R4/103 Layden Robinson OG Texas A&M
- Thread starter DJnVa
- Start date
The entire offensive coaching staff wasn;t? It's not like every guard is just plug and play in every offense.
As an example... Robinson is like 25-30 lbs lighter than Mafi, taller wiht longer arms.
Mafit was an outlier, the rest of the guard/centers the Patriots have are lighter. Bill used to use one heavy and 1 light when he could, the new staff may want lighter guards on both sides.
New OL coach. I mean, I’m pretty sure they know who’s on roster and are drafting an OG anyway, so…
Not here last year in that they had a say in the guys that are here from last year and want to keep them, or that they were here last year, saw them practice, study, work out and play and know that some of them are not good enough? It could really cut both ways, but I’d probably go with the latter.
Fair point.
Either way, not a great reflection on the 2023 draft, but that’s now history.
Not thrilled with this one. Seems like a value pick, and not a reach, so that's good - but seems like we have a lot of interior lineman. Would have liked to see a TE project.
If nothing else those dimensions: 6’4 315 34.5” arms seem more tackle than guard.
I will be zero percent surprised if David Andrews announces his retirement between now and the end of camp.
I don't htink the interior line has THAT many bodies....
COle Strange (may not be ready for week 1)
David Andrews (May not be back, age/injury concerns)
Sidey Sow
That's your hypothetical starters...
Jake Andrews is you backup C but lacks experience
Antoni Mafi (but he may no longer be a scheme fit.... also he was really bad last year)
Then they have a vet on a glorified camp deal...
Nick Leverett... UDFA, had 1 year he played some for Tampa but played 0% of snaps last year
That's some seriously low depth and you;d have to start moving OTs back inside in you get 1 or 2 injuries.
With the two guys this year, they now have a bit of depth at both positions.
COle Strange (may not be ready for week 1)
David Andrews (May not be back, age/injury concerns)
Sidey Sow
That's your hypothetical starters...
Jake Andrews is you backup C but lacks experience
Antoni Mafi (but he may no longer be a scheme fit.... also he was really bad last year)
Then they have a vet on a glorified camp deal...
Nick Leverett... UDFA, had 1 year he played some for Tampa but played 0% of snaps last year
That's some seriously low depth and you;d have to start moving OTs back inside in you get 1 or 2 injuries.
With the two guys this year, they now have a bit of depth at both positions.
I could see them moving Strange to center when Andrews hangs it up. Then Sow and Robinson at the guards, with Onwenu at RT and Okorafor (eventually Wallace) at LT.
And also would rather them have drafted Christian Mahogany in round 6 over Milton.
And also would rather them have drafted Christian Mahogany in round 6 over Milton.
Last edited:
I can't remember where I heard it over the last couple days, but someone mentioned the possibility of the team trying him at OT as well as IOL.
I think they'll likely be in the market for an OT at the top of next year's draft. (Probably in addition to Edge and WR.) This year is about getting some new guys in the door, hopefully something hits, but they'll still need a top end investment at some point soon. Owenu can always kick back inside too.
Doubtful, I think. He's not considered a very good athlete. Could have enough versatility to play center though, which might be important. They are very convinced Wallace can move to LT, so it's likely Okorafor to start the season, with Wallace backing him up, and a depth signing.
Brandon Thorn made part of his weekly O-line breakdown free, happened to pick Robinson
View: https://twitter.com/BrandonThornNFL/status/1836455656599228556
View: https://twitter.com/BrandonThornNFL/status/1836455656599228556
The issue with Robinson is he has allowed the most pressures of any interior lineman in the NFL through two weeks. He has some nice highlights but way too many lowlights. To me if they had anyone better I’d want to bench him. I don’t get Thorn’s takes sometimes.
At this point I'd just plug in Onwenu at RG and Wallace at RT and go from there. Let Robinson fight it out for the LG starting spot with Jordan and then Sow/Strange when they're healthy. Onwenu is an average at best RT (a level I believe Wallace could potentially approach even as a rookie), but light years better than Robinson at RG.
Who's playing LT? Or shall they leave it vacant and roll right? Not the worst idea!
I know he's playing tonight, but is Vederian Lowe out for an extended period of time? I wouldn't move the OL around for a Thursday game anyway, just talking of something I'd like to see happen.
Robinson's limitations on pass protection seem like something that will improve over the course of the season with more reps.
His scouting report out of college was that he was good at attacking and not good at building a wall. Mentions that he doesn't read and respond well to stunts and twists, doesn't recover well to being thrown off balance, etc. That's not to say that he won't improve on these things with NFL coaching, and he has plenty of length and size to do it, but his explosiveness and athleticism is a limiting factor for now. His pass blocking was predicted to lag behind his run blocking.
That Wallace is playing tonight is why you don't make the move. They have 2 tackles without Onwenu, and guys get hurt both week to week and in games. One thing we've seen pretty consistently is that time together in the same role is one of the best things for a line. Robinson is a rookie, he should see some improvement as time passes, and Onwenu should settle some at RT.
Now, next season.... I would guess the hope is they get a stud rookie and he and Wallace handle the tackles, with Lowe and others as depth, which would allow Onwenu to slide inside and Sow/Robinson/Strange? fighting it out for LG (Strange might end up at C if Andrews hangs it up).
https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/6046871/2025/01/09/nfl-all-rookie-2024-draft-picks-jayden-daniels/
Robinson is on Brugler's 2nd team all-rookie.... a sign that OG was not great.
Writeup is basically... he played and showed promise, especially late year after being moved to the left
Robinson is on Brugler's 2nd team all-rookie.... a sign that OG was not great.
Writeup is basically... he played and showed promise, especially late year after being moved to the left
Yeah, that's 4th place finish feels like something of a participation prize
Puni, Powers-Johnson, and to a lesser extent McCormick all had good rookie years.
Only four other rookie Gs got more than ~200 plays, they were all pretty bad, and of them young Layden got the most snaps. So his inclusion feels kinda like a "shrug, give it to the guy who played" move
...
This whole thing also feels like it illustrates something about draft strategy.
The consensus draft boards had Puni around the ~80th prospect. The 49ers took him at 86.
The Pats would be better off today if they'd taken him in the third round (instead of Caedan Wallace) even if it meant only drafting one OLineman, instead of two. Better to have a great OG than a backup OT and a backup OG
Maybe... I thought Wallace showed some promise post-injury and if he becomes a playable RT that's probably worth more to them.
If Wallace ever became a playable RT and Robinson is an average starting guard, this draft is a home run on top of Maye. I’d love one of them to be only pretty good.
Both of those things are conceivable but feel like 90th percentile outcomes. I think that it's more likely that neither is with the team in two years than Wallace is our RT and Robinson a league average starting guard. They were barely rotation guys on a horrific OL as rookies. They'll improve, but so should the rest of the line.
I’m not saying it’s likely but it’d be the best case scenario. For either of them though, you get one of the top tackles in FA, get Andrews back (if he doesn’t retire), move Onwenu back to RG it’s a much better chance for success. If Robinson was on not a completely garbage OL, could he have grown more or was he just thrown into a shitshow every single snap trying to do too much?
I really don’t expect either to become fulltime starters, but there’s a path where one of them might be and the other is a good backup? Even then, that’s a win.
They both flashed something at times, so I get the optimism. Even if they end up only being depth, an upgrade on street FA depth is something. We ran so many street FAs out there this year that it was embarrassing.
True, but they'd already drafted Strange, Onwenu, Sow and Mafi at OG in prior years. Imagine the howling if the only lineman they'd taken was another OG, when OT was so clearly the needier position. Of course, then Strange and Sow get (stay?) hurt, and Mafi gets cut. I assume they knew Conor McDermott was ailing, hence his cut the day after the draft was completed. Really, Wallace was as much a draft for a body as much as anything.
I do wonder if these players were some of what Wolf was talking about when he mentioned that players didn’t develop as hoped.
Maybe another thread worthy- besides Mike O, is there another OG that can kick out to OT currently (ala Thuney) ?
The WR's, probably. Polk started off fine and then the Miami game broke him. He and the staff never figured out a way to get him back on track. They never really god Baker on the field.
The OL's...Robinson was probably rushed due to injuries but played a ton. Was predictably up and down. Not sure what to make of Wallace's development. They tried him at LT, moved him back to RT then were forced to play him at LT in real games way too early because of injuries. He sucked and then got hurt and missed a bunch of time which stunts development.
Probably falls more under the "internal improvment" comment from Wolf but second year guys like Sidy Sow. He looked to be a solid starting guard after 2023. Got hurt in the final preseason game and was terrible upon returning and couldn't get on the field even with such a bad line. They probably thought they had more there from him.
Looking back on the year, it's tough enough for young players to adapt to the NFL level. I have to imagine given the insane amount of lineup changes in the line, it must have been quite challenging to give young players consistent coaching. I don't watch line play super closely and love others' write ups, but I have to imagine there is different coaching on footwork, leverage and arms depending on where you are and even on the strengths of the dude next to you. If we can even fill out the roster such that the line can have enough consistency for coaching to compound on itself, I'm optimistic we can see some trend on the individual talents. This year feels like a lost year.
First off, F everything that weasel says. I’ll leave any more to his thread.
I believe they were getting good coaching along the line, and of all the positions being filled by noobs or incompetents (like vp player personnel) this wasn’t one.
Scott Peters was widely respected and had strong track record at…wait for it…the actual job he was hired to do.
https://www.patriots.com/team/coaches-roster/scott-peters#:~:text=COACHING-,Scott Peters enters his first season as the Patriots offensive,coach for the Cleveland Browns.
Maybe Caedan shows something. Maybe Robinson gets better at pass pro. Occam’s razor leaning into they weren’t good because they aren’t good.
]
Well not entirely. He had a strong rep for being an assistant line coach, but he never ran his room and he was only coaching for 4 years... big step up to being in charge of the whole line vs working with guys on punch techique and the like. Peters was the Jeff Davidson to Callahan's Scar.