Dear god, make it happen. I would be happy to donate to keep him playing on the Lakers.
What better way to keep the Lakers in suckitude?
Kobe will retire at the end of this season
- Thread starter ifmanis5
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What better way to keep the Lakers in suckitude?
In the sense that he played no D and took nearly every shot for his team it was, but still, pretty amazing by any standard.
The one thing I will say is Utah was playing defense. This wasn't an all star game type of situation where they let him do whatever. They were fighting through picks, manning up, fouling him, etc. They legitimately just could not stop him down the stretch though. He made everything. I've hated Kobe my whole life, but as a sports fan, that's some fun shit to watch.
Indeed. You can hate but its somewhat irrational. At his peak he was a beast. This is a fitting end to a hell of a career.
Yep. Kobe never came out of the locker room when they retired Shaq's jersey. Shaq is the bigger man literally and figuratively.
Not me. Either you get the awesome or you don't. Your faint sadness is wasted on the clueless.
Fuck that. No sadness for a franchise crushing rapist who just heaved 50 shots in his masturbatory finale?!
Franchise crushing? I hope someone comes along and crushes the Celtics franchise by delivering 5 championships over the next 20 years. I don't care how bad the last few years might be for that kind of return.
He set an NBA record for missed FG in a regulation game tonight. He already held the record for missed FG in an OT game.
And inefficiency only matters when you don't win the last game. You know this man.
Yup. Forget even the five-year no-complaints rule that Red Sox fans (and the insufferable Patriots fans) here conveniently ignore--any way you slice it, a five-ring run is worth a solid decade of bad, and they certainly won't be bad that long.
Please. Tonight was emblematic of the last three years: Not very good, but he was going to give you a lot of it whether you wanted it or not. Kind of like having sex with him, I guess.
OK, tonight happened to finish in a team win over an opponent that had nothing to play for. This approach left the Lakers almost 100 games under .500 the last two years, too. He's a formerly great player with a laughable degree of narcissism, enabled by the kind of ball-washing he's getting here and on ESPN.
He's been Norma Desmond for the last three years, pretending he can still get it done. The only difference is he's had people pretending he still can right along with him.
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Is it possible for people to just not want to root for rapists, no matter their team allegiance? Is that cool?
I think it's silly to criticize people for "sports hate". Kobe had a hell of a career but there are legitimate reasons to be sick of him, especially if you're not a Lakers fan. Of course, it's pretty funny that over the past couple of seasons, Boston fans have watched Manning go out with a SB, Jeter go out with a walk off, and now Kobe go out with a 60 point win. I respected Jeter but absolutely do not "miss" him. I will miss watching Kobe. He made the NBA more fun and it kind of sucks that he's gone.
I'm not a huge Kobe guy, but you might want to read about that case a bit more before convicting him in your mind.
It was essentially an exhibition game and it was fun. I've always been a Kobe fan like I am a LeBron fan......I appreciate true greatness on the court. To me the most amazing part of this was a 39-year old who still has the ability to create 50 shots in one NBA game. The defense wasn't laying down and nobody was "giving" him 50 shots. Shot creation is a vastly underapprecisted part of the NBA game with a 24-second shot clock. It takes a special player to do this consistently.
Just finished the DVR version and this was a perfect way for Kobe to go out....with the game winner and 60 points.
I don't feeling like wading in on the pro or cons of Kobe right now, but seeing you denigrate "hate" on a message board that sees you go pretty bonkers over video games from time to time is perfect theater. Well played.
I have read about this case at the time and afterwards. Be very careful what you read about it because the Kobe ballwashers, the Lakers PR team and Kobe's personal PR team have been massaging this for years.
What a perfectly emblematic game, Kobe's entire career crystallized in one night. If you're a Kobe fan, you can point to the 60 points, the barrage of late scoring, and the fact that they won. If you're a Kobe hater, you can point to the 50 shots, middling efficiency, and the fact that the game was meaningless. And because its Kobe, he somehow managed to overshadow the Golden State Warriors on a night when they won 73 games and Steph broke 400 3's.
How often does an athlete get to go out in a way that so perfectly encapsulates their whole career? This kinda shit is why I love sports.
How often does an athlete get to go out in a way that so perfectly encapsulates their whole career? This kinda shit is why I love sports.
Great post. I don't begrudge those who dislike Kobe as a person - and there is a lot to dislike there - but you have to respect his talent and competitive drive. The latter may have cost his team wins when he tried to do too much or alienated/exiled teammates but it also helped win five championships. As DotB said, many of us sports fans would take that deal any time.
I don't know about athletes but Dan Dierdorf suggesting that the Patriots should have taken a safety after a fumble near their goal line instead of trying to make a goal line stand (which they later did) during his final game for CBS is pretty damn close.
For the uninitiated, what's the bottom line on this? Or is there an article or two you can direct us to that isn't ballwashed?
Wow, I didn't realize the 50 shots till i wound up here. That's crazy. I randomly jumped on b-ref to check out average FGA for 2016 and he ranks 17th with 16.9pg. #18? - Isaiah Thomas (with a much higher make rate). For that metric there is only one other player that makes less than 40%(Kobe makes 26%) of their shots in the top 50; 5 in the top 100. Not trying to make any point; just found it interesting.
6-24 and efficiency stats don't make me feel any better about Game 7 2010, I'll tell you that much. If anything that game should serve as a reminder of Kobe's all around skills and dispel any notion that he was some empty high volume gunner. HRB's point about the skill level involved in actually attempting 50 shots in a game, the majority of which that were in half court sets is right on. I've always felt there was an underrated intrinsic value in high volume shot creation even if somewhat inefficient, Iverson's career was basically a testimony to that, especially given the roster construction of some of those successful early 2000s' Philly teams.
I was never a Kobe fan but will always respect two things about him;
1) His respect for the Celtic-Laker rivalry, and NBA history in general.
2) His dedication to his craft and always trying to improve his game. Jackie Mac's recent piece on ESPN was pretty insightful, especially the 1 on 1 work with Hakeem improving his post up game.
http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/15193525/kobe-bryant-personal-mount-rushmore-mentors-starring-michael-jackson
I was never a Kobe fan but will always respect two things about him;
1) His respect for the Celtic-Laker rivalry, and NBA history in general.
2) His dedication to his craft and always trying to improve his game. Jackie Mac's recent piece on ESPN was pretty insightful, especially the 1 on 1 work with Hakeem improving his post up game.
http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/15193525/kobe-bryant-personal-mount-rushmore-mentors-starring-michael-jackson
Absolutely. Bryant's defense team was absolutely brutal towards the alleged victim in this case. And I was not trying to insinuate that this was a Jackie situation; merely that there is some doubt as to what actually occurred that afternoon.
Kobe's statement - http://www.thesmokinggun.com/documents/crime/kobe-bryant-police-interview
Victim's statement - http://www.thesmokinggun.com/documents/sports/kobe-police-file-released
Summary of the case and ongoing implications - http://thinkprogress.org/sports/2016/04/13/3768242/kope-bryant-rape-case-legacy/ (if we view thinkprogress as reputable)
Bob Ryan tweeted that Kobe was #2 Laker all time, in front of Kareem, West, etc.My personal feeling was to put him behind Kareem, but maybe I should consider Kareem wasn't a Laker his entire career. Some of my first basketball memories was watching the Lakers/Celtics finals and thinking once Kareem got the ball and the right positioning, he was unstoppable. Any opinions on this?
I have him 6th (Kareem, Shaq, Magic, West, Baylor, Kobe), but I'm always a peak value proponent over longevity--if you're more the latter, Shaq certainly vanishes from the argument, though he was certainly the more dominant player for an 8 year stretch with the Lakers. Baylor probably does as well, and depending on how you frame the argument even having Kobe at #1 is probably defensible.
Kareem did play 14 years for the Lakers so it's not like it was just a 5 year run.
And he didn't dominate the Celtics in the Finals--his FG% against them was below his career average (52.5% vs. 56%) but it seems easier to recall his big games (13/18 for 32 points in game 6 in 87).
I think that if the game had playoff implications, a very different Jazz team would have shown up.
Screw Kobe.
This guy hasn't been good for 4 years. For 4 years.
Forget, just for a moment all the shots he took. But for 4 years the Lakers have been precluded from getting a star that would take shots he may hypothetically take if wasn't injured.
What kind of warped world do we have where Lebron is pilloried for wanting to play with great players, and Kobe is a "legend" for holding his franchise hostage as his own private sports fantasy camp for 5 years?
5 rings? Sure he was there but he was arguably not the best player on any of the 5 teams. He inarguably was not even close to the best player on the 1st three. Gassol had better win shares the other two times. 5 rings? If he wasn't such a selfish baby he could have went after Bill Russell's 11. He works things out with Shaq, he gets to 7 or 8,before he is 30, easy. Easy. Even Jerry West, long a Kobe apologist, now admits Shaq went the extra mile, but Kobe bristled at even acknowledging Shaq was a good player. This fraud then has the nerve to publicly condemn a series of team mates for not fitting in.
And Mr. Clutch? From the article linked below:
With Nike, he created Kobe The Closer™, a cold-blooded, crunch-time messiah, never mind the fact that he made a mere 37 percent of shots in the last two minutes of a game to either tie or take the lead. Statistics are for eggheads who can't recognise greatness
Jeter was a self important over rated media manufactured annoyance, but if he had acted like, and been allowed to act like Kobe he would still be at SS batting leadoff.
Seriously what is the baseball stat equivalent of taking 467 3's while making 28.5%? I mean he was 6th in 3s attempted while being far below any threshhold where you be considered being allowed to even take any 3s. I mean this is 2007 Julio Lugo batting cleanup. It is hard to argue he even belonged in the league this year. If he had an ounce of integrity he would have stopped playing after the first two months. but, he is the quintessential egomaniac. Donald Trump looks at Kobe and thinks, 'Wow that guy has no shame, I hope I am never so self important.'
50 damn shots?
"Mamba out" when the T-shirts have already been made.
I love guys that train hard, that are nasty, that want to shoot the ball. So at one time Kobe was to me a guy for young guys to emulate. "Believe in yourself, be nasty, get in the gym" At one time I thought he had the chance to be better than Jordan, he was a better shooter. But at that zenith he made one decision, like a series of forced shitty shots, after another that were all about him. Jordan is and was a lousy human being, but he made concessions to his ego. Jordan's fire was directed to winning games. Kobe's was always more about Kobe.
Screw him and his sham of a last game.
http://rollingstoneaus.com/culture/post/kobe-bryant-goodbye-to-the-nbas-all-time-asshole/3598
This guy hasn't been good for 4 years. For 4 years.
Forget, just for a moment all the shots he took. But for 4 years the Lakers have been precluded from getting a star that would take shots he may hypothetically take if wasn't injured.
What kind of warped world do we have where Lebron is pilloried for wanting to play with great players, and Kobe is a "legend" for holding his franchise hostage as his own private sports fantasy camp for 5 years?
5 rings? Sure he was there but he was arguably not the best player on any of the 5 teams. He inarguably was not even close to the best player on the 1st three. Gassol had better win shares the other two times. 5 rings? If he wasn't such a selfish baby he could have went after Bill Russell's 11. He works things out with Shaq, he gets to 7 or 8,before he is 30, easy. Easy. Even Jerry West, long a Kobe apologist, now admits Shaq went the extra mile, but Kobe bristled at even acknowledging Shaq was a good player. This fraud then has the nerve to publicly condemn a series of team mates for not fitting in.
And Mr. Clutch? From the article linked below:
With Nike, he created Kobe The Closer™, a cold-blooded, crunch-time messiah, never mind the fact that he made a mere 37 percent of shots in the last two minutes of a game to either tie or take the lead. Statistics are for eggheads who can't recognise greatness
Jeter was a self important over rated media manufactured annoyance, but if he had acted like, and been allowed to act like Kobe he would still be at SS batting leadoff.
Seriously what is the baseball stat equivalent of taking 467 3's while making 28.5%? I mean he was 6th in 3s attempted while being far below any threshhold where you be considered being allowed to even take any 3s. I mean this is 2007 Julio Lugo batting cleanup. It is hard to argue he even belonged in the league this year. If he had an ounce of integrity he would have stopped playing after the first two months. but, he is the quintessential egomaniac. Donald Trump looks at Kobe and thinks, 'Wow that guy has no shame, I hope I am never so self important.'
50 damn shots?
"Mamba out" when the T-shirts have already been made.
I love guys that train hard, that are nasty, that want to shoot the ball. So at one time Kobe was to me a guy for young guys to emulate. "Believe in yourself, be nasty, get in the gym" At one time I thought he had the chance to be better than Jordan, he was a better shooter. But at that zenith he made one decision, like a series of forced shitty shots, after another that were all about him. Jordan is and was a lousy human being, but he made concessions to his ego. Jordan's fire was directed to winning games. Kobe's was always more about Kobe.
Screw him and his sham of a last game.
http://rollingstoneaus.com/culture/post/kobe-bryant-goodbye-to-the-nbas-all-time-asshole/3598
Call me shallow, but as a lifelong Laker hater I was absolutely delighted that Kobe stuck around. I only wish he would change his mind and rejoin the Lakers for one more year!
Kobe, like some other notable athletes, convinced himself that whatever was best for himself was equal to whatever was best for the team. Kobe was a fantastic player so often times this worked out, but later in his career this became extremely apparent. The last summer with the story of Kobe trying to recruit Aldridge by basically saying that he would make a great second banana for Kobe, is incredible.
Kobe, especially during this last season, has benefited from a large contingent of fans who have come of age watching Kobe play. I can't believe how many people I argue with about Kobe's all-time legacy and how he has been sucking the life out of the Lakers for years now. My favorite Kobe hypocrisy is how the guy gets the credit for being this incredible competitor that only cares about winning, while he makes $30 million dollars. Meanwhile, real competitors like Duncan and Nowitzki take paycuts and surprise surprise, those guys are in the playoffs while Kobe's team sits at home, again.
