And why would the Padres do that?Benintendi for Yates plus five years each of Franmil Reyes and Dinelson Lamet would work for me.
And why would the Padres do that?Benintendi for Yates plus five years each of Franmil Reyes and Dinelson Lamet would work for me.
Please explain to me why San Diego wouldn't laugh and hang up if you offered them Benintendi, a guy you've gone to great lengths to prove to this board secretly sucks, for those three players.Benintendi for Yates plus five years each of Franmil Reyes and Dinelson Lamet would work for me.
Plus Hosmer has a full no trade. They'd have to give him even more to get him to waive it I assume.Man, I can't see that being anywhere near realistic. If Eovaldi is healthy you're not trading him for Yates and Hosmer. If he's not healthy SD isn't taking him. And why would we want Hosmer? He's league average and for that we'd get to pay him $20 million/year until 2022, and potentially have him opt in until 2025?
I mean I agree in the sense that I believe it's a lost season. However, the Sox really don't have any top prospects in terms of viable blue chip guys that can be used as a headliner in a big trade. They pretty much jumped from 30th to 25th. The farm is still really bad but not as bad as they looked rankings wise in spring training.I will be pissed if we trade top prospects.
I don't really need to offer an alternative trade to think that one doesn't make much sense. A 32 year old having a career year isn't a guy I want to get into a bidding war for. And there's no way I offer Eovaldi, who's a better pitcher, for him and agree to take on Hosmer. There's just no way.Feel free to offer up something that makes more sense all around, especially given that SD really has no needs except proven starting pitching and that a bunch of teams with better farm systems would also like Yates.
Come on, man. I never said Beni “secretly sucks.” I qualified again and again across several research-heavy posts that I think he’s good and he has a high floor, but that he was overrated as a star, not improving against LHP, was not a great fit for our park, and there were ample replacements in free agency. All of which has so far turned out to be pretty accurate, no?Please explain to me why San Diego wouldn't laugh and hang up if you offered them Benintendi, a guy you've gone to great lengths to prove to this board secretly sucks, for those three players.
EDIT: In fairness, that trade simulator site says it's closer than I think it is. But I still can't imagine the Padres would go for it.
I’m not disputing your assessment of Benintendi - it convinced me! But that’s also my point - if you can see all of this based on looking at publicly-available data, then it’s probably safe to assume that other teams can too and probably won’t be tripping over themselves to acquire him, especially when he won’t be cheap that much longer. And it also just doesn’t make sense for the Padres - why wouldn’t they just keep Reyes and use Yates to get an MLB-ready SP like Jon Abbey suggests above (since that more closely aligned with their needs)? They’ve got plenty of depth in the outfield. I don’t mean to sound like I’m picking on you here, because you’re not the only one, but I feel like I’m constantly seeing trade proposals that only benefit the Red Sox.Come on, man. I never said Beni “secretly sucks.” I qualified again and again across several research-heavy posts that I think he’s good and he has a high floor, but that he was overrated as a star, not improving against LHP, was not a great fit for our park, and there were ample replacements in free agency. All of which has so far turned out to be pretty accurate, no?
I think SD would more likely want to get rid of the Will Meyers contract. They seem to like Hosmer thereThe same reason BOS and HOU bid big on him this past winter, plus they’d be moving Hosmer’s deal.
Very (very) easy to poke holes in my idea but very difficult to come up with one that makes sense for both teams.
I’d rather sell than stand pay honestly. But I know I am in the minority and that it won’t happenI'm hoping they stand pat. None of the assets I'd be comfortable trading will fetch much in return, and I also don't want them trading more young players for a reliever. Get into the playoffs with one of the best offenses in baseball, hope Sale and Price step it up, use starters to supplement the bullpen and let the chips fall where they may.
They have 10 games until the deadline.I’d rather sell than stand pay honestly. But I know I am in the minority and that it won’t happen
Barnes would probably get a decent return despite what some people on this board think.They're not going to get much of anything for:
Porcello (ineffective and expensive)
Moreland (injured)
Pearce (injured and ineffective)
Eovaldi (injured and expensive)
I guess we could trade:
Holt (fan favorite)
Mookie (face of the franchise)
Price (expensive)
JBJ (too inconsistent to fetch much IMO)
JDM (down year, expensive)
I'd rather they ride out the season and try to make some noise in a short playoff series or three than worry about the marginal returns we'd get for these guys.
In those 10 games we getThey have 10 games until the deadline.
They go 5-5 or worse, and I'm with you about selling.
I wouldn’t do it. But to not even consider given his insistence to go to FA is the ludicrous thing. Maybe that’s the kyrie talking tho@Chad Finn nails it right here. If posted elsewhere, Dopes please delete.
Nice write-up.
https://www.boston.com/sports/boston-red-sox/2019/07/22/mookie-betts-trade
I can kinda see the logic in judging things based on the next 10-14 games because those two teams are the ones the Sox are pursuing. 5-5 or 7-7 puts them back where they are right now, most likely. A winning record means they're gaining ground.In those 10 games we get
3 @ TB
4 at home to NYY
3 at home to TB
4 @ NYY after that.
5 and 5 over the next 10 and split the next 4 wouldn’t throw it in for me because, for one thing, it has to get easier, and it does.
What's different? SF has won plenty over the past decade also and have that same entitled attitude now. All I'm saying is that a team like Pittsburg, Tampa, Cincinnati, etc... would never imagine looking to unload their present talent (and possible future stars) to "reload" at 2.5 games out of of the Wild Card with more than 2 months remaining. It's a ridiculous attitude to have.That's funny, because the SF Giants are 2.5 out of the WC and their fans are DYING for the team to trade MadBum and their best relievers in order to be better-situated for the future.
For Sox fans, it's not arrogance - it's understanding that paying some exorbitant amount for a closer they should've acquired in the off-season is just going to compound a prior mistake.
So would Workman, a guy that they might be selling high on. I can’t believe he’s going to maintain his sub-2.00 ERA, and he’s right about at the point in his career where a lot of relievers go off the deep end, especially ones with a Tommy John surgery already under their belt.Barnes would probably get a decent return despite what some people on this board think.
I hadn't been thinking of Workman as a trade chip but you're right. In fact, he might be their most valuable chip based on the season he's having, at least in terms of pitchers and players that would be worth dealing if they decide to cash out on the season. He might actually bring back something of true value (and I don't mean the hardware store).So would Workman, a guy that they might be selling high on. I can’t believe he’s going to maintain his sub-2.00 ERA, and he’s right about at the point in his career where a lot of relievers go off the deep end, especially ones with a Tommy John surgery already under their belt.
Don't know whether that's just being too honest, or it's a subtle way of saying "We know you love Boston, Mookie. Make you salary demands more realistic or find yourself in Seattle."DD was asked on WEEI about the possibility of trading Mookie Betts and he didn't exactly shoot it down.
"Ever trading any player, I've always said you always consider trading any player you possibly have," Dombrowski noted. "When I was with Detroit Miguel Cabrera was the MVP and you're in the position where he won the Triple Crown. I used to say would I would trade Miguel Cabrera, yeah I would trade Miguel Cabrera because if you could get two Miguel Cabreras for one you would do that. So it doesn't happen very often but you have to be open-minded. So, sure, could you ever do that with any player the answer would be, 'Yes.' Is it likely, most likely not but, again, you can never tell what happens with any particular player."
"I think he likes Boston. I think he would like to stay here. But I think that everybody also understands there are finances that are involved in every decision every free agent makes."
https://weei.radio.com/blogs/rob-bradford/mlb-trade-deadline-dave-dombrowski-says-there-has-been-no-mandates-regarding
I dont really get a hidden-message vibe from Dombrowski. And the last thing he needs to do is inspire some "hometown-discount" talk 18 months before he's a FA. As long as mookie reads what he actually said, and doesn't rely on the "interpretation" of some radio moron ("The only way to read Dumbrowski's comments is that he hopes mookie dies so the Sox never have to pay him. What do you think? Let's take our first call from Igor in the porta-john near Stoughton"), I think BMMH is probably right. It's a business (Mookie already said that), and both sides have to do what they consider best for themselves.Don't know whether that's just being too honest, or it's a subtle way of saying "We know you love Boston, Mookie. Make you salary demands more realistic or find yourself in Seattle."
I think it's a reasonable and perhaps more or less conscious rejoinder to Mookie's quote from the other day. Both guys basically saying they would be happy for Mookie to stay in Boston but they're not going to foreclose prematurely on the alternatives. Que sera sera, people will make the best choices available as they arise, and we'll see where he is when the dust settles.Don't know whether that's just being too honest, or it's a subtle way of saying "We know you love Boston, Mookie. Make you salary demands more realistic or find yourself in Seattle."
I read it that way too, but there’s not a single player in the Mariners organization that could lead a package for Mookie.Don't know whether that's just being too honest, or it's a subtle way of saying "We know you love Boston, Mookie. Make you salary demands more realistic or find yourself in Seattle."
WOOHOO! I might actually go to a few Mariner games.Don't know whether that's just being too honest, or it's a subtle way of saying "We know you love Boston, Mookie. Make you salary demands more realistic or find yourself in Seattle."
I'd like to see the Sox start to live up to their potential (which is a World Series victory).I'd love to see a forward looking move from the Red Sox that would shed a bunch of salary and restock the system. Not sure which players that would include, but I think you could remix this whole thing really quickly and not lose too many seasons.
Theo would love to have him. The Brewers are always looking to add bats. Hell, he'd look awfully good in the Cleveland outfield.A contender would give up more for Mookie now, to get him for two potential playoff pushes. Which contender(s)? I don't know. St. Louis could do it, even after getting and extending Goldy. The top 3 in the NL East. Oakland has done similar trades in the past.
I’m not sure what a realistic Mookie package would look like, but I’d only be interested in moving him if we were getting cost controlled players with high floors and moderately high ceilings. A Red Sox equivalent package would be Devers before this season and Eduardo Rodriguez. And even then, my judgement might be clouded by Devers’ breakout.I don't think he'll get traded. But just for discussion purposes: what do people think he'd bring back in a trade?
You're overestimating the value of a guy--even a guy as good as Mookie--who only has a year and change left before FA and will likely earn >$25M, maybe $30M next year. There are probably few if any teams in baseball that couldn't put together a very fair offer for Mookie. The list that's much shorter is the teams that would see any point in doing so right now.I read it that way too, but there’s not a single player in the Mariners organization that could lead a package for Mookie.
I agree with you and that’s what the rest of my post said. I’m just throwing shade at the Mariners.You're overestimating the value of a guy--even a guy as good as Mookie--who only has a year and change left before FA and will likely earn >$25M, maybe $30M next year. There are probably few if any teams in baseball that couldn't put together a very fair offer for Mookie. The list that's much shorter is the teams that would see any point in doing so right now.
Restock the system?I'd love to see a forward looking move from the Red Sox that would shed a bunch of salary and restock the system. Not sure which players that would include, but I think you could remix this whole thing really quickly and not lose too many seasons.
I have a feeling at the end of the season, Red Sox ownership is going to say to themselves "You know what, we screwed up by cheaping out on the bullpen - luxury tax or no luxury tax". Yes, I totally understand the rationale behind not resigning Kelly and Kimbrel, but most of the way through the season it's pretty clear that the Sox would be serious contenders for a championship if not for the bullpen problems (yes, there have been other issues - but still). Bottom line is, one doesn't get that many chances to win championships - even here in championship town. It's a shame they are very likely going to waste a year of the prime years of Mookie et al.In the last 10 or 15 years, we've all kind of convinced ourselves (in every sport, not just baseball) that the future is where it's at. "Blow it up and build for the future!" "Trade all the veterans and find some kids who can play!" It's bullshit thinking. Right now, the Boston Red Sox are presently in their future. Despite the down season, their window is still open. Dave Dombrowski completely screwed up this offseason by not building a good bullpen, you don't compound that folly by trading away a building block. You either a. ride this season and do better in the offseason or b. trade the prospects you have to fix it. Trading one of the above (maybe not Chavis) just to "restock the system" especially when their is a log jam of young talent in front of them is dumb.
Thor for Kyle Tucker and some lower prospects would seemingly make a lot of sense. Houston should be all over this.Syndergaard is reportedly on the block for real. he's the one guy I'd sell low-ish on Beni for, if the dysfunctional Mets would bite. (and it would probably hurt a lot more than Beni)
Ken Rosenthal@Ken_Rosenthal
1h
An option #Metsare exploring, per sources: Trading Syndergaard and signing Wheeler to an extension. NYM would benefit from return for Syndergaard while keeping Wheeler, a quality starting pitcher who otherwise would depart in free agency.
@TheAthleticMLB
Buster Olney
@Buster_ESPN
36m
Rival evaluators say they believe the Mets are fully intent on dealing Noah Syndergaard before the trade deadline. "It's beyond listening," said one. "They want to move him."
Marc Carig
@MarcCarig
16m
Impression is that trading for Noah Syndergaard would require a top 30 prospect and a couple of other solid pieces, one rival exec said earlier today.
The Sox would be serious contenders for a championship if not for the ROTATION problems.I have a feeling at the end of the season, Red Sox ownership is going to say to themselves "You know what, we screwed up by cheaping out on the bullpen - luxury tax or no luxury tax". Yes, I totally understand the rationale behind not resigning Kelly and Kimbrel, but most of the way through the season it's pretty clear that the Sox would be serious contenders for a championship if not for the bullpen problems (yes, there have been other issues - but still). Bottom line is, one doesn't get that many chances to win championships - even here in championship town. It's a shame they are very likely going to waste a year of the prime years of Mookie et al.
Yep. Bullpen was terrific until the stress of overuse starting taking its toll.The Sox would be serious contenders for a championship if not for the ROTATION problems.
There, fixed that for you.
yea there are so may teams that match up better for Thor than we do. Tucker and some other top 100 guys would do it. That team would steamroll through the playoffsThor for Kyle Tucker and some lower prospects would seemingly make a lot of sense. Houston should be all over this.
Just like last year.yea there are so may teams that match up better for Thor than we do. Tucker and some other top 100 guys would do it. That team would steamroll through the playoffs