Trade Deadline 2023 General Thread

moondog80

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Trout has a full no-trade clause and has 7/248M left after this season. That probably limits where he could end up and what the Angels could really get back for him.
Yeah, I don't he generates a Soto-like return. But for now, I do think his value is on the positive side (moreso if the Angels pay some of his salary), and if they're going to tear it down with or without him, I don't think talking him into a trade would be an issue.
 

jon abbey

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Trout has a full no-trade clause and has 7/248M left after this season. That probably limits where he could end up and what the Angels could really get back for him.
And he is out with a hamate injury currently, which tends to kill players’ power for multiple years, if not forever.
 

Yelling At Clouds

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I also want to take a moment to discuss the Chicago White Sox, who are perhaps something of a cautionary tale about big rebuilds. They executed a teardown/rebuild that a lot of baseball observers were impressed by, and they absolutely looked like a team who’d be competing every year in 2021. Turns out that one division title is all they really have to show for it. And I don’t think you can even blame TLR for this, not entirely at least.
 

Scoops Bolling

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I also want to take a moment to discuss the Chicago White Sox, who are perhaps something of a cautionary tale about big rebuilds. They executed a teardown/rebuild that a lot of baseball observers were impressed by, and they absolutely looked like a team who’d be competing every year in 2021. Turns out that one division title is all they really have to show for it. And I don’t think you can even blame TLR for this, not entirely at least.
No, but you can blame White Sox management for failing the second part of the typical rebuild: signing free agents and trading for pieces that put you over the top. The White Sox refused to spend, and when they did, they did so idiotically. They also never really pulled the trigger on any trades to upgrade the team. The cautionary tale the White Sox should illustrate is "you need outside talent, you can't just tear it down and hope your farm fills all your needs".
 

Yelling At Clouds

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No, but you can blame White Sox management for failing the second part of the typical rebuild: signing free agents and trading for pieces that put you over the top. The White Sox refused to spend, and when they did, they did so idiotically. They also never really pulled the trigger on any trades to upgrade the team. The cautionary tale the White Sox should illustrate is "you need outside talent, you can't just tear it down and hope your farm fills all your needs".
Well, they traded Nick Madrigal for Craig Kimbrel, but that decision worked out poorly for all involved. Pretty much all of their spending was on relievers, now that I look - Graveman, Hendricks, Joe Kelly.
 

moondog80

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I also want to take a moment to discuss the Chicago White Sox, who are perhaps something of a cautionary tale about big rebuilds. They executed a teardown/rebuild that a lot of baseball observers were impressed by, and they absolutely looked like a team who’d be competing every year in 2021. Turns out that one division title is all they really have to show for it. And I don’t think you can even blame TLR for this, not entirely at least.
Yeah, no matter what path you take, the risk of failure is there. In this case, they didn't fill in the missing pieces with Connor Wongs and Rob Refsnyders, and some of the guys they were reasonably counting on like Moncada and Tim Anderson went south.

Does Moncada have negative trade value at this point? 24.8 mil next year and 25 mil in 2025 with a 5 mil buy out. I think yes?
 

Yelling At Clouds

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Does Moncada have negative trade value at this point? 24.8 mil next year and 25 mil in 2025 with a 5 mil buy out. I think yes?
This is a side note, but I am increasingly convinced that Yoan Moncada is what Nick Yorke's MLB career is going to look like.
 

Jason Bae

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I don't think that the Sox/Angels trade is that bad. If you think that Quero is a going to be your catcher of the future, he's currently blocked at the Major Leagues by the catcher of the future O'Hoppe. So unless you think that he's a good candidate for permanant DH, then I'm not sure where you'd put him. Plus you have someone who is a really good DH that you're trying like hell to sign to a mega contract. I'm not an expert on the Angels' system by Ky Bush doesn't seem to be anything special either. But the players themselves aren't really the issue, right? It's like why are you throwing more resources behind a team that's probably not that good and probably won't make the playoffs? And to answer that I think that this is a move made with the idea of trying to convince Ohtani that they are doing everything that they can to be good. The Angels haven't made the postseason in 10 seasons and I don't think have been particularly close either despite having Mike Trout, Albert Pujols, Ohtani, etc. on the roster at certain times. I think that when you get even a sliver of an opportunity like Los Angeles has, you have to take it.

The Angels' system also isn't very good, so I'm not sure the White Sox chose now to trade maybe the best pitcher on the market (dependent on whether Paxton is available, though the way the Red Sox have played I doubt very much that he is) when there could've been a nice bidding war going into the last week of July.

And I don't think that Arte Moreno is a good guy or a particularly good owner, but I do like that he went for it. I wish that more owners would go against their brains for making money and just say fuck it and see what happens.
I didn't realize Quero skipped high-A. That he's been able to maintain strong walk and strikeout rates is impressive. In fact, he has more walks than K's. Hasn't shown much power in AA so far though.
 

moondog80

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This is a side note, but I am increasingly convinced that Yoan Moncada is what Nick Yorke's MLB career is going to look like.
He did have some good seasons; I don't know that I'd want him going forward, but for the first 6 years? It would be a huge win for Yorke to be like Moncada while he is cheap.
 

Petagine in a Bottle

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Moncada had the one great year where he hit .315.

Kind of wild to look at his BA by season

.231
.235
.315
.225
.263
.212
.228
 

jon abbey

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That is four NL teams in two seasons for Robertson, CHC/PHI last year, NYM/MIA this year.
 

grimshaw

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That's a good haul for Robertson. According to fangraphs, Vargas is a 40+ fv guy with a potentially "special" hit tool, Hernandez is an fv 40.
Martin seems like the closest comp skill wise though he has another year. The relief market is crazy high.
 

DeadlySplitter

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... Why do the Dodgers want yet another shitty prior player back? Maybe its their way of lowering the return out?
 

E5 Yaz

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Andy Martino of SNY reports that the Mets have thus far received “moderate” interest in Verlander but have not had meaningful enough talks to even approach the three-time Cy Young winner about waiving his no-trade clause. Scherzer has drawn less interest, per Martino. / mlbtr
 

Scoops Bolling

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Lee's been kinda shitty this year, but between him and Quero, the White Sox should have a successor for Grandal.

Ninja edit: Korey Lee is the return for Graveman.
 

EvilEmpire

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Given the apparently high prices for rentals, I wish Baltimore would set their farm system on fire for a few upgrades. Their system is pretty good and I'd love to see some of that potential long term talent go elsewhere for questionable short term gains.
 

LogansDad

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Given the apparently high prices for rentals, I wish Baltimore would set their farm system on fire for a few upgrades. Their system is pretty good and I'd love to see some of that potential long term talent go elsewhere for questionable short term gains.
Finally, something we can agree on as Red Sox and Yankee fans.

I don't see them doing it, though, and, as someone who is enjoying watching that team, I am not sure they should. I'm not even sure this is their window opening season yet, they are going to be scary good if they stay the course, and they are in pretty good position to start putting the "Rays model" (that is what we are calling it, right?) into effect.

In any case, they are a lot of fun to watch.
 

jon abbey

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The AL East is so stacked, both currently and longer term, that it really doesn't make much sense for any of the five teams to trade prospects for short-term rentals in most situations. The Orioles are this good doing things their way, unexpected short-term success shouldn't change their plans. People bashed them all winter for not 'going for it' and spending money, but spending money is a mistake at least as often as it is the right thing to do.
 

AB in DC

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And how good are the Orioles, anyway? Their run differential is 7th best in the AL. Their third-order win percent is 8th. The 50-54 Padres have a better Pythagorean. How much of this is actually sustainable?
 

John Marzano Olympic Hero

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And how good are the Orioles, anyway? Their run differential is 7th best in the AL. Their third-order win percent is 8th. The 50-54 Padres have a better Pythagorean. How much of this is actually sustainable?
I don’t know if it matters. I’m not sure how you could sell your fans or your team that “actually, we’re not really that good. It’s all smoke and mirrors.”

especially since they haven’t made the postseason since 2016(?).
 

AB in DC

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I was trying to make the opposite point -- if the aren't buyers at the deadline, there's a serious risk of reversion, and they'll blow their only open window.
 

Bob Montgomerys Helmet Hat

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I was trying to make the opposite point -- if the aren't buyers at the deadline, there's a serious risk of reversion, and they'll blow their only open window.
Obviously, nothing is guaranteed, but shouldn't this be the very beginning of a decent window as opposed to their only open window? If anything, this is probably a little premature bonus.
 

Yaz4Ever

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Love reading the tweets or whatever they’re called now with “Soto traded” “Verlander on the move” but no specifics and other people are bemoaning trades that aren’t real
 

jon abbey

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And how good are the Orioles, anyway? Their run differential is 7th best in the AL. Their third-order win percent is 8th. The 50-54 Padres have a better Pythagorean. How much of this is actually sustainable?
Well, on the flip side, they keep bringing up more and more young talent. Grayson Rodriguez looked incredible last night, big boost if he can keep that up.

Also I know the Yankees always outperformed their run differential when they had Rivera, I’m sure at least some of that is how good Cano and Bautista have been.
 

JM3

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Mets doing the smart thing & selling has been mildly surprising, but good for them.
 

amfox1

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What did they give up? I’d kick the tires on Verlander
Scherzer has a full NTC and may not approve.

Per Evan Grant, Sebastian Walcott, Rangers' top int'l signee this winter (MLB Pipeline #98, TEX #6), was pulled from his game in the ACL this afternoon. So, he could be part of the return.
 

jon abbey

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Per Evan Grant, Sebastian Walcott, Rangers' top int'l signee this winter (MLB Pipeline #98), was pulled from his game in the ACL this afternoon. So, he could be part of the return.
No, this was evidently disciplinary. I'm sure the Mets will do well if it goes through though.