I wouldn't cry if we got Solarte.
Not sure what a winning offer from here ends up looking like though. He appears to be a fairly useful player for them to just be dumping off for a Chavis type, no?
Who's on Third? I don't know
- Thread starter Devizier
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Not sure what a winning offer from here ends up looking like though. He appears to be a fairly useful player for them to just be dumping off for a Chavis type, no?
Can Neil Walker play third? He's a very good second baseman on a one-year contract for the bad Mets. Not mammoth power, but his .198 ISO would be tied for second on the team (with Bradley). His wOBA+ from the last two seasons is .350. Others over that span:
Beltre .372
Machado .349
Moustakas .346
Shaw .340
Solarte .340
Flores .329
Frazier .326
Prado .324
Sandoval .259
Looks like he's working his way back from a hamstring tear, projected back on the field "late July or early August." With Addison Reed available he could be a sneaky get if he's healthy and willing to move out of position before hitting FA.
Beltre .372
Machado .349
Moustakas .346
Shaw .340
Solarte .340
Flores .329
Frazier .326
Prado .324
Sandoval .259
Looks like he's working his way back from a hamstring tear, projected back on the field "late July or early August." With Addison Reed available he could be a sneaky get if he's healthy and willing to move out of position before hitting FA.
Solarte has a great contract (roughly 6 mill AAV ) which include two team options, so is going to be more expensive to acquire than Frazier would have been. The issue is that it is longer term and there really isn't another great positional fit unless he's their utility guy once Devers is ready.
Harrison is more expensive (10.5 AAV over the next three years, but two are team options), it's a decent contract so would probably be easier to acquire than Solarte. He is the same as Solarte in that, he really wouldn't have anywhere else to play once Devers is up, and he would also make too much for a utility guy.
I guess they could deal either this off season if needed.
I have zero interest in Freese or Cabrera. They are upgrades on paper because they are league average bats but. . . meh. I would hope the combination of Holt, Lin, Marrero and Devers could outperform either.
Harrison is more expensive (10.5 AAV over the next three years, but two are team options), it's a decent contract so would probably be easier to acquire than Solarte. He is the same as Solarte in that, he really wouldn't have anywhere else to play once Devers is up, and he would also make too much for a utility guy.
I guess they could deal either this off season if needed.
I have zero interest in Freese or Cabrera. They are upgrades on paper because they are league average bats but. . . meh. I would hope the combination of Holt, Lin, Marrero and Devers could outperform either.
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Could that be spin coming out of the front office or do we really think they never really wanted him?
Could be, but it's also kind of hard to swoop in and grab Frazier on the cheap if talks had already been in the works elsewhere with Chicago looking to make a larger scale trade.
If the initial phone call left DD with the impression that we weren't going to get Frazier by himself and on the cheap then no, probably not. Given that was kinda the whole sell there to begin with.
Yankees basically gave up nothing much but kryptonite in their pen. Couple of low level prospects who may of may not be more than lottery tickets. They agreed to eat all the salary which gave them an edge.
Frazier has not been great in the 2nd half for much of his career and I'm not sure YS3 is a great park for him, but their bullpen will be better
Might be better deals out there for the Red Sox. DD better hope so
Frazier has not been great in the 2nd half for much of his career and I'm not sure YS3 is a great park for him, but their bullpen will be better
Might be better deals out there for the Red Sox. DD better hope so
All this says to me is that you know anything about Yankee prospects ... and since you haven't heard of them, they must suck. There's a thread on this trade in the Yankee sub-forum, where the prospects involved have been discussed all night.
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Maybe something like Groome, Lakins and Abad plus a far away guy with upside like Baldwin?
Rutherford is a top 40 prospect so the Red Sox would have had to offer up one of their best to be competitive.
Given DD's history of acting quickly and decisively, I think it's probably accurate. If he was going to make the trade, it probably happens right after we start hearing about it. His deals usually don't linger around.
I'm more than OK with not making this deal. This Red Sox team has too many flaws to send a few of their remaining trading chips for a two-month rental at 3B and a bullpen upgrade.
Solarte has been on the DL for nearly a month with an oblique strain, so he is not an ideal target right now.
Did anyone else see Olney speculating that the Orioles should consider trading Machado to the Sox for Devers ? His argument is that the Os won't re-sign MM next year so Devers for a 1.5 year rental would be worth it.
http://nesn.com/2017/07/manny-machado-to-red-sox-buster-olney-believes-orioles-should-explore-trade/
My sense is that even for a rental, Devers wouldn't be enough.
Thoughts?
http://nesn.com/2017/07/manny-machado-to-red-sox-buster-olney-believes-orioles-should-explore-trade/
My sense is that even for a rental, Devers wouldn't be enough.
Thoughts?
I would throw in Beni if they would throw in Showalter just so I could fire his ass. So good thing I'm not GM.
I wouldn't trade Devers for Machado straight up. Now that Machado doesn't really steal bases, Devers actually has a reasonable chance of offering the same offensive production, and I'll take the $30m/yr difference in their salaries starting in 2019 and spend it on something else, thanks.
It's not that the team has "too many flaws" it's the fact you need a decent farm system to keep pumping out prospects in order to keep being successful and they're dangerously close to being a bottom 10 farm system. Once Devers comes up they might have the worst or close to it. Right now the Sox need help on the corners. Pitching is fine. Middle of the order bat will be solved at 1st or 3rd.
I know this is unrelated, but where do you think he signs after next year? Everyone has Harper going to the Yankees, but I feel its much more likely that he stays with the Nats and Machado ends up a yankee.
Do we see ourselves as serious players next offseason? Will we make a run at one of these two? do we resign kimbrel long term? Or are we hoping on saving all of our money for the young talent currently on the roster?
Do we see ourselves as serious players next offseason? Will we make a run at one of these two? do we resign kimbrel long term? Or are we hoping on saving all of our money for the young talent currently on the roster?
A deal with the Bucs for Freese or Harrison still looks like the most likely option to me due to their surplus, likely acquisition cost, and pertinent contract situations. Harrison is a better hitter this year including more pop, slashing .272/353/422/775 and providing positional flexibility (but which also begs the question of whether he can hold down 3B as a regular - I'm not familiar with his glove work). He has a decent contract, flexible with 2 team options/buyouts but expensive AAV ~$10.5M. Freese would be much more of merely a stabilizer as opposed to an asset, since he's slashing 241/371/357/728, good for an OPS+ of 93 (which obviously is still an improvement for the Sox). Freese is only owed about ~$4.5M next season and then can be bought out, so he will have a lower acquisition cost. Anyone want to speak to his defense?
I think this is a critical question for divining DD's trade strategy. I don't see us as good fits for many of the top FAs the next two offseasons.
(Expanded on this in a post a few weeks back: http://sonsofsamhorn.net/index.php?threads/evaluating-the-2017-red-sox.19416/page-3#post-2291183)
Its interesting for the Sox....one way the trade cost is potentially lower is that they only need someone who merely sucks to replace someone who shouldn't even be in MLB.
It's probably as simple as the Redsox wanting Lin to get regular at bats to see if he's the real deal or not and to get more reps at 3b and possibly the OF again. The few times I saw Lin in Portland, he looked like he could turn into a competent CF.
This team has at most four real flaws and upgrading third base and the bullpen fixes two of them. I'm okay with not doing this deal too, but let's not pretend this team needs an overhaul.
In addition, given that Holt and Lin are LH bats, they may have gone with Marrero as the RH option so that they could settle into a L/R platoon and ease Holt into action
People keep saying this and it probably does play into it, but Lin has no career split vs L/R in his minor league career. It's 1400 PA vs R, 500 vs L. He also didn't hit at all until this year so who knows what to make of it. This year he's hitting lefties even better than righties. 201 PA vs R, .285/.372/.436. 47 PA vs L (SSS) .310/.370/.500. I'm not sure where the platoon talk comes from. Must be scouting vs stats or Farrell simply doing L/R, R/L match ups.
edit: Nevermind, people probably just look at the 2016 splits and don't bother going further back.
My thought of a platoon is more from the angle of getting Holt some days off. Given the recent few months with his concussion recovery I think that is something they will try to do regularly. Platoon is just one way although maybe not the best way.
Does anyone know if Sam Travis ever had any playing time at 3B either in the minor or college? I am guess NO since I have never heard him mentioned as an option...... If I were him I think I would be taking some grounders over there.
He's never played anywhere but 1B/DH in the minors. Can't find his college stats, but I'd guess if they thought he could handle it, they would've had him work on it in his last AAA stint.
He's really, really slow afoot. I doubt he'd have the range or reactions to play 3b.
They were certainly a bottom third of the league system before the draft and IFA signing period. They're comfortably middle of the pack now. And unless they don't make a trade and just end up calling Devers up in early August, their ranking will stay in that range over the winter. If that's the case, by the time he does graduate next season, advancements from within along with next year's draft and IFA period should keep them from slipping back that far.
They did a really good job of filling out the system again, and even plunked a bunch of interesting talent in rounds 11-40 to max bonuses (125k), a couple just over (140k) and one at 172k, so they may even have a name or two from that group hit the radar by then.
This was a really good couple of months for infusing talent into a depleted system. They've added 11 names to the soxprospects.com top 60.
Tanner Houck (5), Daniel Flores (7), Cole Brannen (14), Alex Scherff (15), Jake Thompson (18), Danny Diaz (22), Brett Netzer (32), Zach Schellenger (33), Antoni Flores (40), Tyler Esplin (56) and Aaron Perry (58).
Cozart will be expensive and I'm not sure how much of his season line is sustainable. Since June 1st he's been league average offensively with a decent ISO. His ISO in that span would still be better than anyone currently on the roster not named Mookie, but I'm not sure I'd want to pay for the 142 wRC+ and .236 ISO. He wouldn't be any worse than Frazier would have been for the club, but he won't be as cheap as Frazier would have been (solo), either.
Side note: Chris Sale currently has the highest ISO on the Red Sox roster this year. Tiny samples are fun.
I don't think he'd be all that expensive especially in comparison to what a true, established, impact bat like JD Martinez cost.
He'll cost more than Frazier but I'd think he'd be less than Solarte or Harrison (depending on salary absorbed) given Cozart will be a free agent. I just think he's more of fit with Devers looming.
Now that the Yankees have their guy, there isn't much of a 3b market.
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Yeah..great idea, I mean having try the outfield a couple years ago worked so well...what could go wrong?
I would bring Lin back up. His defence was pretty good and in 50 at bats he was hitting .280 with a .379 OBP. Far superior to Morrero. Hitting .333 vs lefthanders and .273 vs right-handers. Give him the chance to see if he can maintain this.
Texas is 17.5 games back in the division but only 3.5 out of a wildcard spot. They may not be quite ready to raise the white flag.
Also, Beltre is signed through next season at $18M. Dombrowski has already been clear that they're not keen to go over the luxury tax cap this year, and Beltre's salary would pretty much assure going over now and next year. Not to mention that is an expensive roadblock to put in front of your best prospect, especially when you're already eating $20M to be rid of the previous roadblock.
This also assumes Beltre wants to come back to Boston. He has 10/5 rights so he can block a trade. I know he had a great year here and we love him for it, but that doesn't mean he's necessarily keen on a reunion. He might be perfectly happy right where he is.
Cozart has never played an inning of 3B at any professional level. Acquiring him to play that position for the stretch drive strikes me as a bad idea for two reasons:
1) 3B is easier than SS, but easier doesn't mean easy, and it's not "just like SS, but easier". There are plays a 3B has to make that are unlike any a SS has to make. There would be a learning curve, and it would happen during games that count.
2) SS is more valuable than 3B and therefore the Reds are likely to want more for him than a 3B with his offensive skills is worth.
The gist of what I was getting at was that if they were square pegging 3b with names like Asdrubel Cabrera by moving a player off of their natural position I'd rather have Cozart. Your second point is something I hadn't considered.
Edit: Cozart not Frazier.
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Dombrowski letting Frazier go to the NYY's doesn't exactly scream desperation to me.
I'm not sure what from the trade details suggests that Dombrowski "let" anything happen. The Yankees made a more appealing offer. In order to beat it, the Sox would have had to build a package around Groome, which was a non-starter.
Meanwhile...
Devers goes oppo deep. You look at this collection of total mediocrity and it starts becoming really clear that the best 3B option for this team is already in the system by the name of Rafael Devers.
Devers goes oppo deep. You look at this collection of total mediocrity and it starts becoming really clear that the best 3B option for this team is already in the system by the name of Rafael Devers.
The only question is his glove, but there is Holt or Marrero to sub in for defense at the appropriate time. You could also DH Devers if Hanley is going to be playing 1st a lot.
talk about pushing the issue.. .and Moreland could probably use a DL stint on that toe as well.
Well, DD could have pushed for a deal for Frazier alone. The White Sox could have done a deal with the Red Sox for Frazier and one with the Yankees for the two relievers. DDski does not look like the guy who shows desperation or rush (but closes deals fast).