What would those be?Or perhaps they both realize the potential strategic benefit of saying 6-7 years and Brady has no real intentions of playing that long.
What would those be?Or perhaps they both realize the potential strategic benefit of saying 6-7 years and Brady has no real intentions of playing that long.
Translation: We want him but not for the 11th overall pick plus a big new contract.Saints GM confirms interest in Butler:
Nick UnderhillVerified account @nick_underhill
Mickey Loomis on Malcolm Butler: “We’re kicking the tires, I guess is the best way to describe that. We’ll see how that process works.”
Not sure what that means other than they are interested but we knew that already.
Yeah not much there other than they haven't ruled him out.Saints GM confirms interest in Butler:
Nick UnderhillVerified account @nick_underhill
Mickey Loomis on Malcolm Butler: “We’re kicking the tires, I guess is the best way to describe that. We’ll see how that process works.”
Not sure what that means other than they are interested but we knew that already.
The 21st isn't it?Yeah not much there other than they haven't ruled him out.
We'll see if there is any action after the15th, assuming Butler signs the tender then. I think if the Pats trade him it will either be shortly after he signs the tender or during the draft.
Yep.With the Patriots cap room, its unlikely anyone puts together an offer sheet that we couldn't match. Obviously the numbers could get to a level where we wouldn't match, and then you'd be talking about a team signing Butler to true FA numbers and giving up a 1st to do so. So I think that is unlikely. Sign and trade is probably what is going to happen if it does.
Here's the numbers based on interview/meetings so far.Yep.
http://www.patspulpit.com/2017/3/8/14760310/2017-nfl-draft-has-the-most-cornerback-depth-mike-mayock-has-ever-seen-tabor-king-marlon-Sidney
And Mayock is not alone in this assessment.
Something along those lines is probably right - maybe 5-56 (basically another year at $13M) - essentially something similar to the Gilmore contract (minus $10M or so and some bonus because of the RFA year).What would a "fair" contract extension for Butler look like? I'm thinking 3 years / $39M with $16M of that guaranteed. Including next year's $4M, that would be $43M over the next 4 years with $20M guaranteed.
I understand that this is the agent's position, but it's a dumb one. Why doesn't he just demand to be paid like a quarterback? A supermodel? The CEO of a Fortune 500 company? He isn't in any of these positions, including "UFA"Something along those lines is probably right - maybe 5-56 (basically another year at $13M) - essentially something similar to the Gilmore contract (minus $10M or so and some bonus because of the RFA year).
I think the sticking point has always been the first year and him getting paid "like a UFA" instead of an RFA.
Here's why I think Payton is signaling.I don't see why the extra 'signal' matters to the Pats. A trade ain't happening unless Butler signs his tender, and there's no chance of the Saints giving up anything less than #11 if they submit an offer sheet tp Butler. If the Saints were willing to give up #11, they would've submitted an offer sheet weeks ago.
If the Saints thought another 'signal' to the Pats was necessary or productive then I think they're wasting their energy.
I still don't see why the Pats wouldn't sign him to this contract thoughI can't see the Saints making a top free agent dollar offer to get him, and then having to give up a draft pick on top of that. If that was their plan, they could have signed a free agent corner and drafted one and had two players for essentially the same. The only way this works for the Saints is if they get the first year of a 4 or 5 year deal at the reduced tender amount, and the rest of the contract pays him slightly less than he might make if he signs now instead of a UFA next year. Here's what I'm saying.
Lets assume he's similar to Gilmore, and FA $$ is $13m/yr
A 4 year deal for Butler via sign and trade might look like 4.9/11/12/13 ~ 4@41m. (where a true FA deal might be 4@52m)
The Saints give up the draft pick because 1) he's a proven commodity, and 2) they get him for essentially an $11m discount.
Butler does it because and takes less than market in yrs 2-4 b/c he has no leverage, and he could get hurt or regress this year and never see a true top market FA $$'s.
So if it goes down, I think its a sign and trade and the deal would look something like that 4@41m. Compensation to the Pats is anyone's guess.
Have we confirmed whether Butler gets the full $3.91M if he only plays 6 games? I would think it would only count if he has actually reported to the team. If he skips 10/16 games, he would be giving up nearly $2.5M, if that is the case.The Pats have an enormous amount of leverage. Their only downside is being stuck with a disgruntled Butler for as little as 6 weeks.
I don't either, but it wouldn't be the first time I didn't understand a BB move. Just appears that something is going to happen under the smoke/fire theory. I'd love to have Butler as a #2.I still don't see why the Pats wouldn't sign him to this contract though
I'm pretty sure that whatever contract he signs, be it the full $3.9 or the reduced $660k, would be subject to lost game checks (at 1/16 of the contract per game) should he hold out.Have we confirmed whether Butler gets the full $3.91M if he only plays 6 games? I would think it would only count if he has actually reported to the team. If he skips 10/16 games, he would be giving up nearly $2.5M, if that is the case.
Right, so the chances of him holding out for 10 games and giving up nearly $2.5M - when he hasn't made $2.5M yet in his career - seems pretty slim.I'm pretty sure that whatever contract he signs, be it the full $3.9 or the reduced $660k, would be subject to lost game checks (at 1/16 of the contract per game) should he hold out.
It's also likely that only playing 6 games would depress any free agent offers he gets - so it would likely be significantly more expensive than that.Right, so the chances of him holding out for 10 games and giving up nearly $2.5M - when he hasn't made $2.5M yet in his career - seems pretty slim.
If a Restricted Free Agent described in Subsection 2(b)(i) above has not signed a Player Contract by the Tuesday following the tenth week of the regular season, at 4:00pm New York time, the player shall not play football in the NFL for the remainder of that League Year, absent a showing to the Impartial Arbitrator of extreme Club or extreme personal hardship.
So if no team signs Butler to an offer sheet, his choices are as follows:If a Restricted Free Agent does not play in the NFL in a League Year, his Prior Team shall have the right to tender such player any Qualifying Offer consistent with Section 2(b) prior to the next League Year’s Restricted Free Agent Signing Period. In the event such a Qualifying Offer is tendered, the Prior Team shall have the applicable rights regarding such player according to such Tender, and such player shall have the same rights regarding negotiations with other Clubs as he had the previous League Year
Logan MankinsHolding out also means hes not practicing for those 10 weeks, or training camp, or preseason. Those 6 games most likely aren't going to be particularly pretty.
Has anyone actually held out until week 10? I know a bunch have threatened, but usually the team promises not to franchise and they show up.
That's if he even gets to play much. You never know what happens when you sit out that long. With that said, there is virtually no chance Malcolm sits any part of the season out.Holding out also means hes not practicing for those 10 weeks, or training camp, or preseason. Those 6 games most likely aren't going up.
That's not a 10-game holdout. He played the last 9 games of the regular season, not just the last 6.
where do we know the Pats schedule...?Knowing that the Pats face some good pass offenses next year, I wondered if the last 6 games might be "easier" for the #2CB then the first 10 games.
...
So yea, its not like he could miss the murderers row of good offenses and come in for the last 6 games for a cakewalk.
Comes out in ~3 weekswhere do we know the Pats schedule...?
Got it, my bad. Explains why 30 minutes went by and no one posted Mankins. For some reason I always thought he held out to the last possible week.That's not a 10-game holdout. He played the last 9 games of the regular season, not just the last 6.
I agree with this, and he has every incentive to be a good soldier again and play to the best of his ability. If he plays 2017 on the tender and plays great, he will get a ton of $$ in free agency next year. If he lets anything affect his play, he risks that.Then let him be pissed. We have zero legit reason to think he will be a distraction as he's basically been a perfect soldier so far. We can speculate, but there's no actual reason to think he would be an issue, as so far, he's been a model Patriot. If he actually is upset, let him play with a little fire in his belly, I don't foresee him being a malcontent. If he is, so be it. They offered him a long term deal and security, he chose this route.