Tottenham 2015-16: We don't even have a clever title

Gunfighter 09

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It is almost like Poch was trying to send a message to Levy by subbing Kane off with 25 minutes to go.
 

DJnVa

Dorito Dawg
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Gunfighter 09 said:
It is almost like Poch was trying to send a message to Levy by subbing Kane off with 25 minutes to go.
 
He was hurt.
 

URI

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Four points dropped from ahead positions in 3 games.
 
Today, Leicester scored like 10 seconds after Alli.
 
What today showed for me was:
1.  We need a strong defensive mid that can mesh with the center backs and forward midfielders.  Dier and Mason were out of their depth today.
2.  We need someone who can play off Kane.
3.  This teams offense depends on Eriksen.  Lloris, and Kane might be our best players...Eriksen is our most important.
 
Considering Leicester's form, I'm not too upset at the result, but we've played three games, and all three games have been LOLSpurs results after outplaying the teams they were opposing.
 

DJnVa

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Sigh. I was following along at my son's tournament, saw the Tottenham goal and my first thought was "No!!! We left them like 10 minutes!!!"
 
EDIT: Also, I'm throwing myself from the Lamela train. Last preseason he looked really good, but it didn't carry over, but he seems too ineffectual on the field. Jesus, even if he could just make a difference in the Europa League games it would help.
 

DJnVa

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http://www.espnfc.us/story/2582376/leverkusens-son-heung-min-has-tottenham-medical-reports
 
 
Bayer Leverkusen winger Son Heung-min is set for a €30 million move to join Tottenham Hotspur, according to German media reports.
 
Son, 23, was set to take part in Leverkusen's Champions League playoff second leg with Lazio, but already on Tuesday missed Bayer's final training session ahead of the match at the Bay-Arena.
 
 
The winger, who can also play in a more central role, has played in 62 Bundesliga games for Leverkusen and has scored 21 goals. He has also struck five goals in 19 Champions League appearances for the Bundesliga club.
 
Tottenham are likely to have a space in their squad for an attacking midfielder as Erik Lamela's father and agent has confirmed the Argentina international is in talks with Inter Milan.
 
 

DJnVa

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Well there's also a story today that Wanyama is not traveling with Southampton for their Europa League game due to a "stomach infection". Spurs want him and the reports say he told the Saints that he wants out. Could be nothing, but it's interesting...
 

coremiller

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Europa League draw is Monaco, Anderlecht, and Qarabag (Azerbaijan).  Not an especially good draw -- Monaco was one of the strongest non-Pot 1 teams, and Qarabag, while a minnow, is the worst possible travel situation.  They should still go through, but they won't be able to coast as much as I would have preferred.
 

eddiew112

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That game was a Europa League wet dream. The young guys and bench players got some run, our new signing got off the mark, and Lamela scored. Let's hope it continues that way
 

coremiller

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For a team that struggled defensively last year, nice to see three consecutive clean sheets.  Although that will almost certainly end next week against City.
 

Dummy Hoy

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I thought the Guardian's Football Extra did a really nice job of describing Harry Kane on today's podcast; Jimbo raised some questions but the other commentators summed up his game and prospects very accurately.  
 
I'm rooting for him, I think he's close.
 

Gunfighter 09

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Holy shit that was fun. That was just as awesome as New Year's day, except for I think they played much better today and it was much more understandable and expected, based on their recent play. 
 
Drew Dawg's post from the game thread: 


DrewDawg said:
Tottenham is the youngest team in the EPL too. Well, youngest starting XI.
 
 
EDIT: Announcer just said "Tottenham calm at the back." You NEVER hear that.
 
 
URI is going to kill us if we keep talking like this, but I am very excited by the way this very young team seems to be coming together. Health, luck and a crowded schedule are all challenges, but this team has looked consistently very good (or at least much better than last year's 5th place team ) over the first seven matches and seems to be improving. With as wide open as the league is this year, April and May might be pretty fun. I am fucking buzzing. 
 

eddiew112

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The thing that stood out to me was that Spurs looked comfortable in defense when City were in possession. Dier and Alli weren't perfect but they were all over the pitch and Alderweireld and Vert didn't put a foot wrong all day. Aside from his mistake on the goal, Walker was very good as well. 
 
The front four showed a lot of promise and that was with Eriksen having an off day. There is a lot to be excited about right now.
 

Gunfighter 09

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I think my favorite part was watching Lamela go from absolute anguish on his flubbed shot over the bar to the absolute joy he displayed after his goal. It is great to watch a guy who puts in such a high effort level, often to little result, have something good happen. 
 

URI

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Gunfighter 09 said:
 
 

 
URI is going to kill us if we keep talking like this, but I am very excited by the way this very young team seems to be coming together. Health, luck and a crowded schedule are all challenges, but this team has looked consistently very good (or at least much better than last year's 5th place team ) over the first seven matches and seems to be improving. With as wide open as the league is this year, April and May might be pretty fun. I am fucking buzzing. 

 
 
Considering I haven't stopped jerking off to the scoreline since about 10 (OOGHAHHAH...ahhhhh) this morning, I feel like you're safe.  And I need a topical ointment.
 

coremiller

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Frustrating draw at Swansea.  I thought Spurs had the better of the play, even if they struggled to create clear chances.  Conceding on a freak own goal like that stings.  Nice to see Eriksen's free kick form is back.  He is deadly from that range.
 
Townsend's decision-making is still awful.  He has great physical gifts, but he's such a selfish player, every time he gets the ball he looks to dribble past three men and shoot from 30 yards.  The rest of the team must hate playing with him.
 
Dier is now suspended for the Liverpool match.
 

DJnVa

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Frustrating, but it's a point on the road--before last weeks game I'm sure we'd have been pretty happy coming away with results against ManCity and Swansea.
 
Next 3 games are Liverpool, Bournemouth, and Aston Villa. We'll be able to see of these are the same old Spurs.
 
Old Spurs would go: win, draw, loss. If this team wants to compete, that's 9 points they need.
 

coremiller

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Liverpool have owned them in recent years, but this is obviously not the same Liverpool team.  Nor the same Spurs team.  When Spurs lost 0-5 to Liverpool at WHL less than two years ago, these were the lineups:
 
Spurs:
 
25 Lloris
02 Walker 
16 Naughton (Fryers - 45' )
19 Dembélé (Townsend - 61' )
15 Capoue
20 Dawson
07 Lennon
30 Sandro (Holtby - 30')
09 Soldado
08 Paulinho 
21 Chadli
 
Liverpool

22 Mignolet
02 Johnson
38 Flanagan
21 Lucas (Luis Alberto - 79' )
37 Skrtel
17 Sakho
24 Allen
14 Henderson
07 Suárez
31 Sterling
10 Coutinho (Moses - 90' )
 
A lot of turnover on both sides since then.
 

eddiew112

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This one had all the makings of a classic Spurs trap game. The Kane goal was a great finish off of a lovely team move. Onto Anderlecht and the Scum!
 

DJnVa

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eddiew112 said:
This one had all the makings of a classic Spurs trap game. The Kane goal was a great finish off of a lovely team move. Onto Anderlecht and the Scum!
 
Yeah, nice solid win.
 
One thing that seems different this season is the GD. Here's what they've been the last two seasons:
 
2014/15: +5
2013/14: +4
 
This year, they are already +10 and that's 3rd in the league.
 

coremiller

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DrewDawg said:
 
Yeah, nice solid win.
 
One thing that seems different this season is the GD. Here's what they've been the last two seasons:
 
2014/15: +5
2013/14: +4
 
This year, they are already +10 and that's 3rd in the league.
 
The big difference this year is that the defense is much improved.  Spurs conceded 53 goals last year, or 1.39 per game, which was the joint-5th worst.  They have conceded only 9 goals this year in 11 games, which is joint 3rd-best, and only 1 behind Arsenal and Man Utd, who are tied for 1st.  
 
In an era when half-decent centerbacks have been going for crazy sums, Alderweireld for 11.4m has quietly been one of the best signings of the season.  Not all the improvement is down to him -- Spurs getting more accustomed to playing Poccetino's style and Dier becoming a solid defensive midfielder have also been important -- but he has been a big improvement over the Fazio/Kaboul/Chiriches group that rotated last year as Vertonghen's partner.
 

soxfan121

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Do Vertonghen and Aiderweireld play next to each other on the national team as well?
 
Has anyone studied long term partnerships and correlated it to team success? It would select for good pairings and sifting the chaff (i.e. "we had no other choices" would be pretty easy). Or conversely, putting together two guys who don't speak the same language?
 

coremiller

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soxfan121 said:
Do Vertonghen and Aiderweireld play next to each other on the national team as well?
 
Has anyone studied long term partnerships and correlated it to team success? It would select for good pairings and sifting the chaff (i.e. "we had no other choices" would be pretty easy). Or conversely, putting together two guys who don't speak the same language?
 
No, they both start at fullback for Belgium because Belgium have no true fullbacks but have a wealth of good CBs -- Kompany and one of Vermaelen or Lombaerts have been starting at CB.  
 

Zososoxfan

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soxfan121 said:
Do Vertonghen and Aiderweireld play next to each other on the national team as well?
 
Has anyone studied long term partnerships and correlated it to team success? It would select for good pairings and sifting the chaff (i.e. "we had no other choices" would be pretty easy). Or conversely, putting together two guys who don't speak the same language?
 
Barzagli, Bonucci, and Chiellini for Juve/Italy certainly comes to mind. Pique and Puyol for Barca/Spain a few years back was another.
 

Morgan's Magic Snowplow

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Zososoxfan said:
 
Barzagli, Bonucci, and Chiellini for Juve/Italy certainly comes to mind. Pique and Puyol for Barca/Spain a few years back was another.
 
Baresi, Maldini, Costacurta, and Tassotti for Milan/Italy during the 1980s and 1990s is probably the best example.  Only the first three were national team regulars but those guys played together a zillion times and it was arguably the best defense of all time.
 

coremiller

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So before the game I would have been very happy with a draw. But after being 1-0 up after 75 minutes having controlled much of the match, a draw is a little disappointing. The team clearly tired in the last 15-20 minutes and I think the Monday-Thursday thing got to them a little bit (what idiot thought it was a good idea to play on a Monday during a Europa League week?).

I'm starting to think the ceiling for this team is a little higher than the typical "5th place with an outside shot at 4th if everything breaks right." They've outplayed both of the Top 2 in the last six weeks, they have real depth everywhere except striker and CB, and the team seems to be gelling nicely under Poch in his second season. With Chelsea self-destructing, 4th place or better is really up for grabs.
 

DJnVa

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72 points usually gets you Top 4, and that's about 1.9 PPG. Spurs right now are at 1.75 PPG, so need to go slightly over that 1.9 pace the rest of the way--if they had turned one of their 6 draws into a win, they'd be at the 1.9 pace.

You have to assume Leicester City falls off the pace eventually and Chelsea would have the play at the pace of a team that wins the table from here on out to reach that 72 point threshold.

Next 3 EPL games are West Ham, Chelsea, and West Brom. The first 2 are at home--7 points out of those 3 should be the floor.
 

coremiller

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I think the points tallies for the top sides are going to be a little lower this year. There's more parity in the league and quality in the mid-table sides than there's been in a long time, and everyone is going to drop points. Teams like West Ham, Southampton, Leicester, Stoke, Palace, etc. are all frisky, and even the bottom clubs like Newcastle and Sunderland aren't complete walkovers. This is not the league of 2010-2014, where there was a huge gap between the top 7 and the rest of the league.
 

OCST

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I think the points tallies for the top sides are going to be a little lower this year. There's more parity in the league and quality in the mid-table sides than there's been in a long time, and everyone is going to drop points. Teams like West Ham, Southampton, Leicester, Stoke, Palace, etc. are all frisky, and even the bottom clubs like Newcastle and Sunderland aren't complete walkovers. This is not the league of 2010-2014, where there was a huge gap between the top 7 and the rest of the league.

I agree. Even the newly promoted sides are, to use your word, frisky. Bournemouth a little less so since Callum Wilson got hurt, and Watford, sitting in 11th right now, are solid.
 

sachmoney

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I was really impressed with what I saw from you guys on Sunday. May be not attacking wise, but the base, the defense and heart of midfield was quite strong. I mean, Lloris was as good as ever, but Alderweireld and Vertonghen really bossed it. I thought Dembele also had a very strong game (personal MotM). The D is clearly the strength of the team and Spurs have become a very difficult team to score on. Arsenal had some chances but none were really clear cut. When you're not conceding high percentage chances, you're doing something right. As far as how well Spurs can do this year, I think that a lot of it will depend on the health of Harry Kane. He is the match winner. Without him, you'd probably have to rely on the not always healthy Eriksen to create goals and who is going to finish them? At this point, I do like Spurs' chances at Top 4 this season.

After all, it is your everything (sorry, I couldn't help myself).
 

eddiew112

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Spurs could have easily had 7 or 8 goals today. I am really liking the toughness they have shown as well, which we all know is usually a bit lacking in a Spurs side. Lots of strong challenges, brave headers, etc.
 

Tangled Up In Red

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Mousa Dembele has become the beast we all hoped to see. Great performance all around.

Only negatives were physical error by KW for their goal and Alli out for Chelsea due to yellows.
 

coremiller

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Nice to see Spurs put a decent team to the sword at home. These teams came in tied in points but Spurs were far superior.
 

Gunfighter 09

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Interesting to see Poch play 8 of the 11 starters tonight in Central Asia with Chelsea on Sunday. I expected the likes of Townsend and Clinton to get more run and play big minutes. Kane, of course, had the winner in a game Spurs dominated.

The nice part is Spurs are now qualified for the knockout round and only need a tie at the Lane against Monaco to clinch the group next month.
 

coremiller

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I only saw the second half of the Chelsea match, but that was one of the dullest halves of football I've seen in a long time.

Spurs have a run now where they need to bag points. Their next 11 fixtures are: @WBA, NEW, @SOU, NOR, @Wat, @EVE, LEI, SUN, @CPL, @NOR, WAT. A couple of the away games could be tricky (SOU, CPL, EVE), but there are no games against "big" clubs (well, except Leicester), the home slate is particularly soft, and there are no more Europa League distractions until mid-February (Spurs having already qualified for the knockout rounds). I'd like to see 22-25 points from that stretch, with 15/15 at home. Is that asking too much?
 

Dummy Hoy

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I think 22-25 is reasonable if you have title aspirations (and you should), but expecting perfection at home seems a bit much. Both Watford and Leicester can score even on the road. You'd be favored for 3 points in all five games, but football is football.
 

DJnVa

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Would have really enjoyed the 3 points there. We've only scored 2 goals in the last 3 games in all competitions, so we're in a bit of a drought there. Luckily our defense is solid (it's really awesome to be able to say that) and we've only allowed 1 goal--but we need to get the offense moving again.
 

coremiller

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It's been a problem this year that the team has been overly reliant on Kane for goals. Kane has 8 league goals, and Alli is second on the team with 3; no one else has more than 2. When Kane is kept quiet, they struggle to score. They aren't getting the secondary scoring they got last year from Chadli and Eriksen, who had 21 goals between them last year. They've compensated with increased defensive solidity, but eventually some of the non-Kane attacking players are going to have start scoring if this team is going to do anything.
 

DJnVa

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I'm hoping that Son will be that person, but I think he was left out of the starting 11 for Lamela this weekend. Is he still not 100%?