2022-23 Yankees Offseason Discussion

jon abbey

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I’ll do some in depth posts when I have energy, but for now, go lock up Rizzo ASAP, like this week if possible. He has a 1/16 he can opt out of, extend it to 2/32 or 3/48 and be happy it’s not more because of his back. Then get him recruiting Judge to return…
 

EvilEmpire

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I really hope they can move Donaldson without eating too much of that contract. DJ was fine at 3B. IKF in a IF utility role can be backup.

Move Hicks if possible too. Extend Bader.
 

RedOctober3829

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First they need to figure out the Brian Cashman situation. Is he coming back? Then, you have to decide Aaron Boone's fate. Once the GM and the manager's seats are all set, you do whatever it is in your power to sign Judge. If you don't do that, this team's record will take a major nose dive. He carried the offense for long stretches at a time.
 

Murderer's Crow

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Worth summarizing

Players Leaving
Chapman - $18m
Taillon - $5.8m
Britton - $14m
Green - $4m
Benintendi - $3.2M (prorated)
Wandy Peralta * I see him as Arb 3 already so I think he's a FA also* - $2.15m

Addt' Salary saved
Gallo - $6.6m
Montgomery - $3.9m
Andujar - $1.2M

Potentially Leaving
Judge - $19m
Rizzo - $16m

Rough math has us with the potential to shed almost $90m in payroll before arbitration cases which aren't going to be as bad this year since no big performers are waiting for a raise. Spottrac has us at $196m projected after arbitration.

Where does that leave us?

Scenario A - Resign Judge, Benintendi & Rizzo (Short Version: running in place)
1) Clearly there is room for Judge in 2023 but it starts to get really tight really fast
2) Rizzo at the same or similar salary gets us back up to probably a $260m payroll
3) Dumping JD and assuming we have to eat 75% of his salary doesn't help much, that saves us about $6m
4) If you re-sign Benintendi, you're already back up to 2022 payroll
5) The Yankees probably want a solid bullpen arm. I can see them paying Green to come back or finding another similar $6-8m guy

Lineup looks something like this
DJ - 3B
Bader - CF
Judge - RF
Rizzo - 1B
Stanton - DH
Benintendi - LF
Peraza - SS
Torres - 2B
Trevino - C

So, we're back to 2022 levels of spending by just doing roster maintenance, and bringing back a couple of players. Fans would be in uproar if this is all that happens. I wouldn't blame them. Cannot put your chips on DJ, Beni, and a kid.

Scenario B - Package Gleyber, Hicks, IKF and JD for salary relief
1) JD has 1 year left and Hicks is a waste of space. Together they make $31m, if the Yankees can shed even $20m of that it would be big. Giving them Gleyber is just icing on the cake.
2) Give Volpe 2B, maybe switch Peraza to 3b
3) Trea Turner to 3B or SS
4) Re-sign Judge & Rizzo
5) Cabrera in LF
6) Pitching left alone again, maybe re-sign Green

Bader - CF
Turner - SS
Judge - RF
Rizzo - 1B
Stanton - DH
Cabrera/Dominguez - LF
Peraza - 3B
DJ/ Volpe - 2B
Trevino - C

Scenario C - No Judge - Turner, Conforto, Benintendi, Rizzo

1) Resign Rizzo
2) Conforto & Benintendi share LF/RF
3) Peraza to SS/3b to start the season
4) Turner to 3B/SS
5) DJ to 2B (still need to offload the scenario b players)
6) Add bullpen help

Bader - CF
Benintendi - LF
Turner - 3B/SS
Stanton - DH
Rizzo - 1B
Conforto - RF
Peraza - SS/3B
DJ/ Volpe - 2B
Trevino - C

In my made up scenarios, I would rank those as B, C, A but B is a lot closer to C than it should for losing Judge. I love adding Conforto as another lefty who can hit and him + Turner spreads the offense around better than Judge alone.
 
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EvilEmpire

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Re-sign Judge.
Re-sign Rizzo.
Try to move Donaldson and Hicks.

Sort out Gleyber/DJ/Donaldson. If you can't move Donaldson, then see if you can get some value for the last year of Gleyber's contract and DJ gets 2B full time.

If you can't move Hicks, he's probably the utility OF. But try. I don't know if they should re-sign Benintendi or not, I'd lean no, and give the Cabrera a full time job. He's a great athlete and learned fast in the OF. Good in RF, I think he can be good in LF too. Get Bader some time in LF too for flexibility.

RF: Judge/Cabrera/Stanton
CF: Bader/Judge/Hicks
LF: Cabrera/Hicks/Bader/Stanton on the road
Util OF: Hicks

Or if they re-sign Benintendi and get rid of Hicks:

RF: Judge/Cabrera/Stanton
CF: Bader/Judge
LF: Benintendi/Cabrera/Bader/Stanton on the road
Util OF: Cabrera

Re-sign Carpenter and give him more work at whatever IF/OF positions you think he can spot start at.
Keep giving Stanton a little, but steady work in the OF. Once a week? If he breaks, he breaks. Especially if Carpenter is back on board.

Give Peraza the full time SS job and every opportunity to keep it. IKF is the utility infielder.

Bottom line, I think this team could look very much like the current one, but full seasons out of guys like Bader, Cabrera, Peraza, and potentially Benintendi could make a world of difference. Youth is good.

If Judge goes elsewhere, I think the big contract might be to Correa and Peraza starts playing more 2B.
 

Murderer's Crow

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Re-sign Judge.
Re-sign Rizzo.
Try to move Donaldson and Hicks.

Sort out Gleyber/DJ/Donaldson. If you can't move Donaldson, then see if you can get some value for the last year of Gleyber's contract and DJ gets 2B full time.

If you can't move Hicks, he's probably the utility OF. But try. I don't know if they should re-sign Benintendi or not, I'd lean no, and give the Cabrera a full time job. He's a great athlete and learned fast in the OF. Good in RF, I think he can be good in LF too. Get Bader some time in LF too for flexibility.

RF: Judge/Cabrera/Stanton
CF: Bader/Judge/Hicks
LF: Cabrera/Hicks/Bader/Stanton on the road
Util OF: Hicks

Or if they re-sign Benintendi and get rid of Hicks:

RF: Judge/Cabrera/Stanton
CF: Bader/Judge
LF: Benintendi/Cabrera/Bader/Stanton on the road
Util OF: Cabrera

Re-sign Carpenter and give him more work at whatever IF/OF positions you think he can spot start at.
Keep giving Stanton a little, but steady work in the OF. Once a week? If he breaks, he breaks. Especially if Carpenter is back on board.

Give Peraza the full time SS job and every opportunity to keep it. IKF is the utility infielder.

Bottom line, I think this team could look very much like the current one, but full seasons out of guys like Bader, Cabrera, Peraza, and potentially Benintendi could make a world of difference. Youth is good.

If Judge goes elsewhere, I think the big contract might be to Correa and Peraza starts playing more 2B.
There's just no chance on the planet they would get away with running it back + the kids.
 

jon abbey

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Cashman’s contract is up but he’s not going anywhere and Boone is the same idiot he was when they re-signed him last year, he’s not going anywhere.

Zero interest in signing Benintendi also.
 

jon abbey

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There is also no chance they are paying big money for a SS long-term, what team have you guys been following?
 

Murderer's Crow

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What does that mean, from the fans? That shouldn’t matter one bit, they have no clue.
Yea, you think they're gonna sell any season tickets if they're like "we figured out what we did wrong against Houston! So we traded gleyber and donaldson and the rest of the team is the same. Let us introduce you to these prospects you never heard of because you're not a nerd."

And god forbid they brought back Boone with the same team. Meanwhile across town, they're probably going to be cutting checks left and right. You can say the fans opinions don't matter, but they do.
 

Murderer's Crow

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Same fans booing Aaron Judge? Fuck those guys.
Sorry, but let me take a different path to this argument.

By everyone's own admission here, even a healthy squad had no chance against Houston. Do you think Peraza and Volpe are the answers to this problem?

We played 500 baseball for over 100 games. Actually, I think we were 1 game under 500 for the last 100 games. I don't think there is enough about this squad that signals to me that we are a championship contender "as is." Not to mention that Judge won't replicate his 2022 season.
 
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jon abbey

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Sorry, but let me take a different path to this argument.

By everyone's own admission here, even a healthy squad had no chance against Houston. Do you think Peraza and Volpe are the answers to this problem?
That's a strange question and actually pretty irrelevant. NY should try to build the best team they can, that may or may not be able to genuinely compete with HOU. Catering to the fans and throwing money around just to throw money around is more likely to lead to an 85 win season than a WS berth.
 

jon abbey

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It's also not just Volpe and Peraza, NY is hoping that a whole group of prospects can step up in the next couple of years, something like:

Austin Wells-C/1B
Peraza, Volpe, Sweeney-SS/2B/3B
Pereira, Jasson Dominguez-OF

Those six were all in AA or above by the end of this season.
 

EvilEmpire

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By everyone's own admission here, even a healthy squad had no chance against Houston. Do you think Peraza and Volpe are the answers to this problem?
A healthy squad narrows the gap. Young players getting better (Cabrera and Peraza and a bunch of the pitching) as opposed to old players getting worse (Donaldson and Hicks) can help narrow the gap too.

But yeah, the Yankees really need some home grown players to make a jump. But you've got to give them a chance to show out, like Houston did with Pena. Cabrera showed something this year and he can get better. Can Peraza? I want to find out. And like JA says, there are other guys to look forward to as well.

The big FA acquisition I want this year is Aaron Judge. Despite the shitty post-season, we know he can produce in pinstripes. He fits. I think everything else is making small improvements around the margins.

Also, while I don't have numbers to back this up, I do think some guys take a while to adjust to NY and play better in their second season with the Yankees, health allowing. So I have some hope there too.
 

Murderer's Crow

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A healthy squad narrows the gap. Young players getting better (Cabrera and Peraza and a bunch of the pitching) as opposed to old players getting worse (Donaldson and Hicks) can help narrow the gap too.

But yeah, the Yankees really need some home grown players to make a jump. But you've got to give them a chance to show out, like Houston did with Pena. Cabrera showed something this year and he can get better. Can Peraza? I want to find out. And like JA says, there are other guys to look forward to as well.

The big FA acquisition I want this year is Aaron Judge. Despite the shitty post-season, we know he can produce in pinstripes. He fits. I think everything else is making small improvements around the margins.

Also, while I don't have numbers to back this up, I do think some guys take a while to adjust to NY and play better in their second season with the Yankees, health allowing. So I have some hope there too.
I praise you and JA for having the resolve to imagine a scenario where a youth movement is all this ownership really needs to do.

Hal, Cashman, and Boone are on the hot seat. Fans don't influence roster moves but they influence urgency and if we don't have a sense of urgency right now to re-tool the lineup, I don't know when we would. Regular season offense, especially how we seem to build it in NY, doesn't seem to translate to postseason success. I have more vivid memories of Gary Sheffield and Arod striking out than I do Tino Martinez hitting line drives at this point, but we are continuing to build strikeout prone offenses that fall asleep in October and it's been that way for basically 20 years. We are stuck in place.
 

jon abbey

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I praise you and JA for having the resolve to imagine a scenario where a youth movement is all this ownership really needs to do.
It's not what they 'need' to do, it's what they can or should do that will make the team better.
 

jon abbey

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The fan base was apoplectic when Cashman traded Montgomery for Bader, they really have no collective clue. They jump on the moves that don't turn out well and ignore the ones that do, no matter that every team has to make dozens of personnel decisions every year and of course they're not all going to be perfect.
 

jon abbey

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One interesting thing to me is that Cashman kind of emptied out the SP depth at the deadline: Montgomery, Sears, Waldichuk, Wesneski, Medina, all gone. This is interesting because it is very unlike Cashman's normal way of operating (maximize depth), but this is what I think is happening here:

1) He thought he had the MLB rotation covered for the rest of 2022, basically true even with Montas not helping at all.

2) He believes in the ability of the guys behind them to progress and be usable depth by the time NY needs them.

As it is, they will need to build up SP depth in AAA again, and I wonder if they're already pretty sure they will be able to bring in someone specific to replace Taillon, maybe Senga from Japan?

https://www.cbssports.com/mlb/news/japanese-star-pitcher-kodai-senga-expected-to-consider-mlb-offers-this-offseason-per-report/
 

TheYellowDart5

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I'm having a hard time seeing the 2023 Yankees as being significantly different from the 2022 edition, Judge notwithstanding. Assuming the priority is re-signing him, I can't see ownership tacking on another nine-figure contract unless Volpe and Peraza decide to join a Ukrainian militia. The rotation is set with Cole-Severino-Montas-Cortes-[insert fifth starter here] (German? Schmidt? Cheap FA option?). The bullpen will still be Holmes-Loaisiga-Trivino plus guys like Marinaccio or Albert Abreu helping as needed; losing Effross and King for all of next year hurts here badly. Donaldson can probably be dumped with a prospect stapled to him, but I have a hard time seeing anyone being interested in Hicks. Nonetheless, LF and 3B look to be the only major lineup spots where a change is needed, and I'd bet Cashman tries to fill those gaps with Cabrera, Peraza, etc., instead of going shopping in the free-agent market.

Trades can always happen and likely will, but Judge returning is almost certainly going to be the only big expenditure given how much he's going to cost. And if that's the case, how else is Cashman going to improve things? As JA noted, a lot of the starting pitching depth was dealt away at the deadline; the system is still good, but there aren't as many pieces to move for established major leaguers.
 

RedOctober3829

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There is also no chance they are paying big money for a SS long-term, what team have you guys been following?
"Behind the scenes, the Yankees front office is telling people in the game that they don’t plan to be players in the top free-agent shortstop market, which is expected to include Carlos Correa, Xander Bogaerts, Trea Turner and Dansby Swanson. They say they’ll move forward with their young infielders, and that they prefer to spend their money on Judge, pitching and contact hitters. Bottom line: I won’t be surprised if the Yankees’ Opening Day infield is Rizzo at first, Torres at second, Peraza at short and LeMahieu at third."
https://theathletic.com/3721850/2022/10/24/yankees-offseason-aaron-judge/?source=user_shared_article
 

Wingack

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I'm having a hard time seeing the 2023 Yankees as being significantly different from the 2022 edition, Judge notwithstanding. Assuming the priority is re-signing him, I can't see ownership tacking on another nine-figure contract unless Volpe and Peraza decide to join a Ukrainian militia. The rotation is set with Cole-Severino-Montas-Cortes-[insert fifth starter here] (German? Schmidt? Cheap FA option?). The bullpen will still be Holmes-Loaisiga-Trivino plus guys like Marinaccio or Albert Abreu helping as needed; losing Effross and King for all of next year hurts here badly. Donaldson can probably be dumped with a prospect stapled to him, but I have a hard time seeing anyone being interested in Hicks. Nonetheless, LF and 3B look to be the only major lineup spots where a change is needed, and I'd bet Cashman tries to fill those gaps with Cabrera, Peraza, etc., instead of going shopping in the free-agent market.

Trades can always happen and likely will, but Judge returning is almost certainly going to be the only big expenditure given how much he's going to cost. And if that's the case, how else is Cashman going to improve things? As JA noted, a lot of the starting pitching depth was dealt away at the deadline; the system is still good, but there aren't as many pieces to move for established major leaguers.
I am pretty sure Michael King will be good to go on opening day.
 

RedOctober3829

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Cashman’s contract is up but he’s not going anywhere and Boone is the same idiot he was when they re-signed him last year, he’s not going anywhere.

Zero interest in signing Benintendi also.
If I were Hal, I'd have to think harder about retaining Cashman than I ever have. He keeps doing the same thing year after year and they haven't broken through. Ultimately, I think he's coming back, but to have a discussion about moving on from him shouldn't be out of the realm of possibility.
 

jon abbey

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If I were Hal, I'd have to think harder about retaining Cashman than I ever have. He keeps doing the same thing year after year and they haven't broken through. Ultimately, I think he's coming back, but to have a discussion about moving on from him shouldn't be out of the realm of possibility.
“Breaking through” is a nonsensical concept when it comes to building teams in current MLB, even the Astros and Dodgers have only won one WS each in recent years. Like Theo said when he first took over in BOS, you try to build 95 win teams and put yourself in contention each year and keep trying to improve, that’s really all you can do.
 

jon abbey

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I'm having a hard time seeing the 2023 Yankees as being significantly different from the 2022 edition, Judge notwithstanding. Assuming the priority is re-signing him, I can't see ownership tacking on another nine-figure contract unless Volpe and Peraza decide to join a Ukrainian militia. The rotation is set with Cole-Severino-Montas-Cortes-[insert fifth starter here] (German? Schmidt? Cheap FA option?). The bullpen will still be Holmes-Loaisiga-Trivino plus guys like Marinaccio or Albert Abreu helping as needed; losing Effross and King for all of next year hurts here badly. Donaldson can probably be dumped with a prospect stapled to him, but I have a hard time seeing anyone being interested in Hicks. Nonetheless, LF and 3B look to be the only major lineup spots where a change is needed, and I'd bet Cashman tries to fill those gaps with Cabrera, Peraza, etc., instead of going shopping in the free-agent market.

Trades can always happen and likely will, but Judge returning is almost certainly going to be the only big expenditure given how much he's going to cost. And if that's the case, how else is Cashman going to improve things? As JA noted, a lot of the starting pitching depth was dealt away at the deadline; the system is still good, but there aren't as many pieces to move for established major leaguers.
Good post outside of the already noted King mistake, but I do think Cashman has specific things in mind that we are very unlikely to guess.

Also if Stephen Ridings ever gets healthy, he is a late inning impact reliever.
 

Yelling At Clouds

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So back and the trade deadline there were reports that the Yankees were “listening” on Torres. I am guessing he’s only available in the “No player is untouchable for the right price!” sense of the word, but, purely for argument’s sake, what kind of a deal do you think would reasonably constitute “the right price?” Asking for some friends in the Pacific NW.

He’s an interesting guy, I think some might think of him as a disappointment relative to the early hype, but ultimately he provides solid production at a position where that isn’t always easy to come by.
 

jon abbey

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So back and the trade deadline there were reports that the Yankees were “listening” on Torres. I am guessing he’s only available in the “No player is untouchable for the right price!” sense of the word, but, purely for argument’s sake, what kind of a deal do you think would reasonably constitute “the right price?” Asking for some friends in the Pacific NW.

He’s an interesting guy, I think some might think of him as a disappointment relative to the early hype, but ultimately he provides solid production at a position where that isn’t always easy to come by.
They were talking about a deal for Pablo Lopez at the deadline, maybe someone like Matt Brash?
 

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I'm so happy Gleyber had a solid year and built back much of his value after last season. I do think he is the lineup regular most likely to go since he has positive value and Hicks and Donaldson don't.
 

RedOctober3829

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“Breaking through” is a nonsensical concept when it comes to building teams in current MLB, even the Astros and Dodgers have only won one WS each in recent years. Like Theo said when he first took over in BOS, you try to build 95 win teams and put yourself in contention each year and keep trying to improve, that’s really all you can do.
Yeah I tend to disagree with the Astros/Dodgers comparisons. The Dodgers and Astros have at least been to multiple World Series in their runs despite only the 1 title. The Yankees haven’t. By the Yankee standards, Cashman has underachieved. I wouldn’t blame Hal if he explored his options.
 

jon abbey

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Yeah I tend to disagree with the Astros/Dodgers comparisons. The Dodgers and Astros have at least been to multiple World Series in their runs despite only the 1 title. The Yankees haven’t. By the Yankee standards, Cashman has underachieved. I wouldn’t blame Hal if he explored his options.
"The Yankee standards' Is again an anachronistic and silly concept that has been rendered irrelevant since the recent CBAs have made it very hard to directly use their greater revenues to outspend teams anymore (and simultaneously the sport trended somewhat towards favoring younger players). Obviously their organization is not on the level of LAD or HOU or ATL currently, just as obviously they are in better shape than most of the others.

But yeah, if I was a Sox fan, I'd want Cashman gone too. :)
 

jon abbey

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Also something easy to fix is dumping the fucking ridiculous facial hair/long hair rule, part of me hopes NY never wins another championship until that is gone. Are they the only team in any US team sport left with any rule like that? Just absurd.
 

jon abbey

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Also NY has wildly revamped their coaching staff and a lot of the way they do things in recent years, you don't just fire everyone every time you don't win a title. Firing Cashman would satisfy moronic bleating heads like Francesa and the Twitter mob, but those same idiots would be right back on the warpath the first time NY had a three game losing streak.

Also I would be thrilled for the Steinbrenners to sell to smarter owners, but you never know when you end up with Dan Snyder or James Dolan.
 

RedOctober3829

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"The Yankee standards' Is again an anachronistic and silly concept that has been rendered irrelevant since the recent CBAs have made it very hard to directly use their greater revenues to outspend teams anymore (and simultaneously the sport trended somewhat towards favoring younger players). Obviously their organization is not on the level of LAD or HOU or ATL currently, just as obviously they are in better shape than most of the others.

But yeah, if I was a Sox fan, I'd want Cashman gone too. :)
Silly concept? Maybe to you it is as you’re only thinking about it from a financial perspective. But that’s all you hear from the players and management when they talk about what’s expected from them year in and year out and what they expect from themselves. By any measure, no WS appearances since ‘09 is not nearly a success. A good farm system and consistent playoff berths is certainly not a failure, but for an organization so used to winning championships that’s not only what they’re looking for. At least that’s what they used to be about. Maybe all Hal cares about is getting in the playoffs for the extra playoff revenue.
 

jon abbey

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Also a lot of flak about the Josh Donaldson trade, and maybe it should have been obvious that his bat would fall off a cliff, but even so I am not sure that trade was not a good move as it helped them to reshape their C position.

Without the trade, C would have been Sanchez and Higgy again this year, moving Sanchez allowed them to bring in both Trevino and Rortvedt in waiting. Just for the hell of it, some 2022 bWAR numbers:

Donaldson 2.4
Kiner-Falefa 2.9
Trevino 2.3 (obtained late in spring training at low trade cost because of the hole this deal opened up)

Urshela 3.1
Sanchez 0.9

Who would the NY SS have been if they didn't trade for IKF? Good question, they went down the stretch in 2021 with guys like Wade and Andrew Velazquez. Would they have rushed Peraza? Maybe but he was not ready until midway through the season.
 

jon abbey

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Silly concept? Maybe to you it is as you’re only thinking about it from a financial perspective. But that’s all you hear from the players and management when they talk about what’s expected from them year in and year out and what the expect from themselves. By any measure, no WS appearances since ‘09 is not nearly a success. A good farm system and consistent playoff berths is certainly not a failure, but for an organization so used to winning championships that’s not only what they’re looking for. At least that’s what they used to be about. Maybe all Hal cares about is getting in the playoffs for the extra playoff revenue.
It's a silly concept because every team (except the rebuilding ones) want to win a championship every year, calling that 'the Yankee standards' is what I am calling silly.

What 'the Yankee standards' actually are now are finishing over .500 every year/not allowing a MLB rebuild and doing your best to compete for a title while not mortgaging the future too much. I guess someone could say they should be more aggressive trading prospects, but it's easy for that to backfire and leave the team in even worse position (hello Frankie Montas). Of course the NY organization/players are disappointed and even devastated when they don't make the WS, but I reject the 'WS champion good, 29 teams bad' way of looking at success.
 

RedOctober3829

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It's a silly concept because every team (except the rebuilding ones) want to win a championship every year, calling that 'the Yankee standards' is what I am calling silly. What 'the Yankee standards' actually are now are finishing over .500 every year/not allowing a MLB rebuild and doing your best to compete for a title while not mortgaging the future too much. I guess someone could say they should be more aggressive trading prospects, but it's easy for that to backfire and leave the team end up in even worse position. Of course the NY organization/players are disappointed and even devastated when they don't make the WS, but I reject the 'WS champion good, 29 teams bad' way of looking at success.
They could be more aggressive in both trading prospects and also on the FA market. Not getting Bryce Harper was a huge loss.

I do also think they put a lot of eggs in the Ohtani basket and it didn’t materialize. No fault of Cashman.
 

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Dec 8, 2005
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"The Yankee standards' Is again an anachronistic and silly concept that has been rendered irrelevant since the recent CBAs have made it very hard to directly use their greater revenues to outspend teams anymore (and simultaneously the sport trended somewhat towards favoring younger players). Obviously their organization is not on the level of LAD or HOU or ATL currently, just as obviously they are in better shape than most of the others.

But yeah, if I was a Sox fan, I'd want Cashman gone too. :)
I definitely want Cashman gone and Boone extended again
 

jon abbey

Shanghai Warrior
Moderator
SoSH Member
Jul 15, 2005
70,420
Joe Sheehan points out that NY had a 106-56 expected Pythagorean record this year (99-63 actual), that is pretty damn good in the toughest division in baseball. They need to figure out how to best use the guys that they have, that is a fixable problem, and of course keep trying to improve.
 

EvilEmpire

paying for his sins
Moderator
SoSH Member
Apr 9, 2007
17,126
Washington
Silly concept? Maybe to you it is as you’re only thinking about it from a financial perspective. But that’s all you hear from the players and management when they talk about what’s expected from them year in and year out and what they expect from themselves. By any measure, no WS appearances since ‘09 is not nearly a success. A good farm system and consistent playoff berths is certainly not a failure, but for an organization so used to winning championships that’s not only what they’re looking for. At least that’s what they used to be about. Maybe all Hal cares about is getting in the playoffs for the extra playoff revenue.
Of course they expect to win year in and year out. Building a team that consistently gets into the playoffs offers the best chance to accomplish that.

More playoffs runs equals more chances at a championship. Counting on free agency or trading a bunch of prospects for a big name player isn't a guarantee of anything. Develop a pipeline of cheap, homegrown talent, trade excess prospects from that pile to get controllable talent that is closer to ready, and keep the payroll manageable to be able to fill important spots with elite FAs without getting penalized so much that the pipeline is compromised.

Sustain that long enough, and a championship will come. Pretty much how the Dodgers, Astros and Braves are doing it. I think Cashman is doing it right and I hope he continues.
 

j-man

Member
Dec 19, 2012
3,600
Arkansas
judge will be back but unlees hou has bad inj luck in the next 2-3 years i see no worles series path unlees someone knock out houton for them

and in the AL east i am worryed about every team boston always follows up a bad season with a great one tb is always good balt is maybe 2-3 years away from being hou east tor is loaded just neeps a better pen
 

jon abbey

Shanghai Warrior
Moderator
SoSH Member
Jul 15, 2005
70,420
Of course they expect to win year in and year out. Building a team that consistently gets into the playoffs offers the best chance to accomplish that.

More playoffs runs equals more chances at a championship. Counting on free agency or trading a bunch of prospects for a big name player isn't a guarantee of anything. Develop a pipeline of cheap, homegrown talent, trade excess prospects from that pile to get controllable talent that is closer to ready, and keep the payroll manageable to be able to fill important spots with elite FAs without getting penalized so much that the pipeline is compromised.

Sustain that long enough, and a championship will come. Pretty much how the Dodgers, Astros and Braves are doing it. I think Cashman is doing it right and I hope he continues.
Yes to all of this, amen, amen, amen.
 

Petagine in a Bottle

Member
SoSH Member
Jan 13, 2021
11,703
It’s really hard to win championships. The Yankees (and Patriots) dynasties were the aberration, not the norm. I don’t think there’s really anything that can be done to guarantee a championship or meaningfully increase the Yankees odds- look at the Dodgers. I get the desire to dump Boone, but the idea that they should move on from Cashman….I dunno, be careful what you wish for.
 

jon abbey

Shanghai Warrior
Moderator
SoSH Member
Jul 15, 2005
70,420
NY fans who haven't yet and would like something to cheer themselves up should familiarize themselves with NY's current top position player prospects, as it's as exciting a group as I can recall. I will link to mlb.com because they have good profiles on all. Check out the top seven here to start, four first round picks and three international studs, check the ages and ETA years:

https://www.mlb.com/prospects/yankees

All seven are in AA already at least except Jones, who was just drafted a few months ago in July, but who still squeezed in 83 ABs of .905 OPS in low A, he looks somewhere between Joey Gallo and a lefty Judge (he is 6'7").

Also that does not include recent overall top 3 international prospects from last Jan (Roderick Arias) and Jan 2023 (Cuban CF Brando Mayea, he changed his name from Brandon recently and how much better is Brando?). The rebuild is on the way already.
 

soxhop411

news aggravator
SoSH Member
Dec 4, 2009
46,041
I cant believe Heyman actually wrote this dreck


https://nypost.com/2022/10/24/time-for-hal-steinbrenner-to-open-yankees-coffers-for-these-fas/
It’s not so much that the Yankees lost to the deservedly reviled Astros, it’s that the ALCS sweep ensured that the World Series would go on as planned without the Yankees a 13th straight year — now two years longer than their infamous Horace Clarke years, 1965-1975.

Considering their World Series-or-bust mission, that’s like dog years, and must feel like 91 years to their understandably impatient fans.

Something’s got to give. And while fans are screaming for all-time nice guy Aaron Boone’s scalp — wouldn’t Don Mattingly be interesting? — we are aiming higher here.

It’s true Boone needs to better grasp the urgency of October. While their bullpen suffered several losses, there’s no reason they needed to lose two games with rookie Clarke Schmidt on the mound and chance burying themselves in Game 3 of the ALCS with trade throw-in Lou Trivino pitching. But let’s be fair here. Miller Huggins wasn’t going to manage this team past the Astros. Boone is handicapped by having unknown kids mostly comprising his coaching staff, and needs as bench coach his very own Don Zimmer type, who helped turn Joe Torre into one of the best managers ever.
Anyway, here’s the winning plan. Which admittedly would cost $145.15 million extra, but hey, let’s not forget Boss junior is $4.99 billion to the good already. (Moving the payroll to $400 million probably isn’t happening, but at least let’s do Judge plus one of these other three ideas, anyway!)
  1. Re-sign Aaron Judge. Without him, this was a .500 team, and a dull one. That $30.5 million a year offer seemed reasonable back in spring. But now even $40 million is light, even after falling down in the postseason. “That’s gone,” Astros exec Reggie Jackson said. We’ll say $45 million per. No reason the legit home run record holder shouldn’t be the game’s highest-paid player.
  2. Sign Justin Verlander (or Carlos Rodon if Verlander insists on remaining an Astro). The Yankees last year tried for Verlander at $25 million, which is ultimately what he’ll get in Houston once he opts out. He’d serve two purposes: recreate the one-two punch he had with ace Gerrit Cole in Houston, and hurt the Astros, a necessity now. If he won’t come, try for Rodon, who’s more dependable that Jacob deGrom, who may go south (Texas?) if he passes on the Mets. I’m figuring $43.3 million for Verlander (same as Max Scherzer), $25 million for backup plan Rodon.
  3. Sign Trea Turner or Carlos Correa. They passed on Bryce Harper, who would have been even better for New York than Philly, plus Manny Machado and Correa (that one-year deal that would have worked much better than taking the Isiah Kiner-Falefa/Josh Donaldson combo). This would allow them to trade Anthony Volpe and Oswald Peraza, the very combo that could have netted Luis Castillo at the trade deadline. Either guy should be about $35.1 million (Correa’s Twins salary).
  4. Sign Edwin Diaz. It’s great the Yankees had three All-Star closers, but ultimately their relief riches came up a man or two short. Why not sign the game’s best closer — $22 million is about right, and I’d lure new Mets fan Timmy Trumpet for another $50,000 as incentive to move crosstown. So that’d be $22,050,000, bringing the grand total to $145.15 million. Happy spending.
 

BigSoxFan

Member
SoSH Member
May 31, 2007
46,920
Re-sign Judge and sign Verlander, Turner, and Diaz. Why didn't I think of that?