Honestly think he needs to flop more. He was taking the shit kicking he got down the stretch straight up. Snap the head back and fall down a few times and you might get a call.
3/25 - Celtics @ Hawks
- Thread starter DeJesus Built My Hotrod
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Except for like 70% of the games this season, this is exactly on point.
Jesus folks, this game literally doesnt matter. They missed every shot they took.
If White and Holiday get hurt, and Hauser forgets how to shoot a basketball, they might struggle in the playoffs. That's pretty much the only takeaway from this.
His whining bothers me, too, but in Tatum's defense, Wes Matthews and other Hawks were allowed to hack the shit out of him in the fourth quarter. At the other end, the officials blew the whistle on every touch foul.
He's been whiner since his first game as a pro. He's probably not going to change, and the refs are never going to give him the superstar treatment.
I just wish in the final minutes they weren't adverse in trying to move the ball around to find an open man instead of having either Tatum or Brown trying to do it all by themselves.
Welp, glad this game came on March 25th and not April 25th. Learning experience for all involved.
I don't disagree, but it doesn't help his cause when every drive all game and really all year he's complaining. The refs have tuned him out.
A gross game but at the same time, we have Jrue and White for these games to settle things down when they count (hopefully).
The Jays, left to their own devices down the stretch, unfortunately are unable to stop the slowdown ISO-ball in the last 5 minutes of the 4th. It's painful to watch.
Fair enough, bad take after an embarrassing loss. I admittedly don't watch every game, but they routinely allow teams to comeback and win games when they should be stepping on throats. Maybe it's just the games I watch.
Yep all true. But hey when you invest your Monday evening on a meaningless game in March and it goes south, tempting to get in some pitchfork practice sigh.
Joe is def intentional with whatever he’s practicing with his lineups tho. No Tillman today and only 9 mins from Kornet.
Yet big minutes from Horford and Zinger with the double big.
yeah.. it's Tatum's fault that he doesn't get calls... unlike all of those other guys that never bitch, never sneer and are always joking around with the refs.. wait, who are those guys exactly? And why can't refs just call fouls when they happen and not have to be pandered to all the fucking time?
NBA games have become a series of streaks. The Celtics have been pretty unique in that it very rarely happens to them
So then what is it about Tatum that keeps him from getting the calls? It’s obviously something.
Point is, you have to figure that out. Someone like Butler obviously has. What is that?
I think you’re kind of agreeing with what @k-factory said.
I really don’t understand how Tatum doesn’t get more calls. I don’t know what he can do to change it
Do you watch any other NBA games? What Tatum does in regards to the ref is basically standard if not docile. And he's definitely improved over the years... the only problem is that he's not getting calls that he should. I tend to think that isn't his fault and is instead incompetent reffing.
At this point it just doesn't make sense. Tatum becomes ineffective when he's held or shoved or hand checked when he goes down the lane.. as would any forward. No other star is hacked as often as Tatum is at this point...and quite often he plays through it, but at some point it's got to be beyond frustrating.
So many calls in the NBA are reflexive by the refs mostly about positioning and separation and Tatum just doesn’t create a ton of positional or separation advantages that become automatic foul calls. Hawks players were really physical with him high and doing a lot of hand checking and what not but Tatum does a ton of that too and refs tend to let it cancel out with him for whatever reason. In the end I don’t think he gets a friendly whistle because he doesn’t beat guys as cleanly as other superstars where the guy who basically “lost” is doing more desperate things to try to regain advantage
He's a top three whiner in the NBA. If you think that refs don't hold that against him, (at least subconsciously) then we just have to disagree.
Let's hope the Jays will allow White and Holiday—and, God forbid, maybe even Porzingis—to touch the ball occasionally in those situations.
I honestly have no idea at this point... because he's getting the shit hacked out of him going down the lane quite often and it just doesn't make sense. It's not a speed thing, it's not that it isn't obvious... it's either incompetent or crooked officiating.
Giannis does as much complaining as Tatum does, but the NBA has decided he's the golden boy.. who was the last Celtic to get anywhere close to the same whistle as Giannis or Butler or LeBron? It feels like they haven't had that since maybe Pierce?
HA. This is absolutely ridiculous... how would you even quantify that? LeBron, Harden, Draymond, Beverley... that's four without even trying.
edit: if one watches any other NBA games you see what Tatum does in every single game.. and he is very rarely seen talking to the refs. He may wave his hand after not getting a foul call, but every single player does that... how many times a game do you even see him talking to the refs? With players like the ones I mentioned you see them talking to or yelling at the refs five or six times a game during stoppages. The idea that Tatum is somehow one of the most egregious whiners in the NBA is an opinion I only see in the game threads and threads on this board.
I listen to a decent amount of the opposing team radio and TV calls. Many of them think Tatum is one of the worst whiners in the game. I hear it all the time.
Unfortunately, I do think it's gotten pretty bad. I wouldn't say top 3 in the NBA (I actually think Jokic is one of the worst also) but Tatum is definitely much worse than average. Some games he's incapable of driving without yelling at the refs on the way back down the court.
It's not a good look and I don't think it's helpful. He can't point out when he actually is fouled anymore.
Maybe Mazzulla needs to work the refs better in-game, or take a fine every now and then and call them out specifically with regards to Tatum. We also don’t know what goes on behind the scenes as far as sending in tapes and putting pressure on the league office to watch for x, y and z.
I'm pretty happy I didn't see any of this.
View: https://twitter.com/NBCSCeltics/status/1772448082082283865
"It's a really good lesson. You let a team hang around... credit to them for battling back" Joe Mazzulla on the loss to the Hawks
View: https://twitter.com/ChrisForsberg_/status/1772451271892410669
If you were hoping the Celtics had learned from the 19-dribble Tatum fadeaway in Cleveland, here’s what I believe is a 23-dribble possession for Jaylen Brown where nothing develops and he’s forced to rush up a bad shot after Atlanta pulled ahead late.
View: https://twitter.com/NBCSCeltics/status/1772448082082283865
"It's a really good lesson. You let a team hang around... credit to them for battling back" Joe Mazzulla on the loss to the Hawks
View: https://twitter.com/ChrisForsberg_/status/1772451271892410669
If you were hoping the Celtics had learned from the 19-dribble Tatum fadeaway in Cleveland, here’s what I believe is a 23-dribble possession for Jaylen Brown where nothing develops and he’s forced to rush up a bad shot after Atlanta pulled ahead late.
Yeah.. and Tatum is a top three whiner. OK.
edit: i did say incompetent initially. I don't think you've offered more of an explanation other than 'Tatum whines so he doesn't get calls'.. which is seemingly not that much better of an explanation in my mind?
SO.. NBA refs probably aren't crooked, BUT Scott Foster is still working in this league and the investigation into him was weak if non-existent. But there's really no reason for the Celts to be on the wrong side of getting or not getting calls, and it really doesn't make sense that refs are biased against them, but I guess the only reason Tatum doesn't get treated the same way as other top five players is because he complains too much, but as radsoxfan said, Jokic complains a ton as well. Seems like there isn't particularly any correlation between calls and complaining as far as I can tell.
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Routinely is a nice word for a team that has lost 15 games out of 72 and has a net differential of +11.5...a very accurate take.
Giannis and Jokic have both won championships. Maybe once Tatum clears that threshold he gets more ref respect.
But plenty of other good players do, that haven’t won championships.
I come back to Butler because he’s a guy that gets away with a lot but gets a favorable whistle. Rarely is he jawing at the refs. Most of the time he walks away. For as much fire as that guy has he’s incredibly poised with the refs.
Meanwhile Tatum gets exasperated at every touch and when he does get a call his body language screams “finally you effing idiots called something.”
He’s obviously great but this feels like a piece that he needs to resolve. Because the frustration bleeds into his game and the team’s overall temperament particularly without the calming influence of DWhite or Holiday.
Once an opposing team gets under his skin with physical play up high and see it working they will keep doing it (was surprised they didn’t leverage Zinger in the post more to counteract).
In the playoffs the refs will allow even more contact so for this run would love to see Tatum not get derailed.
It’s just one game and all but if we are going to nitpick on possible gaps this is one where our guy can still grow.
But plenty of other good players do, that haven’t won championships.
I come back to Butler because he’s a guy that gets away with a lot but gets a favorable whistle. Rarely is he jawing at the refs. Most of the time he walks away. For as much fire as that guy has he’s incredibly poised with the refs.
Meanwhile Tatum gets exasperated at every touch and when he does get a call his body language screams “finally you effing idiots called something.”
He’s obviously great but this feels like a piece that he needs to resolve. Because the frustration bleeds into his game and the team’s overall temperament particularly without the calming influence of DWhite or Holiday.
Once an opposing team gets under his skin with physical play up high and see it working they will keep doing it (was surprised they didn’t leverage Zinger in the post more to counteract).
In the playoffs the refs will allow even more contact so for this run would love to see Tatum not get derailed.
It’s just one game and all but if we are going to nitpick on possible gaps this is one where our guy can still grow.
You're holding down a 10.5 game lead on the #1 seed with 12 left to play. The regular season in terms of significance is over. However:
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The number of minutes Horford, Brown and Tatum played respectively. There's a heavy load of 4 games this week (and the next two).... why the hell are we playing these guys such heavy minutes? I love the load management exercise of someone sitting a night or two due to an ingrown hair or sprained liver muscle, but dammit if someone goes down hurt for the playoffs it's going to look pretty silly to be working these guys so much for meaningless games. I want to see the Maine Celtics play for 20 minutes a night...i could care less finishing over .800 or breaking the C's win record. You play around with that shit when you have a title or two under your belt.
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The number of minutes Horford, Brown and Tatum played respectively. There's a heavy load of 4 games this week (and the next two).... why the hell are we playing these guys such heavy minutes? I love the load management exercise of someone sitting a night or two due to an ingrown hair or sprained liver muscle, but dammit if someone goes down hurt for the playoffs it's going to look pretty silly to be working these guys so much for meaningless games. I want to see the Maine Celtics play for 20 minutes a night...i could care less finishing over .800 or breaking the C's win record. You play around with that shit when you have a title or two under your belt.
we have 6 more wins than Denver, and we have two games in hand...it's hard to imagine we crater and flip flop positions but i take your point
Last year Joe said that he was going to play the starters more minutes in the games they played to simulate the playoffs. I think Joe believes the best rest is getting the night off; if guys are playing, they will be playing big minutes (unless a blowout).
Not to mention that the play in schedule gives the first 6 seeds a week off before they have to play.
Unless you are coming back from an injury, reducing minutes isn’t very helpful. Taking the day off is.
As a corollary to that, nothing like running something productive that results in Brown getting a trip to the line then having him shoot the first one short and the second one off the back rim (last night he only did the latter)
As far as possibly playing Atlanta, that would mean one of Philly, Miami or Indiana is eliminated in the play-in (don't see any of those three rising higher than sixth)
; and the other two have to play each other before possibly meeting the Celtics. I'll take that, especially if Trae Young is back playing.
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On NBA Today Windhorst makes a big point of saying Joe still had 2 timeouts left until the very end of the game. Perk also mentions how bad the timeout situation has been all season. They also mention 1-15 from 3 in the 2nd half.