The OC Search

Reggie's Racquet

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A new offensive coordinator is a great idea. I know In Bill We Trust...but can we at least acknowledge that the Patricia/Judge experiment was very costly? Probably cost us a playoff berth and more importantly a year of positive development for Mac Jones.
 

SoxinSeattle

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This is exciting and scary. Can they get someone that will get MJ10 to a place where they can be consistently competitive? It might not be possible but the right guy can make all the difference. Do they go with someone they know a la O'Shea or O'Brien or someone fresh and new? Kingbury and Hackett should be getting interviews around the league.
 

BaseballJones

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To me it’s not scary at all. Purely exciting. I’m looking forward to who this will be!
 

SoxinSeattle

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Graff @ The Athletic has this list of names that the Pats could consider: Bill O’Brien, Kliff Kingsbury, Frank Reich, Gary Kubiak, and Zac Robinson.
 

Cellar-Door

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Graff @ The Athletic has this list of names that the Pats could consider: Bill O’Brien, Kliff Kingsbury, Frank Reich, Gary Kubiak, and Zac Robinson.
Surprised Bevell isn't on the list, though maybe he's let people know he's not interested in OC jobs this cycle, just HC.
 

luckiestman

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Jets insiders seem to think Kubiak is not interested in being an OC at this time. Maybe an advisor role.

Reich is interviewing for HC jobs but if he doesn’t get one he may like his chances working for BB more than Saleh.
 

Justthetippett

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Graff @ The Athletic has this list of names that the Pats could consider: Bill O’Brien, Kliff Kingsbury, Frank Reich, Gary Kubiak, and Zac Robinson.
This is a solid but not terribly inspiring list. I really hope they cast a wide net. Will unlikely ever happen, but it would be pretty funny if LaFleur came here and was successful. Maybe combine him with an old head like Kubiak or Hackett as advisor for a year or two.
 

Kliq

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Graff @ The Athletic has this list of names that the Pats could consider: Bill O’Brien, Kliff Kingsbury, Frank Reich, Gary Kubiak, and Zac Robinson.
I don't know a ton about him, but the most intriguing name there to me is Zac Robinson. He's been on McVay's sideline for four seasons, former Pats draft pick back in 2010. Getting a younger, more modern passing mind in the room I think is really important for this Mac and therefore this team.

I can't stand Kingsbury and think he's an overblown hack.
 

Seels

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no to Kubiak, don't like the thought of O'Brien, and I thought Reich was a fraud way before Wentz proved that he was.

Probably overthinking it but it would be nice if they could hire an OC that was both competent but also someone that wasn't just going to get poached in a year if Mac suddenly has a 30 touchdown year.
 

NDame616

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Why are they beginning to interview OCs next week?

A lot of these names go quick. While a lot of this is weird, announcing to the world you aren't going to start interviewing until next week is extra weird.
 

CoffeeNerdness

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no to Kubiak, don't like the thought of O'Brien, and I thought Reich was a fraud way before Wentz proved that he was.

Probably overthinking it but it would be nice if they could hire an OC that was both competent but also someone that wasn't just going to get poached in a year if Mac suddenly has a 30 touchdown year.
I wouldn't mind watching Rhamondre go for 1500+ in the Kubiak system. One of my biggest issues with Patricia is he took a dominant run team and tried to turn them into something they weren't.

I wouldn't mind Reich either. Despite his failures as a HC, I think he's proven to be a clever play caller. Ultimately, I'd want someone younger.

The problem is you either get one of the veteran types listed above or you bring in a younger guy who will be in the poaching crosshairs.
 

Rook05

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You want to hire someone that is going to stick around for 3-5 years. Part of the reason BB tried Patricia.
This is an underrated point. It certainly seems like BB was going for continuity for Mac. I really wonder who’s idea was it to go away from the Ray Perkins. Was it where BB felt the best way to attack where the league was going? Was it easier to learn than the offensive compendium that is McD’s system? Was it better for their personnel? Patricia had a really interest opportunity….and just couldn’t do the job. What did he run with the Lions?

At the end of the day, though, always innovates or adapts. It’s what he’s best known for, from game plans to team building to scheme. The dude is the septuagenarian Neo. He got this one really wrong. I trust him to fix it.

I’m IBIT(“In Bill I Trust”).
 

Cellar-Door

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no to Kubiak, don't like the thought of O'Brien, and I thought Reich was a fraud way before Wentz proved that he was.

Probably overthinking it but it would be nice if they could hire an OC that was both competent but also someone that wasn't just going to get poached in a year if Mac suddenly has a 30 touchdown year.
Huh? He got multiple good years out of Wentz, far better than anyone else got out of him, he won a SB with Nick Foles and got him a good contract. Reich's offenses have generally been quite good.
 

DeJesus Built My Hotrod

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The fact is that BB is acknowledging a mistake and remedying it. That's all you can ask of someone at the top - they try something, it fails and they adjust. Our collective sports-viewing histories are littered with tales of woe over games lost and teams run aground because people at the top - especially those with a lot of power/tenure - wouldn't change.

That said, let's see how this all plays out. Given what we know of BB, the list of possible candidates almost has to include far more names than those that Graff cited.
 

Petagine in a Bottle

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Ideally, you’d love someone who is great at their job and sticks around multiple years, but is that realistic? If a new OC turns Mac around, that person is going to get interviewed for a HC gig, that seems inevitable. I don’t think it’s something to be overly worried about this time- if you only want someone who isn’t a threat to leave you are going to be stuck with recently fired guys like Patricia and Judge who need longer to rehabilitate their reputations.
 

SMU_Sox

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Graff @ The Athletic has this list of names that the Pats could consider: Bill O’Brien, Kliff Kingsbury, Frank Reich, Gary Kubiak, and Zac Robinson.
Those are all fantastic names minus I am not at all crazy about KK. @Brand Name isn’t crazy about BOB which worries me given Jess has a wonderful football mind. But those two candidates aside holy fucking shit yes please! Hell even BOB concerns aside I would take him over Matty P.
This is a solid but not terribly inspiring list. I really hope they cast a wide net. Will unlikely ever happen, but it would be pretty funny if LaFleur came here and was successful. Maybe combine him with an old head like Kubiak or Hackett as advisor for a year or two.
Not terribly inspiring? I am over the moon with these names especially Kubiak, Robinson, and Reich.

Edit: I read the article though. I thought it had more to it than they could consider them. It's just speculation. Ignore what I wrote.
 
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lars10

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Why are they beginning to interview OCs next week?

A lot of these names go quick. While a lot of this is weird, announcing to the world you aren't going to start interviewing until next week is extra weird.
When is the earliest they can interview coaches that are still in the playoffs?
 

mauf

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Reich would be terrific, and I don’t think he’s getting a another HC job anytime soon. But I think he’ll find another landing spot he likes better — whoever comes here won’t be stepping into a great situation, even taking the cap space into account.

Mike LaFleur was a hot commodity two years ago. I’m sure he hasn’t forgotten how to coach; it’s not his fault that Zach Wilson sucks. Wouldn’t mind LaFleur getting his second chance here.
 

NDame616

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When is the earliest they can interview coaches that are still in the playoffs?
That's true, but there are several enticing names who aren't in the playoffs, which makes me concerned why we haven't reached out to them
 

BaseballJones

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That's true, but there are several enticing names who aren't in the playoffs, which makes me concerned why we haven't reached out to them
We don't know they haven't. While this is the most transparent the organization has ever been under BB about these things, I'm quite sure there's lots they're still not telling us.
 

rodderick

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It hasn't been a week since their season ended, I don't think it's reasonable to expect them to have all their ducks in a row in regards to the next offensive coordinator. I don't want them to go into this with the mentality that anyone is better than Patricia and experience coaching that side of the ball is all that matters either. Figure out what kind of offense you want to run, determine how much that marries with the concepts already built into the "Patriots offense", find which of the available candidates' schemes better conforms to that and go from there. I'm slightly worried they might feel pressured in announcing a "big name" here to give fans assurance.
 

Dotrat

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It seems clear (and has since last summer, I think) that BB hired MP & JJ in part because he valued familiarity with his organizational groove over familiarity with Josh's offense--and given the leadership and talent drain the team endured, this is a defensible decision, even after having failed. He valued peopled he knew and believed that capable coaches should be able to move to different sides of the ball with some measure of success. He also may have thought that there wasn't anyone available (or willing) to come to NE to run either McDaniels's offense or a version of the Shanahan/McVay system that he and at least some member of the staff were so enamored with in the offseason.

But he seems to have realized that he left the team's offensive coaching ranks dangerously thin and that neither Patricia nor Judge is suited to run the offense. So in adding a new OC, does he hire someone who runs some variation of the Perkins-Erhardt system in order to maximize Mac Jones's comfort level and effective development, or does he risk bringing in someone like Reich or Kubiak who'll have Jones playing in his third system in as many NFL seasons? Does he also hire an experienced QB coach and put Judge back in charge of ST?

I'd like to see them interview Chad O'Shea, in addition to Reich (though the risk of his departure for a HC gig is really high if he were to succeed in NE), Robinson, Kubiak, O'Brien, and LaFleur. I'm a big 'No' on Kingsbury. But I'm even more excited to see how the process plays out--and what that says about the team's probable direction doing forward.
 

BigJimEd

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Charlie Weis Jr. He’s built a resume on his own at Ole Miss along with stops at the Falcons, South Florida, FAU, Alabama, etc.
Yes, Kiffin obviously thinks highly of Weis Jr. Pretty good resume. Interesting name that I haven't seen brought up yet.

Have to think O'Brien is the favorite at this point assuming he's interested.
 

tims4wins

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Thought my dad and I had while texting each other: do you think the Pats would shy away from hiring O'Brien given the Mayo news, since both of them are kind of after the same thing on similar timelines? If the Pats are successful the next couple years, and BB retires, it makes for a difficult situation in transitioning to the next HC.
 

rodderick

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Thought my dad and I had while texting each other: do you think the Pats would shy away from hiring O'Brien given the Mayo news, since both of them are kind of after the same thing on similar timelines? If the Pats are successful the next couple years, and BB retires, it makes for a difficult situation in transitioning to the next HC.
I would never in a million years pass over a guy I think is the best candidate for the job because it could potentially make the HC succession awkward.
 

tims4wins

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I would never in a million years pass over a guy I think is the best candidate for the job because it could potentially make the HC succession awkward.
Fair enough. Personally I think BOB is the best man for the job. I think he's the exact type of personality that would be best for Mac.

Edit: but would BOB pass on the job due to Mayo?
 

Shelterdog

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I would never in a million years pass over a guy I think is the best candidate for the job because it could potentially make the HC succession awkward.
Right. Plus BOB or any OC will have other opportunities if you really want to make Mayo the successor
 

Saints Rest

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I would love to see Bill O'Brien return with a Brian Hoyer taking off his pads and becoming QB coach. That combo would really minimize the negative effects of 3 different play-callers in Mac's ear, and provide some continuity while also brining in some new ideas and concepts.
 

tims4wins

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I would love to see Bill O'Brien return with a Brian Hoyer taking off his pads and becoming QB coach. That combo would really minimize the negative effects of 3 different play-callers in Mac's ear, and provide some continuity while also brining in some new ideas and concepts.
Love this idea from the perspective of succession planning. BOB stays for 2 years, then Hoyer could be ready to take over without the OC title for 1-2 years, then become OC.
 

Cellar-Door

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Thought my dad and I had while texting each other: do you think the Pats would shy away from hiring O'Brien given the Mayo news, since both of them are kind of after the same thing on similar timelines? If the Pats are successful the next couple years, and BB retires, it makes for a difficult situation in transitioning to the next HC.
No, you don't do succession planning in the NFL, too much can change. You hire the best guys you can for each job, and when Bill goes you interview a bunch of people inside the organization and out to figure out your next HC. Especially true after Bill leaves since he's also the defacto GM, and you likely are hiring two people, one of whom (the GM) should have a significant say in the other.
 

Harry Hooper

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The press release reminded me of something:

Ever the showman, Selznick conceived the idea of conducting a worldwide search for the right person to play Scarlett O’Hara. The campaign, directed by Selznick’s publicity chief, helped occupy the public mind during the long months before the producer was ready to begin filming.
LINK
 

Brand Name

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Those are all fantastic names minus I am not at all crazy about KK. @Brand Name isn’t crazy about BOB which worries me given Jess has a wonderful football mind. But those two candidates aside holy fucking shit yes please! Hell even BOB concerns aside I would take him over Matty P.


Not terribly inspiring? I am over the moon with these names especially Kubiak, Robinson, and Reich.

Edit: I read the article though. I thought it had more to it than they could consider them. It's just speculation. Ignore what I wrote.

Thanks for this, appreciative that greatly from a great mind like yours.

And as down as I am on BOB, I'd take him over Matt Patricia.

That said, let's talk about BOB, what I saw from him at Alabama every snap last year. Because I think it conveys personal experience, stats, and also a more macro feel that people can make their own judgments. I saw lots of curl concepts, (if you look at Tide tape and see the Indianapolis Colts horseshoe logo play card sign, that was the cue!) some Y stick, and the occasional Portland Concepts. Way too often stuck on inside draws, and didn't develop the outside zone and boundary run, although this improved as they used Jase McClellan more as the season went along, as opposed to Jahmyr Gibbs (great home run guy, reminds me a bit of Kenneth Walker, but was rather boom/bust metrically). BOB would almost never run inside the 10. Averse to play action. This was an offense stuck when Chip Kelly's spread circa 2011-12 was innovative.

Because I want to talk success rate a ton below here as for my concerns, here's a brief primer to anyone who needs one from FO: Success Rate (college football): Our (FO's) Varsity Numbers column calculates Success Rate for teams, not just running backs, using a set of baselines that differ slightly from our NFL Success Rates: 50% of needed yards on first down, 70% of needed yards on second down, or 100% of needed yards on third or fourth down.

Let's look at the 5 most common Alabama plays by the percentage of overall usage and as a percentage of yards:

Usage; the percentage listed is the percentage of all play calls gained by Alabama in 2022:

1) Inside Zone Read, 129 usages, 14.4%, 47.29% Success Rate.
2) Flood Variations, 67 attempts, 7.48% usage, 47.76% Success Rate
3) Inside Power, 58 attempts, 6.47%, 51.72% Success Rate
4) Outside Zone Read, ran 54 times, 6.03% of all play calls, 48.15% Success Rate
5) Outside Zone (no read), 52 uses, 5.8% usage, 40.38% Success Rate

Yards; the percentage is the percentage of all yards:

1) Inside Zone Read, 10.76% of all yards, 670 yards, 5.19 yards/play
2) Flood Variations, 551 yards, 8.85%, 8.22 yards/play
3) Outside Zone Read, 7.95%, 495 yards, 9.17 yards/play
4) Texas Concepts (HB Option)/Clearouts/Checkdowns 5.84%, 364 yards, 10.11 yards/play
5) Stick, 4.99% of all yards at 311 yards, at 8.64 yards/play

This to me isn't ideal. Like, let's talk about the fact that BOB's trail concepts were ran 27 times last year for Alabama. T-10th (with all screens, combined) most usage, yet had a 59.26 success rate. This and inside power were 1 of only 2 concepts in BOB's most 10 called concepts with a success rate over 50% (not including exactly at 50%).
 

joe dokes

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We don't know they haven't. While this is the most transparent the organization has ever been under BB about these things, I'm quite sure there's lots they're still not telling us.
I wonder if part of the strategy is to attract some candidates. If -rightly or wrongly-- BB is perceived as *only* hiring from his personal acquaintances, that could dissuade some from "applying" (or however this works).