The terribly mediocre Lakers

[Gunfighter 09]

Over his last five against the best three teams in the league, Kuzma is averaging 25.8 on 16.2 shots with 8 boards. Over the 4 game stretch against GS, Houston and Cleveland he has been what Celtics fans think Tatum will be someday, at least offensively. That makes up for some terrible defense.


His biggest issue on defense seems to be his lack of strength, he gets muscled quite a bit, Bell and Draymond were shoving him around effortlessly last night. He's 22, but it seems reasonable to assume he will fix the strength issues with more time in an NBA S&C program. Just incredible that they got this with the 27th pick. It is certainly lucky, and makes the D Russell debacle palatable.

 

[Lazy vs Crazy]

How did KCP not get a suspension for actually pleading guilty to a crime and going to jail? They are letting him out to play games in California and practice, but he can't leave the state.

Does the NBA not have a rule for this?

 

[Tony C]

Yep, Kuzma has really stepped up his game, as has Ball -- shooting 47% from the field and from 3-point land over the last 5 games. Basically about the same from the FT line, only 50% over the last 5 and a pathetic 48% for the season. The 4 game sample size on Kuzma and 5 game on Ball is obviously incredibly small sample size (albeit vs very strong competition and mostly on the road) -- be interesting to see if those are just small sample size oddities or not. (Ball's FT struggles suggest that there's a good chance he has something fundamentally wrong with his funky stroke and he'll go back to struggling from the field.)

 

[InstaFace]

How did KCP not get a suspension for actually pleading guilty to a crime and going to jail? They are letting him out to play games in California and practice, but he can't leave the state.

Does the NBA not have a rule for this?

Seems sufficient to me that he's obliging his duties to society. I don't see what piling additional discipline from his job on top would accomplish.

Has the NFL not been sufficient evidence of the folly it is for a professional sports league to try and substitute for (or overlap with) the criminal justice system? As a wise man once said here, I pay people to do that shit for me.

 

[the moops]

This team is not nearly terrible enough

 

[tims4wins]

This team is not nearly terrible enough

On pace for 29 wins. I think that's right around what we all expected, no?

 

[Devizier]

On pace for 29 wins. I think that's right around what we all expected, no?

Not a whole lot changed from the beginning of the season in terms of expectancy. I figured they would be somewhere between 3rd and 10th worst and it seems like that's where they are.

 

[the moops]

On pace for 29 wins. I think that's right around what we all expected, no?

They look a lot better the past couple weeks. They are gonna sneak out some wins that were unexpected, IMO

 

[tims4wins]

They look a lot better the past couple weeks. They are gonna sneak out some wins that were unexpected, IMO

3-11 last 14. That is a 17.5 win pace.

 

[tims4wins]

Also this can't be a bad thing for the pick

LOS ANGELES -- The Lakers' eye toward clearing salary-cap space and pursuing two superstar free agents next summer might be causing some frustration within the roster, and it could've played a role in the team's lackluster 95-92 home loss to the Portland Trail Blazers on Saturday night at Staples Center.

Head coach Luke Walton noted that the Lakers did not play with the same effort and fight that they have brought much of this season and that some players on the bench were "pouting."

"Pouting? Possibly. Guys are frustrated," veteran center Andrew Bogut said of the Lakers as Brandon Ingram sat out because of injuries to his quads. "There are some injuries right now, different rotations. Guys are frustrated, obviously. You would be lying to say that there are guys that are not frustrated on this team.

"Everyone knows what is going on with the salary-cap situation next season and all that. That is just distractions that we can't let affect us. That is part of the league, the business decisions that front offices and coaches make. So if that is distracting guys, that is going to be like that your whole career. That is just the nature of this league."

 

[the moops]

3-11 last 14. That is a 17.5 win pace.

And in that time they have beaten the Rockets, lost to GS in OT twice, and had some close calls against NYK and POR and GSW.

Yea, sure, their record sucks over the past 14, but as I said, they are playing better than I would hope.

 

[Cesar Crespo]

And in that time they have beaten the Rockets, lost to GS in OT twice, and had some close calls against NYK and POR and GSW.

Yea, sure, their record sucks over the past 14, but as I said, they are playing better than I would hope.

Bad teams find a way to lose, regardless of how "well" they are playing.

 

[Cesar Crespo]

Also, do the 76ers suck? 1-9 in their last 10. The Magic are an abomination too. 9 straight losses, followed by 2-3, followed by another 8 game losing streak. 2-20 in their last 22 games.

 

[the moops]

Bad teams find a way to lose, regardless of how "well" they are playing.

Perhaps. But would it be surprising to see the Lakers play .500 ball for a month stretch?

 

[lovegtm]

Perhaps. But would it be surprising to see the Lakers play .500 ball for a month stretch?

Yeah I think it's reasonable to say that the Lakers have shown more than a lot of the teams bunched around them. I'm not particularly sanguine about the pick's conveyance odds.

 

[Devizier]

Lonzo has a sprained shoulder.

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/nba-christmas-lakers-rookie-lonzo-ball-out-vs-timberwolves-with-shoulder-sprain/

Early Sunday evening, the Los Angeles Lakers announced that rookie point guard Lonzo Ball has been diagnosed with a shoulder sprain, and will miss the team's Christmas Day game against the Minnesota Timberwolves. He will be re-evaluated in a week. Via NBA.com/Lakers:

 

[nighthob]

Perhaps. But would it be surprising to see the Lakers play .500 ball for a month stretch?

I can certainly see them going 6-4 in February. Aside from that, however...

 

[Smokey Joe]

Lonzo has a sprained shoulder.

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/nba-christmas-lakers-rookie-lonzo-ball-out-vs-timberwolves-with-shoulder-sprain/

Does this mean that they are more likely or less likely to win the next few games?

 

[Eddie Jurak]

Does this mean that they are more likely or less likely to win the next few games?

Lonzo has been much better of late - something the critics have mised.

 

[Morgan's Magic Snowplow]

Lonzo has been much better of late - something the critics have mised.

Yup. His shooting and overall game has really picked up. I still don’t think he’ll be a star but he has absolutely been an asset to the team. Credit where credit is due.

 

[Sam Ray Not]

Even if techically Ball’s been a very mild negative on floor (relative to the minutes with Clarkson) his absence massively effs up their depth and their normal rotations. And other than Clarkson — who’s really more of a combo guard, with nothing like Ball’s court vision and floor management skills — they basically have no other point guards..

Ball has 220 assists so far this season; no one else on the Lakers has over 100. Their offense goes from bad to horrific with him out, and he’s a pretty decent defender too.

Doesn’t sound like major sprain — “at least a week” apparently — but if it were to turn into a lingering, Fultz-type deal, I’d think Cs fans could start allow themselves to ponder that #2-5 pick a bit more fervently.

 

[mauf]

Is there any team whose 2019 pick you’d rather own than Sacramento’s? Worst team in the league by point differential, and you really have to squint to see any prospect of them improving next year.

I’ll therefore stick with my contrarian view of the Lakers’ pick — we’ll get enough ping-pong balls to make the draft lottery worth watching, but if we don’t jump into the top 3, I’d rather roll the dice on that Kings pick than draft someone besides Ayton/Doncic/Bagley this summer.

 

[Eddie Jurak]

I’ll therefore stick with my contrarian view of the Lakers’ pick — we’ll get enough ping-pong balls to make the draft lottery worth watching, but if we don’t jump into the top 3, I’d rather roll the dice on that Kings pick than draft someone besides Ayton/Doncic/Bagley this summer.

I wonder how the Sixers and Celtics view this point. I would imagine that another deal between the Celtics and Philly that revises the protections on those picks is not out of the question.

 

[benhogan]

Is there any team whose 2019 pick you’d rather own than Sacramento’s? Worst team in the league by point differential, and you really have to squint to see any prospect of them improving next year.

I’ll therefore stick with my contrarian view of the Lakers’ pick — we’ll get enough ping-pong balls to make the draft lottery worth watching, but if we don’t jump into the top 3, I’d rather roll the dice on that Kings pick than draft someone besides Ayton/Doncic/Bagley this summer.

While I don't agree with it, your contrarian view could be aided by some 76er ping pong balls in 2019. Embid is a fragile big that enjoys publicly taunting 7'/275lb men with large ego's, not a recipe for long-term health.

 

[the moops]

There is no way I take my chances with SAC pick instead of the # 2 - 5 LAL pick if given the choice. Yes, SAC will suck in 2019. Even so, the chances of their pick being #1, or #6 + is far greater than it being better than whatever # the LAL pick is

 

[nighthob]

The Sacramento pick only has #1 protection.

 

[the moops]

I know. I was saying it has a far greater chance of falling outside of the LAL protection than not

 

[mauf]

There is no way I take my chances with SAC pick instead of the # 2 - 5 LAL pick if given the choice. Yes, SAC will suck in 2019. Even so, the chances of their pick being #1, or #6 + is far greater than it being better than whatever # the LAL pick is

That’s true in the abstract. I’m suggesting, however, that your typical #4 or #5 pick is unlikely to be a cornerstone player, and probably won’t even contribute more than one season of strong value to a contending team before he gets expensive. So in the C’s specific situation, I’d rather gamble on another shot at a potential franchise player if the ping-pong balls don’t fall our way this summer.

 

[the moops]

I guess we are just looking at it differently For I think the balls falling in the 4 or 5 spot this year is indeed the balls falling our way.

 

[Jimbodandy]

I guess we are just looking at it differently For I think the balls falling in the 4 or 5 spot this year is indeed the balls falling our way.

Agreed. Especially with #1 protection next year. #4 in 2018 seems better to me than waiting another calendar year for #2 in 2019 at best.

If 2019 #1 was on the table, I might be swayed to the other side.

 

[Devizier]

I would put the median outcome of Celtics' pick as being a 6-7 either this year or next. Anything better (in either year) is gravy.

Just back-of-the-envelope here.

 

[Red Averages]

Seems like the Brook Lopez injury will give them some issues as well. They were 9-10 in games in which he played 20+ minutes, 2-11 in games which he's under 20 min played or out. Some of that is likely games that were out of hand so he had no reason to play, but he's obviously a quality contributor for them. He's still out for a few more weeks.

 

[lovegtm]

I would put the median outcome of Celtics' pick as being a 6-7 either this year or next. Anything better (in either year) is gravy.

Just back-of-the-envelope here.

Not to be repetitive, but it's 2-5 or nothing for this year.

 

[Devizier]

TO be clear — which I was not — that’s where I expect the Lakers/Kings to finish this year and next.

 

[HowBoutDemSox]

Amusingly, the Lakers and Kings have the same record (11-21) going into today, despite more than a 5 point difference in their average point differential (-8.5 for Sacramento, -3.2 for LA).

 

[Papelbon's Poutine]

I wonder how the Sixers and Celtics view this point. I would imagine that another deal between the Celtics and Philly that revises the protections on those picks is not out of the question.

Interesting premise, I’m just not sure what that would look like? What would be worth it from either side?

 

[uk_sox_fan]

A couple of 'key' games for them coming up in the sense that they'll be favoured tonight (v Mem) and probably Friday night (v LAC). Ingram supposed to return tonight as well. If they come up soft and drop these two games (plus their away game vs the Rockets on NYE) they could fall back to a good spot (Celtics' pick-wise) entering the new year.

 

[wade boggs chicken dinner]

Amusingly, the Lakers and Kings have the same record (11-21) going into today, despite more than a 5 point difference in their average point differential (-8.5 for Sacramento, -3.2 for LA).

Going to be a great race to watch, almost NFL-like. Looks like ATL has the 1 seed wrapped up but then 2 teams have 10 wins, 4 teams have 11 wins, and the Nets and Hornets have 12 wins.

Lakers are in 7th but since CHI is 8-2 over their last 10, LAL should soon be in 6th.

ORL is 1-9 in their last 10. I was wrong about that team. Talk about a never-ending rebuild.

 

[tims4wins]

Only the Hawks have fewer wins than the Lakers now in the entire NBA. Granted the Lakers are tied with 3 other teams at 11 wins, but this has a real shot at conveying this year

 

[BigSoxFan]

Only the Hawks have fewer wins than the Lakers now in the entire NBA. Granted the Lakers are tied with 3 other teams at 11 wins, but this has a real shot at conveying this year

At a minimum, we should be within shouting distance. Still probably doesn’t happen but it could be close. Imagine if Cleveland leapfrogged us and knocked us to #6. That would suck.

 

[DJnVa]

Clippers (Blake supposedly back), Rockets, T-Wolves, Thunder next 4 games then a much easier stretch after that: Hornets, Hawks, Kings, Spurs, Mavs, Grizzlies.

 

[uk_sox_fan]

Only the Hawks have fewer wins than the Lakers now in the entire NBA. Granted the Lakers are tied with 3 other teams at 11 wins, but this has a real shot at conveying this year

What a night! Lakers lose to the Griz, Bulls beat the Knicks, Kings beat beat the Cavs (!), Mavs beat the Pacers (!), Hawks beat the Wiz (!!), Celtics win, Raptors lose. Couldn't really be a much better night than that!

 

[Bleedred]

Yikes. Kuzma shoots 4 for 24 and 1 for 11 from three.

 

[Morgan's Magic Snowplow]

I watched a fair amount of this terrible game against the Griz last night. This team is pretty broken without Lonzo, which is partly a testament to him and partly a testament to the importance of having any kind of functional PG. Clarkson can't run Walton's offense, at all. Ennis came into the game and picked up three missed shots and three fouls in four minutes before landing back on the bench for the rest of the game. Kuzma has been a revelation this year but he can't create his own shot so if the ball movement isn't working to get him open looks, he's going to struggle. All this against a pretty bad Griz team without Conley on the second night of a back-to-back that themselves looked sloppy and unfocused much of the game. I took a lot of shots at Lonzo earlier in the year and I still don't think he'll be a star in the league but this team is much better with him involved than not.

 

[wade boggs chicken dinner]

I watched a fair amount of this terrible game against the Griz last night. This team is pretty broken without Lonzo, which is partly a testament to him and partly a testament to the importance of having any kind of functional PG. Clarkson can't run Walton's offense, at all. Ennis came into the game and picked up three missed shots and three fouls in four minutes before landing back on the bench for the rest of the game. Kuzma has been a revelation this year but he can't create his own shot so if the ball movement isn't working to get him open looks, he's going to struggle. All this against a pretty bad Griz team without Conley on the second night of a back-to-back that themselves looked sloppy and unfocused much of the game. I took a lot of shots at Lonzo earlier in the year and I still don't think he'll be a star in the league but this team is much better with him involved than not.

Here's an article from a Laker's blog that reinforces your point: https://www.silverscreenandroll.com/2017/12/28/16826338/la-lakers-news-lonzo-ball-injury-absence-miss-quotes.

LAL had been playing at a league high pace: averaging 104.08 possessions per game. Without Ball, and given MEM's style of play, LAL played at MEM's pace (MEM averages 95.42 possessions per game and the game was played at 95.84).

 

[JakeRae]

Only the Hawks have fewer wins than the Lakers now in the entire NBA. Granted the Lakers are tied with 3 other teams at 11 wins, but this has a real shot at conveying this year

538 has them tied with the Kings for 5th worst projected record. That seems about right. There's some hope Memphis will improve but there is also very real concern that some teams will tank. It's a pretty tight pack from 2-9 right now.

 

[Sam Ray Not]

Seems like every season there are a handful of young teams who start out looking "surprisingly spunky," "dangerous" and/or "promising" till due to injuries or a tough schedule patch or some combo they get mired in a losing streak that snowballs as the good vibes drain away, losing becomes expected, and the fingers start pointing. (Many of the 1994-2011 Warriors teams followed that model.) Lakers kinda seem on their way to becoming that type of team, especially with 3-4 of their core guys likely looking for new teams next season. They have no incentive to tank, which in theory would help them stay sharp and motivated, but neither do they have much incentive to stick together, listen to Luke, build a harmonious foundation, etc.

Yeah, they could pull together and turn things around when Ball returns, but it could also get ugly for them. Other than SAC and PHO, I'm not sure there are any teams I'm highly confident will finish behind them.

 

[Fishy1]

A bad time for them to have Lonzo and Lopez out. Clippers (who might get Griffin back for Friday), Rockets, Timberwolves, and a rejuvenated Thunder might mean four more losses before they get to play the Hornets, depending on how long Ball is out.

 

[benhogan]

3... 2... 1... implosion begins

http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/21911979/los-angeles-lakers-hold-team-meeting-place-practice-air-frustrations-thursday

 

[HowBoutDemSox]

3... 2... 1... implosion begins

http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/21911979/los-angeles-lakers-hold-team-meeting-place-practice-air-frustrations-thursday

They're a few days late, but I wonder if they still put out the Festivus aluminum pole for the airing of grievances. Wonder which one of them had to pin Walton before the holiday ends (I'd have nominated Randle; hopefully it wasn't Ingram, or they'd still be there).