World Cup Quarterfinals, Day 1--France/Germany, Brazil/Colombia

DLew On Roids

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Arroyo Con Frijoles said:
They targeted James more than Colombia targeted Neymar just this afternoon!
 
Yeah, Neymar was often fouled because he was just faster than anyone the opponents had defending him.  Colombia didn't foul him as much this afternoon because they actually had speed tracking back in Zapata.  
 
Meanwhile DtTtB is basically agreeing with me, saying that Brazil played a physical game because they're bigger than their Latin American opponents.  Well, of course, because that's the team Big Phil chose.  That's what he does.  They came into this tournament planning to beat people up and score with a few flair players.  The stats reflect this.  Defend that as pragmatic if you want, but don't turn around and wail about other sides fouling if you came into the tournament planning to beat everyone up.
 
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DLew On Roids said:
 
 They came into this tournament planning to beat people up and score with a few flair players.
I would love to see evidence of this planning. It could be there, I don't know. It would certainly change my observational opinion of things.
 

theapportioner

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McBride11 said:
After they just rolled him into the bucket, no C-spine precautions. Wow. I guess he wasnt playacting there.

Legitimately scary. Very freak accident to fracture his 3rd vertebrae since the knee appeared low backish. Hopefully no cord damage.
 
They probably mean the 3rd lumbar vertebrae, which would make sense as the point of impact was the lower back. Spinal cord doesn't go down that low, usually.
 

sachmoney

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Feel terrible for the Colombians. I don't know how you can commit 31 fouls in a game and only get 2 yellow cards, but here we are. Just terribly officiated.
 

DLew On Roids

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Dan to Theo to Ben said:
I would love to see evidence of this planning. It could be there, I don't know. It would certainly change my observational opinion of things.
 
I'm sorry, I left all my recordings of Brazil's tactical planning sessions on my other laptop.  Whoops!
 
But maybe you could read this analysis by the BBC's Tim Vickery that anticipated just this tactic being used by Scolari.
 

Bosoxen

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JayMags71 said:
These are the subtle nuances I still miss. How is that possible, considering how many of these players are on European clubs?
 
You can take the player out of Latin America but you can't take the Latin America out of the player. The Latin American will have a tendency to push back when pushed. So what you end up getting is a series of escalations where Player A pushes Player B. Player B pushes back a bit harder a few minutes later. A few minutes later, Player A pushes back again, even harder than the previous retaliation. If, at some point, someone doesn't intervene, the tit for tat will escalate to the point of getting out of hand. You see this a lot in CONMEBOL and CONCACAF (to a lesser degree). If the referee doesn't properly punish hard fouls, what you end up with is an unfortunate hack fest like this afternoon.
 
The European player, on the other hand, doesn't have this tendency as far as I can tell. I guess one can say they're more civilized but we have a saying in Mexico which goes, "El que agandalla, no batalla." Roughly translated, it means, "He who takes advantage, doesn't struggle." You see this a lot on the soccer field where the players will push the envelope until a hard line is drawn by the referee. Today's referee did not do that, which was why I figured things would get out of hand the way they did (though I never could have predicted such a devastating injury).
 

loafnut

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Not a great game but glad the better team won. Unlike chile, Colombia looked to have a pretty cynical game plan to try and outfoul Brazil, getting away from their previous style. Brazil looked more fluid than they have other games. Surprised you all are think the ref was crooked. Colombia fans? From my view it looked like Colombia knew they couldn't hang and just went all Honduras. Then everyone figured out that nothing would be called and the game went to shit.
 

teddykgb

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I don't know that Zunigas foul has much to do with the ref not showing enough cards. It was late in the match and Colombia was just trying to run down every half loose ball. Zuniga fouled him but I don't see it as all that intentional and that contact happens a thousand times every weekend without injury. Seems like awful luck more than anything to me
 
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I looked at the TS goal again, Neymar looks to have slipped/fallen on the celebration. Anyone else see that?
 
I don;'t think it could have contributed to the fractured vertebrae but maybe explains the poorer play. But you never really know.
 

Bosoxen

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Dan to Theo to Ben said:
I looked at the TS goal again, Neymar looks to have slipped/fallen on the celebration. Anyone else see that?
 
I don;'t think it could have contributed to the fractured vertebrae but maybe explains the poorer play. But you never really know.
I did notice him fall. But I don't think that factored into anything. I think he played poorly because Colombia was knocking him around all game. If he'd somehow injured his back in any way at that point, there's no way he plays the rest of the game but even if he does, he's certainly not flopping around like he did. That would have been way too painful.
 

DLew On Roids

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Bosoxen said:
 
You can take the player out of Latin America but you can't take the Latin America out of the player. The Latin American will have a tendency to push back when pushed. So what you end up getting is a series of escalations where Player A pushes Player B. Player B pushes back a bit harder a few minutes later. A few minutes later, Player A pushes back again, even harder than the previous retaliation. If, at some point, someone doesn't intervene, the tit for tat will escalate to the point of getting out of hand. You see this a lot in CONMEBOL and CONCACAF (to a lesser degree). If the referee doesn't properly punish hard fouls, what you end up with is an unfortunate hack fest like this afternoon.
 
 

McBride11

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theapportioner said:
 
They probably mean the 3rd lumbar vertebrae, which would make sense as the point of impact was the lower back. Spinal cord doesn't go down that low, usually.
That would be great if they meant lumbar. But thats pretty crappy to say 3rd vertebrae if they meant L3. Although thatd make a lot more sense. If they meant L3 shoulda said like 22nd vertebrae (c1-7 and t1-12 + L1-3)

Overall still a freak accident. Yea Zuniga played him rough, but I highly doubt he was trying to break his back. Just trying to knock around Bra's best player, like Bra did to HAMES.
 

cjdmadcow

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I was really tired last night so that might explain my thought process but after the 2nd goal went in, I couldn't take watching this Brazil side anymore, switched off and went to bed.
 
To think that by potentially winning the tournament they could be considered to be the equal of the 1970 team or even the losing 1982 side - which is my favourite Brazilian team of all time - sickens me. They have no style and definitely no class and now they have no Neymar. If this tournament was being played anywhere else in the world they wouldn't have even made it out of the group stage.
 
The referee gave one of the greatest performances of all time in how not to officiate in one of the biggest games on the planet. Fernandinho would have got at least 3 bookings if Howard Webb had been in charge and Cesar should have been off when conceding the penalty. As a team they kick, they disrupt, the snear (I'm looking at you, Luiz), they do the dark arts very well, but fuck 'em.
 
I can't believe I'm now rooting for the Germans and if that goes wrong I might possibly have to lend my support to Argentina! What;s the world coming too, for fucks sake, when an Englishman would rather Argentina do well than Brazil?
 

ElUno20

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cjdmadcow said:
I can't believe I'm now rooting for the Germans and if that goes wrong I might possibly have to lend my support to Argentina! What;s the world coming too, for fucks sake, when an Englishman would rather Argentina do well than Brazil?
Not English but I felt the same way watching. Brasil played such a negative game at times that was aided by the ref that I found myself wishing germany would put a beating on them.
 

soxfan121

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soxfan121 said:
This game is well out of the referee's control and at this point, I just hope there isn't a catastrophic injury resulting from a reckless challenge. 
 
Called it.