I don't know... this team is already probably the best in the league. I'm sure they'll consider Brogdon/TL picks for Jrue if it's there, but generally this team has a pretty ridiculous top 7, going to be tough to actually upgrade it
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The difference between Jrue and Brogdon isn’t worth TL. Brogdon and picks or just stand pat.
Dame move has been matched.
View: https://twitter.com/KeithSmithNBA/status/1707124845635399709
The Boston Celtics have signed guard Jordan Schakel to a non-guaranteed training camp contract, a league source told @spotrac.
View: https://twitter.com/KeithSmithNBA/status/1707124845635399709
The Boston Celtics have signed guard Jordan Schakel to a non-guaranteed training camp contract, a league source told @spotrac.
cap rules, basically have to send TL o Horford... also, if you want Jrue you need to make an offer POR takes over others and Brogdon is worth nothing to them, where TL they might keep.
So, we’ll cut him in training camp, the Heat will sign him, and he’ll shoot 68% from downtown against us in the ECF.
I am a big Jrue fan and I agree with this. With the injury issues and/or age related risk of Horford/KP/TL, I think you have to keep all 3.
I would like Brogdon+picks to be explored heavily but I can’t find a great match out there
If Himmelsbach says they’re in on Holiday, it’s on the table.
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Edit: Shams too
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Edit: Shams too
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I don’t see how they match salaries without Brogdon + Horford/TL. And that’s too much to give up unless there’s another rotation big coming back.
Getting Holiday is like getting Smart back. But would need another big. Probably take a 3rd team.
The Blazers are likely going to expect and will probably receive young pieces in addition to draft capital for Holiday. Setting aside the salary matching aspects of any trade for the C's, its hard to see them getting Jrue without surrendering someone like TL in addition to a Brogdon+draft capital.
While the cost of TL is steep, Jrue solves a lot of issues for them (he isn't Smart at all -he is much better in some ways and not as good in others). Given where they are in their window it feels like they have to explore it. As others have speculated upthread, the market for him is likely to be very competitive.
While the cost of TL is steep, Jrue solves a lot of issues for them (he isn't Smart at all -he is much better in some ways and not as good in others). Given where they are in their window it feels like they have to explore it. As others have speculated upthread, the market for him is likely to be very competitive.
Yes. Brogdon, Pritchard, and 4 more players or Brogdon, Horford and one other player.
The Celtics are in this weird and slightly crappy position where they have 3 centers in their top 7 players, but aren't confident enough in the health of any of them to just roll with 2 and upgrade elsewhere.
The only way I really see around it, if you deal one of them, is to lean HARD into "regular season is meaningless in 2023" and play Luke Kornet a lot, come what may.
In that case, if Portland values TL (or thinks a 3rd team would), you can probably top some offers for Jrue and make a pretty nasty defensive team that also doesn't have offensive weaknesses.
You'd have effectively turned Smart and Brogdon and TL into Jrue and KP, which seems.....really good?
The only way I really see around it, if you deal one of them, is to lean HARD into "regular season is meaningless in 2023" and play Luke Kornet a lot, come what may.
In that case, if Portland values TL (or thinks a 3rd team would), you can probably top some offers for Jrue and make a pretty nasty defensive team that also doesn't have offensive weaknesses.
You'd have effectively turned Smart and Brogdon and TL into Jrue and KP, which seems.....really good?
Brogdon money makes the match fairly simple. Include TL, who isn't the same TL as 2-3 years ago, if you must. Please Please Please give me some Holiday for Christmas!!! I can so see him locking up Lillard in the spring.
Edit: More thought on this. Pritchard would surely be included to head back to his hometown team in a contract year and give them minutes. Makes sense for their marketing in a down year too. Brogdon & Pritchard numbers alone should work then add our picks and maybe other stuff from a 3rd team. LFG!!!
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Per @JakeRae, you have to add 4 more players to that.
When I tried the espn trade machine I couldn’t get the trade to work period without including TL or Horford
EDIT: Pritchard, Brogdon, Walsh, Queta, Kornet, Stevens, multiple 1sts.
Brad still has the Grant Willliams trade exception to use to get another solid reserve.
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Yea, consolidate and add J'rue. But it's going to cost TL + Brogdon + a First (probably 2 Firsts)
would mean a lot of regular season minutes for Luke, which I'm 100% comfortable with...
Jrue would get absolutely crucified here after his third playoff game shooting 6 of 17 or whatever. Seriously, check his playoff game logs for shooting especially from 3:
https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/h/holidjr01/gamelog-playoffs/
A whole lot of the Bucks falling short the past couple years was Jrue being unable to shoot. I remember I was praying for him to keep jacking it up in the series a couple years back. He is basically Marcus Smart all over again. I'd look for something else.
https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/h/holidjr01/gamelog-playoffs/
A whole lot of the Bucks falling short the past couple years was Jrue being unable to shoot. I remember I was praying for him to keep jacking it up in the series a couple years back. He is basically Marcus Smart all over again. I'd look for something else.
Yes. We have to come very close to a full match in a trade where we are aggregating because of how close to the second apron we are. I think there’s about $2 million in wiggle room. There may be ways to enhance that by cutting unguaranteed players instead of trading them, but we would need to shed the salary one way or another.
His career shooting numbers are much better than Smart's but, for whatever reason, he does shoot much worse in the playoffs. Not sure if that's just random variance or something else is going on.
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View: https://twitter.com/flasportsbuzz/status/1707378214631326065
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It's really something. It's not a small sample either, 40 playoff games with the Bucks and 70 overall. The Celtics don't have anyone who requires quite as much attention as Giannis, but Jrue was the 2nd or 3rd option there depending on Middleton's health. He'd definitely be the 4th offensive option here, the hope would be that he'd benefit from being a much lower priority for opposing defenses.
Problem with Jrue is that he's an expiring and if BOS is giving up that much for him, he's going to want a huge contract and I don't see how the Cs afford it from a cap perspective.
I'd rather have a healthy Brogdon on this team that Jrue just given the way Mazzulla coaches and the rest of the roster. The 40+% 3P shooting is important to have. Of course the problem with Brogdon is that he can't stay healthy for whatever reason.
Agreed, while I love Jrue's game I worry a lot about what you do after this year.
In some ways, getting Jrue might provide optionality around Jaylen after this year though it's all very risky
Jrue’s shooting would be less of a problem in Boston. Every team collapses the paint against Giannis, especially in the playoffs. Jrue would have better shooters around him in Boston and would be able to attack the paint more.
I didn't realize Jrue was an expiring. Knowing that, I just don't think the numbers work out. If it was just Brogdon, Pritchard and 2 picks then I would be fine...but I don't think you can add either Rob or TL to that trade for an expiring.
Last 3 years Jrue playoff shooting is:
2P% |
3P% |
EFG% | |
| 2020-21 | .466 |
.303 |
.461 |
| 2021-22 | .410 |
.316 |
.432 |
| 2022-23 | .512 |
.286 |
.471 |
Teams aren't packing the paint against MIL just because of Giannis (particularly with Middleton being slow to come back to where he was during their championship run).
Given the current salary structure of the team and the pending extensions, I'd personally be shocked if Brad traded for him (as opposed to driving up the price).
You can't trade guys you just signed until December, Portland will surely move Jrue before then.
Even if you include everyone eligible below Al in salary along with Brogdon(Pritchard, Kornet, Hauser), it doesn't get you enough salary to match Holiday.
The ESPN trade machine is really not great...
Yeah, dream over. Too bad, I think he would have been a very good fit and replacement for Brogdon
Right, but if teams play the same defense against us we’d have more open shooters. Jrue’s shooting is a problem, but it would be less of one here.
All that being said I think he ends up in GS.
Jrue has shot 3s at a 39.5% clip over the last 3 seasons, he's a much better shooter than Smart
But agree that Golden State (& Miami) have the inside track on Holiday.
Do the clippers still feel a certain way about Brogdon? To me, that feels like the most appealing way for the celts to get Holiday to Boston (which I'm in favor of-- Brogdon's documented durability issues and now potebtial ire towards the team are problematic). It also essentially recreates the first deal where Brogdon is gone and the more defensive-minded player is in the fold, albeit Holiday is an offensive upgrade (and depending on the metrics, defensive as well) from Smart. Getting the clips to help facilitate the deal feels like the best way forward, although getting the money to even up still seems like a semi-tough tango to dance.
Maybe? THough then you have to wait until December which isn't happening.
Really though, POR isn't doing any trade that involves them taking a bunch of useless bodies that they have to cut guys to take in.
If BOS wants Jrue, they are going into it knowing that TL or Al is almost certainly going out. The real question would be how they can loop in a useful big in the return.
He has a player option in 24/25 for 37 million. He either takes the option or you work out an extension (or sign and trade)
I think POR would take in 20 useless bodies if it neyted them a couple first round picks
except.... they can get (better) picks from other teams without cutting (and paying) guys.
If the Celtics are seriously interested, like all these reporters are saying, seems that they are willing to move one of Rob or Al, along with Brogdon.
I imagine if the pupu platter of filler salary + picks is what works, it would be a 3 or 4 team deal with a few of those filler guys being offloaded to other teams with some 2nd round picks. The better picks is debatable. PHI, MIA, LAC seem like the most interested and each have issues with giving up picks
GS is the frontrunner I believe, they can give both picks that have more likelihood of being good, and some interesting young guys.
Sure it's hypothetically possible that the Celtics have the best offer by piecing together 6 scrubs and by enough POR will take on the roster headache, I just doubt it. I think it's best to assume that if BOS is going to be a real contender for Jrue it's with TL or Al involved. Any time the hypo for a trade involves a bunch of extra teams, a bunch of cuts and signings, various waiting periods etc.... it's probably not going to happen. Especially when it's a competitive market and the reason for making it complex isn't really cap math but trying to give up as little as possible.
Surprised the Warriors are so low
Chris Paul/Kuminga/ a distant First & pick swap for Jrue would make sense for both teams
Kuminga starts.
CP3 & Chauncey spend the year berating the young Blazers
We all saw how suffocating the offense gets in the playoffs when opponents just sag off of Smart.
I really don't want the Celtics to trade away TL or Horford for that experience again in the playoffs.
White is a much better player than Jrue, and I really don't see a point of playing them at the same time when going 2-bigs is probably much better in terms of talent with how our roster is constructed.
As long as Brogdan is willing to suit up and play, I wouldn't even trade him 1-1 with Jrue.
I really don't want the Celtics to trade away TL or Horford for that experience again in the playoffs.
White is a much better player than Jrue, and I really don't see a point of playing them at the same time when going 2-bigs is probably much better in terms of talent with how our roster is constructed.
As long as Brogdan is willing to suit up and play, I wouldn't even trade him 1-1 with Jrue.