RD5 #13/#159: K Justin Rohrwasser, Marshall

E5 Yaz

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Oh please, stop the pearl-clutching for just a moment. You've rendered judgement based on like 5 hours of the interwebs' reaction to what could be an unfortunate coincidence? Read the article and you'll realize he might actually be right out of Central Casting:
I forgot the sarcasm smilie
 

Marciano490

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Oh please, stop the pearl-clutching for just a moment. You've rendered judgement based on like 5 hours of the interwebs' reaction to what could be an unfortunate coincidence? Read the article and you'll realize he might actually be right out of Central Casting:
Do you think the outrage will burn out or fade away?
 

Rough Carrigan

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Oh come on.
The irony of people who would probably work themselves into tears of sympathy for Hollywood writers and directors of the 1940's not being allowed to ply their trade for mostly having had innocent associations with people of a deeply discredited point of view now wanting to not let him ply his trade for apparently having had innocent associations with people of a deeply discredited point of view is quite rich.
 

PC Drunken Friar

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Oh come on.
The irony of people who would probably work themselves into tears of sympathy for Hollywood writers and directors of the 1940's not being allowed to ply their trade for mostly having had innocent associations with people of a deeply discredited point of view now wanting to not let him ply his trade for apparently having had innocent associations with people of a deeply discredited point of view is quite rich.
In this political climate, he doesn't get the benefit of the doubt that he has had "innocent association" with a hate group. He can ply his trade if he can find a buyer. I'm just very disappointed that the buyer is now something that i am associated with.
 

DeJesus Built My Hotrod

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Has anyone uncovered problematic statements or actions by Rohrwasser yet? Or are some people simply judging him by his appearance and a book he recommended?
 

TSC

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In this political climate, he doesn't get the benefit of the doubt that he has had "innocent association" with a hate group. He can ply his trade if he can find a buyer. I'm just very disappointed that the buyer is now something that i am associated with.
Rohrwasser's explanation was a lot more sincere and forthright than this guys.

You've always been associated with it. You're willingness to accept it just rests on a scale.

 

luckiestman

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Rohrwasser's explanation was a lot more sincere and forthright than this guys.

You've always been associated with it. You're willingness to accept it just rests on a scale.

Something something fungible
 

PC Drunken Friar

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Rohrwasser's explanation was a lot more sincere and forthright than this guys.

You've always been associated with it. You're willingness to accept it just rests on a scale.

Oh I completely agree. I am a hypocrite. I know many athletes and artists I support are horrible people. I choose where the line is drawn.

I won't judge others if they continue to support this team, but I am going to have a very hard time coming to grips cheering for them if this isn't addressed by the owner.
 

TSC

SoSH's Doug Neidermeyer
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Here's why I'm willing to believe this kid.

He's not wrong in that Threepers were originally closely associated with the military/military support. Threepers were mostly dudes who had separated from the military, had conservative values, and took their oaths seriously.

Don't believe me? Here's their mission statement from 2013.


There's no denying that they've gone hard right in the last 5 years or so. And maybe that streak was always there but recent things have made it more acceptable to openly flaunt it. But initially, at least, that was not the messaging they were putting out. And it's not hard to see a young kid with family in the military getting wrapped up with the Threeper symbolism before become more aware of what they actually were.
 

Ale Xander

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Oct 31, 2013
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If a picture is worth a thousand words, isn't a tattoo a statement of a thousand words?
 

P'tucket rhymes with...

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Oh I completely agree. I am a hypocrite. I know many athletes and artists I support are horrible people. I choose where the line is drawn.

I won't judge others if they continue to support this team, but I am going to have a very hard time coming to grips cheering for them if this isn't addressed by the owner.
"Drawing the line" at a no-name kicker who might not make it out of camp while giving a pass to the higher profile, ring-delivering players with questionable politics and behavior is a pretty bad look.
 

PC Drunken Friar

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"Drawing the line" at a no-name kicker who might not make it out of camp while giving a pass to the higher profile, ring-delivering players with questionable politics and behavior is a pretty bad look.
Like I said., I'm a hypocrite. Not really concerned with "the look". This makes the decision much easier when combined with all the nonsense that has happened. If they are not going to address this issue and are prepared to look the other way for a no name kicker...what else will they look past.
 

RetractableRoof

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He isn't innocent if he has had the tattoo for years and has yet to cover it up. Plus, recommending books by Jordan Peterson on April 1, 2020 is a huge concern. I don't want to be associated with people who support people that think like this. He may only have to answer to BB and RK, but they need to answer to the fans.
Wow, just wow. Would you send me your list of questions so that I might filter my own friends and acquaintances? While you are at it, would you send me your CV, social media account information, and enough personal information so that I might contact your friends and acquaintances from high school til present in order to ascertain your suitableness to associate with? Just can't be too careful these days. I certainly hope you've never used a slur at any time, or recommended a book with a point or theory I might not agree with, or posted about a song or a band that might have a wrong word in it. I hope that you've never used the "OK" symbol in a photo, because we all know what that means. I hope I haven't overlooked anything. Oh yes, I'd like the name of every woman you've ever dated, asked out, or worked with. I have no interest in associating with anyone that has misspoken or acted in a callous manner with someone of the opposite gender. I have to tell you, these new standards in society are a little tough to manage, but I'm learning.

Oh, and in the age of football players running afoul of every NCAA rule ever written, running afoul of whatever law is in their way at the moment, skipping classes because they can, taking money under the table, we have huge concerns for the football player who had the audacity to recommend/speak in praise of a book.

Pitchforks are out over a draft pick who states he got a tattoo because as a youth he believed it represented something positive and will have it covered. He can't be trusted to be telling the truth, let's tar and feather him - because damnit we know what he really means, and this story is bullshit. He's had it for years and therefore he agrees with everything WE attribute that symbol to mean. Meanwhile @Marciano490 says he had a tattoo for years until enough people asked him about it, and then he covered it. Maybe this kid hasn't had anyone close to him ask him about the tattoo? Nobody "woke" him up? But let's ruin the kids life, release him from the team, end his professional aspirations because we don't want to associate with such a vile human. Meanwhile, nary a word in any other thread about running out of town the athlete who was actually found to be driving under the influence - you know an actual crime.

That's where we are, huh? Guilty of a crime that we don't care about, no worries dude - get ready for camp. Guilty of heresy for possibly, that is possibly thinking in a way that we don't approve - "get thee away from me satan!" Oh wait, if he was/is religious then that is proof that he's a hater. We may as well have him drawn and quartered. Oy.

Note: There is one line in the other thread listing the driving under the influence as an entry in the 'con' column.
 

brace

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Jun 29, 2011
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I've been lurking here for 9 years, but haven't seen a need to comment, until now. By comparison, my experience is different, but yet somewhat similar - I went to college on an ROTC scholarship, which was great - College was paid for and I had a guaranteed job coming out the other side. My first sense that things were getting real was when I was notified I'd need a Top Secret clearance, and the associated background investigation. I lived a relatively benign college life in small town Vermont, but I ended up answering for things I never anticipated. Decisions I made at 18 were suddenly making a difference at 22. That was 1990, and I was an emotional wreck through 6 months of interviews and investigations. Frankly, I never considered my actions until it was investigated. Ultimately I "passed" the investigation and spent 20 years in the Army, ultimately getting approved for extremely high level of clearance - But I can't imagine what a background investigation would dig up if I was going through the same process now. Maybe he represents the worst of the worst - I've dealt with a few. Or maybe he made a terrible decision and didn't realize it till now. I recommend everyone taking a breath. The facts will speak for themselves soon enough.....
 
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PC Drunken Friar

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Wow, just wow. Would you send me your list of questions so that I might filter my own friends and acquaintances? While you are at it, would you send me your CV, social media account information, and enough personal information so that I might contact your friends and acquaintances from high school til present in order to ascertain your suitableness to associate with? Just can't be too careful these days. I certainly hope you've never used a slur at any time, or recommended a book with a point or theory I might not agree with, or posted about a song or a band that might have a wrong word in it. I hope that you've never used the "OK" symbol in a photo, because we all know what that means. I hope I haven't overlooked anything. Oh yes, I'd like the name of every woman you've ever dated, asked out, or worked with. I have no interest in associating with anyone that has misspoken or acted in a callous manner with someone of the opposite gender. I have to tell you, these new standards in society are a little tough to manage, but I'm learning.

Oh, and in the age of football players running afoul of every NCAA rule ever written, running afoul of whatever law is in their way at the moment, skipping classes because they can, taking money under the table, we have huge concerns for the football player who had the audacity to recommend/speak in praise of a book.

Pitchforks are out over a draft pick who states he got a tattoo because as a youth he believed it represented something positive and will have it covered. He can't be trusted to be telling the truth, let's tar and feather him - because damnit we know what he really means, and this story is bullshit. He's had it for years and therefore he agrees with everything WE attribute that symbol to mean. Meanwhile @Marciano490 says he had a tattoo for years until enough people asked him about it, and then he covered it. Maybe this kid hasn't had anyone close to him ask him about the tattoo? Nobody "woke" him up? But let's ruin the kids life, release him from the team, end his professional aspirations because we don't want to associate with such a vile human. Meanwhile, nary a word in any other thread about running out of town the athlete who was actually found to be driving under the influence - you know an actual crime.

That's where we are, huh? Guilty of a crime that we don't care about, no worries dude - get ready for camp. Guilty of heresy for possibly, that is possibly thinking in a way that we don't approve - "get thee away from me satan!" Oh wait, if he was/is religious then that is proof that he's a hater. We may as well have him drawn and quartered. Oy.

Note: There is one line in the other thread listing the driving under the influence as an entry in the 'con' column.
Dude...relax...it's about being a fucking football fan of a particular team that I root for because 120 years ago 2 people decided to immigrate to Massachusetts. He isn't guilty of a crime. I never said that and you never read that from me. Jumping to the other extreme is what "they" do. Don't be them.

Again, try reading my posts with comprehension. This is strictly a personal choice. My line. Not yours. I don't give a fuck if you continue to root for the team. I won't even judge my father or wife I'd they don't share this view. I am a role model for literally hundreds of teenagers and thousands more to come. In this climate, in this day and age, that tattoo needs to be explained from the owners. And by the looks of things, this guy wholly believes in a different set of values than I do. One that I believe is harmful to our humanity and shouldn't be supported. If you feel differently (and I have no reason to suspect or judge anyone that supports the Patriots as akin to supporting bigotry and I will not do so) then that is your choice. I am sorry my opinion has made you so angry.
 

RetractableRoof

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I've been lurking here for 9 years, but haven't seen a need to comment, until now. By comparison, my experience is different, by yet somewhat similar - I went to college on an ROTC scholarship, which was great - College was paid for and I had a guaranteed job coming out the other side. My first sense that things were real was when I was notified I'd need a Top Secret clearance, and the associated background investigation. I lived a relatively benign college life, but I ended up answering for things I never anticipated. Decisions I made at 18 were suddenly making a difference at 22. That was 1990, and I was an emotional wreck through 6 months of interviews and investigations. Frankly, I never considered my actions until it was investigated. Ultimately I "passed" the investigation and spent 20 years in the Army, ultimately getting approved for extremely high level of clearance - But I can't imagine what a background investigation would dig up if I was going through the same process now. Maybe he represents the worst of the worst - I've dealt with a few. Or maybe he made a terrible decision and didn't realize it till now. I recommend everyone taking a breath. The facts will speak for themselves soon enough.....
My best friend in college had a similar experience. Took a position with a defense contractor that required a clearance of significant level (I don't recall which level). He filled out all the forms and as you stated, sweated every minute. He was the original squeaky clean, I've never met someone as clean as him in my life. About a month later he got a call from an uncle who worked in DC wanting to know what he did that the FBI had visited his office to ask about him. He cleared the background check, and off he went. The uncle? A congressional politician in DC, who'd never been listed on any of his security clearance paperwork.

I'd never want to be under that kind of scrutiny... never mind at that age when I was significantly more clueless than now.
 

RetractableRoof

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Dude...relax...it's about being a fucking football fan of a particular team that I root for because 120 years ago 2 people decided to immigrate to Massachusetts. He isn't guilty of a crime. I never said that and you never read that from me. Jumping to the other extreme is what "they" do. Don't be them.

Again, try reading my posts with comprehension. This is strictly a personal choice. My line. Not yours. I don't give a fuck if you continue to root for the team. I won't even judge my father or wife I'd they don't share this view. I am a role model for literally hundreds of teenagers and thousands more to come. In this climate, in this day and age, that tattoo needs to be explained from the owners. And by the looks of things, this guy wholly believes in a different set of values than I do. One that I believe is harmful to our humanity and shouldn't be supported. If you feel differently (and I have no reason to suspect or judge anyone that supports the Patriots as akin to supporting bigotry and I will not do so) then that is your choice. I am sorry my opinion has made you so angry.
It's not just a football game. It's the same judgmental outrage/hypocrisy bs that pervades every element of our society. Don't like someone's opinion on the radio? Don't bother to turn the channel, get him fired if at all possible. Don't like someone's opinion, label him/her a hater and destroy them - even if he's a wet behind the ears kid. I agree there has been no crime here by him, and if you had read MY post with any reading comprehension you'd see that I didn't assert you had accused him of one.

You are a role model for literally hundreds of teenagers and thousands more to come? My personal hope is they don't learn to model judgmental behavior and intolerance of others points of view when they don't agree with oneself. It's kind of the opposite of what our country is founded on, ya know? Perhaps they'll intuitively understand that you are judging a kid not much older than themselves incredibly harshly, and that's something they don't want to emulate. I hope they do model the strength of conviction and passion about subjects they believe in though, so there's that.
 

BroodsSexton

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Isn’t the point less about when he got it than the fact he kept it despite people likely pointing it out to me.

Like when I was 15-16 I got an ohm tattoo because I thought it looked cool despite not really understanding it. But over the next few years enough people quizzed me on it that I got it covered.
What did I miss about the Ohm tattoo?
 

Marciano490

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What did I miss about the Ohm tattoo?
Some people thought it was a bit cultural appropriate-y. And also it started showing up on a bunch of yoga stuff and it didn’t really fit with that thing I was doing at the time.

My point, though, is that if you have a tattoo on your arm you’re going to be discussing it a shit ton in your life, and if it’s associated with racism and terrorism, you’ll hear about it. After that, you own the decision to keep it.
 

nighthob

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In this political climate, he doesn't get the benefit of the doubt that he has had "innocent association" with a hate group. He can ply his trade if he can find a buyer. I'm just very disappointed that the buyer is now something that i am associated with.
You understand that you just literally told everyone that you long for the innocence of the fucking gulag, right? You Americans are stark, fucking, raving bonkers and you all need to stop acting like a bunch of spoiled six year olds.

Do you think the outrage will burn out or fade away?
Everybody knows this is nowhere.
 

jaytftwofive

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Jan 20, 2013
571
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I read on the CBS TV site in Baltimore that he has rejected this group and he put the tattoo on when he was a teenager. He thought it was more pro gun not a white supremacist thing. Not defending him, just reporting what I read. Correction: He thought it was pro-military because his father was in the military.
 
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RetractableRoof

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SoSH truly is the smartest message board I've ever come across. :)
I've come to agree with that statement, but shockingly (sorry!) there seems to be at least high-expert knowledge on most every topic or subject. It's refreshing to know that no matter what comes up, there will be someone with something credible to add or if necessary to correct.

Oh, and before I let the implication slide, I'm not smart when it comes to electrical theory at all, if I'm being honest I was more than tired of the subject by the time I got through with the circuitry classes, VLSI design, etc. I practically ran to the software side.
 

queenb

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Jan 6, 2016
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1. The worst case scenario is that he's a white supremacist only pretending to disavow white supremacy so he can play in the NFL. But the most anyone can ask of him is to pretend. If he keeps this dirty secret to himself for a 15-year career in the NFL during which he conducts himself professionally and non-racistly enough not to jeopardize his employent with the Patriots, that is not a win for white supremacy. Say on the day he retires he says: "I was just pretending to get along with all my non-white teammates." Were the Patriots duped? Or did they give a white supremacist stakes in conformity that bought our society 15 years of productive employment instead of involvement in domestic terror? (Imagine if we as a society could provide white supremacists jobs in multiethnic workplaces for their entire lives so they had to take their secret racism to the grave.) This is the theory of change behind CVE programs in other countries: we generally don't encourage other governments to view violent and/or political extremists within their borders as irredeemable. We say that they need economic opportunities and meaning and purpose in their lives as part of a larger national or social project (which violent extremist organizations temporarily provide).

2. We extend our sympathies to players who got caught up in gang activity as teenagers. And we expect them to stop when they become public figures and sign their contracts for this very reason. We tell them that the prosperity and security you were denied - and that gangs promise you - is finally yours. This kid's (former) sympathies or associations may not resonate with many of us here, but his arc is the same. He may have lacked purpose, structure, proper moral direction, or some combination of the three, and latched onto an organization like the 3 Percenters that provided him with those things in his youth, but we can all agree that an NFL job and the millions that come with it offer all the purpose and structure a person could reasonably expect, and in return he just has to put his old associations and activities aside.

3. If a racist kicker is bad because he makes his non-white teammates feel uncomfortable or unsafe, an NFL locker room is maybe the place of employment where he does the least harm to his co-workers. What if the gas station he ends up at has non-white employees? Will anyone agitate that he be fired from there so they can feel safe? And if that succeeds and every company in the United States denies him employment for totally legitimate PR reasons and he ends up homeless, will he accept that he's too racist to deserve shelter and go quietly into the night, maybe penning a thoughtful letter to his old militia buddies that they should all rethink their position, or might he join the militia for real because they'll feed and clothe him and tell him he doesn't deserve to die broke because he got a stupid tattoo when he was 17?

4. This is all to say that "people with racist associations and/or pasts, may not deserve to die hungry, but I can't name an acceptable way for them to make a living" isn't a coherent moral position and I don't think effectively combats racism. I would even posit that the NFL and the constraints that being a public figure place on each player are more likely to rehabilitate a racist than a racist is to make the NFL or the country more racist by playing.
 

mauf

Anderson Cooper × Mr. Rogers
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"Drawing the line" at a no-name kicker who might not make it out of camp while giving a pass to the higher profile, ring-delivering players with questionable politics and behavior is a pretty bad look.
Oh bullshit.

First of all, being a Republican is a lot different than having the name of what might or might not be a hate group tattooed on your body.

Second, every thinking person who watches pro sports understands that we cheer for people we wouldn’t choose to have as friends. Each of us rationalizes that in different ways. It’s a little harder to rationalize when the player in question is fungible. For example, if Ben Roethlisberger was a kicker, that incident in Georgia would have ended his NFL career.
 

mauf

Anderson Cooper × Mr. Rogers
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Here's why I'm willing to believe this kid.

He's not wrong in that Threepers were originally closely associated with the military/military support. Threepers were mostly dudes who had separated from the military, had conservative values, and took their oaths seriously.

Don't believe me? Here's their mission statement from 2013.


There's no denying that they've gone hard right in the last 5 years or so. And maybe that streak was always there but recent things have made it more acceptable to openly flaunt it. But initially, at least, that was not the messaging they were putting out. And it's not hard to see a young kid with family in the military getting wrapped up with the Threeper symbolism before become more aware of what they actually were.
Thank you. This is very informative.

I generally align with the Southern Poverty Law Center’s pronouncements on fringe groups — they are very thorough, and the distinctions they draw make sense to me. Here’s what they say about Three Percenters and other “antigovernment movements”; they echo your point about white nationalism being more prominent in these groups now than it was several years ago. Notably, SPLC distinguishes between these groups and “hate groups.”

 

Shaky Walton

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Nov 20, 2019
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This guy appears to be a very good kicker and offered a reasonable and sincere explanation for something he did when he was 17. We also know that dealing with unwanted tattoos is not simple. Here's another vote for getting off the soap boxes, giving him a chance and focusing on sports.

He's going to have to function in a diverse locker room in Foxboro. If he's a racist and is unable to hide it, I'm guessing it will be dealt with.
 

Rough Carrigan

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This guy appears to be a very good kicker and offered a reasonable and sincere explanation for something he did when he was 17. We also know that dealing with unwanted tattoos is not simple. Here's another vote for getting off the soap boxes, giving him a chance and focusing on sports.

He's going to have to function in a diverse locker room in Foxboro. If he's a racist and is unable to hide it, I'm guessing it will be dealt with.
He was already, no doubt, in a diverse locker room at Marshall. The idea that the Patriots, who look very seriously into issues of team ethic, would have no idea if he couldn't get along with large blocks of his teammates is ridiculous.
 

Jim Ed Rice in HOF

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View: https://twitter.com/mikegiardi/status/1254141927861207040?s=21


Asked about his "Three Percenters" tattoo, new #Patriots draftee/K Justin Rohrwasser said he got that tattoo as a teen & thought it was a military support symbol. "Turned into something I would never want to represent. Should have done way more research on it." Will cover it.
Not sure anyone cares, but seems like this dude is lying about getting the tat in high school:
View: https://twitter.com/twoeightnine/status/1254192371543224327?s=19

[Tweet is images of Rohrwasser in college in 2015 without the 3%er tattoo]
One of these people got the quote wrong. I have no idea which one, teen doesn’t mean HS so it would be nice to know.
 

bsj

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This seems like the best evidence thus far - so until I see something different, I’m going with the guy that actually knows the guy versus pure speculation
to be clear...he may have lied about getting the tattoo in high school AND have treated his teammates well. The two aren’t mutually exclusive
 

Gash Prex

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Apr 18, 2002
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One of these people got the quote wrong. I have no idea which one, teen doesn’t mean HS so it would be nice to know.
Unless the media is lying, the twitter guy ranting and raving about billionaires got it wrong


"I got that tattoo when I was a teenager and I have a lot of family in the military. I thought it stood for a military-support symbol at the time," Rohrwasser said during an introductory conference call with reporters. "Obviously, it's evolved into something that I do not want to represent. When I look back on it, I should have done way more research before I put any mark or symbol like that on my body, and it's not something I ever want to represent. It will be covered."
A review of Rohrwasser's Instagram page shows that the tattoo has been on the kicker's arm since late 2015, and since he's 23 now, he was at most 19 years old when that photo was posted -- thus corroborating his claim of getting the ink as a teenager. The ex-Marshall player also has tattoos featuring American iconography including an American flag, and the phrases "Liberty or Death" and "Don't tread on me."
Also, the media actually reviewed his instagram and confirmed his timeframe. Maybe we can let book recommendations and random twitter accusations go for now.
 
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Kliq

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I guess that Resist account is implying that he did the tattoo himself.
 

P'tucket rhymes with...

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Oh bullshit.

First of all, being a Republican is a lot different than having the name of what might or might not be a hate group tattooed on your body.

Second, every thinking person who watches pro sports understands that we cheer for people we wouldn’t choose to have as friends. Each of us rationalizes that in different ways. It’s a little harder to rationalize when the player in question is fungible. For example, if Ben Roethlisberger was a kicker, that incident in Georgia would have ended his NFL career.
Thanks for further illustrating my point. If you're line-drawing principles for following a team or a sport are dependent on the player's performance, they really aren't principles. The faux-outrage is all yours; you're just haggling about the price.