#DFG: Canceling the Noise

[Doctor G]

Since the Colts made an issue of this before the game, and presumably asked for the halftime measurements, it seems likely to me that they inflated their balls to 13.5 psi for contrast.
The outdoors would take them to 12.0, but about 5 minutes after bringing them in at halftime they would be warming up to around 12.5--thus passing the test that the Pats' balls failed.
Would the Colts be smart enough to know this?

to me the question is would they knowingly handicap their own QB with footballs at the high end of the allowed inflation range just to be sure they passed at halftime. considering how wild Luck was throwing in the first half, this might have happened. This seems like the most counterproductive thing you could possibly do.This seems like a pretty big gamble on Tom Brady's inability to adjust to 13 PSI balls in the second half in addition to their defense's ability to force a fumble by Blount.
G
Grigson should be on the hottest of seats in Indy, not just for the Richardson trade but also for this entire fiasco.he might have initiated this whole half-assed plan as a desperate gamble to save his job.
If he gets canned he is going to have a hard time finding an owner to hire him.
There are not too many Jim Irsays in the league.I'm sure he knows this.

 

[Stitch01]

Next up on the docket, BB is a big meanie who played Edelman despite having a concussion.

 

[JimBoSox9]

 
That the Patriots won the Super Bowl with properly inflate footballs is meaningless to this discussion.
 
We've got a league that fails repeatedly to properly address wife-beating, child abuse, animal cruelty, drug addiction, PEDs, long-term effects of concussions and tasteless on-field antics. Deflategate gave it perfect cover when the spotlight burned brightest. The league will find the Patriots culpable, fine them, take a pick away and perhaps suspend Belichick and/or Brady. That will sate the bloodlust of the large segment of fans pissed off by this overblown controversy.
 
Reality has nothing to do with this

 
I find it hard to credit that there are still folks wagering on this as the likely outcome, or at least a probable worst-case one.  Even if you're right about the finding, the punishment will stop at the 25K (for 'allowing' the technical violation to occur), or the Pats won't let the story end there.

 

[Hoya81]

I think the Patriots winning has inoculated them against the possibility of a suspension or serious draft pick loss.
 
Such an action would call into question the legitimacy of the Super Bowl, which in turn would shine the light back on the NFL to prove why they didn't do more to fix it, which could attract congressional attention and advertiser unease.  
 
That would result, eventually, in the finding that this was all a bunch of half-assery that never should have been an issue in the first place.  
 
 
I anticipate that, in 3 weeks, a report will be issued and talked about and the Patriots will get a $25,000 fine.  Which would still be stupid.

Even for a 25k fine, wouldn't the NFL would have to point to a specific violation of the rule?

 

[Marciano490]

Does anyone else think that we only got docked the first round pick for spygate because we had two that year? I always thought that in a normal year, we wouldn't have lost a first round pick and with the punishment being less drastic, the "crime" would've seemed less so as well.  Just another way in which the whole scandal reduced to us being victims of our own success.  Boo hoo.

 

[E5 Yaz]

 
I find it hard to credit that there are still folks wagering on this as the likely outcome, or at least a probable worst-case one.  Even if you're right about the finding, the punishment will stop at the 25K (for 'allowing' the technical violation to occur), or the Pats won't let the story end there.

 
I can't believe people still think the Pats will get the least available penalty. The Saints didn't "let the story end there" over the Bountygate mess, either. And even though that was a far more serious offense, the NFL is too much invested to let this go away with a slap on the wrist.
 
This is high stakes poker going on here, and we have to look at it without thinking the Patriots have the better hand at this point.

 

[PBDWake]

They also had, y'know, evidence. Audio tapes, ledgers, testimony. Things not really applicable here.

 

[Jed Zeppelin]

Even for a 25k fine, wouldn't the NFL would have to point to a specific violation of the rule?

 
This is the problem for Rog. If he penalizes the Pats for what will amount to "something fishy is probably going on here," it's the beginning (or I guess the middle really) of the end for him - he'll lose Kraft forever.
 
The league made the mistake of assuming guilt from the beginning before they and most people even understood the issue (not that the NFL understands any issue). This is why they have been scrambling for anything over the last week and a half, and are apparently now trying to gauge the precise pissing habits of an old man.
 
It's difficult for us to imagine any kind of punishment because we are creatures of logic and reason who have taken the time to learn as much as possible about this. It's also difficult to imagine the NFL backing out of the hole it dug for itself, but if they come away with nothing more than one ball at 2 psi under and some "suspicious" peeing, I don't know what they can do. I still think the most likely scenario is making a big public display of changing the ball-handling rules to give everybody the impression that a crime was certainly committed even if they couldn't prove it.

 

[JimBoSox9]

This is high stakes poker going on here, and we have to look at it without thinking the Patriots have the better hand at this point.

 
Not only do the Patriots have the better hand, based on the flop they're probably holding the nuts.  It's possible the NFL mucked theirs two rounds ago and just haven't noticed yet.

 

[E5 Yaz]

 
Not only do the Patriots have the better hand, based on the flop they're probably holding the nuts.  It's possible the NFL mucked theirs two rounds ago and just haven't noticed yet.

 
I hope you're right. I think you're not.

 

[Stitch01]

If you are talking about something that's still stupid like taking away a 4th round draft pick or something without a lot of evidence, very possibly.
 
If you are talking about suspending BB or taking a first round pick and fining that Pats a million bucks, not gonna happen with zero hard evidence (wont even get into sanctioning the Super Bowl MVP with no evidence, that isn't happening)

 

[DJnVa]

Next up on the docket, BB is a big meanie who played Edelman despite having a concussion.

 
Per twitter reports at the time, Edelman was pulled after the league called down and he passed the concussion protocol.
 

 

[CoRP]

Superbowl DeflateGate Scandal Debunked Using Engineering Simulation

 

[Stitch01]

 
Per twitter reports at the time, Edelman was pulled after the league called down and he passed the concussion protocol.
 

You would think that would stop the commentary, but nope.

 

[SumnerH]

 
Which only makes it technically correct, because most of the public does think of it as a potential perp.

 
I'm not saying you're wrong, but if they do that's incredibly stupid.  The phrase is used all the time for non-suspects; everyone who was present at a crime scene, the last person to see a murder victim/disappeared person alive, and the like are all possible persons of interest until they're interviewed by cops.  
 
E.g. http://www.wdrb.com/story/25591349/bcso-looking-for-person-of-interest-in-knob-creek-gun-range-murder for a typical example.  Or http://www.cnn.com/2013/02/28/us/nevada-las-vegas-deaths/ for an example where someone was a person of interest even while someone else was a suspect in the case.

 

[SumnerH]

To think Belichick or Brady even knows who Billy Bladder or Peter Prostate is is preposterous, like just about everything else.

 
I thought he'd already been identified upthread as Lee Harvey Ballswald.

 

[lexrageorge]

Now that the Super Bowl is over, let's look at what Goodell has to gain and with whom by assessing a draconian penalty (i.e., 1st round pick or suspensions):
 
Sponsors:  Don't care.  Ratings didn't suffer.
 
Broadcasters:  Ditto. 
 
Special interest groups that can make noise:  None exist that care about the inflation of footballs. 
 
Media:  Some will be happy, others will cry foul.  I cannot believe it would be a net win for Goodell to assess a major penalty here; the media has already drawn their lines; most of them, believe it or not, seem supportive of the Patriots. 
 
Owners:  The wild card, for sure, but owners care first and foremost about money.  And Kraft didn't become an influential owner simply by carrying water for Goodell; he got that way by cultivating relationships with the other owners, stroking their egos, etc.  He convinced 31 of 32 owners to support the new CBA, which won major concessions from the NFLPA.  So I do believe Kraft does have a hammer to swing, which he will if Goodell goes after Brady or Belichick without any supporting evidence of tampering. 
 
I'm convinced Goodell is still on the witch hunt, using the "integrity of the game" nonsense as a cover.  Kraft drew the lines once he demanded an apology, one that he knew he would never get from Goodell.  I'm equally convinced he'll find nothing, in which case Goodell's hands will be tied.  He's too egotistical to do the right thing and declare it a non-event, and implement procedures to avoid a repeat.  So it could get ugly.    

 

[theapportioner]

 
I thought he'd already been identified upthread as Lee Harvey Ballswald.

 
I missed this. Who did we decide was Jack Rubby?

 

[Jed Zeppelin]

 
I'm not saying you're wrong, but if they do that's incredibly stupid.  The phrase is used all the time for non-suspects; everyone who was present at a crime scene, the last person to see a murder victim/disappeared person alive, and the like are all possible persons of interest until they're interviewed by cops.  
 
E.g. http://www.wdrb.com/story/25591349/bcso-looking-for-person-of-interest-in-knob-creek-gun-range-murder for a typical example.  Or http://www.cnn.com/2013/02/28/us/nevada-las-vegas-deaths/ for an example where someone was a person of interest even while someone else was a suspect in the case.

 
I think the media is at least aware of the connotation. Many times when I've heard the term it's followed by something along the lines of "we want to remind the viewers that this man is NOT a suspect at this time, but police would like to bring him in for questioning." It's self-explanatory but still vague enough for a lot of viewers who have never been brought down to the station to probably think the "person of interest" must somehow be involved in a negative way.
 
And, yes, a lot of people are incredibly stupid.

 

[Dogman]

That happened two years ago. How quickly we forget the Seattle reign. :buddy:  

 
Ummm, the start of last season was September 2013.  I haven't forgotten that Seattle won last season and opened this season (2014) against GB. 

 

[pappymojo]

On  Mike and Mike today Mortenson speculated that the league would be checking surveillance cameras from other games to see if there was a "pattern" of suspicious activity by the Patriots, and again mentioned the regular season game against the Colts and that lower psi balls were on the list of issues that Indianapolis had asked the refs to look out for in the playoff game.

 
This is ridiculous.  They went into the Colts playoff game looking for evidence of a problem before the game even started.  Now, two weeks later and presumably after finding very little evidence, they are going to go back and review video from a game that was played two and a half months ago looking for more evidence? 

 

[Jed Zeppelin]

 
This is ridiculous.  They went into the Colts playoff game looking for evidence of a problem before the game even started.  Now, two weeks later and presumably after finding very little evidence, they are going to go back and review video from a game that was played two and a half months ago looking for more evidence? 

 
But they just couldn't quite get their hands on that slippery elevator video.

 

[Stitch01]

ROG, like most shitty commanders, is fighting the last war.  One thing he can't personally have happen is to clear the Pats, then have a video show up on TMZ showing a ball boy deflating the footballs.  So we'll get a lot of work for Ted Wells and a lot of hope that they find something they can slap the Pats with a draft pick penalty for.
 
He probably wants this whole thing to go away, but his incompetent league office minions killed that.  If he was smart and had control over the league office he would have linked ballghazi with the Jets tampering, the Falcons crowd noise, the Browns texting the sidelines and other similar nonsense, fined the teams involved a week and a half ago, stated publicly that game integrity would be a focus this offseason, then quietly shitcanned everyone involved with the leaks while asking the league owners if they really wanted to act like crybabies and put him in a position to come down with draconian penalties for the bullshit everyone in the league does.

 

[mauidano]

Ryan Grigson and the Colts had better have irrefutable evidence to have sparked this whole thing.  If not, heads definitely need to roll starting with his.  You just can't blatantly accuse other teams of cheating and then go through what the Pats had to go through with no repercussions. This just sets a very ugly precedent for the rest of the league.  I need video proof at this point or STFU and DIAF!

 

[Harry Hooper]

 
 
He probably wants this whole thing to go away, but his incompetent league office minions killed that.  If he was smart and had control over the league office he would have linked ballghazi with the Jets tampering, the Falcons crowd noise, the Browns texting the sidelines and other similar nonsense, fined the teams involved a week and a half ago, stated publicly that game integrity would be a focus this offseason, then quietly shitcanned everyone involved with the leaks while asking the league owners if they really wanted to act like crybabies and put him in a position to come down with draconian penalties for the bullshit everyone in the league does.

 
 
Exactly. Hey guys, remember that money I got you by carving up the refs' pensions? I need that back now {plus more $} since I will have to deploy new levels of staff and technology to go out and further monitor prep and operations during games.

 

[geoduck no quahog]

All of these leaks are like 95% bullshit.
 
Why, if the Colts put the league on alert about Patriot's footballs, were the footballs not re-assessed before the game started? Why would they wait until halftime? They could have busted the Patriots before kickoff and not allowed them to play an entire half with disputed advantage, particularly since the start was delayed anyway.
 
It all just sounds so full of lies. 

 

[djbayko]

 
I think the media is at least aware of the connotation. Many times when I've heard the term it's followed by something along the lines of "we want to remind the viewers that this man is NOT a suspect at this time, but police would like to bring him in for questioning." It's self-explanatory but still vague enough for a lot of viewers who have never been brought down to the station to probably think the "person of interest" must somehow be involved in a negative way.
 
And, yes, a lot of people are incredibly stupid.

What we normally hear in the news is irrelevant because of the context of this particular situation. This report said that this elderly man was the last person to handle the balls after the refs and he entered a different area of the stadium for a period of time. OF COURSE the connotation is thst he was a perp. It doesn't matter what the general, more expansive definition of the phrase means.

 

[Koufax]

 
I didn't hear any of this, so what did he say? Is it possible he was referring to his earlier comments that the NFL would regret opening up a whole can of worms league-wide with its handling of this investigation?

 
When the game was over he said something like "Well, the Pats are Super Bowl Champions for now.  We'll have to wait and see what the investigation reveals."  There was a lot of innuendo there to suggest that he knew that some serious shit was coming down, he just wasn't authorized to reveal it. 

 

[HowBoutDemSox]

 
The league has never stated that. This is just more of the usual ESPN BS

Yeah, they've since edited the article to say:

"The league said Jan. 23 that evidence shows the Patriots used underinflated footballs in a 45-7 victory over Indianapolis that gave them the AFC championship and a trip to Arizona to face Seattle in a game they won 28-24."

Not that they'd issue a correction, or anything.

 

[CaptainLaddie]

So after watching Goodell play shrinking violet over the past few days and basically disappear after the game... what is the over/under on days before he is no longer commissioner?

 

It won't.  114.2 million people watched this game.

 

[BigJimEd]

What makes people think Goodell wasn't behind the leaks or is unhappy with them?

It's been widely reported for years, at least in Boston, that Goodell felt deceived by Belichick's statement in spygate. That Goodell still believes Belichick wasn't remorseful enough.

I wouldn't be surprised if that isn't the driving force behind the slow investigation and the leaks.

 

[Marciano490]

Well, here's the newest, bullshit-iest scandal:  Belichick kissed his daughter after winning the SB. This is the number two story on Yahoo right now. 
 
https://www.yahoo.com/parenting/patriots-coach-bill-belichick-under-fire-for-109986670677.html

 

[Jed Zeppelin]

 
When the game was over he said something like "Well, the Pats are Super Bowl Champions for now.  We'll have to wait and see what the investigation reveals."  There was a lot of innuendo there to suggest that he knew that some serious shit was coming down, he just wasn't authorized to reveal it. 

He also made some very Costasesque remarks about how thankful he was that it was such a great game, as if the nation needed these three hours to exorcise bad memories and begin healing in the wake of such a tragedy.

 

[LuckyBen]

Well, here's the newest, bullshit-iest scandal:  Belichick kissed his daughter after winning the SB. This is the number two story on Yahoo right now. 
 
https://www.yahoo.com/parenting/patriots-coach-bill-belichick-under-fire-for-109986670677.html

People are sick. The photographer probably took 20 photos per second and they found the perfect pic to fit the narrative.

 

[epraz]

Well, here's the newest, bullshit-iest scandal:  Belichick kissed his daughter after winning the SB. This is the number two story on Yahoo right now. 
 
https://www.yahoo.com/parenting/patriots-coach-bill-belichick-under-fire-for-109986670677.html

 
Astounding, and this is a world where Belichick gets portrayed as an ogre for not being friendly with the media.

 

[NortheasternPJ]

Well, here's the newest, bullshit-iest scandal:  Belichick kissed his daughter after winning the SB. This is the number two story on Yahoo right now. 
 
https://www.yahoo.com/parenting/patriots-coach-bill-belichick-under-fire-for-109986670677.html

 
Coach Belichick kisses NOT HIS daughter. 

 

[theapportioner]

Well, here's the newest, bullshit-iest scandal:  Belichick kissed his daughter after winning the SB. This is the number two story on Yahoo right now. 
 
https://www.yahoo.com/parenting/patriots-coach-bill-belichick-under-fire-for-109986670677.html

 
Awful. Involving a non-public person as well. Of course the Daily News and Post are running with the story.

 

[nighthob]

On  Mike and Mike today Mortenson speculated that the league would be checking surveillance cameras from other games to see if there was a "pattern" of suspicious activity by the Patriots, and again mentioned the regular season game against the Colts and that lower psi balls were on the list of issues that Indianapolis had asked the refs to look out for in the playoff game.

Great, so let Indianapolis explain why the Patriots balls got deflated by their ballboy. Since that game was in Indy and the attendants are always local that would mean that the Colts were trying to sabotage Brady in clear violation of the rules and should be docked a #1 pick.  :q:

 

[Jimbodandy]

At the risk of being greedy, another F.U. Superbowl would be fantastic.

 

[nighthob]

to me the question is would they knowingly handicap their own QB with footballs at the high end of the allowed inflation range just to be sure they passed at halftime.

Many QBs like the ball overinflated, so it's not absurd to think that Luck might be one of them.

 

[MyDaughterLovesTomGordon]

Well, here's the newest, bullshit-iest scandal:  Belichick kissed his daughter after winning the SB. This is the number two story on Yahoo right now. 
 
https://www.yahoo.com/parenting/patriots-coach-bill-belichick-under-fire-for-109986670677.html

 
God, I feel so much dumber for having read that. Fuck. Them. 

 

[Doctor G]

Awful. Involving a non-public person as well. Of course the Daily News and Post are running with the story.

Let's hope the Giants make the Super Bowl next year.

 

[simplyeric]

At the risk of being greedy, another F.U. Superbowl would be fantastic.

 
 
I'll be honest:
 
I'd be totally happy for a "can't we all just get along?" superbowl win.
 
Or a "let's not bicker and argue about who killed whom...this is a HAPPY occassion!" superbowl win.
 
 
 
or "look this isn't personal.."
or "this hurts me more than it hurts you"

 

[ifmanis5]

Can't wait for Roger to release the official NFL 'erm, sorry 'bout all that, chaps' memo on 8pm Friday before Memorial Day weekend and never say a word about it ever again.

 

[DegenerateSoxFan]

Yeah, they've since edited the article to say:

"The league said Jan. 23 that evidence shows the Patriots used underinflated footballs in a 45-7 victory over Indianapolis that gave them the AFC championship and a trip to Arizona to face Seattle in a game they won 28-24."

Not that they'd issue a correction, or anything.

Man that's sleazy, implying that they won big against Indy because of underinflated balls and scraped by Seattle playing with properly inflated ones. As if the fact that Seattle was a much tougher opponent than Indy had nothing to do with the diiference in scores.

Sigh.

 

[8slim]

Chris Collinsworth rocketed to the top of my personal sh!t list with his pathetic comments during the SB telecast.
 
With 2:55 remaining and the Pats driving he started in about the deflation stuff.  I mean, less than 3 minutes left in a historically exciting game and THAT'S when you decide to discuss the "controversy"?!

F%@$ him.

 

[Koufax]

It sure seems as though he couldn't stand to say that the Pats were playing really well in the Superbowl.

 

[TheoShmeo]

All the prior caveats I gave up thread apply.  Take this with a grain of salt or ignore it if you think it should be ignored.
 
With that out of the way, I'm hearing from one of my two sources that Goodell is mad as hell and things have gotten very personal.  How that manifests itself I have no idea.  But the two sides are very dug in and it's a very tense situation.

 

[8slim]

Mad as hell about what and towards whom?

 

[Marciano490]

All the prior caveats I gave up thread apply.  Take this with a grain of salt or ignore it if you think it should be ignored.
 
With that out of the way, I'm hearing from one of my two sources that Goodell is mad as hell and things have gotten very personal.  How that manifests itself I have no idea.  But the two sides are very dug in and it's a very tense situation.

 
[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nG0tpL9zJ0E[/youtube]
 
Kraft = Cartman
Goodell = Osama (at 1:50)