Watching the analysis on the SVP Sportscenter, the analyst onsite and Van Pelt both said that call "sucked".
2023-2024 Women’s College Basketball
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Watching the foul call, Iowa was playing great D. Would have loved to see what would have happened if that play had continued. Sigh. Looking forward to Sunday. Hope it’s a good one.
Great season and we actually overachieved at the end. Congrats to Iowa - they made the shots down the stretch. Please find a way to beat SC
Sources familiar with the thinking of Bam Adebayo say he thinks that screen was perfectly legal. Back to you.
I'll be with you. Edwards did move into Marshall. It was particularly obvious on the one camera angle from behind Marshall that Edwards stepped out and only set her feet when Marshall hit her.
Normally they don't make that call and then it gets argued endlessly the other way.
She also made a ginormous 3 near the end of the game.
I don’t 100% hate that call. In slo-mo it looked totally awful but in real time (which the refs are watching) it looked like Edwards threw her elbow out – just a bit but hard. It was just enough so that with Marshall coming hard around the screen she was kind of redirected, which the refs are going to see.
Even still not a call I probably ever make in that situation.
So proud of the UConn team. They did an amazing job all season and it was an incredible performance just getting to the Final Four. Getting robbed of a chance to win it in the end (zero guarantee they pull it out but it would have been nice to see them get a chance) hurts, but maybe saves them from a serious beatdown by South Carolina in the title game, which I'm 98% sure would have happened.
Losing Muhl and Edwards will hurt next year but they've got a really good recruiting class, they're returning Paige and all the injured players, and hopefully they'll be one of the top teams in the country again.
Losing Muhl and Edwards will hurt next year but they've got a really good recruiting class, they're returning Paige and all the injured players, and hopefully they'll be one of the top teams in the country again.
I mean, it’s like the holding call on the decomposing corpse of JuJu Smith-Schuster in the Eagles-Chiefs Super Bowl that can be metaphysically defended since the player isn’t as still as a Buckingham Palace guard, but isn’t really called.
Definitely looked like a foul in real time. Not so much in slow motion.
South Carolina will have issues (again) with Iowa, which is a much worse matchup for them than UConn . I cheer for USC, but we all know what happened last year and they continue to struggle with teams with 3point shooters. Clark obviously needs to play a lot better. .
South Carolina will have issues (again) with Iowa, which is a much worse matchup for them than UConn . I cheer for USC, but we all know what happened last year and they continue to struggle with teams with 3point shooters. Clark obviously needs to play a lot better. .
FTR, they rarely make this type of call in this situation in the mens game and it's a big source of contention among W fans that men "get away with more" than women do. Or, that the womens game is officiated differently. I can see the counterarguments but I'm just calling attention to many fans' and analysts' frustrations of how technical and exacting the womens game is called compared to mens.
I was at an event with the sound down and nobody had any idea what happened and then there were not many replays. Kind of stunk that there were like 100 people totally riveted by a women’s college basketball game standing around being like “what the fuck”?
It is as bad to decide a game with a no call of a call that should be made as to call a foul that did not happen, and I don’t know which that was but it is so disappointing the game did not end with a make or miss attempt. If the call is there you have to make it, but darn was that a momentum stopper in a situation that was tracking to be classic.
I guess nobody will care on Sunday.
It is as bad to decide a game with a no call of a call that should be made as to call a foul that did not happen, and I don’t know which that was but it is so disappointing the game did not end with a make or miss attempt. If the call is there you have to make it, but darn was that a momentum stopper in a situation that was tracking to be classic.
I guess nobody will care on Sunday.
The game didn’t end on a make/miss because Connecticut couldn’t rebound a missed free throw
A few minutes earlier Clark lowered her shoulder and blasted Arnold off the ball and made a pull up jumper. Does anyone think for one second that if Clark set that screen that she'd be called for the foul in that situation?
Zero. Point. Zero. Percent. would that be called against Clark.
Zero. Point. Zero. Percent. would that be called against Clark.
Agreed. But if it was hockey, Edwards would have gotten 5 minutes and a game misconduct for boarding.
This. All that terrible call did was take away a UConn chance to win it at the end. But even with the call, UConn had a chance for the rebound down two with several seconds left and a time out. Get the rebound, call TO, get the ball at half court, and you still have time to run something.
But nope. Couldn't get the rebound and that ended their season.
One point game is way more exciting. It’s like practically the most exciting thing in sports when the ball is in the air at the buzzer in a one-point game.
I was not able to pay much attention to the whole game, but it would actually be kind of interesting to know how many offensive fouls were called in the first 39:55 of the game. If it was like four or five, the game end would be a little easier to take than if it was like 1.
Looks like 2 offensive fouls called (per the play-by-play), both in the first half.
At 6:06 of the 2nd quarter they called an illegal screen on Nika Muhl, who wasn't moving at all.
At 3:56 of the 2nd quarter they called an illegal screen on KK Arnold, who was moving so that was legit, even though it was a bit soft.
And then the foul on Edwards.
So despite Clark running Muhl off a thousand screens all night, Iowa didn't get called for a single offensive foul all game long. Not one. UConn got called for three: one was legit (Arnold), one was a total phantom (Muhl), and one was the call at the end on Edwards.
It was an objectively awful call to make in any situation let alone there. The officiating benefited Iowa most of the night. KK Arnold gets called for a foul when she touched nobody. Ruined what was one of Geno’s great coaching jobs of his career.
Same boat but I believe all illegal screens were called on UConn despite Iowa setting a bazillion of them.
Man, Geno approached the game like we all knew he would. Unlike, LSU, he had them get up in Clark's face at 50-feet and face guard her. Force her right when she had the ball bc she shoots best off her left hand dribble just like KD (and many great right-handed shooters). Maybe give up a drive or two but with active help and backside rotation force the others to beat you. It's not brilliant but it's necessary and doable and he did it unlike Mulkey. The key is that he got them motivated to do it and you could tell. Their bounciness of defense was electric right from the get-go.
Yeah the game plan tonight was great, but my bigger point was that he got a team with basically 3 players in Paige-Aaliyah-Muhl to the brink of a national title. That team was devastated by injuries but he did a great job.
Sure but you’re not giving enough credit to KK who played her ass off from the jump, hit foul shots and got jobbed by the refs, all as a freshman. Arguably the best player on the court tonight.
By the absolute letter of the law, it was probably a foul, but the great Bill Raftery calls a cheap foul a "nickel-dimer." That wasn't even nickel-dime. That was penny-nickel. It's like a cop giving a ticket to someone driving 58 mph in a 55 mph zone on a dry highway.
It should be a no-harm, no-foul. As Diana Taurasi said, "It didn't even get her open."
It should be a no-harm, no-foul. As Diana Taurasi said, "It didn't even get her open."
It did get her open, though, and forced another player to rotate off their woman.
Definitely a foul, though obviously an argument can be made in context to let it go, most notably because they let it go almost the entire game. But it 100% did give Uconn an illegal advantage on the play.
Watching PTI on YT from Tuesday and Tony called Caitlin an ok three-point shooter but not great. And, he made it a point of emphasis: "She's not a great shooter. She's not Steph Curry."
I can't even tell you how her range is what it is, how she can shoot off balance and leaning, and shoot vs. perfectly coached contests. I rooted hard for UConn tonight but... I mean, men, come the F on. WTF? Just go away dinosaurs.
I can't even tell you how her range is what it is, how she can shoot off balance and leaning, and shoot vs. perfectly coached contests. I rooted hard for UConn tonight but... I mean, men, come the F on. WTF? Just go away dinosaurs.
This tracks. Had a player a couple years ago who went on to play in college in Canada and she has said she was treated way better there as an athlete there than she was here.
I have a feeling that this may change/is changing. Any AD or college president would have to be a fool to not see what’s going on in womens sports and especially college hoops. The men’s tournament is an afterthought this year. The buzz is all on the women’s side and the numbers will bear that out.
plus, with the WNBA (stupidly imo) at only 12 teams, so there are fewer spots for graduating seniors, and the advent of NIL, the incentives for women to stay in school longer are there- it will probably give schools more bang for the buck, recruiting-wise, to prioritize a good women’s squad that will stay for 4 years over a bunch of one and done men.
I’ve noted that I’ve seen a lot less of this kind of condescending “this is not bad for women’s sports” kind of thing. The guys that I hear, in my office, out and about, friends etc are talking about Clark and the women’s tourney generally no differently than if it were NFL NBA etc. including many Clark admiration societies but also general appreciation of SC’s dominance, UConn’s overachieving to get here, Reese v Clark as a great story etc. I’ve got a whiff of the kind of thing you mention but it’s been noteworthy by how little of it I’ve seen.
I have a 14 yo daughter who plays softball so I’m attuned to this and she certainly brings it to my attention. According to her, the boys in school are all taking about the women, not the men at all.
Also I caught PTI fir the first time in years (?) the other day and I was shocked by how old they both looked. I’m not an ageist but it does seem like these fellas’ opinions have ossified and they’re in Granpa Simpson mode.
True but not only are there more spots for men in the NBA, there are currently more competing options for 18 yo men. For now, good women are probably dollar for dollar higher yield recruiting targets, now that women’s hoops is paying off in serious buzz, attendance, and eyeballs, just because women have fewer options.
This was such a physical game. SC would be favored against anyone in any circumstance but with them coasting and Iowa and UConn beating each other up all night, yeah.
I was rooting for UCONN but that was 100% a foul. Even in slow motion, this was a no-brainer call:
https://twitter.com/SportzAssassin/status/1776460338591920545
https://twitter.com/SportzAssassin/status/1776460338591920545
This and I’m surprised at the reaction. It’s a huge drag that it basically decided the game, but it’s an obvious foul
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The more I see the replay, in real time you can see Edwards lean and kind of body check the Iowa player. With a little time for my emotions to cool, yeah it was a foul. It wasn’t egregious, but Edwards did move into her. So by the book, a foul.
That said, I still am very frustrated by the call because
(1) they called UConn for 18 fouls to just 9 for Iowa,
(2) they didn’t call a single offensive foul on Iowa all night on a moving screen when they set a million of them for Clark and in no way were all of them perfectly legal (yes I rewatched), and
(3) earlier in the quarter Clark drove and buried her shoulder into Arnold, knocking her back a few feet and opening up space to make a short jumper. Clear offensive foul and no call.
So the tone of the game, the way the game was being reffed, the lack of calls against Iowa all night long, and the way that call robbed us of a potentially epic finish still have me unhappy.
But I’m more unhappy with UConn not securing the missed free throw. THAT was inexcusable.
That said, I still am very frustrated by the call because
(1) they called UConn for 18 fouls to just 9 for Iowa,
(2) they didn’t call a single offensive foul on Iowa all night on a moving screen when they set a million of them for Clark and in no way were all of them perfectly legal (yes I rewatched), and
(3) earlier in the quarter Clark drove and buried her shoulder into Arnold, knocking her back a few feet and opening up space to make a short jumper. Clear offensive foul and no call.
So the tone of the game, the way the game was being reffed, the lack of calls against Iowa all night long, and the way that call robbed us of a potentially epic finish still have me unhappy.
But I’m more unhappy with UConn not securing the missed free throw. THAT was inexcusable.
Great chat back and forth. I don't have much to add besides this: Iowa committed 8 turnovers in the first quarter (16 total). In any sport, if I see a team play below their level for a segment of game, and their opponent does not take full advantage, it's an awful omen. It's safe to think that Iowa would not finish with 30+ turnovers and their total performance gets closer to the mean.
If Gino rewatches the game, I believe he will see being up 5 after the 1st quarter as the big missed opportunity they needed to bury Iowa early.
I have so much respect for him. To get so close to another title with 6 players injured is not surprising based on his career. A real GOAT in sports history for coaching.
If Gino rewatches the game, I believe he will see being up 5 after the 1st quarter as the big missed opportunity they needed to bury Iowa early.
I have so much respect for him. To get so close to another title with 6 players injured is not surprising based on his career. A real GOAT in sports history for coaching.
He's also mellowed a bit, which is nice to see. I can't imagine him saying this 15 years ago
"We didn't deserve to win the game by the way we played the last couple of possessions"
100%. My daughter is an assistant D1 BB coach and she’s at the final four right now and we were texting during the game and we were both absolutely rueing the fact that UConn didn’t have like a 15 point first Q lead. Clark was way off and Iowa had so many TOs and yes UConn had the lead but it should have been so much more.
Of course on the flip side, UConn themselves had a bunch of TOs and Paige was off so it was kind of fortunate that UConn was up at all. So it kinda cut both ways there.
I give Iowa credit for coming back from 12 down to take a 9 point lead. Amazing. But then I give UConn a ton of credit to come back from 9 down in the last few minutes to be down just 1 point with the ball with 10 seconds to go.
Not the prettiest game you’ll ever see but it was super intense and a great overall contest.
One coaching change I’d have made if I was Geno would have been to feed Edwards in the post a lot earlier. They couldn’t stop her but they only started that in the fourth Q. She got like zero post touches before then.
BJ pointing out that UConn had twice the number of fouls, and VT that UConn had Iowa staggered early and didn’t knock them out- different facets of the same story- UConn had a brilliant game plan to frustrate Clark and Iowa defensively that depended on being extremely physical.
But can you keep that up for 40 minutes, with a) stamina, b) foul trouble c) Iowa adjusting. On an and b, Geno didnt use his bench - Brady play 15 minutes as the only sub and otherwise his starters were in the whole game. Iowa adjusting, it was a simple change to start the second half- Clark wasn’t bringing the ball up the court anymore- that threw UConn, you can’t key off Clark as easily if shes moving without the ball.
But can you keep that up for 40 minutes, with a) stamina, b) foul trouble c) Iowa adjusting. On an and b, Geno didnt use his bench - Brady play 15 minutes as the only sub and otherwise his starters were in the whole game. Iowa adjusting, it was a simple change to start the second half- Clark wasn’t bringing the ball up the court anymore- that threw UConn, you can’t key off Clark as easily if shes moving without the ball.
I thought Clark brought the ball up a lot more in the second half? Martin did it in most of the first half and I thought was kind of responsible for a lot of those turnovers. With Clark taking it up, at least you ensured she got a touch, could drive, etc.
I could be wrong but I noticed that immediately at the start of the second half.
