Tyler Skaggs passes away

[YTF]

Quick clarification point here:

In the 22 years I've been working in the patient-facing side of the pharmacy industry, oxycodone, in ALL its forms, has been a Schedule-II narcotic, which is the "lowest" schedule of a controlled substance that is available in the professional settin, because they carry the biggest risk of long-term addiction and have only minimal medicinal value by comparison (the "lowest" schedule is for drugs that are considered to have no real medicinal qualities and carry the highest risk of long-term dependence).

Oxycontin, which is at the heart of the opioid epidemic, is a controlled-release (or extended release) version of oxycodone that is designed to release the entire dose over an extended period of time in the hope of achieving a constant level of the drug in the system. The problem wasn't that it was addictive, it's that the manufacturer (Purdue) stated that it didn't carry the high risk of long-term dependence that they knew it did. Oxycodone, by itself, is a widely used pain treatment across the medical industry. It's also sometimes called Roxicodone or Oxy-IR, where the IR stands for immediate release; in other words, it gives it to you all at once, then your system clears it and you have to take more, if needed, for short periods (mostly) . Oxycontin use, by and large, required regular dosing and would lead to patients requiring higher doses as time went on, especially in cases of misuse, because their bodies began to need more, and more often. It's almost literally synthetic heroin, if that gives you any idea of the difference between having it constantly in your system, at a steady dose, versus having to dose periodically because the level within the body was always decreasing.

Any drug can be habit-forming, at least on some level, but a lot of the "fun" drugs are CII-V, and as the schedule number decreases, the risk of addiction increases. And those are assigned by the DEA, so the drug companies can't even really say they sold them as having a low risk of addiction when they have to be transparent with the DEA about how addictive the medication can be. Purdue's crime was not showing what that addiction could look like AND pushing prescribers to order it for all of their long-term pain patients, instead of just for long-term pain patients with cancer or other terminal issues, which it originally intended to target. Overprescribing of Oxycontin, more than anything else, is what led to the epidemic; there's a reason you can't get the liquid version on the streets that easily, or something like hydromorphone (Dilaudid) or fentanyl patches.

I'm not fully understanding the highlighted part. Are you saying it is addictive, but Purdue downplayed/denied that it was? If so, the addictive qualities of the drug was the problem and was fostered by the lack of disclosure, yes?

 

[Mueller's Twin Grannies]

I'm not fully understanding the highlighted part. Are you saying it is addictive, but Purdue downplayed/denied that it was? If so, the addictive qualities of the drug was the problem and was fostered by the lack of disclosure, yes?

Oxycodone, in any form, is addictive. That's why it's a CII drug. What made Oxycontin - a long-acting form of oxycodone - so bad was that its users pretty much never stopped having it in their bloodstream, which creates a chemical dependence that is really hard to eliminate. "Regular" oxycodone can be just as addictive if you take it incorrectly, but it doesn't stay in your system as long, so your body can never really adjust to having it be a constant level, and is usually indicated to be taken as needed, whereas long-acting drugs are taken on a schedule, which is what creates the tolerance that will eventually require an increase in dose.

What Purdue failed to disclose was that Oxycontin was basically creating junkies within a few uses because of the release action of the medication because it was like having a little bit of heroin released into your blood every few minutes or every hour or whatever it might be. By comparison, immediate release oxycodone is like having a little bit of heroin just once and having to make the choice to take more.

Oxycodone IR comes in 5mg, 10mg, 15mg, and 30mg strengths. It is one half of the active ingredients in Percocet (the other being acetaminophen) and most regular users only get the low strength in a small qty with instructions to make it last as long as possible. Patients who have chronic pain conditions or might be on a terminal path usually get the higher test stuff, which was supposed to be the reason Oxycontin was created.

Oxycontin comes in 10mg, 15mg, 20mg, 30mg, 40mg, 60mg, and 80mg and is typically taken every 12 hours, with 30-day supplies given out. In MA, you can refill a 30-day CII Rx four weeks after the last fill, so some patients were getting a two-day cushion each time, which increases to four, then 6, then 8 days, etc., with each successive fill, which meant extra doses. You can imagine what most ended up doing with those.

What made the epidemic truly explode was that there were pain clinics across the country who would write scripts for anyone if they were willing to pay the OV fee. When I worked in CVS in the Westford/Acton area, we had a couple patients who would walk in with booklets of prescriptions from a pain clinic in Florida every month like clockwork. We investigated but the place seemed to be legit. We even called the state DEA to confirm. But we had to fill them... until the law changed to say we can only accept controlled substance Rxs if they were written in-state or from a bordering state

I can tell you with 100% certainty that I've never seen that kind of behavior with any other kind of pain medication, only Oxycontin. The only other drug that comes close is Suboxone, which kind of exists because of Oxycontin's ravages.

 

[dynomite]

I'm not fully understanding the highlighted part. Are you saying it is addictive, but Purdue downplayed/denied that it was? If so, the addictive qualities of the drug was the problem and was fostered by the lack of disclosure, yes?

Haven't posted a lot about this on here, but I was pretty involved in the Massachusetts/multi-state litigation against Purdue Pharma and have spent a lot of time with people in the recovery community who have buried parents, children, siblings, or are themselves in a wheelchair because of overdoses. In my opinion, this story is tragically predictable and part of the devastating national opioid epidemic -- no surprise that this crisis is impacting everyone, even professional athletes like Skaggs.

You might be aware, but just for people passing through the read I take the opportunity to note while the history here has been better covered in books, articles, etc. the complaint against Purdue sets it out fairly succinctly. It's like gun manufacturers or automobile companies back in the day: guns/cars/pills don't kill people, people -- in this case, "junkies" -- kill themselves. In short, in my opinion, that company is evil: https://www.mass.gov/files/documents/2019/07/11/43_01 First Amended Complaint filed 01-31-2019_0.pdf

(When reviewing the materials and e-mails directly targeting veterans because they had government sponsored health care and were a better source of "guaranteed revenue" I actually got physically ill and had to walk outside to calm down)

In a pamphlet for doctors, Providing Relief, Preventing Abuse: A Reference Guide To Controlled Substance Prescribing Practices, Purdue wrote that addiction “is not caused by drugs.” Instead, Purdue assured doctors that addiction happens when the wrong patients get drugs and abuse them: “it is triggered in a susceptible individual by exposure to drugs, most commonly through abuse.”2
...
Purdue promoted its opioids to Massachusetts patients with marketing that was designed to obscure the risk of addiction and even the fact that Purdue was behind the campaign. Purdue created a website, In The Face of Pain, that promoted pain treatment by urging patients to “overcome” their “concerns about addiction.” Testimonials on the website that were presented as personal stories were in fact by Purdue consultants, whom Purdue had paid tens of thousands of dollars to promote its drugs.
...
Purdue managers praised Massachusetts sales reps for pitching doctors on the idea that prescribing to “trustworthy” patients was safe. A sales rep reported that one doctor: “let me know that she will Rx OxyContin when the pts [patients] has chronic pain and are trustworthy.” The rep added that he would “Follow up with Dr and ask what pts does she consider ‘trust worthy?’” A Purdue district manager responded: “Great follow up question on what patients does he consider trustworthy.”
...
To target veterans, Purdue funded a book, Exit Wounds, which was packaged as the story of a wounded veteran but was really part of Purdue’s deceptive marketing campaign. The book repeated Purdue’s lie that patients would not become addicted to opioids: “The pain-relieving properties of opioids are unsurpassed; they are today considered the ‘gold standard’ of pain medications, and so are often the main medications used in the treatment of chronic pain. Yet, despite their great benefits, opioids are underused. For a number of reasons, healthcare providers may be afraid to prescribe them, and patients may be afraid to take them. At the core of this wariness is the fear of addiction, so I want to tackle this issue head-on … Long experience with opioids shows that people who are not predisposed to addiction are unlikely to become addicted to opioid pain medications.”9

 

[YTF]

Oxycodone, in any form, is addictive. That's why it's a CII drug. What made Oxycontin - a long-acting form of oxycodone - so bad was that its users pretty much never stopped having it in their bloodstream, which creates a chemical dependence that is really hard to eliminate. "Regular" oxycodone can be just as addictive if you take it incorrectly, but it doesn't stay in your system as long, so your body can never really adjust to having it be a constant level, and is usually indicated to be taken as needed, whereas long-acting drugs are taken on a schedule, which is what creates the tolerance that will eventually require an increase in dose.

What Purdue failed to disclose was that Oxycontin was basically creating junkies within a few uses because of the release action of the medication because it was like having a little bit of heroin released into your blood every few minutes or every hour or whatever it might be. By comparison, immediate release oxycodone is like having a little bit of heroin just once and having to make the choice to take more.

Oxycodone IR comes in 5mg, 10mg, 15mg, and 30mg strengths. It is one half of the active ingredients in Percocet (the other being acetaminophen) and most regular users only get the low strength in a small qty with instructions to make it last as long as possible. Patients who have chronic pain conditions or might be on a terminal path usually get the higher test stuff, which was supposed to be the reason Oxycontin was created.

Oxycontin comes in 10mg, 15mg, 20mg, 30mg, 40mg, 60mg, and 80mg and is typically taken every 12 hours, with 30-day supplies given out. In MA, you can refill a 30-day CII Rx four weeks after the last fill, so some patients were getting a two-day cushion each time, which increases to four, then 6, then 8 days, etc., with each successive fill, which meant extra doses. You can imagine what most ended up doing with those.

What made the epidemic truly explode was that there were pain clinics across the country who would write scripts for anyone if they were willing to pay the OV fee. When I worked in CVS in the Westford/Acton area, we had a couple patients who would walk in with booklets of prescriptions from a pain clinic in Florida every month like clockwork. We investigated but the place seemed to be legit. We even called the state DEA to confirm. But we had to fill them... until the law changed to say we can only accept controlled substance Rxs if they were written in-state or from a bordering state

I can tell you with 100% certainty that I've never seen that kind of behavior with any other kind of pain medication, only Oxycontin. The only other drug that comes close is Suboxone, which kind of exists because of Oxycontin's ravages.

Haven't posted a lot about this on here, but I was pretty involved in the Massachusetts/multi-state litigation against Purdue Pharma and have spent a lot of time with people in the recovery community who have buried parents, children, siblings, or are themselves in a wheelchair because of overdoses. In my opinion, this story is tragically predictable and part of the devastating national opioid epidemic -- no surprise that this crisis is impacting everyone, even professional athletes like Skaggs.

You might be aware, but just for people passing through the read I take the opportunity to note while the history here has been better covered in books, articles, etc. the complaint against Purdue sets it out fairly succinctly. It's like gun manufacturers or automobile companies back in the day: guns/cars/pills don't kill people, people -- in this case, "junkies" -- kill themselves. In short, in my opinion, that company is evil: https://www.mass.gov/files/documents/2019/07/11/43_01 First Amended Complaint filed 01-31-2019_0.pdf

(When reviewing the materials and e-mails directly targeting veterans because they had government sponsored health care and were a better source of "guaranteed revenue" I actually got physically ill and had to walk outside to calm down)

Thanks to both of you. It's always helpful to have folks with knowledge and experience to help the rest of us understand some of these difficult topics. Especially when so many of us have been affected in one way or another.

 

[candylandriots]

I don’t know. Sending someone to prison for 20+ years for a nonviolent, consensual crime seems wrong to me. Kay is an addict himself; it’s not like he was an organized crime figure knowingly preying on people’s weaknesses.

I have a good friend from high school who sold fentanyl online. He sold it to someone who then gave (or sold, unclear to me, not that it matters) it to a minor that died from an overdose. My friend got life in prison for it. I have no idea what happened to the middleman.

My friend was an addict himself, and last time I was back home, one of my friends told me some stories about him that really made me wish someone had gotten him some help before all this, because everybody apparently knew what he was up to. I even had an idea about it living 3,000 miles away and wanted to talk some sense into him, but didn't know how to until it was too late.

 

[Cesar Crespo]

Oxycodone, in any form, is addictive. That's why it's a CII drug. What made Oxycontin - a long-acting form of oxycodone - so bad was that its users pretty much never stopped having it in their bloodstream, which creates a chemical dependence that is really hard to eliminate. "Regular" oxycodone can be just as addictive if you take it incorrectly, but it doesn't stay in your system as long, so your body can never really adjust to having it be a constant level, and is usually indicated to be taken as needed, whereas long-acting drugs are taken on a schedule, which is what creates the tolerance that will eventually require an increase in dose.

What Purdue failed to disclose was that Oxycontin was basically creating junkies within a few uses because of the release action of the medication because it was like having a little bit of heroin released into your blood every few minutes or every hour or whatever it might be. By comparison, immediate release oxycodone is like having a little bit of heroin just once and having to make the choice to take more.

Oxycodone IR comes in 5mg, 10mg, 15mg, and 30mg strengths. It is one half of the active ingredients in Percocet (the other being acetaminophen) and most regular users only get the low strength in a small qty with instructions to make it last as long as possible. Patients who have chronic pain conditions or might be on a terminal path usually get the higher test stuff, which was supposed to be the reason Oxycontin was created.

Oxycontin comes in 10mg, 15mg, 20mg, 30mg, 40mg, 60mg, and 80mg and is typically taken every 12 hours, with 30-day supplies given out. In MA, you can refill a 30-day CII Rx four weeks after the last fill, so some patients were getting a two-day cushion each time, which increases to four, then 6, then 8 days, etc., with each successive fill, which meant extra doses. You can imagine what most ended up doing with those.

What made the epidemic truly explode was that there were pain clinics across the country who would write scripts for anyone if they were willing to pay the OV fee. When I worked in CVS in the Westford/Acton area, we had a couple patients who would walk in with booklets of prescriptions from a pain clinic in Florida every month like clockwork. We investigated but the place seemed to be legit. We even called the state DEA to confirm. But we had to fill them... until the law changed to say we can only accept controlled substance Rxs if they were written in-state or from a bordering state

I can tell you with 100% certainty that I've never seen that kind of behavior with any other kind of pain medication, only Oxycontin. The only other drug that comes close is Suboxone, which kind of exists because of Oxycontin's ravages.

Didn't they have to remove oxycontin from a lot of pharmacies because they were getting robbed at alarming rates? I had a friend who did just that.

It was really bad around the end of the 90s and early 00s from what I recall.

 

[Plantiers Wart]

Kay did not profit from getting Skaggs the drugs. 20 year minimum seems ridiculous.

 

[Daniel_Son]

Oxycodone, in any form, is addictive. That's why it's a CII drug. What made Oxycontin - a long-acting form of oxycodone - so bad was that its users pretty much never stopped having it in their bloodstream, which creates a chemical dependence that is really hard to eliminate. "Regular" oxycodone can be just as addictive if you take it incorrectly, but it doesn't stay in your system as long, so your body can never really adjust to having it be a constant level, and is usually indicated to be taken as needed, whereas long-acting drugs are taken on a schedule, which is what creates the tolerance that will eventually require an increase in dose.

What Purdue failed to disclose was that Oxycontin was basically creating junkies within a few uses because of the release action of the medication because it was like having a little bit of heroin released into your blood every few minutes or every hour or whatever it might be. By comparison, immediate release oxycodone is like having a little bit of heroin just once and having to make the choice to take more.

Oxycodone IR comes in 5mg, 10mg, 15mg, and 30mg strengths. It is one half of the active ingredients in Percocet (the other being acetaminophen) and most regular users only get the low strength in a small qty with instructions to make it last as long as possible. Patients who have chronic pain conditions or might be on a terminal path usually get the higher test stuff, which was supposed to be the reason Oxycontin was created.

Oxycontin comes in 10mg, 15mg, 20mg, 30mg, 40mg, 60mg, and 80mg and is typically taken every 12 hours, with 30-day supplies given out. In MA, you can refill a 30-day CII Rx four weeks after the last fill, so some patients were getting a two-day cushion each time, which increases to four, then 6, then 8 days, etc., with each successive fill, which meant extra doses. You can imagine what most ended up doing with those.

What made the epidemic truly explode was that there were pain clinics across the country who would write scripts for anyone if they were willing to pay the OV fee. When I worked in CVS in the Westford/Acton area, we had a couple patients who would walk in with booklets of prescriptions from a pain clinic in Florida every month like clockwork. We investigated but the place seemed to be legit. We even called the state DEA to confirm. But we had to fill them... until the law changed to say we can only accept controlled substance Rxs if they were written in-state or from a bordering state

I can tell you with 100% certainty that I've never seen that kind of behavior with any other kind of pain medication, only Oxycontin. The only other drug that comes close is Suboxone, which kind of exists because of Oxycontin's ravages.

Tried googling but didn't get anything - what's an OV fee?

 

[Burn Out]

Tried googling but didn't get anything - what's an OV fee?

I think he means the OC (OxyContin) fee that unscrupulous prescribers were charging.

C and V keys are adjacent.

(And a quick recommendation to watch Dopesick on Hulu)

 

[candylandriots]

Oxycodone, in any form, is addictive. That's why it's a CII drug. What made Oxycontin - a long-acting form of oxycodone - so bad was that its users pretty much never stopped having it in their bloodstream, which creates a chemical dependence that is really hard to eliminate. "Regular" oxycodone can be just as addictive if you take it incorrectly, but it doesn't stay in your system as long, so your body can never really adjust to having it be a constant level, and is usually indicated to be taken as needed, whereas long-acting drugs are taken on a schedule, which is what creates the tolerance that will eventually require an increase in dose.

What Purdue failed to disclose was that Oxycontin was basically creating junkies within a few uses because of the release action of the medication because it was like having a little bit of heroin released into your blood every few minutes or every hour or whatever it might be. By comparison, immediate release oxycodone is like having a little bit of heroin just once and having to make the choice to take more.

Oxycodone IR comes in 5mg, 10mg, 15mg, and 30mg strengths. It is one half of the active ingredients in Percocet (the other being acetaminophen) and most regular users only get the low strength in a small qty with instructions to make it last as long as possible. Patients who have chronic pain conditions or might be on a terminal path usually get the higher test stuff, which was supposed to be the reason Oxycontin was created.

Oxycontin comes in 10mg, 15mg, 20mg, 30mg, 40mg, 60mg, and 80mg and is typically taken every 12 hours, with 30-day supplies given out. In MA, you can refill a 30-day CII Rx four weeks after the last fill, so some patients were getting a two-day cushion each time, which increases to four, then 6, then 8 days, etc., with each successive fill, which meant extra doses. You can imagine what most ended up doing with those.

What made the epidemic truly explode was that there were pain clinics across the country who would write scripts for anyone if they were willing to pay the OV fee. When I worked in CVS in the Westford/Acton area, we had a couple patients who would walk in with booklets of prescriptions from a pain clinic in Florida every month like clockwork. We investigated but the place seemed to be legit. We even called the state DEA to confirm. But we had to fill them... until the law changed to say we can only accept controlled substance Rxs if they were written in-state or from a bordering state

I can tell you with 100% certainty that I've never seen that kind of behavior with any other kind of pain medication, only Oxycontin. The only other drug that comes close is Suboxone, which kind of exists because of Oxycontin's ravages.

I think this is a really important post. The switch from instant to extended release formulation *may* have been done for good reasons, but the result was catastrophic.

 

[Mueller's Twin Grannies]

Didn't they have to remove oxycontin from a lot of pharmacies because they were getting robbed at alarming rates? I had a friend who did just that.

It was really bad around the end of the 90s and early 00s from what I recall.

I know some strengths were taken off the market (I believe there used to be a 120mg strength too) and pharmacies had limits as to what they could have on-hand. All narcotics had to be locked in a safe or otherwise secured vessel at all times, when not being counted out, which made it harder for smash-and-grab style robberies. The Rite Aid I was working at locally a few years ago got hit overnight in what looked to be a very professional operation, but that's the only time a pharmacy I've been working on or for has been robbed.

It's also worth noting that one of the ways the epidemic got brought a bit more under control was an update of the DEA's online records system. Every time a CII is filled, the pharmacy has to run a DEA check to make sure the patient isn't filling too soon (at least in MA). It used to be that the DEA system could take an hour or more to update after a prescription is filled, so the scammers would shuttle around to as many pharmacies as they could with these fraudulent-but-authentic Rxs, always paying cash (because insurance would show a paid claim and result in a Refill Too Soon rejection), until they were told they were too early.

It was quite the scheme.

Tried googling but didn't get anything - what's an OV fee?

Office Visit

If you look at your health insurance card, very often you'll see a copay structure that'll say, like, "ER: 50 OV: 25 SP: 100" or something like that. ER is obvious, we covered OV, and SP is usually specialist/out of network.

 

[Daniel_Son]

Office Visit

If you look at your health insurance card, very often you'll see a copay structure that'll say, like, "ER: 50 OV: 25 SP: 100" or something like that. ER is obvious, we covered OV, and SP is usually specialist/out of network.

Got it - so basically, these pain clinics would provide a script as long as you'd pay them an office visit fee. That's horrible.

I think he means the OC (OxyContin) fee that unscrupulous prescribers were charging.

C and V keys are adjacent.

(And a quick recommendation to watch Dopesick on Hulu)

Thanks for the recommendation. I'm aware of the show, but I haven't been able to bring myself to watch it. Hits a little too close to home - growing up in Northern CT/Southern Mass, I've had more than a few friends and family members struggle with opioids. A few of them lost that battle. I hope Sackler and his ilk rot for what they did to communities like mine.

 

[Mueller's Twin Grannies]

Got it - so basically, these pain clinics would provide a script as long as you'd pay them an office visit fee. That's horrible.

Capitalism: Ain't it grand!?

 

[dynomite]

Mods, is there any way we could sticky something to the top of this thread for resources? The good news is that there are wonderful resources to help people struggling with substance use as well as family members in lots of places (including Massachusetts), the bad news is that often people don't know about them:

For immediate intervention and assistance, including a 24/7 phone line: https://helplinema.org/ and 1-800-327-5050.

For longer term support networks, advice, and groups, Learn2Cope is an incredible organization based in Taunton, MA: https://learn2cope.org/

Just as a reference point, five people are going to die today in Massachusetts alone because of an overdose. And tomorrow. And the day after that and after that and after that. Hopefully the tragedy of Skaggs' death and this entire episode can help destigmatize those suffering and encourage more people to demand additional resources and support for recovery (and punishment for companies that willfully helped create and sustain this crisis).

 

[Marciano490]

Kay did not profit from getting Skaggs the drugs. 20 year minimum seems ridiculous.

Why? Part of sentencing is general deterrence. Go after everybody who sells or trades this shit. It’s fucking poison. If you play Russian roulette, you can’t complain it’s unfair when there’s a bullet in the chamber.

 

[sean1562]

What exactly is the relationship between Kay, Harvey, and Skaggs? Is Kay the guy they give money to so he can go buy all the drugs that they do, sometimes together? He bought pills that he thought were oxycontin but were really fentanyl and then Skaggs died? Is that more or less the timeline?

Why wouldn't Kay give up where he bought the pills? He seems like a drug addict that was acting as the errand boy for all of these MLB stars to get their pills.

https://www.latimes.com/sports/angels/story/2022-02-11/another-angels-employee-connected-eric-kay-with-drug-dealer-in-tyler-skaggs-case-prosecutors-argue

This article makes it seem like the dealer Kay bought them from used a pseudonym and burner phones. So Kay is the last person in the supply chain they can get their hands on so he gets the 20. The dealer flipping tainted pills is probably still out there doing it.

 

[mauf]

Why? Part of sentencing is general deterrence. Go after everybody who sells or trades this shit. It’s fucking poison. If you play Russian roulette, you can’t complain it’s unfair when there’s a bullet in the chamber.

General deterrence doesn’t work on addicts. Pretending it does leaves us with some variation on a theme of punishing addicts for their illness. Which is what society has done here — destroying one addict (Kay) to demonstrate how upset we are about the death of another (Skaggs). We’re treating a medical problem as though it were a moral problem.

Perhaps general deterrence works on people like the Sacklers, but that’s a whole other discussion, and it doesn’t do anything for people suffering from addiction right now.

 

[Dahabenzapple2]

General deterrence doesn’t work on addicts. Pretending it does leaves us with some variation on a theme of punishing addicts for their illness. Which is what society has done here — destroying one addict (Kay) to demonstrate how upset we are about the death of another (Skaggs). We’re treating a medical problem as though it were a moral problem.

Perhaps general deterrence works on people like the Sacklers, but that’s a whole other discussion, and it doesn’t do anything for people suffering from addiction right now.

Thank you for this. I could write much about this but I’ll save it for my meetings when I speak with other addicts and I listen to them as we try to save each other from this disease.

 

[sean1562]

Bubbles would have done 20 if Landsman didn't toss him back.

 

[Dahabenzapple2]

Bubbles would have done 20 if Landsman didn't toss him back.

I’ve met a whole bunch of dudes & dudettes like Bubbles over the years. Very glad many of them are alive and well and clean today and not in prison.

 

[InsideTheParker]

Frontline did a great documentary on Oxycontin marketing:
https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/frontline/article/inside-the-aggressive-marketing-of-oxycontin-revisit-purdue-pharmas-role-in-the-opioid-crisis/

 

[Marciano490]

General deterrence doesn’t work on addicts. Pretending it does leaves us with some variation on a theme of punishing addicts for their illness. Which is what society has done here — destroying one addict (Kay) to demonstrate how upset we are about the death of another (Skaggs). We’re treating a medical problem as though it were a moral problem.

Perhaps general deterrence works on people like the Sacklers, but that’s a whole other discussion, and it doesn’t do anything for people suffering from addiction right now.

You can be an addict without giving drugs to other people. Let’s not let personal addiction be an excuse for facilitating the deaths of others.

 

[loshjott]

The Washington Post today revealed some texts between Skaggs and his agent Ryan Hamill that paint Hamill in a pretty unfavorable light. Basically urging Skaggs to take meds to pitch through injuries so as not to jeopardize his service time early in his MLB career. "The text messages between Skaggs and his agent were admitted into evidence by prosecutors, but they were not discussed in court and have not been previously reported." Hamill did not testify in the trial of Eric Kay. Per the article, it is not clear whether Hamill was aware of Skaggs's "history of drug abuse dating from at least 2013, when the young major leaguer attempted to wean himself off Percocet."

In 2016, Los Angeles Angels pitcher Tyler Skaggs was trying to return to the majors after nearly two years sidelined following Tommy John surgery on his elbow. But then he experienced discomfort in his groin and, wary after having suffered various injuries throughout his career, wanted to tell the team.

His agent, Ryan Hamill, disagreed, advising Skaggs that it would jeopardize the service time he needed to qualify for salary arbitration and accompanying seven-figure raises.

“We can aleeve and Advil the f--- out of it,” Hamill told Skaggs via text, according to court records reviewed by The Washington Post.

Two years later, in 2018, Skaggs described hamstring pain that was “getting worse pretty much every day.” But Hamill repeatedly warned him against taking time off, including by telling him that he would hurt his chances to make the All-Star Game. When Skaggs said the Angels wanted to place him on the injured list, Hamill disagreed.

“Why no dose pack,” Hamill texted, referring to an anti-inflammatory steroid. “Flush this s--- out.”

 

[bosox188]

Certainly paints the issue of service time manipulation in an even darker light. Although I thought service time still accrues if you're on the IL? Looking at the MLB website definition, that seems to be the case. I believe only the restricted list (i.e. suspension) doesn't accrue time. So not sure why that part of it was a concern.

 

[Red(s)HawksFan]

Certainly paints the issue of service time manipulation in an even darker light. Although I thought service time still accrues if you're on the IL? Looking at the MLB website definition, that seems to be the case. I believe only the restricted list (i.e. suspension) doesn't accrue time. So not sure why that part of it was a concern.

I believe the case with Skaggs was he was in the minors on optional assignment, and his agent was suggesting he hide an injury that would have only gotten him put on the minor league IL. No service time accrued there. I would guess the agent was hoping he could play through the injury long enough to get called up, and then he could disclose it and get put on the big league IL where he would accrue service time.

 

[Lose Remerswaal]

Matt Harvey suspended 60 games for admitting to taking pills with Skaggs.

https://sports.yahoo.com/ex-angels-pitcher-matt-harvey-suspended-60-games-after-admitting-to-taking-pills-with-tyler-skaggs-trial-211707608.html

 

[DeadlySplitter]

View: https://twitter.com/JeffFletcherOCR/status/1579931875308544001?s=20&t=XU-ubBageIIMIFxCuqJQcA

View: https://twitter.com/ggarciaroberts/status/1579928278798041089?s=20&t=iLtt1szg3J3grB0b-sA5GA

 

[santadevil]

Well, it looks like he's got some time to change his attitude towards people
He may feel the Skaggs was a piece of shit, and maybe he was. But he was also supplied drugs by a guy who is a piece of shit too

 

[Marciano490]

Note to self - if ever murdering, wait till after sentencing to besmirch the deceased.