Tottenham Hotspur 20/21: José se foi.

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Sunny von Bulow
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Also, I finally got around to watching the Everton match last night. What a tactical shit show for Mou to leave on. Sissoko had such a puzzling performance that I have to think he was just totally disillusioned with Jose and didn't know what to do (in addition to potentially being merely washed up). He actually made forward passes and tried to get forward, but then he also couldn't be inconvenienced with tracking back for the WBs.

The WBs just had no coordination and the halftime show correctly pointed out that Everton's first goal was caused in large part because both were caught upfield.

Spurs were so so lucky to nab 2 goals and earn a point. Kane is goddamned lethal. That first goal was incredible, especially for being on his weaker foot, and the second goal was just so easy for him (not easy for everyone).

Dier continues to be terrible and he was clearly picked on for Everton's second goal (which was stunningly beautiful BTW). Lloris came up huge and deserves the second most credit for the point behind Kane.

Rodon looked very good. He's certainly got the correct level of nastiness (I assume we're not using the C word anymore, because that was what came to mind).

Lucas had the most bad Lucas game I can ever remember--appropriate for Mou's last match. The commentators pegged Lamela perfectly--brings tons of positive energy, very capable of linking the MF and attack, but the final touch is maddeningly inconsistent.

Very curious to see what Mason (is this confirmed?) comes out with on Wednesday. Any idea what to expect?
Toffees outplayed Spurs comfortably; the Spurs goals were due to two catastrophic fuckups by Keane and Holgate in front of goal that Kane pounced on. I'd call Spurs listless.

Everton came close to a triple over Spurs with the FA Cup win thrown in.
 

scott bankheadcase

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Toffees outplayed Spurs comfortably; the Spurs goals were due to two catastrophic fuckups by Keane and Holgate in front of goal that Kane pounced on. I'd call Spurs listless.

Everton came close to a triple over Spurs with the FA Cup win thrown in.
I completely agree. I actually think it was one of the worst performances Spurs had under Jose. If you just look at the result, it doesn't show you how absolutely terrible they were. I think it was a justified sacking based on that performance.
 

Zososoxfan

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I completely agree. I actually think it was one of the worst performances Spurs had under Jose. If you just look at the result, it doesn't show you how absolutely terrible they were. I think it was a justified sacking based on that performance.
I don't think anyone disagrees.

#freemason (I know I'm super late on this but too good not to post)
 

Zososoxfan

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Nagelsmann to Bayern.

Leading candidates now include Ten Hag (Ajax), Rodgers (LCFC), and Rangnick (free). I'd also imagine they'll look around the rest of the EPL.
 

DJnVa

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The Telegraph also reports Gareth Southgate and Roberto Martinez in the mix.
 

teddykgb

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I can’t imagine Rodgers leaving LCFC for Spurs. That’s probably a downgrade. Not trying to troll Spurs fans but he’s built a fun little side at Leicester. Of course money always talks but I don’t see why he’d leave that Leicester job for anyone but a true CL ready contender
 

coremiller

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Please not Southgate or Martinez. I'd be ok with Rodgers or Potter.

Not sure Spurs are a step down from Leicester. Leicester have been better than Spurs the last two seasons but Spurs have a lot more financial power and don't have to regularly sell their best players any more.
 

Morgan's Magic Snowplow

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I think Potter would be a really strong choice. But I'm not sure whether Levy has the balls and vision to make that kind of appointment. Really serious supporters will know that Brighton play good stuff and that they're ridiculously underperforming XG. But I think it will be hard to sell to sponsors and the more casual supporter (which is most of them) the idea of appointing an unknown guy who has his club 17th in the table. Poch was in a very different position after taking Soton to 8th and their best ever Premier League points total. And all Levy's other appointments have been even better known with even stronger pedigree.

The managerial appointment seems extra tricky because it can't really be separated from the issue of what Spurs does with Kane and Son this summer. The identity of the next manager seems likely to bear pretty highly on how happy Kane is to stay and how Son thinks about signing a new contract, and most potential managers will want to understand what is likely to happen with Kane and Son before taking the job.
 

teddykgb

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Please not Southgate or Martinez. I'd be ok with Rodgers or Potter.

Not sure Spurs are a step down from Leicester. Leicester have been better than Spurs the last two seasons but Spurs have a lot more financial power and don't have to regularly sell their best players any more.
It’s mostly a cycle thing. Spurs had a good thing going with Poch but the bottom fell out. You can’t change all the players so they tried to change managers first and while I think they chose a strange manager for that purpose it also seems clear that the mix of players isn’t going to transform into world beaters. It puts Spurs in a strange position of needing to rebuild but it’s not obvious how to do so. You have to either sell Kane and/or Son and really rebuild or try to shift a lot of the middle of the roster to quickly try to rebuild around them. I don’t think Spurs are a disaster or anything and maybe a few intelligent purchases could really then the tide but really all that work is already done at Leicester who now have money and an ascending team that is mostly young. Rodgers choosing to start a rebuild or rejigger when he can instead try to purchase a little quality and push for the league just doesn’t seem to line up well at this time.
 

coremiller

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It’s mostly a cycle thing. Spurs had a good thing going with Poch but the bottom fell out. You can’t change all the players so they tried to change managers first and while I think they chose a strange manager for that purpose it also seems clear that the mix of players isn’t going to transform into world beaters. It puts Spurs in a strange position of needing to rebuild but it’s not obvious how to do so. You have to either sell Kane and/or Son and really rebuild or try to shift a lot of the middle of the roster to quickly try to rebuild around them. I don’t think Spurs are a disaster or anything and maybe a few intelligent purchases could really then the tide but really all that work is already done at Leicester who now have money and an ascending team that is mostly young. Rodgers choosing to start a rebuild or rejigger when he can instead try to purchase a little quality and push for the league just doesn’t seem to line up well at this time.
Spurs actually have turned over a lot of the Poch-era squa and still have a fair amount of youngish/early-prime talent: Dele (25), Ndombele (24), Lo Celso (25), Hojbjerg (25), Winks (25), Reguilon (24), Sanchez (24), Bergwijn (23), Rodon (23), Sessegnon (20). Kane is only 27 and Son 28 -- not young but far from over the hill. The only prominent outfield players over 30 are Sissoko (not a first choice player and should be phased out anyway) Alderweireld (still playing well, if not quite as well as 2-3 years ago), and Bale (who knows if he'll be back).

They have weaknesses at RB and CB but the makings of a really good team are still here. In particular, this team is potentially set up very well to press and possess now that they have actual good healthy midfielders that they didn't have at the end of the Poch era. This team is not at all set up well to play Mourinhoball, because they lack high-action physical defensive midfielders and A+ penalty box defenders, which has been obvious for a long time. Part of what made this season so frustrating was Mourinho's refusal to 1) play the best players, and 2) play a system that actually suited those players rather than Mourinho's personal ego and neuroses.
 

67YAZ

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I actually think Leicester might listen to a large enough offer. They have built a fantastic organization where no one person or player is irreplaceable - they always have an up-to-date list or targets ready to step in and keep the train running. I don’t doubt they have Rodgers replacements in mind already, especially since Rodgers is clearly the manager and Rudkin is director of football. It’s not a change in philosophy or even in strategy. It’s bringing in a new neck to hang the whistle on.

But Leicester have a really strong hand. They’re in UCL position. There’s no vague threat of retaliation for the Super League over their head. And Rodgers has 4 more seasons a £10m per on his contract. Levy’s infamous low-ball tactics aren’t going to be tolerated unless Rodgers gets really loud about wanting to leave.
 

67YAZ

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My Dutch friend gives ten Hag a begrudging thumbs up (PSV supporter saying good things about an Ajax manger and all). He also points out that ten Hag only has a year left on his contract, so he’s an affordable option plus he has worked well in a highly structured organization. Levy has to appreciate a manager who isn’t trying to be director, too.
 
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coremiller

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Damn, I liked ten Hag. Maybe Ajax demanded more than Levy wanted to pay to let ten Hag out of his contract.
 

DJnVa

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Damn, I liked ten Hag. Maybe Ajax demanded more than Levy wanted to pay to let ten Hag out of his contract.
He's not out of the running. Tottenham will simply have to pay a bit higher amount to get him.
 

Kliq

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Clearly, they are enamored with someone from Red Bull. There are worse organizations to model yourself after.
 

coremiller

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At least they are looking in the right places, at progressively oriented managers with experience developing players and not at another big-name retread.

Ragnick would be an odd choice though because he has a front office management role at RB, a role Levy normally keeps for himself.
 

Kliq

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Match fitness is always going to be a concern with Bale, and his workrate on defense has left a lot to be desired, which is probably why Jose favored Lucas and Lamela. That being said, he still possesses a special kind of class and skill that is only found in the very elite tier of players, and that has been on display this season when he has gotten ample playing time. It seems like Bale, like everyone else, was frustrated with Jose and if he can continue to play well and often in these final games with Mason, I think he could be more open to sticking around.
 

DJnVa

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Match fitness is always going to be a concern with Bale, and his workrate on defense has left a lot to be desired, which is probably why Jose favored Lucas and Lamela. That being said, he still possesses a special kind of class and skill that is only found in the very elite tier of players, and that has been on display this season when he has gotten ample playing time. It seems like Bale, like everyone else, was frustrated with Jose and if he can continue to play well and often in these final games with Mason, I think he could be more open to sticking around.
Bale is top 20 in the EPL in goals scored. Which just seems nuts.

He's at 1.12 goals/90 minutes. He doesn't have enough minutes to qualify, but the of those that do, the leader is at .78.
 

coremiller

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Bale is top 20 in the EPL in goals scored. Which just seems nuts.

He's at 1.12 goals/90 minutes. He doesn't have enough minutes to qualify, but the of those that do, the leader is at .78.
This is skewed a little by Jose mostly only playing Bale at home against weaker sides. Bale's goals have come against Brighton, Burnley, Palace, Southampton, and Sheffield United, all in home games.
 

DJnVa

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Tottenham want a coach who will demonstrate a commitment to improving young players - like Pochettino – The Athletic

Contrary to fears they will be restricted to picking from those managers currently out of contract and therefore not requiring a hefty compensation fee, Spurs would be in a position to recruit a manager from another club, should he be the right candidate.
The other aspect of Pochettino’s tenure that the club want to return to is his style of play. Pochettino pioneered an energetic high-pressing style at Spurs, encouraging his players to dominate the game no matter who the opponent.

The club is very conscious of this sense of identity or ethos, that Tottenham should get back to their best traditions by playing football on the front foot again. They know that the team will win and lose games, but there is a desire for a style of play that the fans can buy into again.
 

Zososoxfan

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This is encouraging, but the reality is that Harry Kane can't press in a system like that anymore. It doesn't mean you can't build a pressing side and allow for the striker to have fewer responsibilities, but it takes an acknowledgment from the manager and everyone buying in--the manager, Kane, and most importantly the other players. Fortunately, I think Arry has that gravitas.
 

Kliq

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IOW, Levy is implicitly admitting he massively screwed up in hiring Mourinho, who is none of these things.
That was my take away too; this kind of philosophy feels like a total contrast to Mourinho, which shows how scarring that experience was. I guess the logic with Mourinho was that Levy felt Spurs were close to the top, but the team was tuning out Poch and a change need to be made, which was probably accurate. The problem was that he selected Mourinho to be the guy to come in and push these guys to the top; but since Mourinho's philosophy was completely different from Poch, the roster wasn't conducive to playing his style (which was outdated regardless) and the result was that Spurs were even worse under Jose than they were in the last days of Poch. Now they are looking to turn back the clock and trying to find someone like Poch again; but the problem to me is that the roster is older now, as ZoSo pointed out above, and they may not be as adept at playing that style, especially after spending a season building the team around Jose's anti-football philosophy.
 

Morgan's Magic Snowplow

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This is completely speculative but I wonder how much the Super League played into Levy's decision to hire Mourinho. While the recent ESL proposal was partially launched in response to the pandemic situation, the idea has been brewing for a while, many have long considered it an inevitability, and it seems plausible to me that for a long time an important calculation for Levy has involved thinking about how to make sure Spurs gain entree into the rarified group of clubs that would be invited into a Super League. If that's how you're thinking about things and you're a club that hasn't had really famous managers or won trophies recently (not intended as a jibe, just the reality) but then you have the opportunity to hire arguably the most famous manager in the world who always delivers trophies, I can see the attraction. Even if it never made any sense in footballing terms.
 

DJnVa

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Tottenham is my team but they can f*ck all the way off for that effort AT HOME WITH FANS IN THE STANDS against a team with nothing to play for.
 

Pesky Pole

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Tottenham is my team but they can f*ck all the way off for that effort AT HOME WITH FANS IN THE STANDS against a team with nothing to play for.
Maybe they really want to play in the European Conference League? I mean Albania, Armenia, Estonia, Finland, and the Faroe Islands are places I've certainly never been.
 

candylandriots

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Maybe they really want to play in the European Conference League? I mean Albania, Armenia, Estonia, Finland, and the Faroe Islands are places I've certainly never been.
If Union Berlin win on Saturday, you're all welcome here for the games :). I personally would be ecstatic to have the chance at that competition.

I owe my Spurs fan friend in London after he took me to the Champions League game last year at Bayern.
 
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Tangled Up In Red

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Tottenham is my team but they can f*ck all the way off for that effort AT HOME WITH FANS IN THE STANDS against a team with nothing to play for.
Nothing to add but amen to this.
Apparently didn't do a final lap around the ground, either.
 

DJnVa

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And I don't want to get into the whole "if you can't beat Aston Villa at home, why tf do you all think you should go play in real meaningful games?"

They have 5 or 6 guys that all want to go play big minutes for teams in the Champions League when those same 5 or 6 guys can't find their way past Villa.
 

Kliq

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Sounds like I picked the right day to go golfing instead of watching Spurs.
 

Zososoxfan

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Very dispiriting loss today. The Tanganga injury was the cherry on the shit sundae. I think there are useful and very good players on the squad, but they need to tear it all down before they can build it back up.
 

DJnVa

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Very dispiriting loss today. The Tanganga injury was the cherry on the shit sundae. I think there are useful and very good players on the squad, but they need to tear it all down before they can build it back up.
I do too. And maybe after the season we'll hear stories about how they couldn't just flip a switch from Mourinho's style to what they want to play and with an offseason they will be able to make some stylistic changes. But that was as ugly as any game during Jose's time.