The Patriots ran some plays with only 4 offensive linemen. An eligible receiver (Hooman or Vereen) reported in as ineligible (the same way an extra OL or a Mike Vrabel sometimes reports in as eligible).CaptainLaddie said:Can someone explain what the Ravens were bitching about?
https://twitter.com/jeffzrebiecsun
Harbaugh said he took a penalty to get referees attention. They weren't given time to identify eligible wide receiver. Refs pit stop to it
Harbaugh said he took penalty to get refs attention re NE using 4 O-linemen, ineligible backs, WRs. Clear deception, never saw it before
Eddie Jurak said:The Patriots ran some plays with only 4 offensive linemen. An eligible receiver (Hooman or Vereen) reported in as ineligible (the same way an extra OL or a Mike Vrabel sometimes reports in as eligible).
Some of the time, Vereen was the ineligible but split out as a WR, while an eligible Hooman lined up as if he was at tackle. At the snap, Hooman ran a seam route while the ineligible Vereen ran back into the backfield. (I think that Vereen, though ineligible, would have been allowed to catch a backward pass - it would have been called a rush - but had he run downfield he would have been flagged as an ineligible receiver downfield). Ravens were probably pissed that a guy lining up seemingly at tackle was allowed to go out for a pass. Or they didn't get that Vereen was ineligible even though ref was telling them with his mike on.
Id love to know what Jpsh McD was smoking when he thought that one up.
Nothing about giving defense time to sub.If a player changes his eligibility, the Referee must alert the defensive captain after player has reported to him.
Gambler7 said:They had to give the refs a heads up they may be doing that. A lot of the time they will with odd plays. I'd love to know if they did.
Andrew said:I think he means them telling the refs what they intended to do with that play ahead of time, I think they did in that old Vinatieri-to-Brown play against the Rams.
kieckeredinthehead said:Can someone explain for a football dummy what the benefit is for the Patriots?
kieckeredinthehead said:Can someone explain for a football dummy what the benefit is for the Patriots?
and to make it even worse the time that Vereen was ineligble he lined up wide and drifted into the backfield. They still needed to account for him as a threat because he could catch a lateral and run so they essentially had to cover an extra reciever.Harry Hooper said:
Do you know how sometimes offensive linemen get confused about which pass rushers to block when the defense runs stunts and blitzes to get to the QB? This was the mirror image of that. The Ravens D had trouble identifying who was going out for a pass and who was staying in to block for Brady.
I think the rule implies that the defensive captain has to be given time to let the rest of the defense know otherwise what good does it do to let the captain know and then have the ball snapped a split-second later?They did. There's a replay of Vereen telling ref, and ref pointing at him and shouting across the LOS. That's him alerting defensive captain.
Nothing says they must allow defense "time".
Ah. Good to know. I didn't hear it. All I saw was the official point to Vereen and inform the Baltimore defensive captain that he was ineligible.Stitch01 said:Was announced via microphone
Linemen have to stay at the line of scrimmage on pass plays. The can't run down field. So, you don't cover linemen in pass coverage. When you put a guy who usually can catch balls out wide (like a running back) the defense puts a pass coverage back on him. But then that guy just stays at the line and counts as one of the required linemen. His defender doesn't know what to do, so he is just standing there. This means another eligible receiver can run down field from the line off scrimmage and there is one less back to cover him. The down side is that once they are hip to it, they get a big advantage. If a guy who is ineligible is split wide, he's effectively useless in the passing game, and you can ignore him so you are playing 10 against 11.kieckeredinthehead said:Can someone explain for a football dummy what the benefit is for the Patriots?
wade boggs chicken dinner said:I think the rule implies that the defensive captain has to be given time to let the rest of the defense know otherwise what good does it do to let the captain know and then have the ball snapped a split-second later?
Eddie Jurak said:Id love to know what Jpsh McD was smoking when he thought that one up.
And that's why it was fucking awesome.Byrdbrain said:and to make it even worse the time that Vereen was ineligble he lined up wide and drifted into the backfield. They still needed to account for him as a threat because he could catch a lateral and run so they essentially had to cover an extra reciever.
SteveF said:Ah. Good to know. I didn't hear it. All I saw was the official point to Vereen and inform the Baltimore defensive captain that he was ineligible.
Reporting as eligible/ineligible is all covered by the exact same rule, so I'm not sure why Harbaugh thinks it's illegal. It reflects poorly on his knowledge of the rules.
what a fucking baby.soxhop411 said:
Ryan Hannable @RyanHannable 2m2 minutes ago
Harbaugh on Pats gimmick: "The league will look at that type of thing and I’m sure that they’ll make some adjustments and things like that."
I just posted this in the game thread but 3-4 times they announced it in the stadium. I don't recall on the one play the ravens are bitching about though. Everyone In our section was very confused, as it seems was the immortal Harbaugh and his clan of goons.SteveF said:Ah. Good to know. I didn't hear it. All I saw was the official point to Vereen and inform the Baltimore defensive captain that he was ineligible.
Reporting as eligible/ineligible is all covered by the exact same rule, so I'm not sure why Harbaugh thinks it's illegal. It reflects poorly on his knowledge of the rules.
Phil Plantier said:Firstly, lol boo hoo.
Secondly, I don't believe anyone was covering Vereen on the line anyway. They just forgot to cover Hooman as well.
Someone was definitely on Vereen.Phil Plantier said:Firstly, lol boo hoo.
Secondly, I don't believe anyone was covering Vereen on the line anyway. They just forgot to cover Hooman as well.
Maybe they were confused about whether ref said "ineligible" or "an eligible". Although didn't the ref also say "don't cover him"?RedOctober3829 said:He's such a whiny bitch. Vereen was announced to the stadium as ineligible. What else do you want? Practicing against unbalanced lines happens all the time. This is no different.
They did. Later after a few times they stopped covering the ineligible guy because he wasn't fucking eligible. Go figure.RedOctober3829 said:Someone was definitely on Vereen.
I believe so, which makes it all the more hilarious they are complaining.Eddie Jurak said:Maybe they were confused about whether ref said "ineligible" or "an eligible". Although didn't the ref also say "don't cover him"?
Eddie Jurak said:Maybe they were confused about whether ref said "ineligible" or "an eligible". Although didn't the ref also say "don't cover him"?
He should be complimentary to his team and leave the rest alone.mwonow said:To be fair to Harbaugh - he just got powned on national TV by an opposing coach, and his team, which played well, got bounced out of the playoffs. Of course he's butthurt.
I really, really, really can't work up any sympathy for him or his organization.
mwonow said:To be fair to Harbaugh - he just got powned on national TV by an opposing coach, and his team, which played well, got bounced out of the playoffs. Of course he's butthurt.
I really, really, really can't work up any sympathy for him or his organization.
Tony C said:
Yeah, but by bitching about it in a sense he almost made himself look worse. Called attn to how he was out-smarted and that he was a bitch about it.
(and I say that as someone who respects Harbaugh and thinks he coached a helluva game)
They don't need to, because it's not illegal. You just need 5 people on the line deemed ineligible. Vereen was the 5th.DrewDawg said:Harbaugh keeps saying substitution, but that had nothing to do with it. Vereen was on the field the previous play. No new player came on, and ref announced eligibility. That's all there is to it. League should tell him to shut it.
He also said the refs "put a stop to it" and I'm not sure they did. Because, of course, there's no reason to.