's guard, and IIRC he used his position to pass when he did slip one of his shoulder's out. Yes, after 22 minutes of fighting, Sonnen got caught in a triangle that he should have seen coming and could have postured out of. However, he did try to defend against it, but he left his arm vulnerable when he threw his legs over Silva, a black belt in jiu jitsu. To say he has never learned submission defense is a bit unfair IMO.

In the press conference after the fight, Dana said he was unsure whether a rematch with Chael or a fight with Vitor is next for Silva.
I think Chael absolutely deserves a rematch there. When you push an undefeated champ to the brink like that, you get another shot.
 

Awesome Fossum

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Say what ever you want about Silva but he's still the best pound for pound fighter on the planet.
I disagree, I don't think you can get get dominated for 22 minutes and still call yourself the best pound for pound fighter on the planet. He's definitely the champion and still the man to beat in his division, but the best in the business doesn't lose four straight rounds. For better or worse, I think that title now belongs to Georges St. Pierre.

Of course, if the injury Silva alluded to was legitimate, I guess that changes everything.
 

rembrat

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Not only that but Chael had 2 rounds scored 10-8 in his favor. That's never happened to Silva.



Honestly, they should just rematch Sonnen and Okami to figure out Number #1 contender while Silva destroys Vitor in a few months.
 

Curtis_Lesspanic

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Did Silva look human against Sonnen? Yup. Did he still find a way to beat him? Yup.

To me, Anderson Silva has been and still is a better fighter than GSP. Personally, GSP getting starched by Serra will always mar his resume in the same way as Fedor losing to Werdum. These are guys that P4P best fighters shouldn't lose to.

Sonnen is clearly a top level fighter at 185 and the strategic antidote to Silva's style and Silva still managed to beat him.

To me, Silva is still on top, Penn, Fedor & GSP are behind Silva until he loses. Aldo and Lesnar have to do it a little longer to enter the conversation.
 

kelpapa

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It isn't about defending most submission attempts, it's about maintaining focus and avoiding unnecessarily dangerous positions - and he continues to fail on both of those fronts. Twice now, he's dominated an unbeatable champ, been in a position where he is just running out the clock and he's left himself vulnerable to the only weapon his opponent had. (With Filho it was at 4:55 of the second, after which he briefly denied tapping - Sound familiar?)

Sonnen now has eight submission losses in eight years because he's crippled by the same mental lapses that were costing him fights in 2003. Since he lacks finishing power (last finish was Kyacey Uscola) and spends almost the entirety of his fights in the guard, there is no excuse for him to still have a fatal weakness of technique and focus. At some point it becomes about him and not his opponent.
Yes, there are amazing similarities between both fights. I thought you were attacking just his technique as opposed to his focus. My point was that he did a great job defending until the fifth round when, admittedly, he should have seen the triangle coming. The Filho fight, however, was almost three years ago, and he has fought seven times since then. He has avenged his loss to Filho, and beaten Dan Miller, and Nate Marquardt - both talented fighters with heavy jiu jitsu backgrounds. All three fights went the distance with Sonnen winning via decision, something he was two minutes away from against Silva. IMO calling it a fatal weakness is a bit extreme. Is it a weakness? Sure. Will he have to improve that aspect of his fighting to become a champion? Maybe. If he has a rematch against Silva and he wins I wouldn't be surprised, now. (I am one of the people that thought he had no shot against Silva in this fight.)

Overall, I understand your point, I just think you're being a little too critical of him. The two guys you mentioned are black belts. Throw in Demian Maia, Jeremy Horn (twice), Forrest Griffin, and Bobalu, and you can see seven of the eight guys who have submitted him are pretty talented on the ground. He's also beaten some talented black belts (Granted they are no Maia.). I would wait until/if he gets his rematch with Silva before I agree with you, though. If the same thing happens, then I will agree with you.
 

rembrat

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To me, Anderson Silva has been and still is a better fighter than GSP. Personally, GSP getting starched by Serra will always mar his resume in the same way as Fedor losing to Werdum. These are guys that P4P best fighters shouldn't lose to.

Sonnen is clearly a top level fighter at 185 and the strategic antidote to Silva's style and Silva still managed to beat him.

To me, Silva is still on top, Penn, Fedor & GSP are behind Silva until he loses. Aldo and Lesnar have to do it a little longer to enter the conversation.
Meh. Let's be a little realistic here, Serra connecting with one of the luckiest and well placed punches in the history of MMA shouldn't be a knock against GSP. GSP beat Penn twice for chrissake, another dude who is always in consideration for P4P best fighter. Plus, the GSP of 2010 would rape the GSP of 2007.

I have to pull a switcheroo here and declare GSP P4P the best. Especially after seeing how easily a high caliber wrestler can control Silva.
 

Curtis_Lesspanic

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Meh. Let's be a little realistic here, Serra connecting with one of the luckiest and well placed punches in the history of MMA shouldn't be a knock against GSP. GSP beat Penn twice for chrissake, another dude who is always in consideration for P4P best fighter. Plus, the GSP of 2010 would rape the GSP of 2007.

I have to pull a switcheroo here and declare GSP P4P the best. Especially after seeing how easily a high caliber wrestler can control Silva.
I know everyone points to the two wins over Penn as evidence of his greatness but has GSP ever beaten a former champ in a weight division higher than his own? Because that's what Silva did against Forrest in spectacular fashion.

And yeah Serra was fortunate to clip GSP the way he did. It still doesn't change the fact that an 11-1 underdog who won his title shot on a reality show for midlevel talent rolled him decisively.
Sonnen caught Silva all night long. Silva weathered the storm and won the fight.
 

Talon

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Nog injured himself and is out vs Mir for the Main Event of UFC 119

Cro Cop is in.

That sound was me marking out.
 

Commander Shears

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To me, Anderson Silva has been and still is a better fighter than GSP. Personally, GSP getting starched by Serra will always mar his resume in the same way as Fedor losing to Werdum. These are guys that P4P best fighters shouldn't lose to.

Sonnen is clearly a top level fighter at 185 and the strategic antidote to Silva's style and Silva still managed to beat him.

To me, Silva is still on top, Penn, Fedor & GSP are behind Silva until he loses. Aldo and Lesnar have to do it a little longer to enter the conversation.
Ryo Chonan.

I take it the exact opposite way. Silva was dominated - powerless to stop something for 22 minutes against someone who, fortunately for Silva, has zero finishing power or submissions. His loss to Chonan, however, was like the Fedor and GSP fights you mentioned. Brief slip-ups that cost them and highlighted just how easy it is to lose an MMA fight. (The lack of killer instinct he showed in the first Hughes fight hurts GSP far more, in my opinion, even though it was against a much stronger opponent.)

Side note: Not only does Sonnen have major focus issues on top, but look at how poorly he defends himself against striking from there. He spent the entire Silva and Marquardt fights in dominant positions, yet he looked like absolute hell after each of them. His opponents? They looked relatively fine. You can't base your entire fighting style around getting on top of someone and never learn to inflict damage, protect yourself, and avoid submissions against people whose only weapon is a submission. It's the ONLY THING HE NEEDS TO WORRY ABOUT. That he still forgets to do so is an embarrassment. He's like the pre-04 Red Sox with these screw-ups.

Am I the only one who finds it annoying as hell that GSP's wins over Penn count in P4P discussions? The whole freaking point of the 'pound for pound' concept is to compare different sized fighters at their ideal weight. Penn goes up in weight by getting fat, sacrificing speed and endurance - so going up and losing to an optimal weight, gigantic GSP really doesn't prove anything to me other than GSP is a 170, Penn is a 155. I'm not saying he isn't better, but I just don't see how those fights prove anything.
 

rembrat

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Cro Cops leg vs Mir's big dumb head

Can't wait
I can't decide on this fight. Mir will be fighting back at his old weight so he'll be a bit quicker than he was against Carwin, which bodes well for him in standing up with Cro Cop. I want to say Cro Cop because of his last performance against Pat Barry but I'm hesitant because a less star struck Pat Barry would have finished Cro Cop in the 1st round after dropping him, instead he allowed Cro Cop back to his feet both times.

Help?

EDIT: Speaking of upcoming fights, Jon Jones is set to square off against Forrest Griffin at UFC 123. Finally.
 

mikeford

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Cro Cop hasn't looked like Crop Cop in like 3 years so it wouldn't surprise me if Mir takes him down and submits him.

But it won't surprise me either if Cro Cop baits him into getting his head kicked into the 19th row.
 

Mr Weebles

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WEC has a live event on Versus tonight.

Dominick Cruz Vs. Joseph Benavidez is the main event.
 

rembrat

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Too bad Urijah Faber had to pull out due to an injury. I'm Looking forward to Roller vs Pettis.