Rosenthal: Tanaka signs with Yankees

[rembrat]

 
Yeah, it shouldn't, this is no way to build a team in 2014. 

 
They're following the model that got them their last championship. Go hog wild throwing money around with the hopes of winning it all in years 1 and 2 of the new deals and live with mediocrity until the next FA binge. It's not the smartest way but that's never been The Yankee Way.

 

[Jaylach]

 
Sherman tweeted about this, the doctor who did the physical is the same one who did two physicals on Kuroda for them and they trust him. It was by a Dodgers doctor, FWIW. 

 
I understand that but, and correct me if I'm wrong, he wasn't signed to a 7 year, $155,000,000 contract. 
 
I don't know, with that much money and those amount of years, I'd think you'd want your own guy taking a look.

 

[Doctor G]

This team is going to need more pitching.Kuroda was on fumes last August. Tanaka has  always pitched once a week. Pineda is coming off shoulder surgery. Ervin  Santana come on down.

 

[Jesus the 33rd]

I blame Mayor De Blasio.

uhhhh...  he's a sox fan.

 

[jon abbey]

 
They're following the model that got them their last championship. Go hog wild throwing money around with the hopes of winning it all in years 1 and 2 of the new deals and live with mediocrity until the next FA binge. It's not the smartest way but that's never been The Yankee Way.

 
CC and Tex were way safer bets than any of this new crop, plus they had to worry about filling the brand new Stadium at that point. This is way way way dumber than the 2008 plans, which were actually pretty smart given everything, even AJ Burnett IMO. 

 

[nattysez]

This team is going to need more pitching.Kuroda was on fumes last August. Tanaka has  always pitched once a week. Pineda is coming off shoulder surgery. Ervin  Santana come on down.

 
The MFY should go full heel and sign Garza, Balfour and Rodney.  All of those guys would help them and they would immediately be the most irritating team ever.
 
edit:  And that was fine work, mt8thsw9th.  Thanks for the info.

 

[Brickowski]

The Yankees had to do it and I'm glad they did. Did they overpay? Probably. I wonder what the Dodgers offered.

If the Yankees do go after more pitching, they guy I would be targeting is Ubaldo Jimenez.

 

[sfip]

(explanation of the Theo/Contreras urban legend)

 

 
mt8thsw9th, I hope you don't mind but I've added your explanation to my blog that's in my sig. This way anyone can link to the blog post instead of having to research and post all your links the next time someone posts the Theo/Contreras urban legend.
 
Granted they could also bookmark your post but that's up to them.

 

[ThePrideofShiner]

Isn't this the same amount they offered Cano?
 
I think this signing is great. Only costs them money, and they get a young pitcher in his prime.

 

[soxhop411]

Today is not the cubs day.

Wrigley Field deal ‘fell apart’ at stormy session with Cubs, rooftop owners. http://t.co/3w91sRldgL

 

[EvilEmpire]

They really need pitching and they got pitching. Given how little quality pitching talent reaches the FA market, I'm glad they got him. Hope it works out.

 

[MrNewEngland]

Does the year four opt out clause do anything? He won't have 6 years of service time. He'd still be under team control, right? Does it just mean he could go to arbitration in years 5 & 6?

 

[Rovin Romine]

This team is going to need more pitching.Kuroda was on fumes last August. Tanaka has  always pitched once a week. Pineda is coming off shoulder surgery. Ervin  Santana come on down.

 
Pineda logged 40 innings in 2013 in the minors and finished healthy with decent numbers.  He did have a mid year setback though, and he's reportedly down to a 91-93 mph fastball, unlike his 95 dial-up-to-98 mph fastball he sported as a rookie with Seattle. 
 
There's a chance he can be effective going forward, but in the unlikely event he is effective at the ML level, he's probably not going to be throwing a full season's worth of innings.  He should likely be considered a half-season SP, and perhaps an ineffective one. 
 
** 
Remember when Pineda for Montero was a big deal?  I remember handwringing that the Yanks had snapped up a potential #2 for a cornerstone player (blocked at the time). 
 
While Pineda has yet to throw a ML pitch for NY, Montero's sported a (slightly) negative WAR for Seattle.  He's also been moved off the catcher position (1b/dh), tore up his knee (surgery for meniscus) and was suspended as one of the Biogenesis players.  Amazing how ARod's antics are covering the other Biogenesis players in the press - even making their conduct look reasonable, by comparison. 
 
The other moving parts: Noesi, has given Seattle 135 IP of negative WAR, and Jose Campos is a 20 year old pitching well for the Yanks in A ball.  

 

[Smiling Joe Hesketh]

Olney embarrassing himself on ESPN. Not one mention of the Yankees just saying Screw It to the luxury tax threshold.

 

[ThePrideofShiner]

Sherman got ahold of Hal Steinbrenner:
 

“I have been saying for well over a year now that it makes sense to meet [the $189 million threshold], but not at the expense of a championship-caliber team,” Steinbrenner told The Post by phone. “I felt we needed another starter. We were not where we needed to be, in my opinion. So this should not be a surprise because [Tanaka] was the best free-agent pitcher available. He is one of the greatest players Japan has ever produced. He is tough. He has thrived under pressure. He will fit in well to New York.”
 

 
http://nypost.com/2014/01/22/hal-steinbrenner-why-yankees-had-to-get-tanaka/

 

[Doc Zero]

Go Hal, Go!

 

[jon abbey]

They really need pitching and they got pitching. Given how little quality pitching talent reaches the FA market, I'm glad they got him. Hope it works out.

 
Again this is true in and of itself, the Beltran move is the really inexplicable one given everything else including the $189M level. It's like they said to themselves "Maybe we can make up for not signing Beltran when he was begging to come here before the 2005 season, who cares that he's nine years older now."

 

[Frank Fenway]

 there's no way they under 189m next year either, right?  
 
Money fight!

 

[InsideTheParker]

I'm a little afraid of this guy, like Uehara or Tazawa, but younger and better, and for 6-7 innings. I thought he'd sign with the Dodgers. I guess I'm the only Sox fan who's sorry to see him with the Evils?

 

[MakMan44]

 there's no way they under 189m next year either, right?  
 
Money fight!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aHdh6LiBKZM

 

[JimD]

I'm a little afraid of this guy, like Uehara or Tazawa, but younger and better, and for 6-7 innings. I thought he'd sign with the Dodgers. I guess I'm the only Sox fan who's sorry to see him with the Evils?

 
He is going to be a good MLB pitcher, and perhaps a great one.  That said, it was always highly unlikely that he would sign with Boston, so he'd end up on another contender regardless (I never took the Tanaka-to-the-Cubs rumors seriously).  The Dodgers will probably represent a bigger roadbloack to a Red Sox championship over the next few years than the Yankees will. 

 

[Jnai]

 
He is going to be a MLB good pitcher, and perhaps a great one.  That said, it was always highly unlikely that he would sign with Boston, so he'd end up on another contender regardless (I never took the Tanaka-to-the-Cubs rumors seriously).  The Dodgers will probably represent a bigger roadbloack to a Red Sox championship over the next few years than the Yankees will. 

 
This is insane.

 

[Corsi]

Full no-trade.

 

[jon abbey]

Keith Law says (Insider): "I think he'll be the Yankees' best starter in 2014 and one of the top 20-25 starters in the league."

 

[amfox1]

 there's no way they under 189m next year either, right?  
 
Money fight!

 
Nope.
 
My 2015 Yankees payroll:
 
Rotation (51.54 AAV + 2 FA) - Sabathia (24.40 AAV), Tanaka (22.14 AAV), Nova (arb2, assume 5.00 AAV), FA (Kuroda), FA (5th SP)
 
Bullpen (8.00 AAV + 2 FA) - FA (Robertson), FA (setup), Phelps (min, 0.50 AAV), Thornton (3.50 AAV), Kelley (arb3, assume 3.00 AAV), Warren (min, 0.50 AAV), Claiborne (min, 0.50 AAV) 
 
Lineup (103.86 AAV + 4 FA) – Ellsbury (21.86 AAV), Beltran (15.00 AAV), Teixeira (22.50 AAV), Rodriguez (27.50 AAV), McCann (17.00 AAV), FA (Soriano), FA (Gardner), FA (Jeter), FA (Roberts)
 
Bench (4.00 AAV + 2 FA) - Cervelli (arb2, assume 2.00 AAV), Ryan (2.00 AAV), FA, FA
 
[SIZE=12.800000190734863px]Total AAV is 167.40, plus 17.00 AAV in benefits/40 man roster.  That puts the Yankees less than $5mm under the 2014 threshold with only 15 spots filled.[/SIZE]

 

[glennhoffmania]

I'm a little afraid of this guy, like Uehara or Tazawa, but younger and better, and for 6-7 innings. I thought he'd sign with the Dodgers. I guess I'm the only Sox fan who's sorry to see him with the Evils?

 
The Yankees are never going to go away.  They will continue to sign high-profile, expensive free agents.  They can talk all they want about cutting payroll and fiscal restraint but it will never happen without significant changes to the CBA.  As long as they continue building their team like they did this year and in 2008, as opposed to actually developing a farm system that produces multiple high-impact and cheap players, I'm thrilled.  It's when they stop doing shit like this and start producing more than one prospect every five years that we should become afraid.

 

[JimD]

 
This is insane.

 
The Dodgers are probably the top team in MLB right now.  Are the Yankees even in the top 10?

 

[Lose Remerswaal]

I'm a little afraid of this guy, like Uehara or Tazawa, but younger and better, and for 6-7 innings. I thought he'd sign with the Dodgers. I guess I'm the only Sox fan who's sorry to see him with the Evils?

 
You missed a couple Japanese pitchers there.

 

[mabrowndog]

Does the year four opt out clause do anything? He won't have 6 years of service time. He'd still be under team control, right? Does it just mean he could go to arbitration in years 5 & 6?

 

 there's no way they under 189m next year either, right?  
 
Money fight!

 
Both these questions were addressed in earlier posts.
 
Read the fucking thread, people.

 

[Infield Infidel]

 there's no way they under 189m next year either, right?  
 
Money fight!

 
This was true before they signed Tanaka. With A-Rod out, 2014 was their gut-shot year to get under the threshold. 
 
The funny thing to me is that they signed Ellsbury, Beltran and McCann for what they could have signed Tanaka and Cano for and stayed under the 189m, and possibly have a better team. And they let Martin go last year and will lose Gardner next year or via trade. It's like they overreact to what happened last offseason, with repercussions for next offseason. 

 

[Rovin Romine]

I'm a little afraid of this guy, like Uehara or Tazawa, but younger and better, and for 6-7 innings. I thought he'd sign with the Dodgers. I guess I'm the only Sox fan who's sorry to see him with the Evils?

 
There's a chance he'll be very good.  He's apparently a fastball/splitter/slider pitcher, with swing and miss stuff on both the splitter and the slider. Consensus seems to be his ceiling is a #2 - or a #1 on a weak team.  
 
There's also a chance he'll have adjustment problems or his arm will fall off; he's 24 and has thrown a lot of innings.  We're not sure about the pitch count.  Whatever he does with the Yanks in terms of exercise, warmups, drills, and frequency of pitching will be different than what he's used to - he's played for the same team from age 18-24.  The Yanks may instruct him to try to pitch a certain way, favoring certain pitches, etc.  The caliber of the hitters will be different as well; he may not get to "rest" against weaker bats in an AL lineup.  There's also the "softer" worries about the media, cultural adjustment, and whatnot.  Granted, asian players overcome these changes all the time, but players also succumb to them.  We'll just have to see. 
 
So I'm moderately worried - but it's a tempered worry.  If he's successful, it's more likely to be early on, before the league adjusts to him and scouts him in a ML environment.   I don't think his likelihood of success arc matches up well with the Yanks overall.  Meaning they may get a good year out of him next year, but that good year may not make a difference to the Yanks.  

 

[mabrowndog]

Nope.
 
My 2015 Yankees payroll:
 
Rodriguez (27.50 AAV)

 
Minor quibble/question: Wouldn't his AAV will be recalculated to account for the 2013 reduction? If so, I have it as $25.14M.
 
Not that it would have any major impact on how royally fucked over they are next season...

 

[Mugsy's Jock]

 
If he sucks for for years, he'll just opt in, and it'll still burn them. 

Exactly.  I'm rooting hard for the opt-in, so we'll all chuckle about the last 4 years of the deal for $100mm

 

[EvilEmpire]

This was true before they signed Tanaka. With A-Rod out, 2014 was their gut-shot year to get under the threshold. 
 
The funny thing to me is that they signed Ellsbury, Beltran and McCann for what they could have signed Tanaka and Cano for and stayed under the 189m, and possibly have a better team. And they let Martin go last year and will lose Gardner next year. It's like they overreact to what happened last offseason, with repercussions for next offseason.

I don't see any way how Ellsbury, Beltran, McCann, and Tanaka isn't better than Tanaka and Cano. They've said for a long time they would go over for the right players, and with Tanaka, they did. Sure they would have loved to have kept Cano. They tried, but balked at 10 years. Not signing Cano had nothing to do with the $189 threshold.

 

[TomRicardo]

 
The Dodgers are probably the top team in MLB right now.  Are the Yankees even in the top 10?

 
No.  But there is still time to pick up Drew, another SP, and entire bullpen.  They still lack any depth but maybe HGH-Sabathia (I mean they got a bunch of guys pinched in Biogenesis I am sure the Yankees have found a new lab to send their players) will bounce back.

 

[Mugsy's Jock]

 
Well, at least they'll get the compensation pick to start rebuilding their farm system.

True, and there's sure to be especially attractive crop of headed-the-wrong-way Tommy John rehabbers and guys who aren't going to break their college commitments to choose from.

 

[Infield Infidel]

I don't see any way how Ellsbury, Beltran, McCann, and Tanaka isn't better than Tanaka and Cano. They've said for a long time they would go over for the right players, and with Tanaka, they did. Sure they would have loved to have kept Cano. They tried, but balked at 10 years. Not signing Cano had nothing to do with the $189 threshold.

 
 Sorry, I mean, I think Ellsbury+Beltran+McCann+Tanaka+50%tax<Tanaka+Cano+AvgOF+AvgC+Tax reset. And then go buck wild next year when you know you will be over the tax anyway. And it's possible Beltran finally ages and McCann keeps declining and Ells gets hurt again. The guy with the fewest question marks is Cano.

 

[Doctor G]

 
The Yankees are never going to go away.  They will continue to sign high-profile, expensive free agents.  They can talk all they want about cutting payroll and fiscal restraint but it will never happen without significant changes to the CBA.  As long as they continue building their team like they did this year and in 2008, as opposed to actually developing a farm system that produces multiple high-impact and cheap players, I'm thrilled.  It's when they stop doing shit like this and start producing more than one prospect every five years that we should become afraidfor me 

For me there are only two really satisfying  baseball seasons. The most satisfying season is the one that ends with a championship. the next best thing and it IS close is the season where you see the emergence of an exciting crop of young players  as regular  parts of the team for the foreseeable future. This is the best regular season experience on a game by game basis.
Both of these outcomes are possible in 2014 for the Red Sox. Only one is a possibility for the Yankees.
 
Thank you Ben Cherington and the player development  staff.

 

[StuckOnYouk]

the Yankees laughed at 10/240 for one of the top 5 players in the game but spend 7/175 for a guy who hasn't done jack in the bigs. They could have had Cano, tanaka, Ellsbury, Beltran and McCann. Why didn't the resign Cano?
 
Are they scared that owners are waiting for that one offseason that just completely freaks people out and brings in the hard cap?

 

[CaskNFappin]

Their rotation is still weak....CC will be god awful this year.

 

[The Gray Eagle]

 
This was true before they signed Tanaka. With A-Rod out, 2014 was their gut-shot year to get under the threshold. 
 
The funny thing to me is that they signed Ellsbury, Beltran and McCann for what they could have signed Tanaka and Cano for and stayed under the 189m, and possibly have a better team. And they let Martin go last year and will lose Gardner next year or via trade. It's like they overreact to what happened last offseason, with repercussions for next offseason. 

 
The Yankees throwing money around like madmen isn't surprising, and Tanaka's probably going to be a very good pitcher. But what is just astonishing about their offseason isn't the money they spent or the players they brought in, it's that they've spent all this during the same offseason where they let Robinson Cano leave.
 
They finally had a great player they wanted to keep who left-- and it happened during this spending spree! As Infidel noted above, they could have kept Cano and signed Tanaka and stayed under the $189 line. That would have been a thousand percent smarter offseason for them, as they would have kept the player who is better and less risky than anyone they signed, and also added a potentially great young pitcher, while positioning themselves to spend even more in the future. Instead, they got older, way more expensive and way riskier. and will always have to pay luxury tax. 
 
With their money, they should have given Cano the ten years and just eaten the last few years of his deal. They will now pay more in luxury tax in the next ten years than they would have paid for Cano over the last couple years of his deal anyway.
 
Cano is likely to be a better player than anyone they brought in, and offers way more certainty of being good over the next few years, especially in that environment. All the others have way more risk, but they let Cano walk and still guaranteed that they will never get under the luxury tax in the very same offseason.
 
They Yankees are always going to spend loads of money and always bring in famous players. And they are much better with Tanaka than without him. But it's just so great that they found a way to let Cano walk during this spending blitz. That is the part that Sox fans should be happy about. 

 

[E5 Yaz]

Happy Yankee Elimination Day!

 

[glennhoffmania]

 
 
They Yankees are always going to spend loads of money and always bring in famous players. And they are much better with Tanaka than without him. But it's just so great that they found a way to let Cano walk during this spending blitz. That is the part that Sox fans should be happy about. 

 
This is what I've been saying for weeks now.  I really don't get it.  The one guy in the last decade or so they decided to play hard ball with was probably the best and most valuable player they've had.  And they let him go over what's basically 3 years and $50m.  The only way this makes any sense is if they know something about Cano that no one else knows, like he's a heavy PED user or has a shoulder that's about to rip.  Barring that, I can't think of a reasonable argument for signing all of these guys but not Cano when you're a team that can easily absorb a couple of bad years on the back end of a long-term deal.

 

[NYCSox]

 
The Dodgers are probably the top team in MLB right now.  Are the Yankees even in the top 10?

 
It's easier to win a 7 game series than win out over the course of a 162 game season. So it's better for the Sox if the Dodgers sign whoever they can instead of the MFYs.

 

[EvilEmpire]

the Yankees laughed at 10/240 for one of the top 5 players in the game but spend 7/175 for a guy who hasn't done jack in the bigs. They could have had Cano, tanaka, Ellsbury, Beltran and McCann. Why didn't the resign Cano?
 
Are they scared that owners are waiting for that one offseason that just completely freaks people out and brings in the hard cap?

Cano is a lot older and they know him better than we do. Your argument would have been the same one they could have made to themselves (and maybe did) with the last ARod extension. For all we know, they think Cano is a lock for the next four year of high end production and were willing to accept risk for the last 3 years of a 7 year deal, but not 6 on a 10 year deal.

The Yankees have always been willing to spend money for talent and production, but that doesn't mean they want to be paying years and years of dead money. For whatever reason, they thought the risk of that with Cano was too high.

 

[Murderer's Crow]

I still think the Yankees think feel they had a reason to let Cano walk and a big part of that is Arod. I doubt they would ever draw a line in the sand about 10 year deals but I bet they won't be giving one to a 30+ year old any time soon.

 

[Rovin Romine]

the Yankees laughed at 10/240 for one of the top 5 players in the game but spend 7/175 for a guy who hasn't done jack in the bigs. They could have had Cano, tanaka, Ellsbury, Beltran and McCann. Why didn't the resign Cano?
 
Are they scared that owners are waiting for that one offseason that just completely freaks people out and brings in the hard cap?

 
It's very weird.  
 
Contrary to all pre-offseason speculation, the Yanks have basically gone out and gotten all of the top players in FA, with the exception of Cano, and those players whose positions were filled/blocked.  (No need for Choo if you have Beltran/Ells, no need for Napoli if you have Tex/Beltran, no need for Salty if you have McCann.)
 
C - Yanks sign McCann (best FA at position)
2b - Yanks pass on Cano, sign Kelley Johnson (not best FA at position)
OF - Yanks pass on Granderson, sign Ellsbury (best FA at position)
OF/DH - Yanks sign Beltran (wash with Choo)
SP - Yanks sign Tanaka
SP - Yanks sign Kuroda (wash - Santana/Burnett/Garza, etc.)  Plus they may sign another, now that they're over cap.
 
Basically they lost out on Infante (2b) to the Royals, but could still sign Drew (maybe). 
 
I'm not saying these contracts are wise, or that better players won't be available next season, or these players may not regress, or that these players will be worth it on the tail end of their deals, but looking back over this offseason, it seems like the Yanks have selected the "premium" player at each position - damn the length or amount of the contract they signed them to. 

 

[E5 Yaz]

Cano is a lot older and they know him better than we do. Your argument would have been the same one they could have made to themselves (and maybe did) with the last ARod extension. For all we know, they think Cano is a lock for the next four year of high end production and were willing to accept risk for the last 3 years of a 7 year deal, but not 6 on a 10 year deal.

The Yankees have always been willing to spend money for talent and production, but that doesn't mean they want to be paying years and years of dead money. For whatever reason, they thought the risk of that with Cano was too high.

 
 
So they spend the money instead on a guy who hasn't thrown a single pitch in the major leagues, and they "know" only through video, scouting and a face-to-face or two?
 
I agree with your point about Cano, but they're doing the exact opposite by signing an unknown quantity.

 

[chrisfont9]

 
Indeed - I think Darvish is kind of an anomaly for an Asian pitcher given his size, and there is alot of risk in a long term contract for an Asian pitcher given the track record of Dice-K, Nomo and others, albeit yes, Tanaka is younger than those guys.  Assume he will have a couple good years at least out of the gate until the league gets more familiar with his stuff, so it is years 3-8 that are potentially troubling....  

Right, and since it's a player opt-out, if he does indeed have the mileage of a much older pitcher, it'll be fun watching Tanaka decline to opt out and keep the Yankees on the hook.

 

[dbn]

 
The MFY should go full heel and sign Garza, Balfour and Rodney.  All of those guys would help them and they would immediately be the most irritating team ever.
 
edit:  And that was fine work, mt8thsw9th.  Thanks for the info.

 
Reminds me of The Onion classic.