The Celtic $15 Challenge

PedroKsBambino

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I think this would be weak on ballhandling, hence my choice of Rondo > Ainge.
Celtic-era Rondo needed the ball to have offensive value, and on a team with Bird (and Russell, a great passer) his lack of shooting is going to get exposed pretty quickly (remember---he was a 27% 3pt shooter as a Celtic and that's what you're getting here, not the later guy who can actually shoot ok). Not the end of the world, but pretty confident the Ainge team would be better.
 

Bernie Carbohydrate

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Hey, if Marcus goes on the dollar list I’ll pair him with DJ. That would be a defensively psychotic team.
My Celtics fantasy team is down by one with eleven seconds left. Marcus brings up the ball against aggressive press.

Bird is open on the wing. Tatum just shook his man thanks to a great pick by Cowens. Sam Jones has just curled around the baseline and will be wide open in the corner if a crisp pass is thrown.

Clock down to seven. After the pick, Cowens has rolled to the basket with a step on his man. Bird’s defender has fallen down. Tatum is waving both arms because a switch has left him being covered by a 5’11” point guard with a bum knee. Sam’s defender has left him, inexplicably, to double Smart, who is holding the ball at the top of the key.

Four seconds left. Marcus says “Fuck it, I’m taking the shot.”
 

Over Guapo Grande

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My Celtics fantasy team is down by one with eleven seconds left. Marcus brings up the ball against aggressive press.

Bird is open on the wing. Tatum just shook his man thanks to a great pick by Cowens. Sam Jones has just curled around the baseline and will be wide open in the corner if a crisp pass is thrown.

Clock down to seven. After the pick, Cowens has rolled to the basket with a step on his man. Bird’s defender has fallen down. Tatum is waving both arms because a switch has left him being covered by a 5’11” point guard with a bum knee. Sam’s defender has left him, inexplicably, to double Smart, who is holding the ball at the top of the key.

Four seconds left. Marcus says “Fuck it, I’m taking the shot.”
And Bird flies in for the put-back dunk (left-handed, of course), as the clock hits 0.01
 

Eddie Jurak

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Celtic-era Rondo needed the ball to have offensive value, and on a team with Bird (and Russell, a great passer) his lack of shooting is going to get exposed pretty quickly (remember---he was a 27% 3pt shooter as a Celtic and that's what you're getting here, not the later guy who can actually shoot ok). Not the end of the world, but pretty confident the Ainge team would be better.
I agree that's a problem, but I still think the team needs a legit ballhandler, and don't think Bird, Ainge, Reggie, or (cringe) Jaylen are up to it. Maybe swap out Brown, Lewis, and Rondo for Allen, Ainge, and Sharman, but that would be a more offensive team.
 

PedroKsBambino

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This year's Denver team (as well as the 1980s Celtics) show you don't need a traditional ball-dominant PG if you happen to have a top-5 all time passing big, however. The skill of "dribbling the ball to halfcourt" just isn't that scarce an ability at the NBA level. Though I agree Jaylen is a low-outlier on that one...

Also...my faith in Larry Bird is unreasoanbly high.
 
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TripleOT

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In today’s NBA, considering each pick as their best as a Celtic:

KG
Bird
Tatum
Ainge
Rondo

Bird, Tatum, and Ainge provide enough three point firepower. This should be a very good defensive and rebounding team. Rondo isn’t a perfect fit, but when I spent $13 on my first three I had to go with two $1s, and the old time players weren’t good enough shooters or athletes to justify picking over Rondo.

In today’s NBA, considering each pick as their best in their career

Walton (a no brainer for $1)
KG
Bird
Tatum
Rondo

Three MVPs, plus the future 2024 MVP
 

Ale Xander

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This year's Denver team (as well as the 1980s Celtics) show you don't need a traditional ball-dominant PG if you happen to have a top-5 all time passing big, however. The skill of "dribbling the ball to halfcourt" just isn't that scarce an ability at the NBA level. Though I agree Jaylen is a low-outlier on that one...

Also...my faith in Larry Bird is unreasoanbly high.
That team had 3 points (2 point guards and a point forward) in its starting lineup, though.
 

McBride11

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May lose some on the post but gimme

Bird (5)
Kg (4)
Tatum (4)
Rondo (1)
Walton (1)

Distributor (multiple really), bunch of clutch players, . Pondered if only Bird / Tatum can spread the floor that that could be an issue, but I think opposing D will need to collapse on KG / Walton or get destroyed inside. C's D will be top notch

PS - KG is way undervalued.
 

Euclis20

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Pretty sure that there are more lineups in this thread without Bird than without Rondo. Weird.
Nobody would ever say he's better than Bird, but lets be clear on who peak Rondo was - a top 20 player, top 10 in MVP voting, 3rd team all-NBA, 1st team all defense, league leader in assists, nightly triple double threat, and had a well deserved reputation as a guy who played his best in the biggest moments. Even with his total lack of 3 point shooting, he's an absolute steal at $1. There's a pretty big drop off in quality after the $4 and $5 guys, so finding value at $1 is big.
 

Ale Xander

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Nobody would ever say he's better than Bird, but lets be clear on who peak Rondo was - a top 20 player, top 10 in MVP voting, 3rd team all-NBA, 1st team all defense, league leader in assists, nightly triple double threat, and had a well deserved reputation as a guy who played his best in the biggest moments. Even with his total lack of 3 point shooting, he's an absolute steal at $1. There's a pretty big drop off in quality after the $4 and $5 guys, so finding value at $1 is big.
Avatar checks out
 

PedroKsBambino

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Nobody would ever say he's better than Bird, but lets be clear on who peak Rondo was - a top 20 player, top 10 in MVP voting, 3rd team all-NBA, 1st team all defense, league leader in assists, nightly triple double threat, and had a well deserved reputation as a guy who played his best in the biggest moments. Even with his total lack of 3 point shooting, he's an absolute steal at $1. There's a pretty big drop off in quality after the $4 and $5 guys, so finding value at $1 is big.
I agree, Rondo is often underrated.

Though, within this exercise, also worth noting that a material amount of that value (statistically and perception-wise) is averaging 11+ assists per game. On a roster with Bird and Russell he's only the third best playmaker so his actual value is going to drop a fair amount---not only is his passing less valuable, his crappy 3 pt shooting is more a negative relative to other options with those two distributing. So while he's still a good value at $1 for sure, he's very unlikely to be the best fit at least if that's how someone handles the top two spots

If I were building a Rondo roster would be something like Cowens, KG, Tatum, Rondo, Jaylen to manage spacing.
 
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brendan f

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Nobody would ever say he's better than Bird, but lets be clear on who peak Rondo was - a top 20 player, top 10 in MVP voting, 3rd team all-NBA, 1st team all defense, league leader in assists, nightly triple double threat, and had a well deserved reputation as a guy who played his best in the biggest moments.
Rondo is largely overrated and has no business being among even the $1 options here. He was a very good defender for a very short amount of time (first four years in the league). He was surrounded by great talent and played for a long time, which means a lot of people think he was unsung. Was he great in big moments? Ask Derek Fisher.

Edit: I take one point back--he's properly rated as a $1 option
 
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BaseballJones

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I’m going Parish/KG/Tatum/DJ/Danny. Or basically throwing JT and KG on to the ‘86 Celtics. In 1986 that team wins 75 games.
Well I mean you’re not just adding KG and JT to that team. You’re swapping them in for Bird and McHale. Kind of an important detail.
 

BaseballJones

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What’s the best team you could come up with under these parameters if you have to keep both Tatum and Bird?
 

Jimbodandy

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I love Rondo, but I think that talk of him as ever being a top-20 player in this league is a bit much. Good on him for stealing a couple of MVP votes and a third-team all-NBA, but the man literally could not shoot to save his life. And on a team with top-75 all time players, we're really not reliant on "who's gonna pass the ball".
 

PedroKsBambino

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What’s the best team you could come up with under these parameters if you have to keep both Tatum and Bird?
That's tough mostly because Centers are a bit overpriced on this list, imo. You need size/rim protectoin and a couple quick guys to surround Bird and tatum.

Bird Tatum Cowens Ainge Sharman?

Bird Tatum KG Ainge Rondo?

You can get Rondo in there as the $1 if KG is your center
 

Devizier

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Thinking on this:


The 5s: Bill Russell, Larry Bird, John Havlicek, Paul Pierce, Kevin McHale
The 4s: Jayson Tatum, Dave Cowens, Kevin Garnett, Bob Cousy, Robert Parish
The 3s: Sam Jones, Jo Jo White, Ray Allen, Cedric Maxwell, Tommy Heinsohn
The 2s: Don Nelson, Nate Archibald, Reggie Lewis, Jaylen Brown, Dennis Johnson
The 1s: Danny Ainge, Rajon Rondo, Bill Sharman, Frank Ramsey, Bill Walton

What changes would you make?

I scratch Tiny and Walton. Possibly switch Pierce and Tatum. Sharman becomes a two dollar guy, Easy Ed a three dollar guy, Jo Jo White goes to two dollars, and Don Nelson goes down to one dollar.
 

bankshot1

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Celtic-era Rondo needed the ball to have offensive value, and on a team with Bird (and Russell, a great passer) his lack of shooting is going to get exposed pretty quickly (remember---he was a 27% 3pt shooter as a Celtic and that's what you're getting here, not the later guy who can actually shoot ok). Not the end of the world, but pretty confident the Ainge team would be better.
Russell was a good passer. He was not a great passer. His key contribution in this regard was cleaning the boards and wheeling and firing the ball to a breaking wing to start what hopefully would end in a lay-uo. Russell was the key to transition basketball. His teamates were pretty damn sure he was going to get the board and broke out. In that he excelled.But he was not a low post magician, but he was ok passing out of the post, generally passing to teammates running high weaves .

As for Rondo (who I included in my 5 Celtics), his value would be ball flow and defense and toughness, and on my 5 he would have fed Bird and Sam Jones on the perimeter, or cuts to the hoop and Russell or Walton in the post. His offensive contribution (dropping dimes) was secondary to his playing D. He was a very good defensive guard.