That was then: Celebrating what was

lexrageorge

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Side note -- I'm still annoyed at Belichick for running the ball on the third-and-long just before the Rams' last touchdown. The difference between 2 minutes and 2 1/2 minutes for the Greatest Show on Turf was meaningless. Convert the first down and the Pats could have taken a knee and walked out as 17-10 victors.
You have a good memory....

I'll argue that the play call was justifiable, in that the Rams needed a TD to tie, and had already exhausted all their timeouts. Part of the problem was that Ken Walter shanked the punt and made the job substantially easier for the Rams. And until the final drive, the offensive game plan had been fairly conservative.
 

AB in DC

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It's actually worse than I remembered -- according to the play-by-play, that third-down play was snapped at 2:15. So all they saved was a few seconds -- even an incomplete pass followed by a punt probably takes the clock down to the two-minute warning.
 

DennyDoyle'sBoil

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I bet it looks sharp inperson based on the quality of the suit. He is big dude and it suits him.

Edit. Better question: Why did he have to hand it off to Strahan?
I guess that's how they do it now. Last year, Terrell Davis started off, and then handed to Namath and Swann. I guess maybe they are going to have a hall of famer for the winning team start it off and then hand off to another hall of famer to bring up to the podium?
 

mwonow

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Peter King represents:

"This win left no doubt: Brady would be considered the best quarterback of all time, Belichick the best coach, and the Patriots perhaps the NFL’s greatest dynasty."

Except for an extraneous "perhaps," he's spot on!
 

mwonow

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Gotta love the Onion. And if they had their sixth already, we'd have missed a parade! WON'T SOMEONE THINK OF THE DUCKBOAT DRIVERS!
 

InstaFace

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In many ways, I still haven't processed the win two years ago vs Seattle, I continue to watch replays of the game, shows about the game and that season and still can't believe Malcolm made that interception and they won the game.

This; I can't even begin to comprehend the magnitude of this.

Can't speak for anyone else, but for me, the demons from the 2006 AFCCG, the game that shall not be mentioned and the 2012 Super Bowl all died tonight, dead and buried, gone forever.
Frankly, the 2006 AFCCG and the 2011 SB are water under the bridge for me too - both were winnable games but against teams that were our peers in quality, and you don't win all of those. SB49 helped enormously with both.

But I will never get over the third game you mention, until and unless they get another chance to do what they almost did and succeed. Brady threw a perfect pass that traveled 70 fucking yards in the air and Moss touched it with both hands. Until that moment, there was nothing that the two of them could not do, no physical act of athletics that was beyond them. And then, like that, the spell was broken. I didn't personally cry that night the way I did after the 2003 ALCS, but I was damned close to it.

Perhaps instead, the glory of SB51 was how much of an all-team effort, 1 through 46, it truly was. Some stars made some plays (Hightower, Edelman), but every member of that team was dialed in and on the same page. The pass blocking. The pass rush. The limiting of YAC by the secondary. Ghost putting kickoffs into a thimble. Brady won the MVP and James White was the chief sword which cut the Falcons' collective throat, but there was no hero ball being played.

We haven't seen video yet of Harmon's halftime speech, but I imagine it was less imploring them to lift their heads up and consider the faint notion of hope, and more of a "look, we're totally prepared for this, just have to execute" and ~50 other heads nodding calmly. Nodding because he's saying something obvious and non-controversial, they know that every one of them can win their individual matchups and not have to rely on superstar plays. If we're Celebrating What Is, that self-belief and mutual team-belief is perhaps the most magical creation of Belichick-land.
 

54thMA

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Frankly, the 2006 AFCCG and the 2011 SB are water under the bridge for me too - both were winnable games but against teams that were our peers in quality, and you don't win all of those. SB49 helped enormously with both.

But I will never get over the third game you mention, until and unless they get another chance to do what they almost did and succeed. Brady threw a perfect pass that traveled 70 fucking yards in the air and Moss touched it with both hands. Until that moment, there was nothing that the two of them could not do, no physical act of athletics that was beyond them. And then, like that, the spell was broken. I didn't personally cry that night the way I did after the 2003 ALCS, but I was damned close to it.

Perhaps instead, the glory of SB51 was how much of an all-team effort, 1 through 46, it truly was. Some stars made some plays (Hightower, Edelman), but every member of that team was dialed in and on the same page. The pass blocking. The pass rush. The limiting of YAC by the secondary. Ghost putting kickoffs into a thimble. Brady won the MVP and James White was the chief sword which cut the Falcons' collective throat, but there was no hero ball being played.

We haven't seen video yet of Harmon's halftime speech, but I imagine it was less imploring them to lift their heads up and consider the faint notion of hope, and more of a "look, we're totally prepared for this, just have to execute" and ~50 other heads nodding calmly. Nodding because he's saying something obvious and non-controversial, they know that every one of them can win their individual matchups and not have to rely on superstar plays. If we're Celebrating What Is, that self-belief and mutual team-belief is perhaps the most magical creation of Belichick-land.
Great post.

One thing you mentioned that few have touched on is how they limited YAC, specifically on Jones; he had zero YAC on his four receptions. Granted, three were along the sideline, he had the one crossing route over the middle (that catch was spectacular as well, still not sure how he held on to that) where he was tackled right away.

His fourth catch was just incredible.

The other thing about the game is how the Patriots defense took away the running game on Atlanta in the second half, they sealed the edges very well.
 

DennyDoyle'sBoil

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I think the Pats winning 49 changed how I feel about everything.

Consider the situation if the Patriots lose that game. It would have been a decade since the team's last championship. They would have been 11-9 in the playoffs since winning the Championship. Quite respectable, but a very far cry from having won 10 in a row earlier in the 2000s. And along the way, there were some crushing defeats. The underdog Ravens dominating in Gillette. Losing a perfect season in a difficult way. The Colts coming back from 21-3 in the Championship game. Getting punched in the mouth by Rex Ryan's Jets after beating them twice in the regular year. Two defeats to the Broncos that while maybe not dominating were pretty sound defeats.

And they would have lost three Super Bowls in a row. In the interim, the Giants, Steelers and the Seahawks would each have won two since the Patriots had won their last. And maybe worse of all, we would be mired in the muck of deflategate for a year with all that out there. Now, the Patriots were still a great team in those ten years. I'm highlighting the downside obviously, but I think I would have felt all of that at least on some level.

But one yard changed everything. Everything. The narrative of legacies turned maybe not 180 degrees but damned close. This year was icing on the cake. Or maybe the cherry on the sundae is better. I will never be happy in any year in which the Patriots don't win their last game of the year in the playoffs, but I view the entire thing as one piece. It's hard to explain, maybe. But it's similar to the way I now look at 2003 for the Red Sox. It's part of the narrative that ends up incredibly. And that's how I feel now about all of it for the Patriots. It doesn't change how I felt about the Scottish Game or the Manningham Game, but it does change how I feel about all of it now. It's now just one incredible ride, each stop in the way culminating in something that as a whole is fantastic.
 

dcmissle

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Going 0 for the plan until the 4th quarter and winning anyway is a mark of greatness:

Sometimes things don’t go according to plan.

That was certainly the case for the Patriots in Super Bowl LI, when the coaching staff made “Start fast” the top priority in a presentation to the players — only to have them fall behind 28-3. After the game, USA Today took a picture inside the Patriots’ locker room that showed a white board that still had the team’s defensive priorities listed on it, and “Start fast” was No. 1.

The rest of the priorities listed on the white board were more or less what you’d expect: Stop The Run, Go After #2 (meaning Matt Ryan) and Eliminate #11 (meaning Julio Jones) & No Big Plays were the next priorities on the list.

Also found in the Patriots’ locker room after the game: Five empty bottles of champagne, a few empty cans of Bud Light, an empty bottle of whiskey and two half-full syringes sitting next to empty bottles of the painkillers Lidocaine and Marcaine.
I can't recall a game of the same magnitude in which a team appeared so dead in the water then managed to right itself. Usually, this kind of start leads to a downward spiral and fatal crash.
 

Mr Mulliner

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Five empty bottles of champagne, a few empty cans of Bud Light, an empty bottle of whiskey and two half-full syringes sitting next to empty bottles of the painkillers Lidocaine and Marcaine.
Sounds like my prom night.
 

jsinger121

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As the Patriots go for another 3 out of 4 next year it's fun to take a look back at some things.

Each of the Pats 5 Super Bowl wins have gone through either Pittsburgh (3 times) or Indianapolis (2 times) in the AFC Championship game.

As we look to win another 3 in 4 years the first one went through a previous NFC west Champion/Super Bowl Champion (Rams and Seahawks), the second one against an upstart NFC South team that wasn't great the year before (Panthers and Falcons) while the third was against an NFC East team that finally broke through in the NFC (Eagles.....Will the Cowboys be that team next year to finally break through?)
 

tims4wins

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Also the first title each time was in a building they had lost a SB before - New Orleans and Arizona. The second title was in Houston both times. The third title was/will be in a random location for a Super Bowl - Jacksonville and Minnesota.
 

pappymojo

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I guess that's how they do it now. Last year, Terrell Davis started off, and then handed to Namath and Swann. I guess maybe they are going to have a hall of famer for the winning team start it off and then hand off to another hall of famer to bring up to the podium?
But neither of those guys won a super bowl against the Broncos or the Panthers.
 

loshjott

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As the Patriots go for another 3 out of 4 next year it's fun to take a look back at some things.

Each of the Pats 5 Super Bowl wins have gone through either Pittsburgh (3 times) or Indianapolis (2 times) in the AFC Championship game.

As we look to win another 3 in 4 years the first one went through a previous NFC west Champion/Super Bowl Champion (Rams and Seahawks), the second one against an upstart NFC South team that wasn't great the year before (Panthers and Falcons) while the third was against an NFC East team that finally broke through in the NFC (Eagles.....Will the Cowboys be that team next year to finally break through?)
On that note, the Pats have played half the NFC teams in their nine SBs. Should they make it again against a ninth team, who's most likely?

1. Dallas
2. Minnesota
3. Detroit
4. Arizona
5. Tampa
6. NO
7. Wash
8. SF
 

Reardon's Beard

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On that note, the Pats have played half the NFC teams in their nine SBs. Should they make it again against a ninth team, who's most likely?

1. Dallas
2. Minnesota
3. Detroit
4. Arizona
5. Tampa
6. NO
7. Wash
8. SF
I would think Dallas and NO toward the top of the list.
 

The Needler

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I would think Dallas and NO toward the top of the list.
The Saints? You could probably get 50/50 that the Saints make the playoffs before the Patriots win another SB. They've gone 7-9 three of the last four years, their QB isn't getting any younger, and of the teams above, only SF has longer SB odds according to the bookies.
 

jsinger121

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On that note, the Pats have played half the NFC teams in their nine SBs. Should they make it again against a ninth team, who's most likely?

1. Dallas
2. Minnesota
3. Detroit
4. Arizona
5. Tampa
6. NO
7. Wash
8. SF
Dallas. I think they are real close to breaking through especially if they load up on defense.
 

Reardon's Beard

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The Saints? You could probably get 50/50 that the Saints make the playoffs before the Patriots win another SB. They've gone 7-9 three of the last four years, their QB isn't getting any younger, and of the teams above, only SF has longer SB odds according to the bookies.
Yah. I'm out to lunch on NO I guess - didn't realize they had fallen off that much...but struck me as a team with some components that could be a faster turnaround than others.

Dallas remains though. Not sure anyone is closer.
 

joe dokes

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Going 0 for the plan until the 4th quarter and winning anyway is a mark of greatness:



I can't recall a game of the same magnitude in which a team appeared so dead in the water then managed to right itself. Usually, this kind of start leads to a downward spiral and fatal crash.
But it was an odd kind of dead in the water, considering the number of plays they ran, yards gained and TOP in the 1st half. More like very alive in the water, but really far from land.
 

Euclis20

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And that list doesn't even include anyone in the AFC East or arguably the Pats 3 biggest rivals over the last 15 years (Broncos/Colts/Steelers). That's 6 more teams with good reason to hate the Pats, adding up to nearly half the league.
 

BigSoxFan

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And that list doesn't even include anyone in the AFC East or arguably the Pats 3 biggest rivals over the last 15 years (Broncos/Colts/Steelers). That's 6 more teams with good reason to hate the Pats, adding up to nearly half the league.
Yeah, may not have been a SB but 2001/2004 AFCCG have to rate very high on the Steelers' list.
 

loshjott

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Per Reiss, a stat that amazes me: "since 2015, all 31 of the NFL's other teams have made at least one coordinator change." Conversely, Patricia and McDaniels have been in their roles since 2012.
The fact that teams always have to wait 2-5 weeks after the reg season to hire them is a factor. Plus you can't discount the lack of success of the BB coaching tree also. Great for us fans, maybe not so much for the coordinators.
 

speedracer

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54thMA

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And that list doesn't even include anyone in the AFC East or arguably the Pats 3 biggest rivals over the last 15 years (Broncos/Colts/Steelers). That's 6 more teams with good reason to hate the Pats, adding up to nearly half the league.
The Steelers should be on that list for one or both of the AFCCG losses, although their loss in the Super Bowl to Dallas is probably worse for them.

I also thought the Colts should be on that list for the 2004 AFCCG or the 2005 Divisional round game where they were held to a measly three points, but who can forget the Super Bowl loss to the Saints and if you want to lump Baltimore in there prior to their move to Indianapolis, the Jets Super Bowl loss is probably the biggest upset in Super Bowl history, with the game that shall not be mentioned being a close second.

All of that said, that article makes a lot of sense as to the main reason why they are so hated.
 

snowmanny

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I remembered the 1972 Conference Championship game to (undefeated) Miami as a horrible Steeler loss. This was of course, pre-titles for Pittsburgh and was the week after the Immaculate Reception game. I just read the Globe article to refresh my memory. The Dolphins converted several fourth downs including a fake punt. Bradshaw got hurt, probably concussed since after the game Noll talked about resting him for a "pinched nerve" because he was "having trouble remembering plays" but he came back in in the fourth quarter and led Pittsburgh to a touchdown to make it 21-17. Bradshaw then threw two late interceptions and the game ended with that score. This was one of those weird old NFL games that was played at Pittsburgh even though (duh) Miami had a better record

I have to say that I had zero recollection that the Dolphins had to come from behind in the fourth quarter against Cleveland the week before.
 

InstaFace

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...if you want to lump Baltimore in there prior to their move to Indianapolis, the Jets Super Bowl loss is probably the biggest upset in Super Bowl history, with the game that shall not be mentioned being a close second.
Speaking of not mentioning it, could someone Roethlisberger me for a sec and explain why we're now calling it The Scottish Game? I have this vague sense that it's a Macbeth reference (because of SimplyEric's post earlier in this thread) but even if so, the connection just isn't clicking.
 
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snowmanny

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So looking at the "All-Decade Teams" as voted on by the NFL HOF committee is a fun time-waster and also gives a heads up on who will be getting into the HOF, since first-teamers have a high induction rate. The years go from 0-9 (e.g. 2000-2009). The quarterbacks are as follows:

1960's: Jurgenson-Starr-Unitas
1970's: 1. Staubach 2. Bradshaw/Stabler
1980's: 1. Montana 2. Fouts
1990's: 1. Elway 2. Favre
2000's 1. Brady 2. PManning

The crazy thing is we are (edit) SEVEN years in and at this point it's probably Rodgers chasing Brady for #1 of the 2010s. And losing ground.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Football_League_2000s_All-Decade_Team
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Football_League_1990s_All-Decade_Team
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Football_League_1980s_All-Decade_Team
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Football_League_1970s_All-Decade_Team
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Football_League_1960s_All-Decade_Team
 

DJnVa

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Fouts ahead of Marino? I love Fouts but no.
Yeah, that's nuts. It was a different time, but Fouts numbers aren't off the charts great. In the 80s he had a QB rating of 84.4, and a 172/141 TD/INT ratio and after 1981 never won more than 7 games in a season. He was 53-45 in the 80s. He did lead the NFL yards/game 5 times, and TDs twice.

Marino was 89.3, with a 220/125 ratio, with a 62-39 record and led in passing yards 3 times, TDs 3 times, and QB rating once.

Hell, Montana barely beat out Fouts, 24.5-22
WTF? Montana: 94.0 rating, 215/107 TD/INT, 86-37 W/L record.
 
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snowmanny

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At the time I probably would have voted Marino #1.
Edit: I was traumatized by a few games.
 

Saints Rest

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Speaking of not mentioning it, could someone Roethlisberger me for a sec and explain why we're now calling it The Scottish Game? I have this vague sense that it's a Macbeth reference (because of SimplyEric's post earlier in this thread) but even if so, the connection just isn't clicking.
In the theater, there is a superstition that you never say the word Macbeth inside a theater as its bad luck. So instead people simply call it "The Scottish Play."
 

Saints Rest

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The fact that teams always have to wait 2-5 weeks after the reg season to hire them is a factor. Plus you can't discount the lack of success of the BB coaching tree also. Great for us fans, maybe not so much for the coordinators.
That may or may not be true; but regardless of why it happens, it's still a net positive for the Pats. Continuity is good.
 

tims4wins

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That may or may not be true; but regardless of why it happens, it's still a net positive for the Pats. Continuity is good.
Correct. Dan Quinn got hired 2 years ago. Shanahan was hired this year. And yet the Pats coordinators remain in place.

Next year is going down like 2004, with a group hug between BB, Matty P, and Josh McD after a 3rd title in 4 years, with MP and JMcD having jobs secured elsewhere.
 

Al Zarilla

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"... I was really concerned when we tried the onside kick, missed it, and then got the five-yard penalty on top of it—‘Ah geez, we’re pressing, we’re pressing.’ [Bill] Belichick knows what he’s doing, and the defense was magnificent. It just looked like Atlanta got real tight.”

-- TB12, Sr

http://mmqb.si.com/mmqb/2017/02/06/super-bowl-51-tom-brady-father-mother
The woman reporter Jenny Vrentas made a lot more sense there than Peter King. He asked her why the Falcons ran out of gas and the Pats didn't. He then completely ignored her answer. By the way, Phil Simms mentioned on inside the NFL that the Pats were conditioning hard in Houston, running a LOT; she said they were running up hills in Foxboro late in the year, same kind of thing. Pats didn't hire Jerry Rice, did they? He was supposed to be a fiend at conditioning.
 

Papelbon's Poutine

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The hills have been mentioned a few times by various people and it was noted during the week that they were in pads at practice on Wednesday, which isn't normal for most teams. Considering they ran twice as many plays on offense and they looked fine in comparison, I think it was easily a factor in the outcome. BB was one of the biggest opponents to when they changed practice rules. Conditioning is high on his list.
 

CantKeepmedown

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They discussed that on Inside the NFL as well. I can't remember if it was Irvin or Simms, but they talked about how hard the Patriots actually practice and it's really not the norm nowadays. One of them referenced it almost as being like the old days (they may have been poking Brandon Marshall a bit too, almost as if saying, "you want nothing to do with playing for the Pats, because they actually work). But I may have been reading way too much into that.