Poor Moses parted the Red Sea to get to Boston and then got turned right back around.
At least he went to another winning team!
Josh Richardson to the Celtics
- Thread starter RedOctober3829
- Start date
At least he went to another winning team!
Seeing Doncic hook up “Slovenian” 7 footer Mike Tobey with alley oops over and over again, Moses might be in the perfect spot to thrive.
Dallas has cornered the market on freakishly skinny centers, that's for sure.
Have been disgusted by that roster for a while. With Hardaway Jr and Richardson gone, they're free to move on Fournier, I guess? Seems like that'll just keep them in basketball purgatory, though.
Small nit to pick, but it wouldn't be a problem ALL year. If Horford gets really old and TL trips over a curb. The team, if good, can easily add a veteran 5 pre/post-trade deadline for exp salaries/for free (see Drummond, Theis, Dieng, Griffin). So they can add depth at Center in February for the end of the season/playoffs for next to nothing. It really makes no sense to pay for a 3rd string/depth at Center, it should be a vet min player(s), hence unloading TT was a no-brainer (& a really good trade by PBS)
Plus Brad has more moves to go. Figuring out rotations/depth chart/minutes before the pre-season is fun but kind of a fruitless exercise.
If I read this correctly, they can dress 15 as well this year. They will almost never NEED 15, considering it was only in rare blowouts that they even played 13. but it's another argument for having big stiff depth. If TL or Al or both come up lame in a game, you can bring in <Insert tall guy here> as needed. Like, you can dress too many backups at every position. No reason not to.
Tacko is still affiliated with the Celtics, right? I'm fine with him taking the Moses Brown minutes, although I was intrigued by Brown before he was unceremoniously shipped out of town.
Welcome Back, Kornet!
Tacko can have the 2-way if he wants it, but suspect he'll be doing Disney ads down in Orlando this season. The Magic need more BIGz!
Am I delusional for liking Kornet as a third center? Seemed to fit the offense well: decent passer and rim-runner, decent defender, and mobile enough to do good work against second units. Another guy coming from dysfunctional situations. Seems like if he rediscovers his three point stroke, he's a good back-up. That's a big if, but not out of the realm of possibility. And another smallish contract that could be moved to nab Beal at the deadline.
He'd get abused by bigger centers and small-ball 5's, but I don't think I really care if he's splitting the third center minutes with Granite.
He'd get abused by bigger centers and small-ball 5's, but I don't think I really care if he's splitting the third center minutes with Granite.
I like him as a No. 3, too, but his value probably hinges on his 3-point shooting. I thought he'd be better from long range than he turned out to be as a Celtic last season.
yea running a Kornet/Grant 3-pt contest as your 3rd/4th string Centers is ok. as Jimbo noted, Fernando is 6 fouls
I do wish Wyc broke out the crowbar and purchased a 2nd rounder. They could have drafted Bassey for the 2-way, think he has potential.
When did Hardaway Jr leave? Everything I read was that they wanted to bring him back (unless Leonard is coming and they need to clear the space).
Good point. I just assumed a team that wanted to go deep in the playoffs wouldn't want to pay him 15-18 mill a year, but that doesn't mean they won't. He's become a great shooter, rather than the mediocre one he was on the Knicks, but he's a terrible distributor and offers nothing on the other side of the ball.
The Mavs window to sign Hardaway didn’t close but it was narrowed by his refusal to sign prior to entering FA. If they weren’t willing to pay him what he can get in the open market by now they surely won’t once he receives that offer. In few cases does it work out when you allow you’re guy to reach FA.
Edit: Unless prime destinations like Miami begin picking up $20m team options as they did with Dragic lol.
I assume that is so they can retain Duncan/Nunn and use Dragic as the ballast for a Lowry sign and trade.
fun fact, that's not Julia Roberts. It's an actress from a Brazilian soap opera.
I’m looking forward to seeing Richardson on the Celtics, where he and Smart should form a terrific defensive back court, hopefully leaving the long distance shooting to others. This highlight package from YouTube MVP TIMI shows a lot of athletic blocks, stealing, opportunistic passing, and strong, 1970s-ish finishing.
View: https://youtu.be/0IZaSQSKqOE
View: https://youtu.be/0IZaSQSKqOE
Yea, the offense may not be as pretty, but a Richardson, Smart, Brown, Tatum defense is super switchable and kind of awesome to think about
That really surprises me. No idea what to make of it, other than the Celtics are pretty high on Richardson (and low on Langford?).
Well....this is surprising. I can justify it but I don't know if I'm justifying it apologetically. Extending Richardson makes him viable as a trade piece, but the price has to be good for him to be valuable like that. Is the price (12.4-ish?) currently good? No. The Celtics must be pretty confident when it comes to rehabilitating his trade value but how confident can they be since they haven't seen him play with them at all?
Odd.
I guess Brad likes the middle tier expiring deals as options going forward next offseason.
Could obviously be a good signing but in general it might be nice to see him play a half season with this team. Plus would also get more info on Nesmith/Romeo.
There is a non-zero chance Richardson is terrible this season, he has not been good for awhile now.
I guess Brad likes the middle tier expiring deals as options going forward next offseason.
Could obviously be a good signing but in general it might be nice to see him play a half season with this team. Plus would also get more info on Nesmith/Romeo.
There is a non-zero chance Richardson is terrible this season, he has not been good for awhile now.
I feel like this is a chess move…I just don’t know what it is. Or maybe it’s as simple as them liking him and locking him in. Interesting nonetheless.
the crowbar is out and firmly planted in Wyc's wallet. Tax dollars galore starting next year
Any word on the NBA TV deal?
At some point the Cap will be getting a sizeable bump, signing players now isn't the worst idea
Any word on the NBA TV deal?
At some point the Cap will be getting a sizeable bump, signing players now isn't the worst idea
If he's involved in any trade, it's most likely as salary filler. He won't be hard to move at 1 year and 12 million or so anyway unless he completely falls off a cliff.
This seems like a recognition that they aren't going to be going cap space next year, and perhaps they feel like Richardson is just as moveable with 2 years as 1, and maybe could have positive value if he has a bounceback year.
I don't really get this. Yes, contracts are moveable, but sometimes you have to staple assets with them to get rid of them. So, it's quite hard for me to see the value of doing this now. We don't even know if he's going to fit in and add value to the Celtics yet.
Best case he's surplus value that can be kept or used as an asset in a trade.
Most likely case he's neutral value who can be kept or moved as salary filler.
Worst case the contract has slightly negative value & he can be kept or moved for a minor asset.
Seems...nonproblematic.
Most likely case he's neutral value who can be kept or moved as salary filler.
Worst case the contract has slightly negative value & he can be kept or moved for a minor asset.
Seems...nonproblematic.
reason to do it now is it's low downside and it lets you trade him before the deadline
It gives them maximum flexibility in trades, whether it's at the deadline this year or next offseason, with now 4 movable good size salaries besides the Jays, plus several trade exceptions
Maybe they think he is good. Was a lot of hand wringing around here when Liberty Bell signed him and maybe C’s think they can get that player back and if they do they have control for another year. I couldn’t pick the guy out of a lineup but the moves lead me to this conclusion.
Richardson is an old fashioned G. Or combo guard as the current terminology goes. He plays best when he's allowed to do some handling. But in his last two stops he's played for teams whose offense is entirely dictated by players that have the ball in their hands every minute they're on the floor (justifiably in Doncic's case). Boston has an offensive monster on their roster, but Tatum is as good without the ball as with it. I think that Richardson is going to be fine here.
On a broader level, with a bounceback here, the contract is attractive in a trade scenario where a third star shakes loose. But he also fits really well with the Jay-Crew. So on a long term basis they continue to surround Tatum and Brown with cost efficient talent that fits them.
Seems like the most likely answer is it’s a bit of both. They clearly like him/his potential fit and they also probably value the flexibility his salary slot may provide down the road. I’m not “pumped and jacked” to watch him but I am a little intrigued with this trade.
Of course I know next to nothing about the dynamics of the Celtics front office but from the outside looking in it sure seems like Stevens and Zarren are working very tightly. A lot of this off-season has been very technical, focused on cap management and forward options. Not a bad thing at all in my view and something I’m interested in watching play out
Not only moveable but now his contract is valueable as he isn’t simply an expiring. This is really beginning to smell like Brad and Sheppard are communicating to best structure a deal for Beal based on the Wizards wants not too dissimilar to Ainge and McHale in the year leading up to the KG trade.
My guess is they like him. think he can be better on O, needs confidence, to feel wanted. They are betting he be worth it. There are just too many moving pieces to sign him if the plan is to not play him.
If he does work out, you have a good player on a good contract for an extra year. If he doesn’t work out, you have a matching salary to pair with a young asset for an upgrade. If you can trade for a star next offseason then who cares if he worked out he’s a contract in that trade.
The offseason before the Smart extension and after seem like two completely different strategies. If you knew before the offseason that they would commit salary to being over the cap for years out, I think we would have all assumed that it would be for a major FA or trade or S&T. This deal only makes sense to me if they are preparing for a major trade, but a month ago it looked like they were lining up for a major FA move. Weird stuff. I wonder if they didn't expect Smart to sign their offer? Hopefully there is a plan.
Given that it was an extension that the team did not have to offer, it's 100% certain the team expected Smart to sign the offer. However, it was important to find out early on if extending Smart was going to be feasible; had he refused, Stevens probably would have taken a different approach.
The Celtics would have had to renounce nearly everyone to sign a max free agent in 2022, including Smart and the promising Robert Williams. And even that may not have given them the room to offer 100% of the max. So operating as an over the cap team made sense.
As mentioned previously this deal isn't the difference between being able to sign a major FA next year and not (far from it), so really, what's not to like? He's a solid, versatile player and it's not big money. He'll be starting plenty of games next year (if they decide Schroder is better off the bench) and likely more the year after that (when Schroder is gone and if none of the young guys take a major step forward).
With the extension, Horford, Richardson, Langford is enough salary to balance out a trade for Beal in the off-season. I think Brad sees the value of having a bunch of mid-tier contracts that are short term and easy to move around for a bigger fish. Plus, if it doesn't work out that way, that's a good deal for a player like Richardson.
It's nice to have a salary that isn't Smart to move with Horford in a star trade, since Smart fits great on a team with 3 offensive alphas--he's a mini-Iguodala in a lot of ways.
If Richardson plays like he did the past 2 years, he'll be a small negative at this amount and be fine trade ballast. If he plays like he did a couple years ago to start this season, the contract will be an asset at the deadline or over the summer. It would suck a bit to buy low on Richardson and then lose him right away if he plays well (as will 100% happen with Schroeder).
This is pretty much it, I think. Brad clearly made the decision (and I think it’s the one he had to make given that you don’t want to totally give up on a year of Tatum and Brown ahead of time) that they weren’t going to hamstring the team this year to ensure max cap space next year. And once that decision was made, there is very little reason not to make these kinds of moves (Smart, TL and now Richardson).
It’s somewhat conventional wisdom on this board that next year is Beal-or-bust, but (a) these moves don’t really affect that and if anything make it easier to work out a sign-and-trade (or a trade and extension if a deal happens at the deadline this year) if Beal wants to come to Boston and (b) they give Brad some added flexibility if the Beal scenario doesn’t come to pass - he can use these assets to trade for someone else or, worst case, he has a number of decent players locked up a decent salaries for next season, whereas if Brad went the “clear cap space” route and they lost out on Beal, 2022-23 would be basically guaranteed to be a lost year, which you really can’t afford when you have Tatum and Brown on your team.
The downside risks of clearing out the space were indeed significant. You would have a number of players all playing for their next contracts, creating a potential headache for the new coach. Word of dysfunction could spread, causing Beal to stay in DC or go elsewhere, and the Celtics would then be scrambling to fill a roster around Tatum/Brown in a year without any headline free agents. One lost year of the J's could easily turn into 2 or more, which would end up hastening the exit of one or both.
Stevens has made an honest attempt to fill this season's roster with quality depth while maintaining the flexibility that comes with having tradeable assets. It will be on Stevens to take advantage of that opportunity, either at the deadline or next offseason. His moves may not have been splashy, but they were much better than trying to run it back with last season's roster.
<Danger Tea Leaves>
So we lock up Richardson (another mid Level) prior to the Deadline enabling us to trade him this year.
I wonder if Beal is more likely then we thought. If maybe Beal is communicating with someone close to the Celtics organization. (I have NO idea who
) and indicating that he is ready to pull the trigger and demand a trade and "would really prefer" Boston.
Seems like it make alot of sense. Richardson is now tradable. It helps salary matching. Doestn completely gut the team (allowing you to keep Smart and or Schroder for example......I think). Plus it makes sense that Wyc would sign off on "Half a year of Richardson (and others) and the associated tax to attain Beal....who would put you over the tax anyway".
We point out that "Richardson and Smart and Schroder" isnt worth going over the cap for......"Unlike Beal". But what if They ARE going over to GET Beal?
So we lock up Richardson (another mid Level) prior to the Deadline enabling us to trade him this year.
I wonder if Beal is more likely then we thought. If maybe Beal is communicating with someone close to the Celtics organization. (I have NO idea who
) and indicating that he is ready to pull the trigger and demand a trade and "would really prefer" Boston.Seems like it make alot of sense. Richardson is now tradable. It helps salary matching. Doestn completely gut the team (allowing you to keep Smart and or Schroder for example......I think). Plus it makes sense that Wyc would sign off on "Half a year of Richardson (and others) and the associated tax to attain Beal....who would put you over the tax anyway".
We point out that "Richardson and Smart and Schroder" isnt worth going over the cap for......"Unlike Beal". But what if They ARE going over to GET Beal?
How would JRich be a small negative if he’s replacing minites that were a larger negative? It’s a win-win…..you upgrade the position AND create a salary slot (discussed by Brad and Sheppard?). I fail to see where there is a negative unless you are simply valuing his contract dollar by his numbers which is missing the entire picture.