I just looked up the clip. If THAT was the final straw, then that is one dumb franchise because that was a dime a dozen example of a manager/coach chafing at a question.That spat with the reporter yesterday must have been the last straw
well, he’s probably in a much smaller room with far fewer people now, so perhaps?So not the smartest guy in the room then?
Trading Joes?I hope the Phillies hire Maddon and the Angels hire Girardi.
Tito managed rings around him in WS 2016. It was almost, but not quite, enough to overcome a colossal talent differential (pythagorean wins were 107 for Chicago to 91 for Cleveland).He did a pretty good job in Tampa Bay, considering. And he did an OK job in Chicago (I think he actually did his darndest to lose Game 7 and several other games in 2016 but I digress).
My first thought as well.Man. I wish they had waited until Thursday.
The colossal talent difference was that half of Cleveland's pitching staff was injured and the other half overworked. The Indians would have won with ease if they could have had one start from Carrasco, Salazar or a fully healthy Bauer. Francona was making some bold pitching moves out of necessity and Maddon was so jealous that he was being outmaneuvered and overlooked that he did his best to wreck a perfectly fine Cubs pitching staff. Cleveland had a couple of opportunities where they came up a hit short against a gassed Aroldis Chapman. It was the biggest case of over-managing we'll ever see and he still got away with it and thought they won because of it.Tito managed rings around him in WS 2016. It was almost, but not quite, enough to overcome a colossal talent differential (pythagorean wins were 107 for Chicago to 91 for Cleveland).
Managing isn't everything, particularly in-game managing, and we often overlook the strategic aspects of it: roster rotation and health management, people- and morale-management (including clearly communicating consistent roles and expectations), communications with the press but also to front office and other internal groups, making good hiring and empowerment decisions. It's not often that in-game management is the difference between winning and losing, or a good vs bad season. But man, when managing makes the difference at the margins, you REALLY feel it.
Absolutely spot on post.The colossal talent difference was that half of Cleveland's pitching staff was injured and the other half overworked. The Indians would have won with ease if they could have had one start from Carrasco, Salazar or a fully healthy Bauer. Francona was making some bold pitching moves out of necessity and Maddon was so jealous that he was being outmaneuvered and overlooked that he did his best to wreck a perfectly fine Cubs pitching staff. Cleveland had a couple of opportunities where they came up a hit short against a gassed Aroldis Chapman. It was the biggest case of over-managing we'll ever see and he still got away with it and thought they won because of it.
Joe Maddon was on the line. He had just been fired as Angels manager. And the first thing he said was that he found the moment “liberating.”
It’s been kind of difficult overall. I’m into analytics, but not to the point where everybody wants to shove it down your throat. Real baseball people have felt somewhat impacted by all of this. You’re unable to just go to the ballpark and have some fun and play baseball. It’s too much controlled by front offices these days.
I hope the Angels hire Rick RenteriaI hope the Phillies hire Maddon and the Angels hire Girardi.
He already has a Job with bailey sports westI hope the Angels hireRick Renteria.Bobby Valentine
Wait. Is he saying he felt stifled by the analytics coming out of the <checks notes> Angels front office?
It could just be that he wanted to manage his way and the Angels' front office wanted him to manage a different way.Wait. Is he saying he felt stifled by the analytics coming out of the <checks notes> Angels front office?
Ohhhkay.
This reads to me like a huge confirmation regarding what fans think about in-game decision making. The FO is running shit. Not that Maddon is a reliable narrator here, but I find this interesting coming from him.You said it was liberating. Why? Usually managers are crushed when this happens.
It’s been kind of difficult overall. I’m into analytics, but not to the point where everybody wants to shove it down your throat. Real baseball people have felt somewhat impacted by all of this. You’re unable to just go to the ballpark and have some fun and play baseball. It’s too much controlled by front offices these days.
I actually talked to Perry about this. This isn’t anything new. I told him that. I said you just try to reduce the information you’re giving, try to be aware of who’s giving the information and really be aware of when it’s time to stay out of the way. In general the industry has gone too far in that direction and that’s part of the reason people aren’t into our game as much as they have been.
Well, no, they lost jobs because their teams aren't doing well.Both him and Maddon, huge reputations for how analytical they are, essentially losing jobs over reluctance to further implement analytics.
Christ almightyAlso, I am not especially anti-Maddon, but this back and forth to end that piece is amazing.
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...I’m just excited about my next opportunity.
You want to manage?
Of course. Of course I want to manage. I’m really good at it.
At that point, I commend DOB for his ability to suffer fools.DOB thinks Valentine is in the hunt.
I bet DOB, Maddon and Valentine are buds.
I bet he didn't see this shift coming.So not the smartest guy in the room then?
You can't be the smartest guy in the room if they won't let you in the room.So not the smartest guy in the room then?
Shouldn‘t have stacked the right side of his W-L record.I bet he didn't see this shift coming.
Yeah, with Dusty and LaRussa still managing in their 70s, I have no doubt the 68 year old Maddon will get at least one more job. Maybe to replace one of the young first time managers leading his team nowhere, like the Reds or Pirates or Rangers.Why wouldn’t Maddon get another shot? While I personally think he’s overrated and am glad he’s not managing the Red Sox, he’s exactly the kind of former WS winning retread manager that gets multiple bites at the apple.
Back in 2008 he did it to peak-powers Hamilton (2 outs in 9th at least). I don't doubt though he felt like doing it again for the reasons you stated.My guess is he was determined to do it once in his managerial career after Bonds was walked with the bases loaded (Bonds decision made sense though - 2 run game w/ 2 outs in the 9th).