Yup. Pretty special that we may have several “forever Patriots” on the squad in guys like Brady, Gronk, DMC, Edelman, Hightower, Slater, etc. I don’t want any of them to play for another team.I think there are very few players who are less likely to be traded than DMac (Brady, Slater, . . . I'm not sure I can think of anyone else). I think BB loves DMac for his physical talents, but more so, by a lot, for his leadership on the field and in the locker room. I'm sure I'm not the only one who noticed that it was DMac in every game giving the pre-game pep talk to the secondary. I think if a team could have only one captain for each phase, and if the coach was in charge of selecting, it would be TB, MS and DMcC.
And as for the depth chart that MMS noted, I think Dawson is considered a CB, not S.
Pretty sure he was practicing at S when he came back. That said, Jones also played S in the Super Bowl. So clearly there is some crossover.And as for the depth chart that MMS noted, I think Dawson is considered a CB, not S.
I'm not sure this is really clear. He played outside corner, slot corner, and safety at different times at Florida and after drafting him people like Caserio stressed that his versatility was a big asset. I kind of doubt he profiles as a single high guy who would eventually replace McCourty but they very easily could see him as a potential Chung replacement, playing some deep zone coverages (if not much single high), playing man on tight ends and slot receivers at times, etc.And as for the depth chart that MMS noted, I think Dawson is considered a CB, not S.
#PositionalVersatilityPretty sure he was practicing at S when he came back. That said, Jones also played S in the Super Bowl. So clearly there is some crossover.
That is the key. I don't know if they envision Jones as a long term answer at safety, but my goodness, they trusted him, playing the position for the first time, in the biggest game of the season - the freaking Super Bowl, and he crushed it.Pretty sure he was practicing at S when he came back. That said, Jones also played S in the Super Bowl. So clearly there is some crossover.
Yeah that versatility is huge. Better backfill for injuries, better able to matchup against an opponent, better to keep QBs guessing at what they're looking at pre snap.That is the key. I don't know if they envision Jones as a long term answer at safety, but my goodness, they trusted him, playing the position for the first time, in the biggest game of the season - the freaking Super Bowl, and he crushed it.
I feel like the way these guys played this past season - especially the second half of the year and the playoffs, that this is probably the best and deepest secondary group I've ever seen.
CB
- Gilmore (28): Best CB in the game and in his prime
- Jackson (23): Looking like he's going to be a stud
- J McCourty (31): Solid vet pro
- Jones (25): Speedster, solid in coverage, versatile
- Dawson (22): Real potential at CB
S
- D McCourty (31): Still a very solid pro
- Chung (31): Tough, plays the run well, solid cover guy on TEs
- Harmon (27): The "closer". Good in pass coverage
- Crossen (22): Tremendous athlete
- Melifonwu (24): Freak athlete, big, fast
I mean, we're not saying that each guy is an all-pro, but as a group, they're fast, skilled, and very versatile. I think they're always looking to add talent to this group but I don't see it as a huge need for 2019.
So many of these guys are key players in the ST coverage units. Meanwhile, the Pats secondary is repeatedly good at open field tackles and limiting YAC. The correlation makes sense as tackling in the open filed on D is pretty similar to doing so on ST. So does one beget the other?That is the key. I don't know if they envision Jones as a long term answer at safety, but my goodness, they trusted him, playing the position for the first time, in the biggest game of the season - the freaking Super Bowl, and he crushed it.
I feel like the way these guys played this past season - especially the second half of the year and the playoffs, that this is probably the best and deepest secondary group I've ever seen.
CB
- Gilmore (28): Best CB in the game and in his prime
- Jackson (23): Looking like he's going to be a stud
- J McCourty (31): Solid vet pro
- Jones (25): Speedster, solid in coverage, versatile
- Dawson (22): Real potential at CB
S
- D McCourty (31): Still a very solid pro
- Chung (31): Tough, plays the run well, solid cover guy on TEs
- Harmon (27): The "closer". Good in pass coverage
- Crossen (22): Tremendous athlete
- Melifonwu (24): Freak athlete, big, fast
I mean, we're not saying that each guy is an all-pro, but as a group, they're fast, skilled, and very versatile. I think they're always looking to add talent to this group but I don't see it as a huge need for 2019.
Anyone know how order is decided on comp picks? I wanted #99 not #101 dammit!Pats get 2 3rds and a 6th, as predicted. I thought they would get a 7th as well, don't see any in the tweet though?
Edit: I see it, 252. So 97, 101, 205, 252
Yes, they canCan comp pickes be traded?
Pats as far as I can tell
1st
2nd
3rd (lions)
3rd comp
3rd comp
4th
5th
6th (comp)
I could see a trade up to grab Hock if he falls into the 20s.Trade value chart says that Pats can get to around #12 or #13 if they trade 32, 56, 64. Obviously not likely given team needs but they do have the ability to get aggressive, especially with 3 #3’s.
Forgot about the Bears and didnt bother with 7 from phone. Seems like i really should figure out this twitter thingYes, they can
For a team that has a lot of strengths (and that just won the Lombardi), they sure have a ton of ammo to improve the squad. It's amazing how different the outlook is for this team than when they were losing to Tennessee and Miami and Pittsburgh.
We don’t see things as they are; we see them as we are.For a team that has a lot of strengths (and that just won the Lombardi), they sure have a ton of ammo to improve the squad. It's amazing how different the outlook is for this team than when they were losing to Tennessee and Miami and Pittsburgh.
God damn that’s a huge Morton’s toe.Re:OBJ
isn’t he like a huge Brady fan? It seems like he comments on almost every Instagram post Brady has
(From last year)
(Via Dov Kleiman)
If he comes to the pats I wouldn’t be shocked if he was somewhat willing to restructure.
Jamison Crowder on the Patriots would be awesome. He always seems to find a way to get openI've always liked Crowder. He fits the profile of the kind of slot guys the Pats like: shifty, agile, and can find soft spots in coverage.
I wouldn't worry about the injuries last season. He only missed one game due to injuries during his first three seasons in the league. He's a slight guy but last year was the only time injuries have kept him off the field for any significant amount of time.
All-pro? Trey Flowers, top-4 DE in the league?That’s a pretty great 4th round with two regular starters, each of whom is right on the verge of All-Pro level.
Am I missing the sarcasm here? I don't think anyone who watches football thinks that KVN is a better football player than Trey Flowers. KVN is underrated, but so is Flowers because he does not rack up "a ton of sacks" which apparently is the only way that you quantify the value of edge defenders. Trey Flowers was the #6 ranked DE according to PFF, KVN #30 ranked LB.All-pro? Trey Flowers, top-4 DE in the league?
I think Van Noy is really underrated and might be a borderline pro bowler, but Flowers? And All-Pro is a whole other level. Basically everyone in that category is nearly a household name with a ton of sacks.
Thuney is a better guard, and both Brown and Cannon better linemen, than Mason. Thuney got a ton of press for taking Aaron Donald one-on-one in the super bowl. Brown is about to have a bidding war for his services. You really think Shaq Mason is easily a pro bowler, and thus in the argument for top-4 guard in the league?
We got great value with the picks, they're good players at great contracts, but let's not go crazy.
You are severely underselling Mason. He's one of the best guards in the NFL, which is the Patriots paid him as such last offseason.All-pro? Trey Flowers, top-4 DE in the league?
I think Van Noy is really underrated and might be a borderline pro bowler, but Flowers? And All-Pro is a whole other level. Basically everyone in that category is nearly a household name with a ton of sacks.
Thuney is a better guard, and both Brown and Cannon better linemen, than Mason. Thuney got a ton of press for taking Aaron Donald one-on-one in the super bowl. Brown is about to have a bidding war for his services. You really think Shaq Mason is easily a pro bowler, and thus in the argument for top-4 guard in the league?
We got great value with the picks, they're good players at great contracts, but let's not go crazy.
Yeah. I agree that Flowers is being oversold in the earlier posts. I have Flowers and Van Noy in the same ballpark, fwiw. But Mason is likely our best lineman. Thuney may be in his vicinity, and Brown/Cannon play more important positions, but Mason is a beast.You are severely underselling Mason. He's one of the best guards in the NFL, which is the Patriots paid him as such last offseason.
I made no statements anything like the bolded. Mischaracterizing an opposing viewpoint may be de rigueur on most of the internet, but it'll tend to keep you a lurker around here.Am I missing the sarcasm here? I don't think anyone who watches football thinks that KVN is a better football player than Trey Flowers. KVN is underrated, but so is Flowers because he does not rack up "a ton of sacks" which apparently is the only way that you quantify the value of edge defenders. Trey Flowers was the #6 ranked DE according to PFF, KVN #30 ranked LB.
As for Mason, he was the #1 ranked Guard according to PFF- ahead of Zack Martin, Quenton Nelson, and yes, even Joe Thuney (ranked 7th). I guess it's possible Flowers and Mason have become overrated by this board, but they are certainly two of our elite players and among the best in the league at their respective positions.
You actually did. By your own logic, Trey Flowers is not a borderline pro-bowler, let alone an All-Pro and cannot possibly be an elite player because he is "not a household name and doesn't rack up a ton of sacks". There are other ways to measure success at Flowers' position outside of name recognition/sexy sacks and by most metrics he is elite.I made no statements anything like the bolded. Mischaracterizing an opposing viewpoint may be de rigueur on most of the internet, but it'll tend to keep you a lurker around here.
I was speaking, as is obvious from my post, about what tends to make DEs a "household name" - think three-time DPOY JJ Watt. Or any non-DB DPOY, frankly.
Mason was considered a highly skilled, athletic guy with solid technique coming out of college, but he's undersized (short and has short arms), and played in an old fashioned, run-heavy, option offense at Georgia Tech. He was a bit of a projection (many thought he would have to play center in the NFL because of his size) and was always viewed as more of a long-term project, which is why he fell to the 4th round. He rarely pass blocked in college. His senior season at Tech I think they threw the ball like a 100 times and ran it over 700. Pass blocking was always going to be a work in the progress, especially out of the gate. Which may be why you remember him struggling more during his first couple seasons.I made no statements anything like the bolded. Mischaracterizing an opposing viewpoint may be de rigueur on most of the internet, but it'll tend to keep you a lurker around here.
I was speaking, as is obvious from my post, about what tends to make DEs a "household name" - think three-time DPOY JJ Watt. Or any non-DB DPOY, frankly.
That PFF thinks Shaq Mason is the #1 guard of 2018 is support for those who think he should be an All-Pro, but I'll also add that most mentions of PFF ratings as dispositive of anything tend to get roundly mocked here. Frankly, I'd sooner talk about win rate for OLs, as at least it's not a black box, even if there's a gray-area for the scoring.
edit: I'm open to arguments that I'm underrating Mason, though let's at least acknowledge that Scarnecchia has a way of making every OL look better than they would under any other coach. But it's certainly possible I'm over-weighting Mason's early years, when it seemed that he was getting beat right left and center, especially his rookie year under DeGuglielmo.
FWIW, Mason was sixth among guards in ESPN's final pass block win rate stats of the season---and I think most of us recognize he's a better run blocker than pass blocker given his college pedigree.That PFF thinks Shaq Mason is the #1 guard of 2018 is support for those who think he should be an All-Pro, but I'll also add that most mentions of PFF ratings as dispositive of anything tend to get roundly mocked here. Frankly, I'd sooner talk about win rate for OLs, as at least it's not a black box, even if there's a gray-area for the scoring.
Because the fit seems so natural, and because I’ve wanted it, and because it hasn’t happened when the opportunities seemed to be there, I’m just going to assume it’s not happening.Golden Tate, free agent, would "love" to play for the Patriots
https://www.si.com/nfl/2019/02/27/golden-tate-would-love-playing-patriots-tom-brady
Totally. He’s only 31 and I have a hard time imagining he’s worse even now than the Hollisters of the world. Seemed like a fun guy and handled the media environment here expertly.I can still access the tweet / video. I'd take him back in a heartbeat if he is serious