World Cup Day 18--Netherlands/Mexico, Greece/Costa Rica

McBride11

Well-Known Member
Gold Supporter
SoSH Member
Jul 15, 2005
15,744
Charleston, SC
Djiraan Iraassi said:
You're free to dislike Spain's style, but calling it "defensive" is oxymoronic. In football you only defend when you don't have the ball. It's like calling a QB or a DH "defensive".

Now, boring, doesn't create too many goal opportunities, slow, boring? OK.
 
Agree here. Their possession was impressive. Those midfielders were great and got old for this WC. I'd equate the 2006 Italians to the 90s NJ Devils, not that Spanish team. Maybe it's not as exciting as the long ball and attacking and multiple chances style, but it's tactically sound and quite beautiful when in action. It's also very impressive to control the game with that amount of possession.
 

nvalvo

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 16, 2005
17,601
Rogers Park
soxfan121 said:
 
It is pretty well accepted that Spain's Tiki-Taka is designed to deny the other team possession and thus, chances. By monopolizing possession, Spain is taking the old "the best defense is a good offense" maxim to an extreme end point.
 
Right. And what's fun about it is watching Xavi do Xavi stuff. I love it, but I respect that it isn't for everyone. 
 

Tony the Pony

Fork You Schpors
SoSH Member
Jan 2, 2007
3,174
Dublin / Ibiza
Zomp said:
 
Its a small Italian apparel company.  They make really nice football boots but don't have the marketing engine of Nike or Adidas.  A player's boot.
 
You're kidding, right?
 
These are the guys behind Navratilova and Boris Becker. They outfitted Holland back in 1990 / 1992 or whatever and also Milan, Napoli, Juventus, etc. It was a major force that has been pushed out over the last 20 years. Partly because Nike / Adidas have much more resources, mostly because the product is just not good.
 
Their boots sucked.
 

ToeKneeArmAss

Paul Byrd's pitching coach
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
nvalvo said:
 
I get that this is a one-liner, but there are two definitions of flopping, and their conflation really confuses the issue. 
 
The first is straight-up simulation: acting as if you've been fouled when you really haven't. That is total bullshit, and should draw nothing but yellow cards and scorn. 
 
The second is going to ground deliberately when you *have* been fouled, but not violently enough to stop you without your acquiescence. That's what Robben did earlier — he was tripped lightly, and he fell more or less on purpose — and I think that's a key part of the balance of power between attackers and defenders. If this kind of flop didn't win fouls, there'd be nothing stopping the defenders from constantly taking little shots at the attackers. It's not pretty, but it's necessary IMO to discipline the defenders. 
Absolutely agree with you. AND I'd wager Luis doesn't. That's all I was saying.
 

swiftaw

Member
SoSH Member
Jan 31, 2009
2,300
nvalvo said:
 
This is the best rule proposal to come out of the World Cup forum. 
I think I made this suggestion in the rules changes thread a week or so ago.
 

Infield Infidel

teaching korea american
SoSH Member
Jul 15, 2005
11,463
Meeting Place, Canada
McBride11 said:
 
Agree here. Their possession was impressive. Those midfielders were great and got old for this WC. I'd equate the 2006 Italians to the 90s NJ Devils, not that Spanish team. Maybe it's not as exciting as the long ball and attacking and multiple chances style, but it's tactically sound and quite beautiful when in action. It's also very impressive to control the game with that amount of possession.
 
Spain would be the Riggins ball-control Washington Football teams of the 80s. They get an early lead, and then grind the clock down by running the ball. 
 

SoxFanInCali

has the rich, deep voice of a god and the penis of
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Jun 3, 2005
12,521
California. Duh.
And now that you are totally gassed, who wants to take a penalty? Oh, and you'll be the goat forever if you miss.
 

coremiller

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 14, 2005
4,662
Part of what made Spain's style so defensive in 2010 was how overwhelmingly negative all their opponents were.  Spain were so good that everyone they played just ceded the midfield and put 10 men behind the ball and tried to hit them on the counter.  It's really hard to score against well-organized packed defenses that basically aren't trying to score themselves.
 
Spain weren't boring at Euro 2008, nor in every game at Euro 2012 -- when teams came out and challenged them, they tore them to shreds (like in the 2012 final against Italy).
 
It's like saying a Barry Bonds intentional walk was boring -- it was, but that's not really Bonds' fault.
 

fletcherpost

sosh's feckin' poet laureate
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Jul 15, 2005
9,941
America
So does Campbell take a penalty?
 
Predictions: My heart says Costa Rica 4-3, My head says Greece 4-2 (or 3-1)
 

Zomp

Dope
Dope
Aug 28, 2006
12,389
The Slums of Shaolin
Tony the Pony said:
 
You're kidding, right?
 
These are the guys behind Navratilova and Boris Becker. They outfitted Holland back in 1990 / 1992 or whatever and also Milan, Napoli, Juventus, etc. It was a major force that has been pushed out over the last 20 years. Partly because Nike / Adidas have much more resources, mostly because the product is just not good.
 
Their boots sucked
 
When is the last time you bought a pair?
 

URI

stands for life, liberty and the uturian way of li
Dope
Aug 18, 2001
10,329
rembrat said:
Too many to quote but thank you all for being extremely helpful.
If you're interested in soccer tactics, Inverting the Pyramid is a fantastic read.
 

Reverend

for king and country
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Jan 20, 2007
45,086
rembrat said:
Too many to quote but thank you all for being extremely helpful.
 
I'm really digging this forum overall.
 

nvalvo

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 16, 2005
17,601
Rogers Park
ToeKneeArmAss said:
My guess is that this means a lot more to the Costa Ricans than it does to the Greeks. Thoughts?
 
The Greeks don't qualify for the World Cup that often, let alone make the Round of 16. I think everyone is pretty invested. 
 

fletcherpost

sosh's feckin' poet laureate
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Jul 15, 2005
9,941
America
Ian Wright in the ITV studio, saying how he always wanted to take the 5th penalty. Why cos you're brave...No cos sometimes it's over by the 4th.
 
Top man.
 

Reverend

for king and country
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Jan 20, 2007
45,086
URI said:
If you're interested in soccer tactics, Inverting the Pyramid is a fantastic read.
 
When I was growing up, the 3-3-4 was accepted in America as the formation. It might as well have been baseball in a universe where the shift had never been invented.
 

Djiraan Iraassi

ángel de la muerte
SoSH Member
Jul 24, 2008
25
Spain
Reverend said:
 
Quite so. He seems to mistaking "style of defense" for having "a defensive style." Having a defensive style is a strategy and I don't think that's really questionable.
I'm not a "he" and I resent your tone. :p
 

rembrat

Member
SoSH Member
May 26, 2006
36,318
ToeKneeArmAss said:
Dunno. Just nationally I suspect it's a bigger thing to your average Costa Rican. I think of Greece as having a wider range of national interests. But it could be my own ignorance.
Are you trying to set up another butt joke?
 

URI

stands for life, liberty and the uturian way of li
Dope
Aug 18, 2001
10,329
You know, it's probably been said, but Karnezis is a hunk.