What does 2023 look like?

8slim

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I was listening to the McDonough/Castig radio broadcast last week and they mentioned that Story was exclusively working at short before the surgery, and has exclusively been working at it during his rehab. They said that there’s no shot he’s going to be a 2Bman when he returns. So there’s that.
 

Red(s)HawksFan

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I have this funny feeling we'll be seeing Kike at short tonight. Cora just loves him some Keekay.
I hope that this is a last, somewhat desperate attempt to get him going in the hopes another team will be willing to take him on by the trade deadline. Either way, his days in Boston have to be numbered. Doomsday for him is either August 1 or the day Story is activated.
 

chawson

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So Story would be displacing Chang.... are you going with Arroyo at 2B as the regular? I'd rather see Story just stick at 2B and Chang stay at SS. Arroyo or Reyes is a better bet there as the backup/break guy (I guess with Turner but I'd rather avoid him there).

I'd like to see on a regular basis:
Wong
Casas
Story
Chang
Devers
Verdugo
Duran
Yoshida
Turner
with Kiké being the defensive replacement (going with him in CF, moving Duran to LF)
with Arroyo being the middle IF bench warmer.
If it's between the two, I think I prioritize Chang over Arroyo at this point. Chang's ability to play SS is a big plus, and there's sneaky power there that Arroyo doesn't often get to. Meanwhile, Arroyo's chase rate has climbed up to near the tops (worst) in the league.

We've also got an extra year of team control for Chang. Given the industry shortage for decent shortstops in this high-EV hitting environment, I may even prefer Reyes to Arroyo too.
 

Big Papi's Mango Salsa

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And if Duvall is moved, Kike can platoon with Duran in CF, while being a "break glass" 2B.
Jarren Duran is hitting a totally respectable .278/.325/.417/.742 against LHP this season, is 26 years old and has a really good chance at being a very good starting CF here for the next 6 seasons. Hernandez is putting up a .257/.313/.338/.651 and should have been jettisoned weeks ago.

Platooning Duran for Hernandez at this point would be a borderline fire-worthy offense. There is no reason Hernandez should still be on the team.
 

TFisNEXT

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And if Duvall is moved, Kike can platoon with Duran in CF, while being a "break glass" 2B.
This is really Kike's best role IMHO. He might be a bit better than "break glass" at 2B, but same idea. His primary position is CF at this point.

The problem is his bat. I have been of the opinion that he will eventually start hitting given his notorious streaky nature, but so much of his hitting is tied up in power. He's always been a fairly "low average, decent pop" kind of hitter and if the pop isn't coming back, then he's useless at the dish. He's 31 years old, so I would think he's not cooked yet, but he's not rebounded since his injury last year.

This article from NESN i found talked about his core injury that sapped his swing mechanics and I am starting to wonder if he has never fully recovered from it. You'd think the doctors and coaches would notice, but the results are damning since the injury. He's lost most of his ISO which is what made him playable as a hitter.

https://nesn.com/2022/08/kike-hernandez-details-traumatizing-injury-that-kept-him-out-of-red-sox-lineup/
 

Fishy1

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Jarren Duran is hitting a totally respectable .278/.325/.417/.742 against LHP this season, is 26 years old and has a really good chance at being a very good starting CF here for the next 6 seasons. Hernandez is putting up a .257/.313/.338/.651 and should have been jettisoned weeks ago.

Platooning Duran for Hernandez at this point would be a borderline fire-worthy offense. There is no reason Hernandez should still be on the team.
Since a really rough start I think Enrique has been just fine at SS, with an emphasis on "just." He's had a miserable year, don't get me wrong, but the case for keeping him is that he's had periods where he was well above-average with lots of pop, a very good outfielder who can play the infield. As recently as 2021 he was a 4 win player and an above-average offensive player at positions where a lot of guys don't even hit their weight.

The case for getting rid of him is that for the last 700 plate appearances he's been about a 70 WRC+ (which is about equivalent to Chang's career) and we've already got a glut of outfielders between Duran, Duvall, Refsnyder, and Yoshida. And even if he's solved his throwing problems at SS, he's not as good there as Chang.

I think they're keeping him around as long as they can (1) in case he breaks out and (2) in case that breakout makes him tantalizing as a trade chip. One of he or Duvall is going to have to go in preparation for Story returning, though.

If he breaks out before Arroyo does, there's also a case to be made for cutting Arroyo - he's been nearly as bad as Kike, is even worse when it comes to hacking (at least Kike can take the occasional walk) and he can't play the outfield. I think Kike is the better player for his career, but Arroyo has had more success recently.

I don't envy the front office in deciding who goes, but you might also just see who gets you the best return and gamble on what remains. The team can swallow bad offense from 2B, given how much it's getting elsewhere.
 

Big Papi's Mango Salsa

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FWIW, if someone wants to argue that of the totally fungible pieces in the middle infield (Chang, Reyes, Arroyo, Hernandez) that they prefer to hold on to Kike, fine. I personally drastically prefer Reyes and Chang, but it's really not worth arguing.

But the idea of taking Jarren Duran (or Yoshida, though I don't really think anyone is arguing that) for Kike Hernandez is not only harmful to the 2024+ Red Sox (which is of the greatest importance, in my opinion) but it also makes the 2023 Red Sox worse.

Plus, for whatever amount Hernandez' defense has improved by in the middle infield, his offense has somehow gotten worse. He had a .716 OPS in March and April, .590 in May, .555 in June and .294 thus far in July. I'd prefer Chang and Reyes to Hernandez, but again, if someone wants to argue for Hernandez for whatever reason, it's not worth quibbling over. But having him play over Duran would be baseball malpractice.
 

JM3

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Once everyone gets back...I wonder if there is also room on the roster for Enmanuel Valdez.

I know it seems counterintuitive, but here's the decision tree as I see it:

Now

Reyes is ready to come back & they'll have to either activate him soon or DFA him. He's been playing some OF during his rehab assignments with Worcester & Portland & has a fair amount of outfield experience in the past.

Choices:

1) DFA or trade Reyes & stick with what they have.

2) DFA or trade Kiké & let Reyes be the 3rd MI & 6th OF.

3) DFA or trade Arroyo, & keep the flexibility that both Kiké & Reyes provide... but one of them has to start at 2B.

4) Trade Duvall & keep 4 MI options with Kiké & Reyes as the 5th & 6th OF options.

When Story gets back

It seems pretty clear they plan to use him as the regular SS but it seems likely they have to keep Chang around to back him up.

So that means that 2 guys from that previous group need to be gone.

& you're left with 2 from Duvall/Kiké/Arroyo/Reyes. But the question is...do we need 2 of those guys?

Without any of them we have 4 outfielders (Yoshida, Duran, Verdugo, Refsnyder), so you'll want at least one other guy who can play OF (Duvall, Kiké or Reyes).

& without them we'll have 2 MI (Story/Chang), so you'll want at least one other guy who can play MI... but if that last guy is either Kiké or Reyes, that means you only need one of them & you can add a guy like Enmanuel Valdez as a lefty bat who can occasionally start at 2B but more importantly can come in & pinch hit for whoever does get the job at 2B, or Wong, or whoever against tough righties.

So that would look something like...

C Wong/McGuire
1B Casas/Turner
2B Reyes/Valdez/Chang
SS Story/Chang
3B Devers/Turner
LF Yoshida/Refsnyder
CF Duran/Reyes
RF Verdugo/Refsnyder
DH Turner/Yoshida/Valdez
 

Niastri

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Yep, trying to trade for a higher caliber starter at the deadline versus just opening the checkbook during the offseason is going to cost an awful lot in terms of prospects which may be detrimental to the 2024-2026 window. It's temping to do because they are right in the race but I think any fantasy of a deep playoff run is going to start and end with Chris Sale/Tanner Houck getting healthy.

The move that makes the most sense is probably trading for a #4/5 starter as a 2 month rental which should be relatively cheap on the prospect cost. You just need someone to eat some innings in a semi-competent manner until the 2 aforementioned starters are back healthy.
I agree with your post. I'd also add that you're hypothetical 4-5th starter should also bea guy who profiles to be even more effective out of the bullpen when the Sox get to the playoffs.

Maybe a guy with a good fastball/breaking ball combo but a iffy third pitch that could really excel after cutting down their repertoire. Probably a profile that grows on trees, right?
 

Niastri

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You'd think. . .but Chang came back on July 7.

July 7 - Chang SS, Hernandez 2B.
July 8 - Hernandez SS, (Chang as a late inning def. rep.)
July 9 - Chang SS, Hernandez CF (PH for by Duran after 2 ABs.)
ASB
July 14 - Chang SS (Turner 2B, Arroyo as a late inning def. rep.)
July 15 - Hernandez SS.
July 16 - Chang SS, (Hernandez late inning 2B sub in a laugher.)

I think we'll see Hernandez in the IF more frequently than is warranted by his ability at this point.
Story can't get healthy fast enough.
 

TFisNEXT

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Once everyone gets back...I wonder if there is also room on the roster for Enmanuel Valdez.

I know it seems counterintuitive, but here's the decision tree as I see it:

Now

Reyes is ready to come back & they'll have to either activate him soon or DFA him. He's been playing some OF during his rehab assignments with Worcester & Portland & has a fair amount of outfield experience in the past.

Choices:

1) DFA or trade Reyes & stick with what they have.

2) DFA or trade Kiké & let Reyes be the 3rd MI & 6th OF.

3) DFA or trade Arroyo, & keep the flexibility that both Kiké & Reyes provide... but one of them has to start at 2B.

4) Trade Duvall & keep 4 MI options with Kiké & Reyes as the 5th & 6th OF options.

When Story gets back

It seems pretty clear they plan to use him as the regular SS but it seems likely they have to keep Chang around to back him up.

So that means that 2 guys from that previous group need to be gone.

& you're left with 2 from Duvall/Kiké/Arroyo/Reyes. But the question is...do we need 2 of those guys?

Without any of them we have 4 outfielders (Yoshida, Duran, Verdugo, Refsnyder), so you'll want at least one other guy who can play OF (Duvall, Kiké or Reyes).

& without them we'll have 2 MI (Story/Chang), so you'll want at least one other guy who can play MI... but if that last guy is either Kiké or Reyes, that means you only need one of them & you can add a guy like Enmanuel Valdez as a lefty bat who can occasionally start at 2B but more importantly can come in & pinch hit for whoever does get the job at 2B, or Wong, or whoever against tough righties.

So that would look something like...

C Wong/McGuire
1B Casas/Turner
2B Reyes/Valdez/Chang
SS Story/Chang
3B Devers/Turner
LF Yoshida/Refsnyder
CF Duran/Reyes
RF Verdugo/Refsnyder
DH Turner/Yoshida/Valdez
I am pretty intrigued by Valdez with the bat....but he's pretty brutal in the field. So if they are going to carry him as a bench bat, I'd feel a lot better about it if they had a guy who can play the field....and one of them needs to be able to play outfield/infield which leaves Kike or Reyes as the last guy. Reyes isn't that good in the outfield, but not a disaster. Still doesn't inspire much confidence as a backup CF option or Fenway's RF though. You could certainly hide him in left or in easy right fields like the Toilet. But not sure I'd want to gamble with that configuration. Kike has been a disaster with the bat, but he's a plus outfielder defensively.

If we're getting luxurious with Valdez's bat, then I'd probably keep Kike and hope he at least partially breaks out of his slump. Otherwise, if we have no faith in him to recover any offensive skills, then you probably just go with Duvall/Reyes or Duvall/Arroyo.
 

JM3

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I am pretty intrigued by Valdez with the bat....but he's pretty brutal in the field. So if they are going to carry him as a bench bat, I'd feel a lot better about it if they had a guy who can play the field....and one of them needs to be able to play outfield/infield which leaves Kike or Reyes as the last guy. Reyes isn't that good in the outfield, but not a disaster. Still doesn't inspire much confidence as a backup CF option or Fenway's RF though. You could certainly hide him in left or in easy right fields like the Toilet. But not sure I'd want to gamble with that configuration. Kike has been a disaster with the bat, but he's a plus outfielder defensively.

If we're getting luxurious with Valdez's bat, then I'd probably keep Kike and hope he at least partially breaks out of his slump. Otherwise, if we have no faith in him to recover any offensive skills, then you probably just go with Duvall/Reyes or Duvall/Arroyo.
That's fair. Keeping Hernandez as the super bench guy in the scenario where Cora isn't tempted to play him at SS over Story & Chang wouldn't be a bad result.

I'm guessing they'll probably just do the more straight-forward thing & keep Duvall/Arroyo, but who knows?
 

Ronnie_Dobbs

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Something tells me the issue of who to keep as the substitute OF/MIF will be impacted by injury(ies) before Story is ready to play SS...
 

Big Papi's Mango Salsa

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Once everyone gets back...I wonder if there is also room on the roster for Enmanuel Valdez.

Choices:

1) DFA or trade Reyes & stick with what they have.

2) DFA or trade Kiké & let Reyes be the 3rd MI & 6th OF.

3) DFA or trade Arroyo, & keep the flexibility that both Kiké & Reyes provide... but one of them has to start at 2B.

4) Trade Duvall & keep 4 MI options with Kiké & Reyes as the 5th & 6th OF options.
Pared down for the sake of space but as to the bolded, I really hope so. But I've wanted literally anyone up from the minors in place of Hernandez and Arroyo for literally months, and Valdez is probably the easiest move, so my answer is certainly yes.

FWIW, I'd move option 4 up to option 1 and I'm hoping that Bloom is actively trying to do this right now. All Duvall does right now is take at bats away from a superior player that has more term and a bigger part of the core (Duran, Yoshida, Verdugo, Refsnyder). There are enough articles out there that it at least seems Duvall has some value on the market, so get whatever you can for him and give the time to better players.

I'd also move option 1 down to option 4. Though my preference would be to go get an actual upgrade on the middle infield, but that probably isn't in the cards.

However, I'd like to be optimistic and think there might be some interesting buys this year to prove me wrong, and if so, a name I'd be really interested in from the trade market (if they sell) is Brandon Drury from the Angels. Bloom was in on him in the off-season, and to my recollection, Drury might have taken less money to go to LAA, but with that team coming apart at the seams, it seems like he'd at least not be totally against the idea of coming to Boston (obviously if he for some reason hates Boston, then don't pursue this) but I think it was just a scenario where he liked something about LAA more, not that he wasn't interested in Boston at all.

He might be something akin to a "Schwarber lite" deal in that he's presently on the IL, but expected to be back soon, so he could be off the radar a little bit. I have no idea on if LAA would be interested in something like this, but the idea of Mata and Hamilton for Drury checks out almost exactly in terms of value on BTV, which - for all it's warts - at least makes me think it's not outlandish. As a RHH that is capable of playing lots of positions, in many ways he would be an upgrade on Duval (though more as an absolute emergency option and he obv cannot play CF) and he would serve as Turner insurance, freeing up a move of Dalbec if he can get anything of any interest in trade (not sure he can, but since it was brought up Dalbec was "Turner insurance", Drury would be a much better insurance policy). He'd also be a really good "gap" player with term for next season as well as the Sox see whom of Yorke, Meidroth or Valdez ends up being the 2b for the 2024-2030 core.

I doubt we'll be spending the prospect capital to land anyone nearly that interesting, but that's the type of move I'd like to see made.
 
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JM3

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Pared down for the sake of space but as to the bolded, I really hope so. But I've wanted literally anyone up from the minors in place of Hernandez and Arroyo for literally months, and Valdez is probably the easiest move, so my answer is certainly yes.

FWIW, I'd move option 4 up to option 1 and I'm hoping that Bloom is actively trying to do this right now. All Duvall does right now is take at bats away from a superior player that has more term and a bigger part of the core (Duran, Yoshida, Verdugo, Refsnyder). There are enough articles out there that it at least seems Duvall has some value on the market, so get whatever you can for him and give the time to better players.

I'd also move option 1 down to option 4. Though my preference would be to go get an actual upgrade on the middle infield, but that probably isn't in the cards.

A name I'd be really interested in from the trade market (if they sell) is Brandon Drury from the Angels. Bloom was in on him in the off-season, and to my recollection, Drury might have taken less money to go to LAA, but with that team coming apart at the seams, it seems like he'd at least not be totally against the idea of coming to Boston (obviously if he for some reason hates Boston, then don't pursue this) but I think it was just a scenario where he liked something about LAA more, not that he wasn't interested in Boston at all.

He might be something akin to a "Schwarber lite" deal in that he's presently on the IL, but expected to be back soon, so he could be off the radar a little bit. I have no idea on if LAA would be interested in something like this, but the idea of Mata and Hamilton for Drury checks out almost exactly in terms of value on BTV, which - for all it's warts - at least makes me think it's not outlandish. As a RHH that is capable of playing lots of positions, in many ways he would be an upgrade on Duval (just as an OF, not that he can play CF) and he would serve as Turner insurance, freeing up a move of Dalbec if he can get anything of any interest in trade (not sure he can, but since it was brought up Dalbec was "Turner insurance", Drury would be a much better insurance policy). He'd also be a really good "gap" player with term for next season as well as the Sox see whom of Yorke, Meidroth or Valdez ends up being the 2b for the 2024-2030 core.
For the record those weren't meant to be in preference order - just a list of options. I guess I should have done a-d. My real preference is whoever they can get the relatively best return for probably, which is kind of unknowable.

Drury is interesting. Can I trade BLIZZARD/Walter instead of Mata? Asking for a Mata apologist.

The lingering nature of the shoulder issue is a bit concerning, too in terms of giving up real assets for a guy who may or may not be able to help anytime soon.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/mlb/angels-news-injured-brandon-drury-not-progressing-as-quickly-as-hoped/ar-AA1dUPsb
 

Big Papi's Mango Salsa

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Hahaha. Forgot about the "Blizzard" nickname. Sure, I just chose Mata, but Walter checks out too. Heck, even if they said "Drohan and it's done; no Drohan, no deal" I'd consider it. But agree I'd prefer to give up either Walter or Mata (or Winckowski, if LAA would do it) first.

Agree the shoulder injury gives some pause, which is why I could see him being available at a slightly discounted rate, similar to Schwarber (obviously he's not the same caliber of offensive player). Unfortunately, I just get the sense they aren't even going to invest "that" heavily on the team. Which is a shame because I think Drury would be a really good fit for 2023 and 2024 allowing for production that doesn't suck while also allowing Yorke and CM to continue working in the minors.
 

JM3

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Drohan is a hard no from me. But I'm also a Drohan apologist.
 

Sandy Leon Trotsky

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Someone is going to have to be dropped from the 40 to make that happen. The only way I see room for both is if Chang is re-injured or if Duvall is moved.
I’m assuming Duvall is moved. I don’t like Kiké but I’d prefer him in late inning defense moves in CF over Duvall. Hopefully won’t need to get up to the plate though. But yeah…. I like Chang, Arroyo and Story for middle IF.
Duran, Verdugo, Masa, Refsnyder in the OF with Kiké nothing more than an 8th/9th inning defensive move….. can also play 2nd if in-game injuries, etc….
Overall I prefer Duvall but he’s the most redundant with any plus skill for a specialist. Probably will get more in return than Kiké too
 

YTF

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I’m assuming Duvall is moved. I don’t like Kiké but I’d prefer him in late inning defense moves in CF over Duvall. Hopefully won’t need to get up to the plate though. But yeah…. I like Chang, Arroyo and Story for middle IF.
Duran, Verdugo, Masa, Refsnyder in the OF with Kiké nothing more than an 8th/9th inning defensive move….. can also play 2nd if in-game injuries, etc….
Overall I prefer Duvall but he’s the most redundant with any plus skill for a specialist. Probably will get more in return than Kiké too
In your scenario I see Kike' getting more playing time than you're hoping for. Cora has shown a pattern of giving guys days off and at times multiple guys get the same day off. If he's on the team he's going to get some starts.
 

TFisNEXT

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I’m assuming Duvall is moved. I don’t like Kiké but I’d prefer him in late inning defense moves in CF over Duvall. Hopefully won’t need to get up to the plate though. But yeah…. I like Chang, Arroyo and Story for middle IF.
Duran, Verdugo, Masa, Refsnyder in the OF with Kiké nothing more than an 8th/9th inning defensive move….. can also play 2nd if in-game injuries, etc….
Overall I prefer Duvall but he’s the most redundant with any plus skill for a specialist. Probably will get more in return than Kiké too
Yep, the more i read through these posts, I feel like flipping Duvall for a lower end arm is the best move. We have a dearth of plus-defense outfielders, and a surplus of decent-hitting but average to subpar defensive outfielders (Yoshida subpar with Duran/Verdugo about average).

Kike is the only guy left who is clearly a plus defensive outfielder. But his hitting has cratered so bad that it’s becoming hard to justify keeping him. Id probably gamble that he will hit a little better and keep him mainly for outfield defense and as 2B depth where his defense is adequate.
 

TFisNEXT

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In your scenario I see Kike' getting more playing time than you're hoping for. Cora has shown a pattern of giving guys days off and at times multiple guys get the same day off. If he's on the team he's going to get some starts.
And this is a good point i didn’t address in my post just above. If the manager isn’t going to use Kike as a mostly defensive replacement, then there’s really no use keeping him if I’m Chaim Bloom. Maybe flip him and Duvall for someone who can play a little better defense with maybe a .700+ OPS (aka, the Gabe Kapler role)…not sure you could score that with those two, but if not, someone who can at least give you .650.
 

JM3

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And this is a good point i didn’t address in my post just above. If the manager isn’t going to use Kike as a mostly defensive replacement, then there’s really no use keeping him if I’m Chaim Bloom. Maybe flip him and Duvall for someone who can play a little better defense with maybe a .700+ OPS (aka, the Gabe Kapler role)…not sure you could score that with those two, but if not, someone who can at least give you .650.
You think they could get something of value for Cora?
 

Sandy Leon Trotsky

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And this is a good point i didn’t address in my post just above. If the manager isn’t going to use Kike as a mostly defensive replacement, then there’s really no use keeping him if I’m Chaim Bloom. Maybe flip him and Duvall for someone who can play a little better defense with maybe a .700+ OPS (aka, the Gabe Kapler role)…not sure you could score that with those two, but if not, someone who can at least give you .650.
I get it…. Yeah Cora will continue to use Kikê as long as he’s there more than he should. I’m sure Cora sees a bit of himself in Kiké.
But there’s then perhaps a need to bring up Rafaela? Would it be good development-wise? Personally I don’t think so right now.
Is there a more expendable all-D type guy that could steal a bag available via lo-leverage trade or down on the farm?
 

EyeBob

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I get it…. Yeah Cora will continue to use Kikê as long as he’s there more than he should. I’m sure Cora sees a bit of himself in Kiké.
But there’s then perhaps a need to bring up Rafaela? Would it be good development-wise? Personally I don’t think so right now.
Is there a more expendable all-D type guy that could steal a bag available via lo-leverage trade or down on the farm?
How much influence does Cora get from above (not God, the FO) when making out his lineup card? Are we sure that it’s only Cora who likes Kike?
 

AlNipper49

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A win today, against the piece of shit Oakland A's, will allow us to either tread water or gain ground on the Blue Jays. A franchise that is such a piece of shit that when they recently had a "protest" by purchasing tickets to show what great fans they are couldn't draw what Fenway pulls on a snowy April Wednesday day game. Let's make them less relevant.

Garbage franchise
Garbage players
Garbage owners
Garbage city
Garbage stadium
Walt Weiss was a garbage ROY
Dave Stewart was a Walmart version of Roger Clemens
Jose Canseco rookie card investors are only surpassed in idiocrasy by pets.com stockholders (I was both)
Can't even have a World Series without their stupid fault line trying to stay relevant
Ricky Henderson was awesome
 

wilked

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That feeling when your team’s on a run,
8-2 in the last 10, and you see that the two teams ahead of you in the division also went 8-2…
 

joe dokes

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That feeling when your team’s on a run,
8-2 in the last 10, and you see that the two teams ahead of you in the division also went 8-2…
In a division like this, head-to-head is where it gets decided. The 8-2s help to swat away some of the rest of the non-division competition.
 

Big Papi's Mango Salsa

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In a division like this, head-to-head is where it gets decided. The 8-2s help to swat away some of the rest of the non-division competition.
I agree with this a great deal. Which (along with the fact that it's players with term driving much of the success) is also why I think this year's team is worth investing (buying) in whereas last year's I think choosing not to sell was an epic failure.

The Sox have been good against their division and against good teams this year, which to me at least, means they'd have a real chance not just to make up the ground necessary to take the 3rd WC, but to be interesting once they get there and maybe even win a round. Last year, I don't think either of those things applied.

Drohan is a hard no from me. But I'm also a Drohan apologist.
Ideally, he's the one I'd like to keep. Probably because of Walter, Mata, Winckowski and Drohan, he is the least well known (meaning there is still a chance he's really good). I don't think the Sox would NEED to give up Drohan for Drury, I just meant that if they had LAA on Zoom and they got a "Drohan and the deal is done; no Dorhan, no deal" response, I'd ultimately (begrudgingly) do it.
 
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BaseballJones

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Oct 1, 2015
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The Sox are spot-on with their Pythag right now, according to b-ref, at 51-44. 481 runs scored, 442 runs allowed, +39 differential.

Amazing in that they only have one pitcher with more than 6 wins (Bello, with 7). Pivetta has 6, and 2 others (Paxton, Sale) have 5 each. Tampa has two guys with 10+ wins. Baltimore has two with 9+ wins. Tor has four guys with 7+ wins.
 

Y Kant Jody Reed

New Member
Jul 19, 2012
38
Ricky Henderson was awesome
Chaim should kick the tires on Rickey. If we're trading Duvall (which seems to be the preference of the board) then Rickey might be a better fit than Kiké as a backup/defensive replacement outfielder; can work a walk, and the larger bases and limited disengagements should benefit his aggressive style on the basepaths.
 

TFisNEXT

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Jul 21, 2005
12,537
Chaim should kick the tires on Rickey. If we're trading Duvall (which seems to be the preference of the board) then Rickey might be a better fit than Kiké as a backup/defensive replacement outfielder; can work a walk, and the larger bases and limited disengagements should benefit his aggressive style on the basepaths.
As a side note, I was always impressed Rickey had a .370 OBP in his one year in Boston despite batting in the .220s. Dude always walked a ton.
 

jon abbey

Shanghai Warrior
Moderator
SoSH Member
Jul 15, 2005
71,231
They are 8 ahead of the NYYs, who should, by the "last place in the AL East" standards of many here, be immediately trying to trade all of their players for prospects, right after they fire their GM.
I'm OK with that.
 

BaseballJones

ivanvamp
SoSH Member
Oct 1, 2015
24,816
Understatement. #1 all time in walks, runs and steals. Crazy to say but he’s underrated.
I agree. He was adequate defensively, and an absolute menace offensively.

Career slash line: .279/.401/.419/.820, 127 ops+
Six times top-10 in MVP voting.
Three seasons with 8.8 bWAR or better (including two 9.9 seasons).

I know stolen bases minus caught stealing don't = extra base hits, but if you took his SB-CS and added half of them to his singles and the other half to his walks, he'd have "hit" 69 "doubles" in 1982.

I know I'm just making up a "stat" there, but I'm trying to quantify how much his stolen bases impacted his overall offense. So like in his MVP season (1990), he hit .325/.439/.577/1.016, 189 ops+.

He also had:
- 95 singles
- 33 doubles
- 3 triples
- 28 homers
- 97 walks
- 65 SB - 10 CS = +55 SB

So that's a total of 95 + (33x2) + (3x3) + (28x4) + 97 + 55 = 434 bases accounted for (not counting extra bases he took on hits and SF and groundouts etc).

434 bases in 137 games = 3.2 bases per game

To give you a comparison, here's Aaron Judge's 2022 MVP season:
- 87 singles
- 28 doubles
- 0 triples
- 62 homers
- 111 walks
- 3 SB - 0 CS = +3 SB

So that's a total of 87 + (28x2) + 0 + (62x4) + 111 + 3 = 505 bases in 157 games = 3.2 bases per game

So a guy who hit *62* home runs and walks 111 times ends up with the same number of bases per game as Rickey.
 

RS2004foreever

Member
SoSH Member
Dec 15, 2022
676
I remember seeing him in 1986 - he walked. And you looked at him and saw how disruptive he was to the infield. Ironically Bob Stanley (IIRC) picked him off.
He was a great player.
 

Fishy1

Head Mason
SoSH Member
Nov 10, 2006
6,162
Story starting his rehab this weekend.

Boston Strong @BostonStrong_34
10s

Alex Cora says that Trevor Story will join one of the Red Sox affiliates this weekend to start his rehab assignments.
This is great news, obviously, and despite all the whinging around these parts about how he'd never play this year or at SS again, he's planning to be back there and so is the team.

For a team that's needed defense and RH power he's going to be a boon. The only position of weakness on offense will be 2B and C, and even there Wong and Arroyo have potential to be at least league average offensively.
 

Red(s)HawksFan

Member
SoSH Member
Jan 23, 2009
20,960
Maine
LFG

Curious about how long this will be. I assume the spring training norm of 60-ish at bats?
Position players get a maximum of 20 days on a rehab assignment before they have to be activated or shut back down. Shutting down involves at least a two week break (no games at all). If he's starting on Saturday (for example), that would make August 10 his deadline. Sox are home from August 4th through the 13th. Anywhere in that stretch would seem a great time to activate him.