2019 Pats: WR "Bust a Move" Sanu Watch

E5 Yaz

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The more I let this move sink in, the worse feeling I'm getting about Gordon
 
Dec 6, 2017
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The more I let this move sink in, the worse feeling I'm getting about Gordon
It doesn't have to say anything about Gordon. Who do you expect on the field in obvious passing situations right now? White, Edleman, watson, gordon, ...Dorsett, meyers, or harry? Sanu just means you don't have to rely on the rookies anymore.

Also, Both Gordon and Sanu are good blockers.... Imagine a screen to their side of the field.
 

CoffeeNerdness

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The issue with Gordon is that it seems unlikely that the 2013 version of Gordon will return. He's been good this season, but far from that standard. And he'll be 29 next season, and any contract he signs will be for his 29-31 seasons.

It will be interesting to see how both sides approach this.
I'd be shocked if he was in a Pats uni next year. In a small sample they've looked better without him.
 

Ed Hillel

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If Gordon was going on IR, it would have happened already. Truth of the matter is the offense has been mediocre for over a month now, including when Gordon was playing. They need weapons, and Sanu is one.
 

BaseballJones

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If Gordon was going on IR, it would have happened already. Truth of the matter is the offense has been mediocre for over a month now, including when Gordon was playing. They need weapons, and Sanu is one.
What they REALLY need is for the OL to operate at a high level. They have plenty of weapons, to be honest. But if the OL can't run block, and if Brady is being pressured constantly, then it doesn't matter who his weapons are.

The OL needs to be fixed and it's by far the biggest issue on the team. Some of that may improve with Wynn's return. He's so much better than Newhouse. But Cannon and Mason have had subpar years and that's troubling. And Karras just isn't that good. Not sure how to fix that.
 

Saints Rest

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I wonder if the Pats (BB, Josh, Dante) realize that this is not the year where the OLine will allow Brady plenty of protection for deep routes or open up big holes for a power running game, so instead they are going to load up on sure-handed guys who can make their living on short/quick routes -- the old passing play as running play scheme.

Sanu seems made for this.
 

DennyDoyle'sBoil

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Some good stuff from Miguel on the Patriots draft picks next year when you take into account all the many trades and comp picks.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">(1/4) Please read all 4 tweets that are in thread<br><br>1<br>3 <br>3 comp-Trey Flowers<br>3 comp-Trent Brown<br>4 from Bears-2019 draft<br>6 from Broncos-Dawson<br>6 from Texans-Crossen<br>6 comp (Patterson)<br>6 comp (Malcom Brown)<br>7 from Falcons-Richards<br>7 from Eagles-Bennett<br>7 from Seahawks-Hollister</p>&mdash; Cap Space=$2,876,787 (@patscap) <a href="View: https://twitter.com/patscap/status/1186679503805976576?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw
">October 22, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>


1 3 3 comp-Trey Flowers 3 comp-Trent Brown 4 from Bears-2019 draft 6 from Broncos-Dawson 6 from Texans-Crossen 6 comp (Patterson) 6 comp (Malcom Brown) 7 from Falcons-Richards 7 from Eagles-Bennett 7 from Seahawks-Hollister

Edit: I still don't understand how to copy and paste tweets.
 

DJnVa

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The more I let this move sink in, the worse feeling I'm getting about Gordon
Hard disagree.

3 WR set--Edelman, Gordon, Sanu. Dorsett is the 4th WR or can sub in for any of those guys. Behind them you have the 2 rookies. Seems like a perfect setup.

Sanu is a talented WR they've wanted for years.

EDIT: That's not to say Gordon isn't more banged up than we think, but I just don't think this move proves that at all.
 

CCR

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Some good stuff from Miguel on the Patriots draft picks next year when you take into account all the many trades and comp picks.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">(1/4) Please read all 4 tweets that are in thread<br><br>1<br>3 <br>3 comp-Trey Flowers<br>3 comp-Trent Brown<br>4 from Bears-2019 draft<br>6 from Broncos-Dawson<br>6 from Texans-Crossen<br>6 comp (Patterson)<br>6 comp (Malcom Brown)<br>7 from Falcons-Richards<br>7 from Eagles-Bennett<br>7 from Seahawks-Hollister</p>&mdash; Cap Space=$2,876,787 (@patscap) <a href="View: https://twitter.com/patscap/status/1186679503805976576?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw
">October 22, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>


1 3 3 comp-Trey Flowers 3 comp-Trent Brown 4 from Bears-2019 draft 6 from Broncos-Dawson 6 from Texans-Crossen 6 comp (Patterson) 6 comp (Malcom Brown) 7 from Falcons-Richards 7 from Eagles-Bennett 7 from Seahawks-Hollister

Edit: I still don't understand how to copy and paste tweets.
That's fantastic. They have 12 picks and only two of them are their own.

View: https://twitter.com/patscap/status/1186680420508848129
 

Ed Hillel

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What they REALLY need is for the OL to operate at a high level. They have plenty of weapons, to be honest. But if the OL can't run block, and if Brady is being pressured constantly, then it doesn't matter who his weapons are.

The OL needs to be fixed and it's by far the biggest issue on the team. Some of that may improve with Wynn's return. He's so much better than Newhouse. But Cannon and Mason have had subpar years and that's troubling. And Karras just isn't that good. Not sure how to fix that.
I really don’t think they do have plenty of weapons catching passes more than 3 yards downfield. Edelman and then not much else. Gordon is ok, but he really should be a 2 WR outside, not a go-to guy at this point. He doesn’t get much separation. Myers has been promising, Harry an unknown and a rookie. Sanu is much needed.
 

TFisNEXT

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I really don’t think they do have plenty of weapons catching passes more than 3 yards downfield. Edelman and then not much else. Gordon is ok, but he really should be a 2 WR outside, not a go-to guy at this point. He doesn’t get much separation. Myers has been promising, Harry an unknown and a rookie. Sanu is much needed.
I also don't think Gordon has been healthy most of the year. He looked great opening night but he's looked a bit compromised since then. Obviously he's out at the moment, but Sanu's addition may allow them to get Gordon healthy which would make a big difference.
 

InstaFace

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Yeah but 7 of the 12 are the 6th and 7th rounds, and besides the two shining exceptions in Brady and Edelman it's been VERY slim pickings there. In the BB era, your best examples are Nate Ebner (10 AV), Elandon Roberts (17), David Givens (22) and Matt Cassell. I'm not going to do the math league-wide, but the odds aren't good, the goods are odd. It's not like the Pats have loaded up on even mid-round picks that at least have a macroscopic chance of contributing. Having 5 picks in the first 4 rounds is good - above-average, obviously - but it's not like they're as loaded as they've ever been or anything. I'd rather have our draft slate in 2004 (Wilfork / Watson, 6 picks in the first 4 rounds), 2009 (4x 2nd-rounders! plus 2x 3rds and our 4th), even 2010.

Part of this is that the rest of the league has caught up to Belichick's strategy and stopped mis-pricing their draft picks so wildly, so often. He hasn't had a lot of highway robbery that resulted in good picks coming his way lately.
 

SMU_Sox

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I love this move. A late 2nd for 2 years of a reasonably priced WR who can lineup anywhere, has great hands, and is a savvy route runner. If they go 11 his blocking will be a plus too. They will have a 3rd and 2 comp 3rds so they still have the flexibility to move around this year.
 

lexrageorge

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What they REALLY need is for the OL to operate at a high level. They have plenty of weapons, to be honest. But if the OL can't run block, and if Brady is being pressured constantly, then it doesn't matter who his weapons are.

The OL needs to be fixed and it's by far the biggest issue on the team. Some of that may improve with Wynn's return. He's so much better than Newhouse. But Cannon and Mason have had subpar years and that's troubling. And Karras just isn't that good. Not sure how to fix that.
The problem with fixing the OL is availability. Trent Williams is a pipe dream for a number of reasons. And few teams are going to trade their starting center mid season, and the ones available could be worse than Karras.
 

DourDoerr

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I wonder if the Pats (BB, Josh, Dante) realize that this is not the year where the OLine will allow Brady plenty of protection for deep routes or open up big holes for a power running game, so instead they are going to load up on sure-handed guys who can make their living on short/quick routes
I was also thinking along these lines. While the goal is to get the OL to a point where they can run and pass block at an above average level, it's also smart to hedge your bets in case the talent level/injury level is too great to be overcome. In which case, getting quick separation becomes paramount. Taking a quick look at Next Gen stats (FBOW) and Sanu is tied for 7th (with Amendola, among others) in separation w/ 3.7 yards btw Sanu and a defender at completion. Interestingly (to me, at least), Sanu gets a cushion of 4.9 yards which stands out as very low compared to the other WR in his separation "neighborhood." Most of the other WR's seem to get 5.5 and up (Amendola gets 6.5 yards). Another way to skin a cat?

I love the added veteran WR depth since we're fairly brittle in the best of times and can now better weather a late season injury in the unit. Since the calculation pre-Sanu was this receiver unit plus AB, it makes a lot of sense that they'd make a move to somewhat fill in that gaping hole since his departure. I also love the timing as they'll get to take advantage of the bye in getting Sanu up to speed. Now they've presumably settled that unit and can focus on how to get their run-blocking up to snuff.
 

KiltedFool

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Sounds a bit like an Anquon Boldin type, make the tough contested catches, physical, blocker.
 

DJnVa

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Yeah but 7 of the 12 are the 6th and 7th rounds, and besides the two shining exceptions in Brady and Edelman it's been VERY slim pickings there. In the BB era, your best examples are Nate Ebner (10 AV), Elandon Roberts (17), David Givens (22) and Matt Cassell. I'm not going to do the math league-wide, but the odds aren't good, the goods are odd. It's not like the Pats have loaded up on even mid-round picks that at least have a macroscopic chance of contributing. Having 5 picks in the first 4 rounds is good - above-average, obviously - but it's not like they're as loaded as they've ever been or anything. I'd rather have our draft slate in 2004 (Wilfork / Watson, 6 picks in the first 4 rounds), 2009 (4x 2nd-rounders! plus 2x 3rds and our 4th), even 2010.

Part of this is that the rest of the league has caught up to Belichick's strategy and stopped mis-pricing their draft picks so wildly, so often. He hasn't had a lot of highway robbery that resulted in good picks coming his way lately.
I think you're missing a part of it though. Anywhere from 15-20% of players that play a significant number of snaps each week are UDFA. More late picks gives the Patriots more chances to grab who they want from this group--there's not much difference between 6th rounders, 7th rounders, and UDFA. More bites at the apple is a good thing and important to building team depth.
 

BigSoxFan

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I love this move. A late 2nd for 2 years of a reasonably priced WR who can lineup anywhere, has great hands, and is a savvy route runner. If they go 11 his blocking will be a plus too. They will have a 3rd and 2 comp 3rds so they still have the flexibility to move around this year.
And depending on who's there at 28-32, could potentially move back into mid-2nd and pick up another 3/4. I love having multiple picks in Rounds 3-4.
 

TheRooster

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Wait, so the Pats didn't panic or get desperate? You mean the greatest FB franchise of all time had a plan and exercised patience? Just as many (most?) of us would have expected.
 

BaseballJones

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I really don’t think they do have plenty of weapons catching passes more than 3 yards downfield. Edelman and then not much else. Gordon is ok, but he really should be a 2 WR outside, not a go-to guy at this point. He doesn’t get much separation. Myers has been promising, Harry an unknown and a rookie. Sanu is much needed.
They've won Super Bowls with limited offensive weapons. The OL needs to do its job and everything else will be fine.
 

CoffeeNerdness

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Hard disagree.

3 WR set--Edelman, Gordon, Sanu. Dorsett is the 4th WR or can sub in for any of those guys. Behind them you have the 2 rookies. Seems like a perfect setup.

Sanu is a talented WR they've wanted for years.

EDIT: That's not to say Gordon isn't more banged up than we think, but I just don't think this move proves that at all.
Yeah I don't know. At this point Dorsett is a better WR than Gordon(at least the banged up 2019 version) All Gordon is offering in that three WR look is size. I think they're trending toward a small WR, short passing, ball control offense.
 

moondog80

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We have to consider the chances that they end up with a 2022 compensatory draft pick for Sanu when we evaluate this trade, right?
 

DJnVa

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Yeah I don't know. At this point Dorsett is a better WR than Gordon(at least the banged up 2019 version) All Gordon is offering in that three WR look is size. I think they're trending toward a small WR, short passing, ball control offense.
We change opinions on players so fast I get whiplash.
 

CoffeeNerdness

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Versus Dorsett in combination with JE and Sanu, yes. And considering that he was already banged up before he got turned into a pretzel I'm not sure a return to full health is at all guaranteed.
 

E5 Yaz

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Versus Dorsett in combination with JE and Sanu, yes. And considering that he was already banged up before he got turned into a pretzel I'm not sure a return to full health is at all guaranteed.
Sanu is 6-2 and listed at 210. He's not a Edelman or Dorsett in terms of size
 

DJnVa

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Versus Dorsett in combination with JE and Sanu, yes. And considering that he was already banged up before he got turned into a pretzel I'm not sure a return to full health is at all guaranteed.
JE is banged up. Dorsett has missed a game. Harry hasn't played. Gordon is in the same boat as everyone else.

Not even sure why we're arguing, it's all going to play out on the field. I feel confident in saying that if Gordon is playing he's more than just some big dude we throw jump balls to.
 

BaseballJones

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Size of NE's receivers:

Harry: 6'4", 225
Gordon: 6'3", 225
Sanu: 6'2", 215
Meyers: 6'2", 200
Gunner: 6'0", 190
Edelman: 5'10", 198
Dorsett: 5'10", 192

They have some pretty big guys at WR now. Nice targets.
 

CoffeeNerdness

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JE is banged up. Dorsett has missed a game. Harry hasn't played. Gordon is in the same boat as everyone else.

Not even sure why we're arguing, it's all going to play out on the field. I feel confident in saying that if Gordon is playing he's more than just some big dude we throw jump balls to.
TBF I think your scenario is perfectly cromulent and likely to actually be how things work out. I'm just saying I'd rather see Dorsett get a bigger snap share because I think he's better than 2019 Gordon.
 

RetractableRoof

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Josh is drooling over a couple of quadruple pass plays he's cooked up.
Seriously... a Brady lateral to Edelman... who draws all the defenders to his side, who then laterals back across the field to Sanu... who then hits Gordon in the end zone. McDaniels has to put this in the playbook.

or ... Brady lateral to Edelman... who draws all the defenders to his side, who then laterals back across the field to Sanu... who laterals back across the field to Brady who then hits Ferentz (reporting in as eligible) in the end zone.

Get it done Josh.
 

wilked

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Ri-ght .
Based on his production he might get a 6th, if we sent a 7th.
Yes, 2nd or 3rd rd picks are reserved for high producers such as 33 receptions for 313 yards and a TD

Point being, there is evaluation on production and evaluation on talent
 

Captaincoop

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Hard disagree.

3 WR set--Edelman, Gordon, Sanu. Dorsett is the 4th WR or can sub in for any of those guys. Behind them you have the 2 rookies. Seems like a perfect setup.

Sanu is a talented WR they've wanted for years.

EDIT: That's not to say Gordon isn't more banged up than we think, but I just don't think this move proves that at all.
I can't speak for E5, but my concern about Gordon is more his league wellness policy status than his health. The guy hasn't made it through a season since when?
 

Jimbodandy

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I wonder if the Pats (BB, Josh, Dante) realize that this is not the year where the OLine will allow Brady plenty of protection for deep routes or open up big holes for a power running game, so instead they are going to load up on sure-handed guys who can make their living on short/quick routes -- the old passing play as running play scheme.

Sanu seems made for this.
Yes. More smart, handsy, quick guys. Sanu is a perfect guy to mitigate the OL problems.