In the modern era of offense-first-NFL?You think this defense is better than the Steel Curtain? Really?
Yup.
In the modern era of offense-first-NFL?You think this defense is better than the Steel Curtain? Really?
Obviously it was much easier to play defense back then but still....In the modern era of offense-first-NFL?
Yup.
The Broncos made a bunch of mistakes, too - three fumbles and a pick and three or four other passes that Panthers got their hands on and could have picked. The difference was Denver took advantage of Carolina's mistakes, while the Panthers didn't really take advantage of Denver's.That's going to feed the frontrunner stuff that I think is largely undeserved.
He struggled. Wade Phillips, underestimated by some here, frustrated him and had one hell of a postseason.
I think Kubiak's solid too. The clamps were out on Peyton weeks ago and stayed on.
Panthers could have won this game. They made all the mistakes. Pretty big experience and maturity difference between these two teams, and Denver's coahing was superior.
That Is basicly the story of the season for the Broncos. They took advantage of every break they got and the other teams could never do the same, everything broke right for them. It was really remarkable how many times other teams dropped picks or fumbles bounced to the broncos, not to mention officiating almost always being favorable to them.The Broncos made a bunch of mistakes, too - three fumbles and a pick and three or four other passes that Panthers got their hands on and could have picked. The difference was Denver took advantage of Carolina's mistakes, while the Panthers didn't really take advantage of Denver's.
Mo Lewis? There's no way Brady was playing a game that early, if at all in the 2001 season without Drew getting killed.Other than the Tuck Rule and an unconscious David Patten touching a ball while out of bounds, what "broke right" for the Patriots in 2001? I feel like that team pretty much earned everything they got.
Yeah this Broncos team was better but that comparison crossed my mind too. They probably only win the Super Bowl a couple of times of we played the season 100 times, but that doesn't make them less worthy champions.Not unlike the 2001 Patriots, a remarkable amount of things had to go right for Denver to win the title - but they all did, and Denver took advantage, and are deserving champions with a defense that played at a very, very high level to carry a truly ineffective offense.
The AFCCG had Its moments: FG blocked for a TD, Steelers inexplicably punt to Troy Brown after a good kick is called back for a procedure penalty, Drew slinging it into double and/or triple coverage without consequence.Other than the Tuck Rule and an unconscious David Patten touching a ball while out of bounds, what "broke right" for the Patriots in 2001? I feel like that team pretty much earned everything they got.
C'mon, dude. Pitt had an injured QB and WR, New England had no o-line, and the Panthers just flat out choked.Carolina got Denvered. Broncos easily the best team in the league.
C'mon, dude. Pitt had an injured QB and WR, New England had no o-line, and the Panthers just flat out choked.
Edit: I'm willing to concede that Denver's defense was "great" this year, but not Bears or Ravens-level great
Now we know what Peyton meant by "the man upstairs".
Brian Steinberg
@bristei
A rep for @AnheuserBusch tells me: Peyton Manning "was not paid to mention Budweiser. We were surprised and delighted that he did."
10:55 PM - 7 Feb 2016
This doesn't give enough credit to Denver. Carolina didn't play their best game or anything, and I don't think Denver was head and shoulders above everyone, but talking about their opponents choking or handing them games or the refs is sort of weak. Denver went out and beat three good teams, for the most part, fairly convincingly with, basically, a non-functioning offense. If its not one of the best defenses of all time (and I think it is probably a small step below the all time greats), it was up there with the '85 Bears for best playoff performance by a defense of all time.C'mon, dude. Pitt had an injured QB and WR, New England had no o-line, and the Panthers just flat out choked.
Edit: I'm willing to concede that Denver's defense was "great" this year, but not Bears or Ravens-level great
Yep - the Raiders lost at home to the Jets who they then beat by 14 the next week in the wildcard round.The Raiders were 10-3 while the Pats were 8-5 and the Raiders lost their last 3 games of the year to let the Pats pss them for the two seed. It was a miracle.
Pretty sure that's the wrong line since Elway had at least one long passing TD to Rod Smith, who torched Eugene Robinson on the play.The last two Super Bowl wins for Denver: 25/45, 264 yards, 0 TDs and 2 INT
Elway: 12/22, 123 Yards, 0 TD, 1 INT
Manning: 13/23, 141 Yards, 0 TD, 1 INT
Elway wasn't kidding when he said he wanted to set things up for Peyton like Denver did to him. What a couple of suckbag games.
I believe those would be the two worst Super Bowl performances of a winning QB.
Anybody see "Best in Show" She looked just like one of the dog owners in that film.Annabelle needs more Botox (LOL)
'85 Bears pass coverage was pedestrian, but they got so much pressure on the opposing QB that it was seldom exploited.Is it the whole defense or is it the pass rush? This team's coverage didn't seem all that spectacular, certainly it was mortal for most of the season. But it was a hell of a pass rush.
Good catch, that was 1997, not 1998 stat line.Pretty sure that's the wrong line since Elway had at least one long passing TD to Rod Smith, who torched Eugene Robinson on the play.
It's similar in some ways, but the primary difference to my mind is that the 2001 Patriots were a collection of no names and underrated/role players. Bruschi and McGinest were homegrown and relatively unknown to the nation, Brady was famously #199, etc. They had gone 5-11 the year before and began the season 1-3. And of course they were one of the biggest underdogs in Super Bowl history.Not unlike the 2001 Patriots, a remarkable amount of things had to go right for Denver to win the title - but they all did, and Denver took advantage, and are deserving champions with a defense that played at a very, very high level to carry a truly ineffective offense.
Absolutely. And congrats again!If that is not one of the best defensive efforts in league history, I don't know what is. Top 4 in the modern era (the game was much different back in '85). 2000 Baltimore, 2002 TB, 2013 Seattle, 2015 Denver.
I think that this is about right. There are enough great performances to argue about, but Denver defense this year is certainly in the conversation. And Von Miller had one of the great postseason performances of all time.Denver's defense just beat 3 of the league's top 4 offenses (Pitt, NE, CAR with the other being AZ) by stuffing the run, blanketing receivers, dominating O-Lines and hitting the passers relentlessly. They customized their defensive approach for each opponent and did all of this while supporting an absolutely dogshit offense that failed to give them much time to rest and handed them dubious field position rather often.
If that is not one of the best defensive efforts in league history, I don't know what is. Top 4 in the modern era (the game was much different back in '85). 2000 Baltimore, 2002 TB, 2013 Seattle, 2015 Denver.
If the Broncos take home the Lombardi trophy, the NFL would have three compelling options: a Super Bowl rematch with Carolina, an AFC Championship Game rematch with New England, or it could go off the board and schedule the Colts and Andrew Luck.
The guess here is that the league would not open the 2016 season with the same matchup that ended the 2015 season, so Carolina would be out. New England is always a prime-time draw, but because of the number of games it has played at night, it might leave the Colts as the most likely opening-night opponent for Denver.
Ironically the Steelers actually played the best offensive game against Denver in the playoffs despite all the injuries. And likely would have won if not for a really bad fumble.Can we please stop it with the Pitt game? Denver beat the Steelers with a half broken Roethlisberger, no Bell, no Antonio Brown, and no DeAngelo. That wasn't a virtuoso performance. The Pats/Panthers games following that one absolutely were.
If Toussiant doesn't fumble. . . .Oh what could have been.Can we please stop it with the Pitt game? Denver beat the Steelers with a half broken Roethlisberger, no Bell, no Antonio Brown, and no DeAngelo. That wasn't a virtuoso performance. The Pats/Panthers games following that one absolutely were.
Ironically the Steelers actually played the best offensive game against Denver in the playoffs despite all the injuries. And likely would have won if not for a really bad fumble.
Your earlier post stated that you thought they were top three all time, which I thought was a little foolish (see my Steeler post):Denver's defense just beat 3 of the league's top 4 offenses (Pitt, NE, CAR with the other being AZ) by stuffing the run, blanketing receivers, dominating O-Lines and hitting the passers relentlessly. They customized their defensive approach for each opponent and did all of this while supporting an absolutely dogshit offense that failed to give them much time to rest and handed them dubious field position rather often.
If that is not one of the best defensive efforts in league history, I don't know what is. Top 4 in the modern era (the game was much different back in '85). 2000 Baltimore, 2002 TB, 2013 Seattle, 2015 Denver.
If you want to say they're a top 3 or 4 defense the past 20 years, I'll agree with you. And congrats on the SB. J-man too!Where does this defense rank all time?
Given (1)how shitty the offense that they carried was; and (2) how the modern NFL is tilted to favor offenses, I think they could be third all time (behind the '85 Bears and the '00 Ravens).
People still think Big Ben was hurt?Can we please stop it with the Pitt game? Denver beat the Steelers with a half broken Roethlisberger, no Bell, no Antonio Brown, and no DeAngelo. That wasn't a virtuoso performance. The Pats/Panthers games following that one absolutely were.
Out of those 4 I would argue Denver is second behind Baltimore (last night I included the '85 Bears, but I feel like it's too hard to compare across wide differences in eras).Your earlier post stated that you thought they were top three all time (which I thought was a little foolish):
If you want to say they're one of top defenses the past 20 years, I'll agree with you. And congrats on the SB. J-man too!
Doesn't matter. PK and the old, white guy posse have already shaped the "Cam Newton is petulant and immature" storyline into the narrative.hmmm
Meh.http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/14734128/ranking-reasons-super-bowl-50-upset-denver-broncos-nfl
Barnwell: "You know what, though? If anybody ever deserves to have a playoff game in which he is carried to a victory by his teammates, as Football Outsiders noted, it's Peyton Manning. Peyton had shockingly little support from his teammates in the playoffs early in his career, when the labels which would become unfairly associated with his playoff performance began to take shape. He's still the greatest quarterback in NFL history, and now he has a second ring to cement his legacy as such."
Oh.
Let's not get too carried away.
2002 Bucs: Allowed 196 points (12.2/game)
2015 Broncos: Allowed 296 points (18.5/game)
2002 Bucs: Allowed 37 points in 3 playoff games (18 of which after they went up 34-3 in the 3rd quarter of the Super Bowl)
2015 Broncos: Allowed 44 points in 3 playoff games.
The Broncos went on an incredible run and deserved to win. Once you get into "best" this or "greatest" that things get murky.
At this point, I'd take Seattle and maybe TB just because they sustained their dominance for a few seasons. Denver may do that too - time will tell.Out of those 4 I would argue Denver is second behind Baltimore (last night I included the '85 Bears, but I feel like it's too hard to compare across wide differences in eras).
You could argue that TB and SEA were better. As someone said earlier, good bar room debate fodder.
Agreed. Just found it interesting that Barnwelll's tone was such that Manning is and was widely regarded as the GOAT prior to this game and this second ring sealed Manning's place at the top. I did not think that was the perception going in to the game- seems to me that most people have Montana and Brady and then a second tier that includes Manning. I'm fine with moving Manning into the Brady/ Montana tier, just the suggestion that he is unquestionably the GOAT seemed tone-deaf IMO.Meh.
To me it is now Montana, Brady, Manning in that order. If Brady wins another ring he leap frogs Joe.
Psssssst.... I was drunk last night. My team had just won the motherfucking SB!At this point, I'd take Seattle and maybe TB just because they sustained their dominance for a few seasons. Denver may do that too - time will tell.
Not to sound snarky but you're the one who stated "all time" - that's why I posted those Steeler stats that you ignored. You're moving the goalposts in this thread not me.
Click bait from Barnwell.Agreed. Just found it interesting that Barnwelll's tone was such that Manning is and was widely regarded as the GOAT prior to this game and this second ring sealed Manning's place at the top. I did not think that was the perception going in to the game- seems to me that most people have Montana and Brady and then a second tier that includes Manning. I'm fine with moving Manning into the Brady/ Montana tier, just the suggestion that he is unquestionably the GOAT seemed tone-deaf IMO.