World Cup Day 6 11/25: AMERICAN REVOLUTION!

DJnVa

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Dec 16, 2010
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Wow x2. So take it to England today and then hope to just beat Iran Tuesday and we get through?
Yep. But if US doesnt win later, Iran can advance with draw versus US which slightly complicates it.
 

Average Reds

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Wow x2. So take it to England today and then hope to just beat Iran Tuesday and we get through?
Well now its all pretty clear for the US, they need to win one of the next two games and not lose to Iran.
If US loses by less than 4 goals today, they will control their destiny and go through with a win versus Iran.

That might be the strangest sentence I’ve ever written.
 

Zomp

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I think an Iran win is actually preferable to a draw.

Sure the US could draw all 3 games and go through but so could have Wales.

Now the US can lose to England and still have a good chance of going through.

frankly if we can’t be Iran we don’t deserve the knockout stage anyway.
 

DJnVa

Dorito Dawg
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Dec 16, 2010
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If US loses by less than 4 goals today, they will control their destiny and go through with a win versus Iran.

That might be the strangest sentence I’ve ever written.
Weird that head to head isn’t first tiebreaker
 

CodPiece XL

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I think an Iran win is actually preferable to a draw.

Sure the US could draw all 3 games and go through but so could have Wales.

Now the US can lose to England and still have a good chance of going through.

frankly if we can’t be Iran we don’t deserve the knockout stage anyway.
Exactly how I would look at it.
 

Jimy Hendrix

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This group will be so finely poised after the US beats England…

I think in that scenario round 3 becomes “win and you’re in” for all four teams.
 

tmracht

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I think an Iran win is actually preferable to a draw.

Sure the US could draw all 3 games and go through but so could have Wales.

Now the US can lose to England and still have a good chance of going through.

frankly if we can’t be Iran we don’t deserve the knockout stage anyway.
It basically makes today irrelevant and Tuesday a knockout match against a team that can bunker and counter. Going to interesting if Gregg rests a bunch on yellows.
 

PedroSpecialK

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#7 is Jahanbakhsh, he was once a nailed-on starter but has ceded playing time increasingly to Gholizadeh. I think Jahanbakhsh is the better fit at RM against the US but won't be a huge blow for Iran IMO
 

speedracer

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It basically makes today irrelevant and Tuesday a knockout match against a team that can bunker and counter. Going to interesting if Gregg rests a bunch on yellows.
Huge worry about Tim Ream being able to survive for me. Not as worried about Dest or McKennie who arguably shouldn’t be starting based on form/fitness.
 

DJnVa

Dorito Dawg
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Dec 16, 2010
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Huge worry about Tim Ream being able to survive for me. Not as worried about Dest or McKennie who arguably shouldn’t be starting based on form/fitness.
Point taken but we may not need a defense against a bunkering Iran.
 

Jimy Hendrix

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On one hand, if we get no points from England the danger is that Iran can sit deep and force the US to try and break them down, a game we’re bad at playing and they’d advance on the draw.

On the other hand, Iran also looked worse playing that game than they did today being aggressive. Probably mostly due to England being England though.
 

GB5

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Aug 26, 2013
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A few things because I am a fatalist. If we lose say 2-0 to England today then beat Iran 1-0 and Wales beats England 1-0, then you have

England 6 points
Wales 4 points (-1 goal differential)
US 4 points (-1 goal differential)

How does that shake out?
 

Time to Mo Vaughn

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Mar 24, 2008
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If US loses by less than 4 goals today, they will control their destiny and go through with a win versus Iran.

That might be the strangest sentence I’ve ever written.
Where is the 4 goals coming from?

If we lose 2-0 today. We'll be at 1 point with -2 GD, which will be the same as Wales. If they beat Iran 1-0 and Wales beats England 2-0, then we'll have:

England 6 points
Wales 4 points, 0 GD
US 4 points, -1 GD
Iran 3 points

And Wales would go through.
 

PedroSpecialK

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A few things because I am a fatalist. If we lose say 2-0 to England today then beat Iran 1-0 and Wales beats England 1-0, then you have

England 6 points
Wales 4 points (-1 goal differential)
US 4 points (-1 goal differential)

How does that shake out?
I believe if the teams are level on pts, GD, GS, and h2h, they then look at the results in a table absent the 4th place team, where it becomes:

Wales - 4 pts, +1 GD, win over England
England - 3 pts, +1 GD, win over US
US - 3 pts, -1 GD, win over Iran

Might be wrong but sourcing it off of this
 

Time to Mo Vaughn

RIP Dernell
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Mar 24, 2008
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A few things because I am a fatalist. If we lose say 2-0 to England today then beat Iran 1-0 and Wales beats England 1-0, then you have

England 6 points
Wales 4 points (-1 goal differential)
US 4 points (-1 goal differential)

How does that shake out?
In that case, the next tiebreaker is goals scored. So a 2-1 win is better than 1-0.

After that it's fair play points:

If any teams still have an identical record after the head-to-head stage, positions are decided by fair play record.

- yellow card: minus 1 point
- indirect red card: minus 3 points
- direct red card: minus 4 points
- yellow card and direct red card: minus 5 points

Only one of the above deductions is applied to a player in one match.
This makes Wales direct red very costly today though the US had two more yellows in their head to head game.
 

Time to Mo Vaughn

RIP Dernell
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Mar 24, 2008
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I believe if the teams are level on pts, GD, GS, and h2h, they then look at the results in a table absent the 4th place team, where it becomes:

Wales - 4 pts, +1 GD, win over England
England - 3 pts, +1 GD, win over US
US - 3 pts, -1 GD, win over Iran

Might be wrong but sourcing it off of this
I was looking at the same thing and not sure where you got that they'd drop the 4th place team results. Are you thinking of if it's a 3 way tie? Don't think that scenario qualifies here.
 

PedroSpecialK

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I was looking at the same thing and not sure where you got that they'd drop the 4th place team results. Are you thinking of if it's a 3 way tie? Don't think that scenario qualifies here.
If three teams identical

This is more complicated, as you can't just use individual results because there's three matches to take into account. Effectively, you create a mini-league of just the three games involving the three nations.
 

Fred in Lynn

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I’m going to avoid researching the letter of the rule and just submit to the wisdom of the forum: Why was the Qatari goalie allowed to handle with his hands that header back to him from a teammate?
 

Time to Mo Vaughn

RIP Dernell
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Mar 24, 2008
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If three teams identical

This is more complicated, as you can't just use individual results because there's three matches to take into account. Effectively, you create a mini-league of just the three games involving the three nations.
But in the process scenario there's only two teams identical: US and Wales.
 

PedroSpecialK

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On replay, looks like Afif felt contact and his body went completely limp. I think Lahoz makes the right decision and VAR probably didn't see a clear error
 

BrazilianSoxFan

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I’m going to avoid researching the letter of the rule and just submit to the wisdom of the forum: Why was the Qatari goalie allowed to handle with his hands that header back to him from a teammate?
The goalie can't handle if the defender passed the ball with his foot. Any other part of the body and it's fair game.
 

Time to Mo Vaughn

RIP Dernell
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Mar 24, 2008
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Other than Bale, what Wales player is better than anybody on England’s bench? It’s not like England is a thin squad.
I mean, I'm not betting money on it, but Argentina lost to Saudi Arabia with higher stakes.

We just shouldn't be claiming that the US controls their own destiny if it's not mathematically true.
 

loshjott

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Oops, that's a pretty bad play in the box.

I love the zip up hoodie the Senegalese coach is wearing. Looks like he could have picked it up a Walmart.
 

Fred in Lynn

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For those of us who cpouls not see the match, please elaborate.
They kept showing an Iranian woman, wearing the garb of any free woman, heartily enjoying the festivities and cheering for her home nation’s team after their first goal. It was a political swipe at the government of Iran in a football thread, but I accept with pride any yellow card shown to me.
 

Jed Zeppelin

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Aug 23, 2008
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My takeaway from this morning is every team in the group now has a chance to survive or go home IF we can beat England today.
 

Average Reds

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Where is the 4 goals coming from?

If we lose 2-0 today. We'll be at 1 point with -2 GD, which will be the same as Wales. If they beat Iran 1-0 and Wales beats England 2-0, then we'll have:

England 6 points
Wales 4 points, 0 GD
US 4 points, -1 GD
Iran 3 points

And Wales would go through.
You are correct - I was thinking of Iran as the key threat for the second spot.

I don’t see Wales beating England, but it’s obviously a possibility.
 

67YAZ

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South Africa didn’t get out of their group in 2010, but they at least had a win and a draw. Qatar setting up to be the worst performing hosts in history.
 

CodPiece XL

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South Africa didn’t get out of their group in 2010, but they at least had a win and a draw. Qatar setting up to be the worst performing hosts in history.
If Ecuador could get something from Netherlands today, I’d love to what kind of horsing they would lay on Qatar in the final game.