2023 PGA Tour

T

TFP

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According to the Golf Channel, it's likely going to be like 5-6 no cut events total, which include the already no-cut playoff events and Sentry TOC. So we're talking like 2 more events, and honestly is much more of a non-story than I thought.

View: https://twitter.com/NoLayingUp/status/1630992453871304704


PGA Tour Comms strategy is an embarrassment. They have the players up there at press conferences answering these questions for the media and explaining this after the story hits. If this was rolled out and announced correctly, it could be a positive change. Instead the players are playing defense and the story is already written in the public mind. If I was Rory/Max/etc I'd tell Jay (or hire someone competent) to get out there and explain all this all the time.
 
BaseballJones

BaseballJones

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FL4WL3SS said:
The Tour should fully embrace the party scene like the WM. So many more people would watch golf.

Golf needs a reimage.
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I'd love this. That would be so much fun. Should happen in tennis too. Rowdy crowds. Background noise. Would be awesome. If a basketball player can concentrate on the free throw line with seconds left in a tie game and the crowd going bonkers, golfers should be able to as well.
 
cshea

cshea

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How many courses have the infrastructure to hold 100,000 fans a day, or whatever the number is?

I kinda like the WM as a unique one off.
 
kenneycb

kenneycb

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Senator Donut said:
This is incredibly stupid. Looking back at how fun Phoenix and LA just were, I can't believe how quickly the tour is abandoning this format.

This is an obvious loss for the fans, but I don't even understand how the players, sponsors, and tv partners benefit either. If you want to funnel more money to the top players, the FedEx Cup already exists.

No cut events are flat-out stupid. Think about what happens to the last place player in the no-cut Tour Championship. He runs the course trying to finish in 2.5 hours to catch an early flight. NBC will even show a running clock. It's a joke and a disgrace to what is actually a pretty fun and meaningful competition.

I'm not opposed to smaller fields. No one (except maybe Puma) cares that Rickie Fowler won't qualify for the Masters because he can't crack the top-50 anymore, but the Masters doesn't have Ian Woosnam teeing off at the crack of dawn to start the pairings on Sunday morning.
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Players get a guaranteed paycheck.
 
cshea

cshea

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Senator Donut said:
This is incredibly stupid. Looking back at how fun Phoenix and LA just were, I can't believe how quickly the tour is abandoning this format.

This is an obvious loss for the fans, but I don't even understand how the players, sponsors, and tv partners benefit either. If you want to funnel more money to the top players, the FedEx Cup already exists.
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The players are getting guaranteed money (more of it, shared across less players) and OWGR points. They are also getting a set schedule each year. The sponsors benefit because they are getting all of the top players at their events, not a ramdom smattering of guys who just happen to have that week fit into their schedule. I'm sure the sponsors for the designated events will pay more than those who sponsor the non-designated events. Having all the stars in the field will sell tickets, with the benefit that fans get 4 days to go see Rory, even if he's not in contention over the weekend. The TV partners are getting more airtime for the stars which, in theory, will lead to a better product and better ratings. People tune in to watch Rory, Rahm, JT, Spieth, etc. I would hazard a guess that more people tuned in to watch Max vs. Rahm at the Genesis than did Chris Kirk vs. Eric Cole htis past week. The lesser players are nice stories in the moment but ultimately nobody really cares.

As a fan, the product should be improved. Less crowded fields mean the liklihood of the stars battling for the win will increase substantially. As a fan, that is a good thing. I get the point about a player 20 shots off the lead going through the motions on a weekend just to collect a paycheck, but I think it's worth it. Maybe other people are different, but when I go to a PGA Tour tournament, I don't go and just follow the leaders. I like to catch as many of the stars as I can for a hole or two, whether they are in the hunt or not. It's definitely a benefit to know that, if one of these tournaments is in my city, I can buy a weekend ticket and not have to worry about Rory, Tiger, JT or whomever I'm there to see miss the cut. Additionally, the lower field size will limit how early and how long I need to stay at the golf course to see everyone I want.
 
T

TFP

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cshea said:
Maybe other people are different, but when I go to a PGA Tour tournament, I don't go and just follow the leaders. I like to catch as many of the stars as I can for a hole or two, whether they are in the hunt or not. It's definitely a benefit to know that, if one of these tournaments is in my city, I can buy a weekend ticket and not have to worry about Rory, Tiger, JT or whomever I'm there to see miss the cut. Additionally, the lower field size will limit how early and how long I need to stay at the golf course to see everyone I want.
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While I agree with you here, absolutely none of these decisions have anything to do with the average fan attending tourneys in person in mind.
 
cshea

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FL4WL3SS said:
Why do they need 40 different venues? Reduce it down to 20 that can do it.
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Well yeah it'd only be a few evemts, but is there even another 3-4 courses that can handle it? Could they get 100,000 a day at Bay Hill this weekend, for instance?

TPC Scottsdale seems an exception in that it was built as a stadium course to hold that kind of crowd. Are there others out there? I legitimately don't know. I guess Hazeltine and other places that have hosted the Ryder Cup?
 
LogansDad

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OCST said:
Sally Jenkins just gut-shot KIV and left it to bleed out

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/2023/02/22/pga-tour-liv-golf/



I’m too casual a golf fan to opine in her takes on Koepka & co as players, and I only sat through ten minutes of one event out of curiosity, but I was following the LIV story - until I realized on reading this that LIV has fallen off the radar. And it seems to be that way because it sucks.
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Late on this, but Airborne Toxic Event is a pretty fun band that I enjoy, so I dig the opening line.
 
jercra

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TFP said:
According to the Golf Channel, it's likely going to be like 5-6 no cut events total, which include the already no-cut playoff events and Sentry TOC. So we're talking like 2 more events, and honestly is much more of a non-story than I thought.

View: https://twitter.com/NoLayingUp/status/1630992453871304704


PGA Tour Comms strategy is an embarrassment. They have the players up there at press conferences answering these questions for the media and explaining this after the story hits. If this was rolled out and announced correctly, it could be a positive change. Instead the players are playing defense and the story is already written in the public mind. If I was Rory/Max/etc I'd tell Jay (or hire someone competent) to get out there and explain all this all the time.
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I know you know this, but the players can do basically whatever they want. If they want to be the ones in front of the press, they can absolutely do that. Just because the players are there doesn't mean they put there by Comms.
 
T

TFP

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jercra said:
I know you know this, but the players can do basically whatever they want. If they want to be the ones in front of the press, they can absolutely do that. Just because the players are there doesn't mean they put there by Comms.
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Of course, I don’t think they’re being literally forced out there. Just that they’re there in the absence of anyone else actually saying something, because someone has to.

It’s a huge credit to Rory, Max, Rahm, JT, etc for everything they’ve done. It’s increased my respect and admiration of them as professionals immensely. I just think it’s unnecessary and unfair to them. But to be fair, if they don’t think so (and I’ve seen nothing to indicate that they do), then I shouldn’t either.
 
jercra

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TFP said:
Of course, I don’t think they’re being literally forced out there. Just that they’re there in the absence of anyone else actually saying something, because someone has to.

It’s a huge credit to Rory, Max, Rahm, JT, etc for everything they’ve done. It’s increased my respect and admiration of them as professionals immensely. I just think it’s unnecessary and unfair to them. But to be fair, if they don’t think so (and I’ve seen nothing to indicate that they do), then I shouldn’t either.
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Remember that all of this is a direct result of the player's only meeting last year. The players taking the win, as I'm sure they see it, is fitting. The details will all be known and distributed by comms and others in good time.
 
OCST

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LogansDad said:
Late on this, but Airborne Toxic Event is a pretty fun band that I enjoy, so I dig the opening line.
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It’s originally from the novel White Noise by Din DeLillo, which was made into a film last year (?) that sank pretty fast.
 
cshea

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The NLU pod discussing the changes is pretty good and informative. They interview Peter Malnati who is on the board and essentially the poster boy for the rank and file. Good to hear his perspective as a player that is unlikely to get into the designated events.

View: https://twitter.com/NoLayingUp/status/1631156363375067137?s=20


They've also been hinting for a while that things are happening on the LIV side. On a recent pod they acknowledged some chatter about Brooks wanted back. In this one, paraphrasing, "we're not reporting anything but let's just say from what we are hearing, it could be an interesting few weeks or month's ahead for LIV." The implication was the ship going down and/or there's a lot of regret on the player side. We'll see, they don't usually rumor monger and they framed everything as just that but they are plugged in.
 
Eagle3

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Some of the rules of golf can be so frustrating at times. I call bullshit on the ruling Speith got on 18 yesterday. He hooked his drive up against an out of bounds fence. The ball was not OB but he had no swing. However, there was a cart path just to the right of the fence, so he was able to get a free drop because the only way he could hit the ball was to hit it Lefty, which meant he would be standing on the path. He then hit it righty after the drop. If he takes a free drop based on a left handed stance being impeded, he should have to hit the next shot left handed. Or, if you're gonna hit it right handed after the drop it should be an unplayable lie - 1 stroke penalty.

To be clear I'm not blaming Speith, he was creative while legally taking advantage of what I think is a bogus loophole.
 
T

TFP

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Personally I’d make OB a forced drop. So keep the white stakes, you can’t play your ball if it’s OB, but treat the drop rules as lateral/red stakes.

Amateurs getting the “Drop in the fairway and take 2 strokes” rule is helpful at least.
 
FL4WL3SS

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TFP said:
Personally I’d make OB a forced drop. So keep the white stakes, you can’t play your ball if it’s OB, but treat the drop rules as lateral/red stakes.

Amateurs getting the “Drop in the fairway and take 2 strokes” rule is helpful at least.
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That rule only applies as a local rule if the course has adopted it. I haven't seen it yet.

But yes, forced drop, one stroke. Same with lost ball.
 
E5 Yaz

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Speith chips in for his fourth birdie in the first five holes to tie for the lead
 
Comfortably Lomb

Comfortably Lomb

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Kitayama with a 2 shot lead over Spieth and Hatton now. The announcing crew seems ready to endlessly talk about Spieth.

Edit: Check that. Kitayama just launched a driver OB and second tee shot into a fairway bunker. Potential big number coming.

Double edit: Rory putting together a Mickelsonian round. 4 birdies, 3 pars, 3 bogies. He's sort of back in contention again at -7 with Kitayama likely dropping at least 2 shots on the 9th.
 
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