Donaldson going to BlueJays.
- Thread starter soxhop411
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Let's see how this plays out for Oakland. If they sign Headley then this deal looks great since Oakland rebuilds the farm a little after emptying it out for Shark and Hammel. I'm assuming Lawrie is going to be used at 2nd. Shark will now probably be traded for Upton or Cespedes which I don't know how I feel about Shark potentially coming over to Fenway for a year. Lots of K's but he's going to give up a lot more runs. Then again maybe he builds off last year and becomes an ace. Who really knows.
I'm guessing when he sells his stake in the team, and the A's stop outperforming expectations.PC Drunken Friar said:
Also, look at Beane's track record on trades. A lot of them are universally panned, but they almost all seem to work for the A's. So I would say he goes on the hot seat when the benefit of the doubt runs out...except he never really got much to begin with.
He should have never written Moneyball.
Just curious why you like Lawrie at second? Is it mainly because of Headley's apparent availability at a discount or because you like him at that spot regardless? This looks like a straight swap of 3Bs plus prospects. Maybe I'm unduly swayed by the sports center highlights but Lawrie looks like a gold glove candidate at 3B, and his UZR and DRS at the position are pretty good. This looks to me like Beane gambling that Lawrie will stay healthy enough to close the gap in WAR at 3B enough to make the prospects worth the difference.Tyrone Biggums said:
I guess I'm ultimately skeptical that Headley really will be signed at the numbers people seem to think. My working assumption is that once the Yankees do their main business -- swooping in to grab Lester at 150m or Scherzer at 200m or both -- they will pony up 4 years for Headley.
I'm not sure why people aren't questioning Anthropoulos and his sketchy trade history. Yes, he got one of the worst GMs of all time to take on Wells, but I think he got fleeced by the Mets for Dickey and gave the Marlins their own Punto trade. I expect all of the prospects to play well for the A's.
AA then practically gave away two years of Mike Napoli (whereupon he went to the Rangers and put up one awesome and one good year) for immortal legend Frank Francisco. The Wells trade went from an absolute heist to merely a fantastic salary dump with that move.
LuckyBen said:
Doesn't mean this one won't be a good one. Donaldson is a legit power bat that has earned MVP votes the past two years at a thin position. There are not many of those guys around anymore. If you have the chance to do it, even if it doesn't wind up working out, he still made the right move.
I think people might be underrating Lawrie a bit. He is still only 24 and although he has been viewed as a bit of a disappointment, he is still considered a potential star. As a point of reference, Steamer currently projects him to put up a 4 WAR in 2015. Betts, by comparison (and Steamer is high on him too) only projects to be 2.6 win player.
Beane wanted a trade that would give him some prospects to rebuild his rotation while also replacing his star third basemen with a cheaper, star-potential, alternative. The only way the Sox could have offered a similar package is by including Betts (since Betts could fill the A's other IF hole -2B).
Who knows how aggressively the Sox pursued a Donaldson trade before signing Panda. IMHO a package centered around Betts would have been worth offering, and may have represented a better return than what BB ended up eventually receiving. That said, it's possible that such an offer was made and Beane just isn't as high on Betts as everyone else. We'll probably never know..
Beane wanted a trade that would give him some prospects to rebuild his rotation while also replacing his star third basemen with a cheaper, star-potential, alternative. The only way the Sox could have offered a similar package is by including Betts (since Betts could fill the A's other IF hole -2B).
Who knows how aggressively the Sox pursued a Donaldson trade before signing Panda. IMHO a package centered around Betts would have been worth offering, and may have represented a better return than what BB ended up eventually receiving. That said, it's possible that such an offer was made and Beane just isn't as high on Betts as everyone else. We'll probably never know..
Steamer has him at 580 PAs which is easily his career high. You're right, the kid is talented as all hell, but he's just seemingly unable to put it together. Billy is banking on him doing so for the A's, but there's a reason the Jays would rather have Donaldson next season and that's considered a good move.
kazuneko said:
That's with Lawrie getting 580 PA (he's never done that before) and Betts getting 403. But the greater point that Lawrie's value is likely rising (if he's healthy) and Donaldson is looking at the end of his peak, stands.
DennyDoyle'sBoil said:
A-Rod walked into the front office and peed on the floor while demanding he play 3rd base.
Wingack said:
If we want to have fun: Maybe the Red Sox could call up the Braves and start on a Betts for Teheran trade.
GilaMonster said:
And why exactly would the Red Sox want to do that, if I may be so bold to ask?
One thing that has puzzled me with this Donaldson trade, and I think also happened with a couple of trades at the deadline (Fister to the nats, Price to Detroit). It seems there have been a number of trades where most of the market didn't even know the player was available. How does this happen? Why, as a GM, would you not want some type of open bidding? Send the word you're about to trade a guy, please give you best offer kind of thing? Or is that the GM wants some specific names, and it doesn't matter what else other teams can offer? It just seems like a dereliction of duty not to shop around a bit for the best offer.
Rasputin said:
I'm curious what the Rays do. They have a nice young core in the pitching staff of Cobb,Archer,Moore,Odorizzi, and Smyly is very solid and cheap. The OF is nice with Kiermaier,Jennings, and Myers. Longoria is awesome. Do they move Zobrist? It would command a ton, even on a rental. I am assuming Joyce is gone. The Rays are still on the border of being competitive, but their farm is awful and it might be better to get some major league talent back in return and aim to contend with a stronger team in 2016.
Snoop Soxy Dogg said:
I'm not saying they shouldn't approach every team, but I think they might need to suggest trades. As many others have said: I'd move either Betts or Xander for a very good cost controlled starter, but the possibilities are limited. Sale or Bumgarner isn't going to happen. Strasburg probably isn't happening. Cobb or Stroman are within the division. Teheran and Gray make sense.
MakMan44 said:
But if none of the players are old, doesn't it make sense to deal off guys like Joyce and Zobrist for close to majors talent in an attempt to contend in 2016. If you are the Rays with their farm, can you really afford to risk those players walking? I have no clue what Zobrist could return, but you have to try. Maybe you could get a Pederson or a Bundy. I mean that is a bit pricey, but look at the market for SS and 2B. I think a Bundy for Zobrist + Joyce package is nice for both sides. It gives the Rays a chance to sell one of their pitchers like Cobb without being in a rough spot.
I don't think the Rays get a Bundy caliber prospect for Zobrist and Joyce-not even close. Firstly, the O's wouldn't trade 6 years of Bundy control for a single year of Zobrist and Joyce. I could see the O's going after Zobrist to play 2b/of for them, but probably only for a B level prospect (maybe someone like Sisco or Davies) and a lower level guy with upside. Zobrist has value vs. his contract, to be sure, and he's so durable that his versatility truly plays every day. I think the Rays could get a nice piece for him, but not Bundy.
