Your 2015 Boston Red Sox
- Thread starter In my lifetime
- Start date
- Status
Hire the best man for the job. How is the guy in working with players, especially the young ones that Sox have all over the place? He did get some praise from his work with the Iowa Cubs, including from Theo himself. This came right up on Googling Manny as hitting coach though:soxhop411 said:
http://www.foxsports.com/mlb/story/manny-ramirez-could-be-cubs-next-hitting-coach-100214
Beyond the sentimental reasons, I would love to see a Xander Bogaerts at-bat after a season of Manny's tutelage.
Al Zarilla said:
There's a pretty good chance Kevin Long is out in MFYLand .. Sox should be all over him
I'm surprised more people aren't talking about Hanley. Only two people in this thread have brought him up, over 371 posts. It seems weird.
Plenty of reasons why he may be a bad fit, but he's a very good-to-superstar caliber player, a FA in a year our pick is protected, and he (arguably) fills a need.
Obviously the Yankees are buying a shortstop this year. It's probably him! But it could also be J.J. Hardy, who's way better defensively, and which might be smarter if they're playing A-Rod full-time.
I don't want to talk about moving Bogaerts to third, and I don't particularly want to read posts by others who do.
But I have a question: Will Hanley play third? Seems like his insistence on playing short for the Dodgers was calibrated so that he'd hit FA right when Jeter's contract was up. Are we presuming he'll go to NY? Are people happy not to care about Hanley for some reason?
Plenty of reasons why he may be a bad fit, but he's a very good-to-superstar caliber player, a FA in a year our pick is protected, and he (arguably) fills a need.
Obviously the Yankees are buying a shortstop this year. It's probably him! But it could also be J.J. Hardy, who's way better defensively, and which might be smarter if they're playing A-Rod full-time.
I don't want to talk about moving Bogaerts to third, and I don't particularly want to read posts by others who do.
But I have a question: Will Hanley play third? Seems like his insistence on playing short for the Dodgers was calibrated so that he'd hit FA right when Jeter's contract was up. Are we presuming he'll go to NY? Are people happy not to care about Hanley for some reason?
chawson said:
Hanley is right in the sweet spot of where John Henry has declared the team's non-interest in signing free agents.
May be true, just saying young arms from teams that are looking to release payroll or retool in several positions. Sale is just an option that I heard spoken of. You never know. I'm just stating that there are plenty of possibilities to put together a trade. It may be, how was it said - ludicrous, but I've seen a team pay Ellsbury $153million which I find completely "ludicrous".Bob Montgomery's Helmet Hat said:
lxt said:
As soon as Ellsbury became a free agent there was a possibility of him getting that kind of contract. There's absolutely no way Sale is dealt for the kind of players you are suggesting. It isn't even in the realm of possibility. The Red Sox have to both get a premium pitcher (or two) and solve their OF/5th starter logjam, but the odds of them accomplishing both those things in a single deal is slim to none. Let's look at those issues separately since the spare parts of a 70 win team aren't going to bring back a great cost controlled young pitcher.
Interesting article:http://www.csnne.com/boston-red-sox/red-sox-take-note-phillies-decide-trade-hamelsrodderick said:
Let's not get hung up on Sale, he was only one of the players I mentioned. I think Shields, Lester, Hamels & Samardzija are also possibilities.
Sale isn't a possibility at all. ChiSox have a ton of talent at a minimal cost. They'll probably be the mystery team on a few FAs this winter. Can we please stop pretending that we'll acquire a stud player without X , Swihart, and/or Betts changing addresses. In the 2nd wildcard era, there is a climate for trading a dollar for Ten dimes.
Won't happen. Too many moving parts, etc... But with all the excess vets and stacked farm system Ending up with
Betts
Pedroia
Votto
Stanton
Papi
Bogaerts
Castillo
Holt/Cecchini
Vasquez
Lester
Cueto
Buchholz
Kelly
RDR/Ranaudo (whoever doesn't get shipped out)
Uehara
Badenhop
Workman
etc.
leaves a payroll under the LTT for the next few years. Of course this whole thing would be predicated on CIN wanted to shed that much payroll while also seeing enough value in Craig and Cespedes. That, however would be a fun team to watch.
Betts
Pedroia
Votto
Stanton
Papi
Bogaerts
Castillo
Holt/Cecchini
Vasquez
Lester
Cueto
Buchholz
Kelly
RDR/Ranaudo (whoever doesn't get shipped out)
Uehara
Badenhop
Workman
etc.
leaves a payroll under the LTT for the next few years. Of course this whole thing would be predicated on CIN wanted to shed that much payroll while also seeing enough value in Craig and Cespedes. That, however would be a fun team to watch.
Okay, I seceding the point. Like Koufax32, I'm just stating a possibility based on rumor, hearsay and wild guessing. With the Sox wealth of excess vets, young talent and prospects to offer up in significant trades there exist all kinds of potential to pull off just about any trade.CaskNFappin said:
What about Charlie Furbush? Seems kind of underutilized as a reliever, a big lefty who might have taken a little longer to figure out his mechanics but who cut his BB/9 in half this past season. 10 K/9. He's 28, under team control through 2017. Has four pitches. He does have a platoon split, but less extreme than a guy like Masterson. Seattle needs right-handed power - their OPS was 60 pts lower vs. RHP this past season.
Do we all agree if the sox don't do anything about the rotation, it makes little sense to invest in other short term pieces - including stopgap 3rd baseman, bullpen, backup catcher.
Its not going to be a pretty product, but I just don't see a way for them to compete without adding [SIZE=13.63636302948px]at least [/SIZE]two top-half of the rotation arms. I am willing to bet Buch figured something out in the stretch and can be lumped into the top-half discussion, but the expectation I have is he is most likely to be a 3. I am comfortable with Kelly and one of the youngens filling up the back. Outside of Barnes (who i think could use another season of seasoning), I think the other likely candidates (webster, renaudo,rdlr, wright) are fungible enough that they would have choices. But without that top half, why bother. Keep your options open. Yes it would blow.
Its not going to be a pretty product, but I just don't see a way for them to compete without adding [SIZE=13.63636302948px]at least [/SIZE]two top-half of the rotation arms. I am willing to bet Buch figured something out in the stretch and can be lumped into the top-half discussion, but the expectation I have is he is most likely to be a 3. I am comfortable with Kelly and one of the youngens filling up the back. Outside of Barnes (who i think could use another season of seasoning), I think the other likely candidates (webster, renaudo,rdlr, wright) are fungible enough that they would have choices. But without that top half, why bother. Keep your options open. Yes it would blow.
I don't get this all or nothing approach some posters here have. They should acquire talent when and where they can. If they have the option to land Headley on a 3 year deal for a price they like they shouldn't balk because they haven't signed a front of the rotation starter yet. Two and three year deals help more than the 2015 club and help bring the floor up so that if they miss out on the top three starters, they might still sneak into the wild card game with some over performance and/or growth. The same can be said about any one year contract they hand out. Improve where you can because you never know when a young player will figure it out or an older vet might have a career year. 2013 should be all any of us need to look at to be reminded that it's always worth raising the talent floor.
I may have miscategroized the stopgaps. I don't think a 3 year asset is a short term acquisition, the commitment in years demonstrates a belief in future value. There is the outside chance of catching lightning in bottle - and sure if you can raise the talent floor by acquiring movable assets, then perhaps they can be leveraged at the deadline to pay the talent pipeline forward, should the team falter. I do see the value bringing in Steven Drew type deals at this point (1yr slightly above market). I like Holt, but I wonder how much of that was him being a fresh breath on a horrible season. That said, I am not sold on him starting, but I do wonder whether the roster/payroll flexibility of having him at 3rd provides an advantage over make-good veteran.
[SIZE=13.63636302948px]Maybe I can get my mind around to what you are saying snod, let me chew on it for a bit. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=13.63636302948px]Maybe I can get my mind around to what you are saying snod, let me chew on it for a bit. [/SIZE]
To be clear, I wasn't trying to single you out, my post just happened to follow yours. I had been considering posting something like that for a few days.
Thanks for the reply.
Thanks for the reply.
The Red Sox are going to spend some dinero this winter. The pitching is the most obvious place begging for attention but the Red Sox do not have to say "well we're spending a lot on pitching so third base is going to be a more affordable solution." Additionally I think two of our three young lefties who are close are going to get "cashed in" for a legitimate top arm who is a little closer to free agency I'm looking at you Cincinnati.
3rd Base
1) Pablo - Even with his weight issues his defense is surprisingly adequate and he provides that sought after left handed bat to lengthen the lineup. Does he get a McCann type deal ? I might do it because I'm not sold on either Hanley or Headley
Pitching
Shields/ Lester- whichever they can stomach taking the "risk" of paying pitching on
Trade for Cueto or Hamels
Be aggressive on Maeda
Bullpen
Bring back Koji 8 mill
Miller give him the 3-4 year deal to take over as closer either next year or move koji to the 8th but if i had to pick either or I'd give the years and money to Miller who is on a historic run.
3rd Base
1) Pablo - Even with his weight issues his defense is surprisingly adequate and he provides that sought after left handed bat to lengthen the lineup. Does he get a McCann type deal ? I might do it because I'm not sold on either Hanley or Headley
Pitching
Shields/ Lester- whichever they can stomach taking the "risk" of paying pitching on
Trade for Cueto or Hamels
Be aggressive on Maeda
Bullpen
Bring back Koji 8 mill
Miller give him the 3-4 year deal to take over as closer either next year or move koji to the 8th but if i had to pick either or I'd give the years and money to Miller who is on a historic run.
I was just thinking, are Sox fans and SOSH ready for all the Panda hats they get at AT&T (or even when the Giants are on the road)? Extra money for the concessions people!
You might do a McCann deal but Sandoval won't. He was asking at one point for 100 million and it's not out of the realm of possibility that he gets it.jimbobim said:
Has there been any word on Ryan Dempter's intentions for 2015? IIRC, he was placed on the suspended (?) list which meant that if he came back he would have to honour his contract - which had a year left. It also meant, I believe that Boston would have to honour it as well which would put a serious crimp in the budget.
Alex Speier has a nice piece on the WEEI site about former Sox draftee/farmhand Hunter Strickland who is now, 7 years on, lighting it up for the Giants:
http://fullcount.weei.com/sports/boston/baseball/red-sox/2014/10/06/long-before-he-threw-100-hunter-stricklands-red-sox-tenure-recalled/
I post that here because of this quote from PawSox Manager Kevin Boles, who managed Strickland in Greenville in 2009:
“I just think that it shows you that anything is possible. There’s guys that have gotten a lot of attention. But you can never say never with guys. You can’t sell short, especially, intelligence and game makeup. Obviously, having the stuff to match that plays a key component. But you just can’t write anybody off at any given point in time. Unless they say that they’re finished, you just never know, and that’s the beauty of this. Anything is possible with these guys.”
Reflects somewhat on how the Sox might have a hard time giving up on a Middlebrooks or a JBJ.
http://fullcount.weei.com/sports/boston/baseball/red-sox/2014/10/06/long-before-he-threw-100-hunter-stricklands-red-sox-tenure-recalled/
I post that here because of this quote from PawSox Manager Kevin Boles, who managed Strickland in Greenville in 2009:
“I just think that it shows you that anything is possible. There’s guys that have gotten a lot of attention. But you can never say never with guys. You can’t sell short, especially, intelligence and game makeup. Obviously, having the stuff to match that plays a key component. But you just can’t write anybody off at any given point in time. Unless they say that they’re finished, you just never know, and that’s the beauty of this. Anything is possible with these guys.”
Reflects somewhat on how the Sox might have a hard time giving up on a Middlebrooks or a JBJ.
They'd have the right to bring him back or release him. It would be a team option.BCsMightyJoeYoung said:
From Dave Cameron's FanGraphs chat. Here is one pitcher I did not think would be available, but if he is, add him to the target list via trade:
Comment From Mike, of Mike and the Mechanics Fame
What is your offseason strategy if you are Washington?
Dave Cameron: It’s an interesting situation. They probably need to trade a starter, and Zimmermann seems like the most likely candidate.
Comment From Mike, of Mike and the Mechanics Fame
What is your offseason strategy if you are Washington?
Dave Cameron: It’s an interesting situation. They probably need to trade a starter, and Zimmermann seems like the most likely candidate.
Hee Sox Choi said:
Zimmerman was a curious name to see in the chat so often considering how good he's been. I'm pretty sure he declined to talk extension and he's arguably been better and more consistent then Strasburg.
The other name that dominated that chat was Mookie. I'm sure this ground has been covered and will be covered extensively but to move Mookie i'd have to get a Stanton or Goldshmidt (never going to happen with his new deal) type in return . Mookie and X are really 1 and 2 in my book with Swihart expendable as a centerpiece.
From that same Dave Cameron chat I thought this was interesting...
Comment From personable person
Hey Dave, I ran this by Jeff yesterday and he seemed a little intrigued so I want to run it by you. I hate trade proposals but here goes: The A’s are in kind of rebuild/go-for-it-again limbo. The Red Sox seem poised to make a run of it though, and they need a 3B. Would a Donaldson for Betts trade make sense? There would of course be some finer details to the deal, but Donaldson is going to get too expensive for the A’s in a year or two probably and he’s right at his peak. Betts would give the A’s cheap value over a while, and the Red Sox would get a peak-ish 3B for a solid run. Any thoughts?
12:54
Dave Cameron: I don’t think the Red Sox would do it. Donaldson is a Super Two, so he’s about to get expensive, and he’s an older player who has probably already peaked.
I wonder if that is the industry consensus on that possible trade? Of course this could mean that the Red Sox just don't match up with the A's if they don't include Betts or Bogaerts but they may be able to get it done with a package centered around Swihart, Owens, Margot, and E-Rod
http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/dave-cameron-fangraphs-chat-10814/. Here's the link to the chat
Comment From personable person
Hey Dave, I ran this by Jeff yesterday and he seemed a little intrigued so I want to run it by you. I hate trade proposals but here goes: The A’s are in kind of rebuild/go-for-it-again limbo. The Red Sox seem poised to make a run of it though, and they need a 3B. Would a Donaldson for Betts trade make sense? There would of course be some finer details to the deal, but Donaldson is going to get too expensive for the A’s in a year or two probably and he’s right at his peak. Betts would give the A’s cheap value over a while, and the Red Sox would get a peak-ish 3B for a solid run. Any thoughts?
12:54
Dave Cameron: I don’t think the Red Sox would do it. Donaldson is a Super Two, so he’s about to get expensive, and he’s an older player who has probably already peaked.
I wonder if that is the industry consensus on that possible trade? Of course this could mean that the Red Sox just don't match up with the A's if they don't include Betts or Bogaerts but they may be able to get it done with a package centered around Swihart, Owens, Margot, and E-Rod
http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/dave-cameron-fangraphs-chat-10814/. Here's the link to the chat
What would lead you to believe Zimmerman would ask for anything but the moon? His success, age, and lack of abuse offers him this leverage.Papelbon's Poutine said:
tbb345 said:
I certainly hope you meant "a package centered around one of Swihart, Owens....etc." I wouldn't give up all four of those guys in the same deal for anything short of Mike Trout.
Savin Hillbilly said:
So it seems like that package is way too much. I think we can pretty safely say that Betts and Bogaerts will not be traded this offseason (you never know, but I think it's a safe assumption). Swihart would seem to be the best chip to trade because of the presence of Vazquez and he has immense value around the league.
I wonder if the A's would consider a Swihart, Owens, Cecchini, and Marrero package. Seems like it would be a good fit for both teams.
A's and Red Sox seem to match up really well and the trade could be expanded to include both Donaldson and Samardzija
I still don't really understand the rationale for the A's to trade Donaldson unless they've somehow come to the conclusion that he's past his prime and/or they can get someone to overpay for him. Isn't he the type of cost-controlled player they should be building around, not trading? Pardon me if I'm being a bit naive, but I'm not sure that's a sweepstakes I'd like to see the Sox win, given the likely cost.
tbb345 said:
I would be very much in favor of you have separated betts and bogaerts from the other talent.
I wonder how Vaz and Swihart are viewed internally. Has to be like splitting hairs but the Molina tutoring and framing might sway me to Vaz. Then again Swihart's best case scenario is Posey which is MVP talent.
Puffy said:
It's all speculation. Olney wrote an article in which he said that this year was the end of the current A's core and he wrote (and actually talked with industry sources and officials) he thought that Beane would trade Donaldson because that's who he would get the best return on
yeah i saw the olney piece. the donaldson thing is the one part of it that made zero sense. donaldson is cost-controlled for the next 4 years. he would easily be part of the next core of cost-controlled players. if i'm beane, the only way i trade him is if I'm trying to completely clear the decks for young prospects and don't plan on being competitive for at least the next 2-3 years. i don't think he's ever operated that way.
Why on Earth would Oakland not go for it next year?
I see a good A's team that should contend for the AL West, at the LEAST a Wild Card:
Rotation: Sonny Gray, Samardzija, Kazmir, Jarrod Parker (he's good) is back, as is AJ Griffin, + Drew Pomeranz & Jesse Chavez.
Line-up:
Crisp CF
Jaso C
Donaldson 3b
Moss 1b
Norris/Vogt C
Reddick RF
Gentry LF
SS ?
2b - Sogard but they should upgrade
They need a 2b + SS in free agency. Their pen is deep and strong. Why wouldn't they go for it again? Just don't see them trading Donaldson at this point. Maybe in 2 or 3 years but not now.
I see a good A's team that should contend for the AL West, at the LEAST a Wild Card:
Rotation: Sonny Gray, Samardzija, Kazmir, Jarrod Parker (he's good) is back, as is AJ Griffin, + Drew Pomeranz & Jesse Chavez.
Line-up:
Crisp CF
Jaso C
Donaldson 3b
Moss 1b
Norris/Vogt C
Reddick RF
Gentry LF
SS ?
2b - Sogard but they should upgrade
They need a 2b + SS in free agency. Their pen is deep and strong. Why wouldn't they go for it again? Just don't see them trading Donaldson at this point. Maybe in 2 or 3 years but not now.
I can easily envision Middlebrooks and JBJ turn into stars in Oakland. I'm sure Beane still sees the value and potential of those two and will figure a way to get them if Donaldson is sent here (along with other talent going to Oakland, of course.)
So what, a whole bunch of his first half overachievers turned into nothings in the second half and ended up costing him a solid power hitter for a rental and they went nowhere in October except home. The wakeup call of a trade could get WMB and JBJ going, or, maybe not. Maybe they just can't hit major league pitching. The fairy dust is off Beane. A lot of Oakland fans are sick of him. OK, his teams are still winning more than they lose but it's a long season and his patchwork offenses aren't getting it done.Trotsky said:
I expect them to do something like signing Shields, Headley and McCarthy. They'll probably re-sign Uehara, otherwise it would have been a waste not to trade him. Then, I could see them signing someone like Luke Hochevar on a pillow contract and picking up a backup catcher. Not many quality options out there, maybe Soto or Kottaras. Then, I imagine they'll explore trading for another starting pitcher. Maybe something like Craig and Swihart for Gio Gonzalez. It would be nice to get soemone on a reasonable contract.
Not a crazy thought on that proposed trade for Gio (whom the Nats may be willing to move), but Craig would be an expensive bench guy on a multi-year deal for a team who has alot of guys who are going to need to get paid soon, unless the Nats buy out Span's last year for $500K and part ways with him this offseason and would be willing to try Craig in LF and Harper in CF.... Also, their starting catcher Ramos is only 27 now, and not a FA for 3 more years.
I understand the frustration of always getting bounced in the first round of the playoffs but they should be thankful that they have a genius building that team who gets them to October on a regular basis with a bottom 5 payroll.touchstone033 said:
The Oakland A's would be so much worse if not for Billy Beane.
Or one could say that Beane is a moron thinking an offense consisting of Norris, Moss, Sogard, Donaldson, Lowrie, Fuld, Crisp and Reddick is going to hit enough to win in the post season. Callaspo, Gomes, Dunn and Punto coming off the bench. That'll strike fear in the opponents' heart. How about his trading Carlos Gonzalez and Huston Street for a few months of Matt Holliday in 2008 when the A's weren't even a contender. Nowadays, maybe Beane is a genius only in his own mind.touchstone033 said:
- Status