The Ultimate Fighting Championship (MMA) Thread
- Thread starter raychild
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Velasquez was 20 pounds lighter at weigh-ins. That's not too bad a size difference. I wonder how he'll be abel to handle all that extra weight come fight time, though. Hopefully it doesn't slow him down too much.
The longer the fight goes, the better chance Cain has. He has phenomenal cardio. I think if he can stay out of danger in the first two rounds, he'll be able to outlast Lesnar, but my guess is Brock finishes him by brutality in the second. No way the fight goes the distance. If it makes it to the fifth round, Velasquez will finish it.
Atdhe usually posts a feed by fight time. Same for channelsurfing.
The longer the fight goes, the better chance Cain has. He has phenomenal cardio. I think if he can stay out of danger in the first two rounds, he'll be able to outlast Lesnar, but my guess is Brock finishes him by brutality in the second. No way the fight goes the distance. If it makes it to the fifth round, Velasquez will finish it.
Atdhe usually posts a feed by fight time. Same for channelsurfing.
IDK, I just don't see Cain being the same gas-outed fish on his back Shane Carwin was if/when Brock takes him down. I mean for all the praise Brock got for "overcoming adversity" that last fight, he lost points in my book. First fight back factor aside, i just see any evolving skill-set claim there being more hype then substance.
Not to say Brock isn't an absolute beast that's a nightmare matchup for anybody, or that i would bet against him straight up here. Just that if skill/technique is ever going to trump over Brock's freak'ish size/power, this is probably the only possibility of seeing it happen in the foreseeable future.
Owned and completely exposed for having an utterly mediocre skillset if/when the bully routine does not play out favorably for him early. Like i said before, essentially falling down on and submitting a gased out fish last time out wasn't all that impressive in my book. Not that Cain isn't deserving of his props here though. He's a bad, bad dude.
Jake Shields was boring as hell, and Tito was a downer. That said, Diego had the kind of fight he sorely needed.
First thing that popped in my head after watching that fight was that Cain is basically going to be to Brock what Anderson Silva was to Rich Franklin. In that Brock is good enough to put out entertaining fights at the heavyweight level, but if he can't bully Cain, he's simply severely outclassed there as an MMA'er. I just don't see a rematch going much different right now.
(nfc why my posts keep bunching up)
Love the 360 ! :rolling:
Didn't see all the other fights, any of them stand out as fight of the night I should be looking for tomorrow ?
It has to be getting Brock back into the WWE arena one more time.
The one time Brock seems dwarfed by someone!
Brock needs to improve his stand up. If he can't take someone down and keep them down for G&P he's screwed. Then again ......Cain is a freak of nature.
Well that was quite satisfying. I have been a big fan of this new crop of heavyweights for some time. In my opinion the heavyweight division of MMA was the last weight class that was still holding on to the champions of the previous generation of fighters. Dominant in a single discipline and passable in the others is no longer enough to hold a title. The arrival of fighters like Velasquez, Carwin and Dos Santos mirrors the progression that the lighter classes have gone through.
Velasquez may very well be to the heavyweight division what Anderson Silva and GSP are to theirs. I think he has all the tools, including the brains, to wear that HW strap for a while.
As far as Lesnar goes, it's pretty clear he doesn't like getting punched. Not that anyone does, but other fighters clearly can deal with it without dropping to the ground and covering up. In the past two fights Brock has taken substantial but not fight ending shots and immediately goes 100% defensive, dropping to the ground and covering up. I'm not saying he'll never contend for a title again. With his skill set and physical attributes he can run through 85% of the HW division. But he'll never have a long title run unless he can deal with absorbing punishment without turtling. And we also saw that his wrestling alone isn't enough to dominate a foe. If you remember, Randy was able to get to his feet with Lesnar on top of him, despite the 50-60 lb weight difference. Cain shrugging off a Lesnar take down was further proof of this.
As far as the rest of the card goes:
Call me crazy but I am not excited to see Jake Shields try and suffocate opponents with his abs. He was lucky to get that decision against Kampmann.
A return to Greg Jackson seems to have rejuvenated Diego Sanchez. He looked like his old energetic self against a game Thiago, but, in my opinion, not even Jackson can make him a champion in either 155 or 170. I would love to see a Florian Sanchez rematch, because while Deigo seems to be the same basic fighter he was in 2005, Kenny has improved exponentially.
Thanks for the memories Tito. He is toast. The ground and pound not only isn't there but if it was fighters are significantly more prepared to counter this tactic now than they were in Tito's heyday. Tito's trademark cardio is gone as well. I really think that Tito is experiencing what he put Ken Shamrock through. A difficult realization that age and the progression of the sport has combined to make him increasingly obsolete.
I swear someone brainwashed Gabe Gonzaga into thinking he is Ernesto Hoost. He gets schooled on his feet for 14:55 against Brendan Schaub and in the five seconds of the fight that hits the mat he had effortlessly slapped a rear naked on Schaub when the final bell rang.
In the past few weeks it's felt like Gonzaga and Congo were transported into a bad 1980s movie where their minds switched bodies, with Congo looking to shoot for the entire fight and Gonzaga convinced he can stand with Schaub. At Gonzaga's next camp they should burn the footage of him headkicking Crocop and force him to watch him crush Carmello Morerro on the ground A Clockwork Orange style until he gets it. Gonzaga has decent to good standup, but it should be used as the gateway to his Jujitsu.
Velasquez may very well be to the heavyweight division what Anderson Silva and GSP are to theirs. I think he has all the tools, including the brains, to wear that HW strap for a while.
As far as Lesnar goes, it's pretty clear he doesn't like getting punched. Not that anyone does, but other fighters clearly can deal with it without dropping to the ground and covering up. In the past two fights Brock has taken substantial but not fight ending shots and immediately goes 100% defensive, dropping to the ground and covering up. I'm not saying he'll never contend for a title again. With his skill set and physical attributes he can run through 85% of the HW division. But he'll never have a long title run unless he can deal with absorbing punishment without turtling. And we also saw that his wrestling alone isn't enough to dominate a foe. If you remember, Randy was able to get to his feet with Lesnar on top of him, despite the 50-60 lb weight difference. Cain shrugging off a Lesnar take down was further proof of this.
As far as the rest of the card goes:
Call me crazy but I am not excited to see Jake Shields try and suffocate opponents with his abs. He was lucky to get that decision against Kampmann.
A return to Greg Jackson seems to have rejuvenated Diego Sanchez. He looked like his old energetic self against a game Thiago, but, in my opinion, not even Jackson can make him a champion in either 155 or 170. I would love to see a Florian Sanchez rematch, because while Deigo seems to be the same basic fighter he was in 2005, Kenny has improved exponentially.
Thanks for the memories Tito. He is toast. The ground and pound not only isn't there but if it was fighters are significantly more prepared to counter this tactic now than they were in Tito's heyday. Tito's trademark cardio is gone as well. I really think that Tito is experiencing what he put Ken Shamrock through. A difficult realization that age and the progression of the sport has combined to make him increasingly obsolete.
I swear someone brainwashed Gabe Gonzaga into thinking he is Ernesto Hoost. He gets schooled on his feet for 14:55 against Brendan Schaub and in the five seconds of the fight that hits the mat he had effortlessly slapped a rear naked on Schaub when the final bell rang.
In the past few weeks it's felt like Gonzaga and Congo were transported into a bad 1980s movie where their minds switched bodies, with Congo looking to shoot for the entire fight and Gonzaga convinced he can stand with Schaub. At Gonzaga's next camp they should burn the footage of him headkicking Crocop and force him to watch him crush Carmello Morerro on the ground A Clockwork Orange style until he gets it. Gonzaga has decent to good standup, but it should be used as the gateway to his Jujitsu.
I think there's a lot to this; he just doesn't want it bad enough. And it's not just the getting punched in the face thing, it's coming into the fight with such shockingly poor cardio. I think the fact that he participated in that angle with the Undertaker speaks volumes - if he sticks with MMA past his current contract, I'll be surprised.
I think it has alot to do with how Lesnar got to where he is in MMA and how he trains. He spent a significant portion of his life as a wrestler, an elite one. He used that wrestling as a base for his MMA skill set but all the training that went into establishing that base never included how to take a punch.
The poor cardio I think stems from how he trains. He has a camp that simply revolves around him. I think he brought Pat Barry up to train with him, but it's all about Brock. No one is there to push him.
I was watched the Dos Santos vs. Nelson fight last night and I am even more impressed with Nelson after seeing it again. If Lesnar had the type of chin and intestinal fortitude that Nelson had, he'd be a much more dangerous fighter.
Best decision they ever made. WEC was never going to be a PPV draw. I loved the live events on Verses but the casual MMA fan probably didn't care. Let's face it. The whole Penn vs. Pulver season of the ultimate fighter as to thrust Jens into the spotlight for not only one more go with BJ but also to draw the ultimate fighter crowd to the WEC and his showdown with Faber. The long term success of that was limited at best.
By merging, WEC fighters who were previously unknown by the masses will become familiar faces and ultimately draws on future UFC cards.
I can't wait to see the rumored 155lbs tournament.
since Carwin/Nelson is off on 1/1 Jose Aldo Jr will be defending his title as the co-main event now
This is off topic but...I hope GSP beats the hell out of Koscheck. After seeing Kos trash the male nurse he's proven He has never learned respect through MMA.
He is easily one of the most disliked guys in MMA by fans. He's the classic bully: stupid, arrogant and unlikable. It's sort of sad to see that even though he's progressed as a fighter from his days on the first season of TUF he's basically the same meathead.
It was funny that Dana had baseball as the Coaches Challenge. It was total charity by Dana considering Kos' team was getting dominated by GSPs. But Kos not only didn't get it but bragged about beating someone with limited experience playing baseball. Yeah Kos, hitting dozens of shallow pop flys with an aluminum bat makes you a bad ass.
I still think my favorite coaches challenges were Serra vs. Hughes bowling and Pulver vs. BJ in ping pong.
The fences were probably set at little league depth...maybe shorter. The Serbian kid was yelling like it was the seventh game of the world series. Koscheck is truly a joke. He's the only one who doesn't know it.
I wonder who Lesnar will fight next. Lesnar/Mir III Maybe? Nelson,Big Nog or maybe a Tune-up fight just to show he can still dominate against a guy like Kongo or Struve. Maybe Mitrione after he fights Hague at FN 23.
It's a good thing that the WEC/UFC has merged for better competition reosons but, I'm going to miss the WEC free pay per Views on Versus. They were free and IMO were more entertaining than most UFC pay per views.
Edited for Big Oversight
I wonder who Lesnar will fight next. Lesnar/Mir III Maybe? Nelson,Big Nog or maybe a Tune-up fight just to show he can still dominate against a guy like Kongo or Struve. Maybe Mitrione after he fights Hague at FN 23.
It's a good thing that the WEC/UFC has merged for better competition reosons but, I'm going to miss the WEC free pay per Views on Versus. They were free and IMO were more entertaining than most UFC pay per views.
Edited for Big Oversight
Bryan Alvarez of The Wrestling Observer live radio show reported today with near 100 percent certainty that a match up with Ultimate Fighter winner Roy Nelson is what Brock Lesnar has asked for as a comeback fight. Alvarez went on to say that he believes the UFC will probably offer Lesnar a third encounter with Frank Mir as his comeback fight.
I don't want to see him fight Mir again. Lesnar dominated both fights, other than a quick submission by Mir when Lesnar had no jiu jitsui. I think he's too big for Mir. The Nelson fight peaks my interest. Nelson could take a few shots from Lesnar and keep coming. But when it comes down to it, Mir Lesnar III would probably be a bigger draw, so I'm not surprised the UFC wants that.
If it wasn't for Steve Massagatti halting Lesnar from tenderizing Mir's gourd with a marginal shot to the back of the head Mir would have been stomped and never would have been the interim title holder. And Lesnar will never get caught in a lazy, telegraphed knee bar set up again.
That being said Mir took a significant amount of punishment before getting stopped. I was seriously impressed with his chin and his composure because if Brock had me trapped and was hitting me with his toaster hands over and over I'd have been looking for any way out of the cage. I think Mir can beat Brock if he keeps the fight standing, where Brock is sloppy and his chin questionable.
However, I'd like to see the Nelson fight just because I want to see if Nelson can take what Brock can dish out and if Nelson and his gut have better cardio than Brock. If Nelson can weather the initial storm, I think he takes Lesnar.
Oh and if you saw last night's episode of the Ultimate fighter there is little doubt left at the level of Koscheck's asshattery. Frankly, I was surprised that he went to apologize to Dane after the scrum, but he clearly had no choice after shoving a guy who was just trying to break up the fight repeatedly in the face.
I am seriously rooting for GSP to unleash some Dan Henderson vs. Bisping style retribution on Kos.
Bisping was such a moron in that fight. Henderson was looking for one thing and one thing only that entire fight: landing that big right. He practically telegraphed it from start.
And Bisping walked right into it. Jackass.
Kos needs to grow the fuck up. He has a shitload of talent but he comes off as an idiot on TV.
I hope GSP doesn't knock him out ... I'd rather see GSP systematically destroys him for a round or two before finishing him in the 2nd or 3rd. That way Kos can't say it was a lucky punch.
Hmmm maybe your right. Seeing Kos get worked for 4 and a half rounds and then pulling a "no mas" to strikes would be pretty satisfying. And when it comes right down to it, seeing Kos lay on Fickett for 14:45 only to eat a knee and get choked out may never be topped.
I hope I'm not Hi-jacking but, Just a question for you frequent MMA followers. Who are your favourite fighters and Why?
I'm a big Rich Franklin fan. He always seems to fly under the radar and has had some of the best fights in the UFC.
Evan Tanner was one of the fighters that got me into MMA. Tough as nails and a great story, A so called Jack of all Trades outside of the cage and a self- taught fighter. I'm still a little bit suprised that Dana White hasn't done anything to honor Tanner since his death.
I was a big Tito fan until all the fame went to his head and he couldn't stay out of the politics in fighting. Brock Lesnar is always fun to watch. Seeing a 280 lb. freak fight like a light weight is always entertaining. As someone mentioned earlier in this thread Lesnar needs to work on his strike defense. I still think he has a good chin though.
You know your going to get your moneys worth when you see guys like Forrest Griffin and Clay Quida fight.
I'm a big Rich Franklin fan. He always seems to fly under the radar and has had some of the best fights in the UFC.
Evan Tanner was one of the fighters that got me into MMA. Tough as nails and a great story, A so called Jack of all Trades outside of the cage and a self- taught fighter. I'm still a little bit suprised that Dana White hasn't done anything to honor Tanner since his death.
I was a big Tito fan until all the fame went to his head and he couldn't stay out of the politics in fighting. Brock Lesnar is always fun to watch. Seeing a 280 lb. freak fight like a light weight is always entertaining. As someone mentioned earlier in this thread Lesnar needs to work on his strike defense. I still think he has a good chin though.
You know your going to get your moneys worth when you see guys like Forrest Griffin and Clay Quida fight.
WEC tonight. Faber vs. Mizugaki on Vs. Faber's dropping down to bantamweight for the bout. This is the WEC's second-to-last fight before being absorbed by the UFC.
I saw Mizugaki fight once against Torres, and it was awesome. I think tonight's fight will be very entertaining. Three of the fights have already finished, but here's the card according to MMAJunkie:
MAIN CARD
I saw Mizugaki fight once against Torres, and it was awesome. I think tonight's fight will be very entertaining. Three of the fights have already finished, but here's the card according to MMAJunkie:
MAIN CARD
- Urijah Faber vs. Takeya Mizugaki
- Chad Mendes vs. Javier Vazquez
- Erik Koch vs. Francisco Rivera
- Joseph Benavidez vs. Wagnney Fabiano
- Demetrious Johnson vs. Damacio Page
- Raphael Assuncao vs. L.C. Davis
- Edward Faaloloto vs. Anthony Njokuani
- Zack Micklewright vs. Dustin Poirier
- Clint Godfrey vs. Michael McDonald
- Yves Jabouin vs. Brandon Visher
- Mackens Semerzier vs. Cub Swanson
Mackens Semerzier vs. Cub Swanson IMO was fight of the night. I wanted to see 5 rounds badly. Swanson looks recharged.
That was a pretty sweet fight. I was hoping Mizugaki was going to put up a better fight against Uriah.
So what's next for Uriah? I would love to see a matchup next year against Torres with the winner taking on Cruz for the belt, but that could take a while. Faber took a six-month medical suspension, but he can be cleared before that by an orthopedic doctor.
Faber was so much stronger than Mizugaki. He had Miz choked out for 5-10 seconds befor the fight was stopped. I agree, Faber/Torres would be a great fight.
Great interview with Dana White last night also.He mentioned more PPV's,I hope they carry on with more free fight cards, now that they have the added Talent and weight classes.
The free fights are a contract issue that I don't believe will change. I saw an interview with Dana where he said the contract they have with Spike allows for four fights a year on Spike and four free fights on another channel: AKA Versus. So that shouldn't change.
Edit: The clip Rembrat showed about the merger talks about that.
The only two fights on this card that actually intrigue me are Siver vs. Winner and Okami vs Marquardt. I just have a bad feeling that outside of these two fights it is going to be gas out central. Rivera vs Sakara being the main one. I hope I'm wrong.
I've been trying to read other forums without spoiling what happens, but it sounds like you're right.
Every week I watch the Ultimate Fighter thinking I can't possibly hate Josh Koscheck any more and every week I end up being wrong.
What a gigantic tool.
The fights were ok last night. Michael Johnson looks like he was gassing big time by the end of the second. A third round would not have been his friend.
What a gigantic tool.
The fights were ok last night. Michael Johnson looks like he was gassing big time by the end of the second. A third round would not have been his friend.
Me too. You see how psyched he was to work with Freddy Roach? He is a sponge. I love his sacrifice throws. Exciting stuff.
As for Johnson, if he can get by Nam, and I hope to god he does because seeing Koscheck happy makes me die inside, He can get into a camp and work on the cardio. I don't think he's a joke, I just think he's raw. There is definitely some talent there.
Yea, you are right. I was just rooting hard for Alex last night.
UFC 123 is this weekend and it is getting no hype! It's crazy because that card is stacked.
G-Sot and his rubber guard against Crazy Joe
Phil Davis and his freakish physique makes his main card debut
Gerald Harris another dude making his main card PPV debut
oh and then you have two hall of famers square off in Hughes/Penn III
and finally it is the battle of styles with slow, podding, heavy handed Rampage Jackson against the evasive Lyoto Machida.
The undercard has Karo making his return, Tyson Griffin and Paul Kelly fighting to stay in the UFC. The prelims has two grappling beasts in Simpsons and Munoz.
I am excited.
UFC 123 is this weekend and it is getting no hype! It's crazy because that card is stacked.
G-Sot and his rubber guard against Crazy Joe
Phil Davis and his freakish physique makes his main card debut
Gerald Harris another dude making his main card PPV debut
oh and then you have two hall of famers square off in Hughes/Penn III
and finally it is the battle of styles with slow, podding, heavy handed Rampage Jackson against the evasive Lyoto Machida.
The undercard has Karo making his return, Tyson Griffin and Paul Kelly fighting to stay in the UFC. The prelims has two grappling beasts in Simpsons and Munoz.
I am excited.
It will be good to see Karo in the cage again. He supposably kicked his painkiller addiction and wants to show that he's still one of the best Judo specialist's in MMA. I'm glad Dana gave him one more chance.
The UFC card looks promising. I'm curious to see which Rampage shows up.
It was awesome to see Freddy Roach training. I hope he has GSP trained and ready to punish Koscheck for 5 rounds.
I'm also a Brookins fan. I think him against Phan is the true finals. I'm not impressed with Johnson . I actually thought he lost the fight against English. It should have neve went three rounds.
Your right Rembrat, Phil Davis has probably the freakish physique in sports. With more fights I predict a championship in his future.
The UFC card looks promising. I'm curious to see which Rampage shows up.
It was awesome to see Freddy Roach training. I hope he has GSP trained and ready to punish Koscheck for 5 rounds.
I'm also a Brookins fan. I think him against Phan is the true finals. I'm not impressed with Johnson . I actually thought he lost the fight against English. It should have neve went three rounds.
Your right Rembrat, Phil Davis has probably the freakish physique in sports. With more fights I predict a championship in his future.
I never heard of the guy but jesus, he has Dwight Howard's shoulders and Manny Pacquiao's waist.