Should be interesting to see what kind of pretzel they twisted to get this by FFP.
Get something done, guys. Fabinho ain’t coming back.
Get something done, guys. Fabinho ain’t coming back.
Liverpool 23-24: The Long Klopp Goodbye
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The Echo is suggesting they are back in for Lavia and will match Chelsea’s offer. Seems like a necessity at this point. The Caicedo ship has sailed - get it done.
edit: so, by entering the Caicedo saga it seems it may have cost them £5m (in the Lavia deal if they sign him) . Of course, they’ve forced Chelsea into an enormous outlay of £115m. Is it possible that doesn’t get done at all if Liverpool didn’t intervene ?
edit: so, by entering the Caicedo saga it seems it may have cost them £5m (in the Lavia deal if they sign him) . Of course, they’ve forced Chelsea into an enormous outlay of £115m. Is it possible that doesn’t get done at all if Liverpool didn’t intervene ?
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Thought Chelsea looked really good … Enzo was fantastic. But they are going to struggle scoring goals.
The change was that transfer fees can only be amortized over the life of the contract up to 5 years. Boehly’s MLB accounting loophole has been closed, but he’s still free to hand out stupid long contacts.
Caicedo was exactly what the Liverpool side needed today. So it goes.
Interestingly its only British law that makes such long contracts allowable, they are actually against FIFA rules:
"The minimum length of a contract shall be from its effective date until the end of the season, while the maximum length of a contract shall be five years. Contracts of any other length shall only be permitted if consistent with national laws."
"The minimum length of a contract shall be from its effective date until the end of the season, while the maximum length of a contract shall be five years. Contracts of any other length shall only be permitted if consistent with national laws."
The Guardian is reporting Liverpool has agreed a deal with Southampton for Romeo Lavia for £60m
It goes on to say there are indications Lavia wants Chelsea instead - despite rumours all month he only wanted Liverpool. Gee, I wonder what might have changed?
Chelsea’s megabucks are proving to be a very disruptive force.
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2023/aug/14/liverpool-romeo-lavia-chelsea?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other
All this angst over acquiring a holding midfielder.
It goes on to say there are indications Lavia wants Chelsea instead - despite rumours all month he only wanted Liverpool. Gee, I wonder what might have changed?
Chelsea’s megabucks are proving to be a very disruptive force.
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2023/aug/14/liverpool-romeo-lavia-chelsea?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other
All this angst over acquiring a holding midfielder.
The more you think of it the more insane that contract is.
It’s the term that’s nuts - 9 years for a holding midfielder - the most physically demanding position on the field. Did they learn nothing from watching Kante continually break down?
It also pollutes the whole market - if any transfer target gets a sniff of Chelsea interest - the Eye of Sauron if you will - their wage demands go through the roof.
At this point, if I'm in charge of recruitment at LFC, go out and get Lavia and Tyler Adams to be your 6's. I know Adams isn't a sexy signing and lacks, to a degree, the name recognition of some of the others who were reportedly available/targets, but he's got an engine and will do the work, and has a bit of an edge to him that LFC could use in their midfield. Find a reasonable CB option and close the transfer window.
I'm pretty much here. I might swap out the Adams part for a "buy, loan back" deal with Andre if they really like him that much. Let his club keep him until they lose in Copa Libertadores or January or whatever. But they need someone in the back.
And the League or FIFA needs to give FFP some teeth at some point. If they don't, you're basically creating the Super League without formally creating the Super League. Either your team is owned by unlimited oil money / a crazy billionaire or you're fighting for 4th place. And I'd feel the same way if Liverpool was in the "haves" of this argument.
Seriously. They also fucked around at the worst possible time (though I’m not sure they could have predicted how it went down).
Having Saudi Arabia come around and throw some money at what may have felt like albatross contracts was great if they had replacements lined up. They didn’t and they got fucked hard.
Chelsea coming up with new and creative ways of fucking the system is the other piece that would have been difficult to predict. What they’re doing is absolutely insane.
Lavia just feels unnecessary for Chelsea and a bad move for the player. They aren't in Europe, they play a 4-2-3-1 type system with only two real CMs, and they have Enzo and Caicedo who will start every match plus Gallagher, Chukwumeka, and another highly rated 19-year-old in Andrey Santos. Arguably they could use a true backup DM but why exactly do they need to spend 60m pounds for a 19-year-old one?
For sure … I think Chelsea’s initial interest was a fallback in case their Caicedo deal fell through - bonus if it fucks over Liverpool if they have to fork out stupid money to sign him.
So, Schmadke’s reign has been a disaster … the initial signings were both via a release clause so no negotiations with the clubs required. Then came Lavia and the wheels fell off - they could have had him for £50m on reasonable wages weeks ago - done and dusted and bedded in. But noooooooo - they just had to dick around with multiple lowball offers - almost begging Chelsea to hijack the transfer.
And the Caicedo thing - supposedly this was a Billy Hogan initiative - in the initial story it was indicated he wanted to come - now it appears (Carragher) they never approached the player. Complete madness.
But do they care much about the cost beyond the amortization years? Like, if he performs well during the next 5 seasons then they'll just have his (admittedly high) wages for the remainder. But they'll have taken their proverbial medicine and can likely ship him out if needed without lots of angst.
To add to this, I believe that Julian Ward was credited with the legwork on both of the transfers thus far.
It looks like Schmadtke is overwhelmed by this job and not really cut out for it. Everything that has happened in the last 3 weeks has been a disaster. The Lavia thing is embarrassing. Haggling over 3M…and now they end up bidding 10M higher than that and it looks as if they are still going to lose out on him
Contracts mean nothing in this sport. And FFP doesn’t really exist. At least, I don’t believe it.
No clue where this club goes from here in this window. They may well be screwed. Klopp needs to tell JWH some hard truths while he’s there.
No clue where this club goes from here in this window. They may well be screwed. Klopp needs to tell JWH some hard truths while he’s there.
Can we put a bid in on Paul Barber? Or at least hijack Brighton's Caicedo replacement signing (Carlos Baleba)?
Tyler Adams? Not the same level as the other 2 but I’d be excited rooting for an American and then hope Bajcetic continues to improve
Between the Prem, Seria A, La Liga, the Bundesliga, League Un, the Eridivisie and the Portuguese League their must be 20-30 qualified number sixes plus half as many up and comers.
It can’t be that hard to buy one of them. Christ, even a loan deal if the guy’s good.
I’m in total agreement. Schmadtke has been truly awful at his job so far.
What worries me with this club is that whatever caused Edwards/Ward to leave the club including other back office personnel is starting to get pretty telling.
If it’s lack of creative freedom under FSG or Klopp having disagreements on what they need and who to target, who knows. What we do know, as supporters- this club needs to sort this out fast.
It’s extremely vital that those in charge of transfers have a clear path and understanding on how to close these deals. They’re a laughing stock as it stands now. And I don’t think JWH has ever understood the business of this game. You can’t do this moneyball shit in the most competitive league in the world.
I don’t necessarily blame Schmadtke. He has 3 month contract and, for whatever reason, Billy Hogan decided to hop into the Caicedo negotiations. (Isn’t Billy busy selling a minority stake in the club?). The whole operation is clearly a mess. Maybe Schmadtke is screwing up and making things worse - we can’t tell from outside. It’s a shit show at the fuck factory and they need to hire at least one adult to get the place in order.
I think that was Mike Gordon who’s selling his stake - or trying to. He was/is the FSG point man for running the club. He stepped away from that last winter to help with selling the club or a minority share. Supposedly very tight with Klopp and Ward (maybe the reason Ward left)
Hogan was the business manager who has supposedly stepped up to help (???) with the football side of things.
L’affaire Caicedo was just weird. Extremely un Liverpool like from the gitgo. Normally they’d of spent months courting the player , sussing out what it would take to sign him, etc etc. all behind the scenes. This was just amateur hour.
I don’t necessarily blame them for its failure as they never in a million years would have offered the contract Chelsea did - or for that matter the Lavia one. But I do blame them for utterly botching Lavia.
Some of the rumors (mostly Jamie Carragher somewhat hinting at this) are that without Edwards/Ward that it's not really a true partnership anymore and Klopp runs the whole thing now.
Schmadtke may just be overwhelmed by the scope of Liverpool and how many irons you have to have in the fire at one time. It was mentioned a lot when he was hired that he has experience working at much smaller clubs, so this must be somewhat of a culture shock...and he was definitely thrown into the deep end right away
You all disrespecting Schmadtke and here he is finding the #6…ok, a #6…
Romano reports Liverpool have made a bid for Stuttgard’s Endō. He’s 30. He’s squad captain and has played 2900 minutes for three season running. But yeah…I don’t even know what Liverpool are doing anymore.
Romano reports Liverpool have made a bid for Stuttgard’s Endō. He’s 30. He’s squad captain and has played 2900 minutes for three season running. But yeah…I don’t even know what Liverpool are doing anymore.
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Seems appropriate. The last week has felt like an Endo up the you-know-where.
I really hope this is a depth signing and not our answer for the starting 6. If it’s a depth signing, what is there not to like? Positional flexibility, captain, progressive passer who was among league leaders in interceptions.
I really hope this is a depth signing and not our answer for the starting 6. If it’s a depth signing, what is there not to like? Positional flexibility, captain, progressive passer who was among league leaders in interceptions.
But is Hendo…er, Endō is the new backup, that makes Bajcetic the starter? Who Liverpool have spent all summer treating as the back up while offering £45m-£111m for a starter in front of him?
I am assuming the starter is still out there to be purchased at DM and CB. This would just be the depth signing to back up both positions so they can sell Nat. If this is it, no bueno indeed.
Tweets don’t embed anymore, but Romano has given the “here we go” on this one - €18m and medical tomorrow. It is good depth, shades of Klavan, who ended up being worth all of his fee (£4m, 53 appearances).
James Pearce (the Athletic) with a good overview of the mess.
https://theathletic.com/4781314/2023/08/16/liverpool-transfers-caicedo-lavia/?source=user_shared_article
According to the article they DID check with the player - and were given assurances he would sign before making the Caicedo bid. So they were screwed by the agent which is some (Tiny? Minuscule? ) comfort.
But Pearce doesn’t really address the elephant in the room - Chelsea’s ridiculous contract offers. Both Caicedo and Lavia signed with Chelsea because they were offered stupid money.
Edit: I guess Pearce omitted this little tidbit because the focus of the story is on LFC’s front office incompetence .
Edit: in an interview Lavia said his decision was due to being made to feel “second choice” and not a bigger contract
Aside from the fact he was Chelsea’s second choice as well.
So he passed up first team football to rot on Chelsea’s bench because his feelings were hurt. Ok
https://theathletic.com/4781314/2023/08/16/liverpool-transfers-caicedo-lavia/?source=user_shared_article
According to the article they DID check with the player - and were given assurances he would sign before making the Caicedo bid. So they were screwed by the agent which is some (Tiny? Minuscule? ) comfort.
But Pearce doesn’t really address the elephant in the room - Chelsea’s ridiculous contract offers. Both Caicedo and Lavia signed with Chelsea because they were offered stupid money.
Edit: I guess Pearce omitted this little tidbit because the focus of the story is on LFC’s front office incompetence .
Edit: in an interview Lavia said his decision was due to being made to feel “second choice” and not a bigger contract
Aside from the fact he was Chelsea’s second choice as well.
So he passed up first team football to rot on Chelsea’s bench because his feelings were hurt. Ok
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Yeah that is where I’m confused. If he went to almost any other team in the world I’d completely get it. But to go to Chelsea makes the whole thing even weirder
It's not weird. The answer is money, however it seems taboo for players to say they moved for money (see every player signed by the Saudis) so they make up weird fake reasons.
Well, of course. But I did lose any sympathy for Lavia for how LFC may have treated him. He felt Liverpool prioritized Caicedo over him so he….went to the team that signed Caicedo to rot on the bench behind him?
I think they offered him higher weekly wages than what Liverpool had ever offered (and would offer).
The real mistake was screwing around and putting in 3 bids that had no chance of being accepted and letting it drag out to get to the point where Chelsea could swoop in
Hybrid 6/8 or even more an 8, as I understand. Good player.
Transfermakt has him valued at 30m
Yep - agree completely. But the Lavia pursuit was kind of weird anyway. They originally targeted him as Fabinho’s understudy. Plan B had him as Fabinho’s replacement.
But ponying up £50m for a 20 year old kid with less than a year’s experience? That had disaster written all over it.
The real shame is Bajetic - he could easily have been as good as Lavia. Now, he’ll be stuck behind whoever 6 they buy.
Bajetic excites me in every way but his size. That scares me. He’ll fill out but he seems small for the role.
I would have to think the price tag for him is going to minimum 60 million, and should be more. Which isn't a bad flip for Palace since they bought him for 28, and added Jefferson Lerma on a free.