I have to admit, after the first game I was looking forward to the first NBA Championship ring with the name "Festus" on it, but after last night's game I guess anything can happen.
So. What's gonna happen?
So. What's gonna happen?
Each team has won a game: How does this end?
- Thread starter Lose Remerswaal
- Start date
I said the Warriors in 6 in the thread, and I'll stick with it. I think we're at Peak LeBron, and I think that they can take one at home, but I just can't see them pulling out three more with that roster. He played 50 minutes last night, and even he has limits.
What I've seen so far is that the Cavs iso-heavy offense has simultaneously kept them in games and been a huge, huge issue for them down the stretch.
It's allowed them to completely dictate the pace and limit the Warriors in transition, which is a good step towards beating them. That said, the Cavs have blown substantial leads down the stretch in this series because they just can't create good looks in crunch time. It's taking them a long time just to get the ball to LeBron on the block, and they don't even have anybody they can reliably run with him in the pick and roll. If Blatt can adjust and find a way to create a little ball movement and open shots when they need them, I think Cleveland has a very serious chance to take this.
It's allowed them to completely dictate the pace and limit the Warriors in transition, which is a good step towards beating them. That said, the Cavs have blown substantial leads down the stretch in this series because they just can't create good looks in crunch time. It's taking them a long time just to get the ball to LeBron on the block, and they don't even have anybody they can reliably run with him in the pick and roll. If Blatt can adjust and find a way to create a little ball movement and open shots when they need them, I think Cleveland has a very serious chance to take this.
Does anyone have an explanation for the Mozgov being out of the game late? Just a function of GS going small? He gets to the rim pretty well on those lobs. Cleveland needs some easy buckets in a bad way once they start slowing Lebron's ISO.
Lebron is a good enough player to be effective in this ISO situations, but its really not what he's best suited to do. One of those situations where he is more Magic than Michael. He still really isn't a great closer.
Lebron is a good enough player to be effective in this ISO situations, but its really not what he's best suited to do. One of those situations where he is more Magic than Michael. He still really isn't a great closer.
Yeah, I've got nothing on the Mozgov thing. He's showing things on this team he hasn't really shown (or maybe just hasn't had the opportunity) to show. One thing I noticed at points was that it looked like Mozgov was checking Iguodala; if they can get away with the Tony Allen on Andre, it may be more feasible to play Tristan Thompson and Mozgov at the same time. I don't know what the Warriors do then, because that ties up Green and Green's far and away their best LeBron stopper.
Not a great closer, or not the greatest? Because if there are five dudes in the league you'd rather have with the ball in their hands when you absolutely Must Get A Bucket, I would be very surprised. My list is a bunch of well-maybe-ifs. Maybe Steph Curry if he isn't being straitjacketed, maybe Westbrook if there isn't a big man down low, maybe CP3 if he's got shooters outside, maybe Davis in three or four years. But LeBron can make damned near anything happen with the ball in an isolation position in a way that very, very few players have ever been able to do. I don't necessarily want LeBron shooting, but I trust that he will do the right thing the overwhelming majority of times and he can go to the rack like literally no one else. You have to have Tony Brothers on the floor to stop him.jmm57 said:
jmm57 said:
It was odd. Yeah, Golden State went small but Mozgov was lighting it up. He was gone in the 2nd half and OT.
I am talking on a Greatest of All Time kind of scale. The haven't closed either of these first two games in regulation when they were in great position. I also remember a game vs HOU a month or so ago where Lebron missed a handful of FT down the stretch.Blacken said:
Winning this series won't alter the pecking order between MJ and LBJ, but it would give LBJ something MJ never had. MJ always had Pippen. LBJ doesn't even have a teammate as good as Horace Grant. And this year's Warriors are better than anyone MJ faced in the Finals save perhaps the '96 Sonics. Yet, right now, I'd give LBJ nearly an even-money chance to will his team to victory. We may be witnessing the most epic moment in the career of one of the five best players of all time.
I'm shocked at the apparent consensus that GS will win 2 of 3 in Cleveland, including a Game 6 clincher. I think the expectation of Warriors' dominance (which I shared heading into the series) have to be revised in light of the first 2 games. Gun to my head, I'd say Warriors in 7, but a Cavs' victory wouldn't surprise me in the least.
I'm shocked at the apparent consensus that GS will win 2 of 3 in Cleveland, including a Game 6 clincher. I think the expectation of Warriors' dominance (which I shared heading into the series) have to be revised in light of the first 2 games. Gun to my head, I'd say Warriors in 7, but a Cavs' victory wouldn't surprise me in the least.
At some point you're going to actually have to give the Warriors credit for murderfucking teams all year from exactly that position. There is no safe lead. Faulting the one guy on the team who is both a relatively undamaged human being and a starting-quality NBA player is getting real weird.jmm57 said:
Blacken said:
Last year there were like a dozen people here who, with a straight face, faulted LeBron for cramping up after playing 32 minutes in a 90 degree building in San Antonio. Everybody took turns recounting guys in the 80s who played hurt, somebody talked about the high school girls team he coached who played through that stuff, and then everybody decided that the cramps were his fault for not staying hydrated enough.
I accidentally waded into the thread and expressed frustration that a broken AC unit robbed us of good basketball, and got shouted down by a half a dozen people who insisted that LeBron robbed us of good basketball by not staying hydrated and not being tough enough, and that I could be upset about not getting to watch said basketball, but only if I phrased it in such a way that didn't absolve LeBron of the blame.
Point being, this place has been weird about LeBron for a long, long time.
jmm57 said:
You're right, but it's also kind of their plan. They let LBJ hold the ball for most of the shot clock and then try to create something for himself or someone else, and in the meantime they kill a little clock, minimize the chance of turnovers and conserve their remaining energy for defense. It was more effective in previous rounds than it's been against GS down the stretch, unsurprisingly.
Voted Cavs in 7. GS is in trouble. There's a reason jump shooting teams don't win championships. Physical vs finesse in this series. GS getting out worked on the boards by Cavs bigs, which GS really has no answer for. Overconfidence has led to laziness and soon to be panic.
Blatt will start to find more ways to get Mozgov involved in the offense because there are points to be had in the paint for Cleveland all day.
I actually think Cavs come out and smoke them in Game 3.
Blatt will start to find more ways to get Mozgov involved in the offense because there are points to be had in the paint for Cleveland all day.
I actually think Cavs come out and smoke them in Game 3.
Taking GS in 6. Curry can't play any worse, James has got to be wearing down with all the minutes and his jumper has been mostly MIA.
I'm as big a lebron hater as you'll find, but one of the things I love about his game is his passing. Especially his willingness to dish it at the end if he can get someone else a better look. Some people kill him for that, pointing to it as an example of his being too passive, not having that killer instinct. Maybe they're right, maybe not. But when he does it, I'm reminded of MJ with Paxson and Kerr. Phenomenal court vision, passing ability, and confidence in your team.
It's great to be talking hoops with you all. I've spent way too long with my head buried in BBtL and ballgahzi, neglecting my true sports love of basketball.
I'm as big a lebron hater as you'll find, but one of the things I love about his game is his passing. Especially his willingness to dish it at the end if he can get someone else a better look. Some people kill him for that, pointing to it as an example of his being too passive, not having that killer instinct. Maybe they're right, maybe not. But when he does it, I'm reminded of MJ with Paxson and Kerr. Phenomenal court vision, passing ability, and confidence in your team.
It's great to be talking hoops with you all. I've spent way too long with my head buried in BBtL and ballgahzi, neglecting my true sports love of basketball.
I´m not a big NBA guy.
Shouldn´t Blatt also get at least some credit? Okay, he has the best player in the NBA and basically it seems as if the Cavs let LeBron create. But being at 1-1 with this team against the Warriors? And if they lost this series, say 1-4, Blatt would have gotten all the fire, i guess.
Shouldn´t Blatt also get at least some credit? Okay, he has the best player in the NBA and basically it seems as if the Cavs let LeBron create. But being at 1-1 with this team against the Warriors? And if they lost this series, say 1-4, Blatt would have gotten all the fire, i guess.
Blatt (and Tyronn Lue) deserve a lot of credit for the defensive end of things, where they're making life really hard for a team that has basically ruined defenses' day over and over again this year. However, it's kind of an open question how much of the offense that they're running is Blatt's and how much is LeBron's, so I try not to pin it to him overmuch.
I love how people point out, "You know, Lebron missed a FT in overtime and didn't score on the last possession," as if that proves Lebron just isn't good enough. My memory might be shaky, but I do think Jordon has missed a shot or two over his playoff career. Ok, ok, he missed one.
I'm closing the poll, will do another after tonight's game.
Picks made so far:
whattya think?
Picks made so far:
whattya think?
- GS in 5 (2 votes [3.57%] - View)
Ale Xander, Kliq
- GS in 6 (34 votes [60.71%] - View)
rotundlio, Mloaf71, TheMoralBully, jmm57, Zomp, jablo1312, Nick Kaufman, tmracht, jon abbey, coremiller, Awesome Fossum, Blacken, mandro ramtinez, Mr TipsyMcStagger, Joe Sixpack, beezer, billgio, ( . ) ( . ) and (_!_), Hiller, TrapperAB, fairlee76, TeddysBonefish, Detts, Tangled Up In Red, Sam Ray Not, ThePrideofShiner, Dollar, GeorgeCostanza, cardiacs, deanx0, redsoxcentury, Plantiers Wart, cromulence, cheech13
GS in 7 (10 votes [17.86%] - View)
tims4wins, Lose Remerswaal, Devizier, ALiveH, JohnnyTheBone, TheRooster, BannedbyNYYFans.com, Deweys Stache, sachmoney, Dahabenzapple2
- Cleveland in 5 (0 votes [0.00%])
- Cleveland in 6 (4 votes [7.14%] - View)
bosox4283, drleather2001, Koufax, Chief Wahoo
- Cleveland in 7 (6 votes [10.71%] - View)
johnmd20, HowBoutDemSox, Grin&MartyBarret, rembrat, Tony C, SemperFidelisSox
There's a vast sea between saying Lebron isn't MJ and saying Lebron isn't good enough. Lebron (as much as I despise him) is a top ten all time player, probably higher than that, I haven't taken the time to rank. He's an amazing player and this postseason has probably kicked him up a slot or two. He has willed this team to being two games for a title and his perfomance so far has been amazing . That being said, he's had far more clunkers than MJ ever did when it mattered.johnmd20 said:
But saying he isn't MJ is like saying Mother Theresa wasn't Jesus. Plenty can sit at the table, just not necessarily at the head.
After watching last night's and seeing Curry finally find his stroke and go nuts in the 2nd half I have to think if the stroke remains GS wins the series. The jump shooting isn't nearly as big an issue as the abundance of bad shots taken early in the shot clock with no ball movement. If they get back to solid ball movement GS definitely wins in 6 or 7.
I can't stand him but I will think he's a top 5 player all time. For me he's in a group with MJ, Larry, and Magic, with Jordan at the top of the class. What makes this group so special is not only are their offensive games transcendant, they were all tremendous defenders. Bron's off the ball defense isn't quite as good as the others, he gets caught drifting on occassion. Or sleeping on a back screen. He's never stopped improving his game which is something I didn't think he would do when he came into the league, having everything handed to him since he was 10 years old or whatever. Although he doesn't seem to have it in this finals, his jump shooting, especially 3s have improved considerably over the years. Still should be a much better FT shooter though.Papelbon's Poutine said: