It was a very tight first two sets before Alcaraz got injured. Personally I wouldn’t use the word crushed. I watched the highlights of their first match before today’s final and it’s obvious that Alcaraz isn’t fazed by Djokovic. He has enough variety that Djokovic can’t suffocate him like he does everyone else.
2023 Tennis
- Thread starter jon abbey
- Start date
Joker's tears are the realization that it is the beginning of the end. I am sure he has more majors in him, but the writing is on the wall...Father Time is coming for all of us.
The consolation may be that as he fights to hang on, he’ll finally becomes a fan favorite.
I saw nothing there in these 5 sets that suggested time is catching up to him. Just that a new guard is starting to reach his level. He will be back, probably in 6 weeks.
Time catches up to us all eventually. I thought Roger could play forever, I wanted him to play forever.
As I said, no question Novak has more majors in him, but he did look every bit of 16 years older than Carlos, especially in the second and third sets. It is great to think there may be a player out there to truly push Novak.
Today Joker lost to '98 Pedro, who could paint the black at 95 and buckle your knees with a change. The kid was great had all his pitches, had power and finesse had Joker off his game and had the stamina to close out a gem. With a slightly less spectacular performance Joker wins today.
Sure, but the end was visible for Roger a long time before it happened. I don't think we're anywhere close with Novak yet.
Early in his career, like back in 06, 07, 08, the book on Novak was that he was mentally weak. Would retire from a match, petulantly. Wouldn't work on his endurance or conditioning. Tons of potential, no commitment. Today, and for the last, like, 15 years, that book has mostly been flipped around. He has supreme focus, mental and physical endurance, grinds opponents down. Even in their primes it took Federer or Nadal every bit of reserve and creativity to find the shots that Djokovic wasn't expecting, to induce him to make those increasingly-rare errors. You could beat him, but first you had to conquer yourself, your own weaknesses. Clearly, few have. And I just see very little evidence that he's slipping. Losing one 5-set match, in which Djokovic continued to show that resilience, that robotic consistency in everything except (to my eyes) his second-serve variety and his net play, after a tournament where he had conquered 6 prior opponents largely with ease, really isn't evidence that his will is breaking. Nor that his body will let him down first.
Sure, the end will come eventually, as it always does. Maybe in 5 years, maybe in 3 years, maybe longer still. But I see nothing that makes me think that he's going to fall off the table, start losing matches he shouldn't, start playing like he just can't get to those balls and return them anymore. Those expecting this to be a harbinger of doom are wrong, imo, even though I can't stand the guy and am rooting for it to happen. Today he was beaten by a player who has finally risen to his level, who has proven himself a worthy opponent and rival (perhaps the first other than the Big 4). Tomorrow he will still be as imposing a figure and as tough an out. He will still be massively favored over everyone else besides Alcaraz, and likely will continue to beclown the likes of Tsitsipas, Medvedev, Ruud, and so on. There is a long journey between "losing a 5-setter in the Wimbledon Final to the world #1" and "Father Time catching up to him".
I thought Djokovic had a lot of uncharacteristic unforced errors this match. Clearly the mental side is still there and he can step it up majorly when he needs to. But he's not the complete wrecking ball he was several years ago, which sounds like an insane thing to say considering he has still won basically everything the last couple years.
I agree that Djokovic doesn't seem all that close to the end, but I always bristle a bit when it's called the Big 4 instead of the Big 3. Djokovic, Nadal and Federer are 1-2-3 all-time in grand slam titles, Murray is tied for 39th. Djokovic, Nadal and Federer have been to 35,30 and 31 GS finals, Murray has been to 11. He's undoubtedly been the 4th best player of this era, but it's a really distant 4th. He's got more in common with Stan Wawrinka than he does with Djokovic/Nadal/Federer.
He only lost 3 service games here coming into the final, the fewest he’s ever lost coming into any of his 35 GS Finals. He took out Hurkacz, Zverev and Sinner in the previous three rounds pretty easily, all top young contenders, and today he expended a ton of energy early on trying to end it quickly. He fell a bit short, he looked old and sluggish at times at the end, but let’s give full credit to Alcaraz who destroyed #3 Medvedev in the semis.
Impressive company!!
"At 20 years, 72 days, Carlos Alcaraz is the third youngest men’s Wimbledon champion behind Boris Becker in 1985 and 1986 and Bjorn Borg in 1976"
This was only his 4th grass tournament ever! He is going to quickly pile up the Slams if he stays healthy, 2 and counting.
"At 20 years, 72 days, Carlos Alcaraz is the third youngest men’s Wimbledon champion behind Boris Becker in 1985 and 1986 and Bjorn Borg in 1976"
This was only his 4th grass tournament ever! He is going to quickly pile up the Slams if he stays healthy, 2 and counting.
Pretty reminiscent of 19 year old Federer beating seven time Wimbledon champ Sampras in the round of 16 in 2001, although he lost the next match and didn't win a Slam for two more years after that.
https://www.atptour.com/en/news/flashback-federer-sampras-2001-wimbledon
https://www.atptour.com/en/news/flashback-federer-sampras-2001-wimbledon
It's just so insane.
As far as Djokovic goes Id be surprised if he werent still a threat at all the majors for another 2-3 years...with the one caveat being a relative major injury. Let's not forgot that Nadal just last year was also 2 wins into the calendar grand slam before injury struck and we see how much that has affected him since.
Mikael Ymer suspended for 18 months! This is a wild story.
https://www.skysports.com/amp/tennis/news/12110/12922783/swedish-tennis-player-mikael-ymer-suspended-for-18-months-for-whereabouts-failures
https://www.skysports.com/amp/tennis/news/12110/12922783/swedish-tennis-player-mikael-ymer-suspended-for-18-months-for-whereabouts-failures
I feel like if you've already dodged the anti-doping random tests twice and you know it's a three-strikes policy, then even if you're clean, it's kinda on you to take extra care to comply with every last detail from that point on.
18 months feels a little harsh for what might be a good-faith failure... but also, it was his third.
18 months feels a little harsh for what might be a good-faith failure... but also, it was his third.
Do you think tickets to the finals of the Western and Southern Open will fall below face value on the secondary market? Based on scheduling, I can only make it to the final weekend.
It really depends on how early rounds go. Alcaraz and Djokovic are both entered…if they are on track to meet I assume prices will go up. If it’s Coric vs Norrie and it’s supposed to be 108 degrees with high humidity prices would fall.
Not sure if anyone else is watching the finals of the Western & Southern Open right now, but there's a rematch of the Wimbledon final going on and Djokovic just gutted out an amazing second set to force it to a third. Not sure if he has enough left in the tank as the announcers have been commenting on the heat and it certainly feels like it is affecting Novak more than Alcaraz.
Holy crap. Two absolute fucking warriors. One of the best matches I have seen in a very long time.
Unreal match. Djokovic looked like he was completely done-for early in the second set and really suffering from the heat. And you couldn’t have really blamed him if he had just let it go…not like he has anything left to prove at this point. Pretty incredible.
I was there and it was amazing. Couldn't ask for a better first time experience. Alcaraz had matched point in the 2nd set but couldn't close it out. By the end of the 3rd set tiebreak, Alcaraz started cramping again.
It was a bit tough for Gauff-Muchova to have their match coincide with Novak's practice session. It brought a bunch of the crowd away from the match to the outer court.
It was a bit tough for Gauff-Muchova to have their match coincide with Novak's practice session. It brought a bunch of the crowd away from the match to the outer court.
Wow, you were at a historic event, I think. My friend on FB said and I agree, I think maybe the best three set match we've ever seen. The announcers were pulling out the hyperbole ('shot making of the gods', Hagler/Hearns comparisons, a lot more) and it was all completely deserved. Both players seem to save their very best for when they are down a game point, so many turns of momentum in just three sets, within individual games often. I broke into laughter after maybe 4-5 different points down the stretch, what a fucking match.
I didn't see their first meeting in 2022 on clay (Alcaraz 7-6 in the 3rd in 3:36) but based on the three this year, I think this is already my favorite men's 1/2 rivalry ever. It's almost certainly the first where I really like both players.
Yeah he was lucky the sun went down for the last set, evidently this was the first match this tournament he hadn't played at night and on top of that it was the first very hot day of the week.
I wish I had watched this match live. Even the extended highlights -- especially if you don't know who is about to win, as I didn't -- were pretty incredible. Should make for a fun backstory as the US Open gets going.
Joe Pos on this match, you know it was something special when people have to break out the old school boxing comparisons (Hagler/Hearns on the broadcast, Muhammad Ali here):
https://www.esquire.com/sports/a44869443/novak-djokovic-carlos-alcaraz-muhammad-ali-moment/
https://www.esquire.com/sports/a44869443/novak-djokovic-carlos-alcaraz-muhammad-ali-moment/
Imagine being so good at tennis (or anything) that the first time a genuine challenger who is even one day younger than you is when you are 36!!!
Alcaraz will only get stronger and more experienced and Novak older but what an unprecedented rivalry (in any sport, I would guess), a 36 year old and a 20 year old, both head and shoulders the best two in the world and perfectly evenly matched at 1 and 2.
Alcaraz will only get stronger and more experienced and Novak older but what an unprecedented rivalry (in any sport, I would guess), a 36 year old and a 20 year old, both head and shoulders the best two in the world and perfectly evenly matched at 1 and 2.
The third quarter of the draw especially seems wide open. Could see either Paul or Thiem making a run there.
Chair umpire for Stevie Johnson and Taylor Fritz was explaining the ground rules. He to the automated calls, and he calls it VAR. He then explains that it's just like soccer.
Not sure he should've used that comparison!
Not sure he should've used that comparison!
Forgot this was on, but Coco just broke to open the second in an absolutely epic game, 25 minutes long, on I think her 7th or 8th break point.Gauff loses her first set
watching the ESPN3 feed, and Mary Carrillo is getting into Coco's team, Brad, who is part of ESPN's team, for reminding Coco of the clock
Not exactly the 1st round match Coco needs
Not exactly the 1st round match Coco needs
Right when seeing Siegemund's face after the point was awarded, I was picturing this becoming a "Karen" meme.