#DFG: Canceling the Noise

[drbretto]

 
It appears to me that Kraft's problem has been that he's consistently thought the NFL would do smart things and the NFL kept getting stupider.  The NFL is setting up an expensive, ugly court fight and tarring the reputation if a star player and lead franchise because of some stupid bullshit and to a smart guy like Kraft this beyond comprehension.

 
Not just that the NFL would do smart things, but more specifically that the NFL was doing dumb things because they were getting pissed that no one bowed down, so he bowed down in Brady's stead, thinking that would "give them what they wanted" so they could give Brady a fair shake. The anti-Kraft camp is reading too much into it.

 

[dcmissle]

So, Kraft implies he could've sued for the draft picks & fine but decided not to.
 
If he could sue before, why can't he change his mind and sue now?  It's only been like 6 months.

Answered by Shelter the past couple of days in a post that should be pinned. His case is no better now than it was months ago. It's a pathetic loser, in fact

 

[edmunddantes]

Remember, Kraft was the one that had to come in and help negotiate the labor peace. 
 
This might be a territorial fight going back to that time. 
 
The lawyers and others were probably advocating going full on curb-stomp on the players on the lock out. Make it last as long as needed for us to get everything. 
 
Would not be surprised if there isn't some lingering animosity from that faction of the NFL hierarchy and others. 
 
"We could have had more if he had just fought longer. Kraft stopped us."
 
While Kraft, as a businessman,  took the side of "we've gotten a lot of what we want. It's never good to full on break the other person in a negotiation. It never ends well especially when you know you have to come back to the table in the future."
 
This would be my guess for the lawyers comment with Pash being on the other side of Kraft.

 

[nighthob]

1 Million fine, loss of a first round draft pick and your starting QB getting a 4 game suspension and no reduction would seem to undermine this wouldn't it?

It depends, in a sense I'd say the opposite. Right now in the billionaire boys club Kraft is sitting at the head of some the important tables. But it also makes him easier to threaten with the loss of his particular seat. His influence in the league's business is a large part of what drives the value of his franchise, losing that position is probably a considerable threat.

 

[mwonow]

""Now the league has taken the matter to court, which is a tactic that only a lawyer would recommend."
 
There have been rumours of friction between the Pats/Kraft and Jeffrey Pash.  I wonder is that particular line is a direct shot at Pash.  

 
I wonder if, when the dust settles a bit, the fact that the league launched the legal assault will have any impact on perceptions - public, media, other players, other owners...

 

[Ed Hillel]

We all know Kraft is a smart businessman, and we know Jon can be ruthless. I assume that the Krafts have dirt on people around the league, including Goodell. I have to wonder if Kraft is reaching the point of "doesn't give a shit" and may start using his power to take the ship down with him.

 

[MuppetAsteriskTalk]

We all know Kraft is a smart businessman, and we know Jon can be ruthless. I assume that the Krafts have dirt on people around the league, including Goodell. I have to wonder if Kraft is reaching the point of "doesn't give a shit" and may start using his power to take the ship down with him.

 
We can only hope and pray. Amen.

 

[dcmissle]

Why would he do that when he is not going down? And when he hopes Jon will take his place?

And if Kraft has dirt on others, there is no reason to believe they don't have dirt on him.

Another reason why it is excellent that Cold Warriors with nuclear launch codes at their fingertips had ice water running through their veins. Let's not get crazy here.

 

[drbretto]

I have it saved but can't figure out how to post it here from phone.

I plan to make it my fb cover photo when I get a chance.

 

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

Fwiw Theismann is on espn radio ripping the league and analysts

 

[mwonow]

We all know Kraft is a smart businessman, and we know Jon can be ruthless. I assume that the Krafts have dirt on people around the league, including Goodell. I have to wonder if Kraft is reaching the point of "doesn't give a shit" and may start using his power to take the ship down with him.

 
Couple this with the possibility that other owners and Goodell may have court appearances in their future...I wonder if a well-positioned reporter or two might get some background info that would make for interesting questions as the shiipmates walk in/out of these sessions?
 
(note - I suppose billionaires don't walk in/out of sessions, I suppose the depositions come to them. Still, the idea is appealing in an electronic context, if a lot less compelling without video...)

 

[nighthob]

This really is incredible.  The Colts actually violated the rules regarding the footballs.  It's right there in the Wells report.  And the NFL is doing *nothing* about it.  How can ANYONE take them seriously on this "integrity of the game" issue?

I said this in the original 17,000 page thread, I still have a copy of the Wells Report here, let me dig out the citations.

 

[MuppetAsteriskTalk]

Why would he do that when he is not going down? And when he hopes Jon will take his place?

And if Kraft has dirt on others, there is no reason to believe they don't have dirt on him.

 
Sorry, the time to be reasonable has passed.
 
Sometimes there comes a time when the only way to fight back involves spreading gasoline and putting a torch to it. Everyone ends up burnt, but only one side will remain standing.

 

[Ed Hillel]

Why would he do that when he is not going down? And when he hopes Jon will take his place?

And if Kraft has dirt on others, there is no reason to believe they don't have dirt on him.

 
The Krafts are set for many generations, and their legacy is secured in their homeland. The NFL has already ruined the legacy of a team he's worked hard to bring to greatness, and that of his head coach and QB. It's possible, at this stage in life, that Bob doesn't feel that he needs to be an NFL owner anymore, especially given how the league has treated him after all he's done. Jonathan would obviously be his concern, but who knows what he wants, given his tempermental and apparently vengeful nature.
 
It has to at least be tempting to him, particularly as it pertains to Goodell. I assume he'd lay off the other owners.

 

[Hoya81]

View attachment 1224

 

[ifmanis5]

Pats presser verbate in the spoiler below...
 

Spoiler

10:07:59 In light of yesterday's league ruling, I felt it was important to make a statement today prior to the start of training camp. After this, I will not be talking about this matter until after the legal process plays itself out. And I would advise everyone in the organization to do the same. And just concentrate on preparation for the 2015 season. The decision handed down by the league yesterday is unfathomable to me. It is routine for discipline in the NFL to be reduced upon appeal.
 
10:08:41 In the vast majority of these cases, there's tangible and hard evidence of the infraction for which the discipline is being imposed. And still the initial penalty gets reduced. Six months removed from the AFC championship game, the league still has no hard evidence of anybody doing anything to tamper with the psi levels of footballs. I continue to believe and unequivocally support Tom Brady. I, first and foremost, need to apologize to our fans because I truly believe what I did in May, given the actual evidence of the situation and the league's history on discipline matters, would make it much easier for the league to exonerate Tom Brady.
 
10:09:42 Unfortunately, I was wrong. The league's handling of this entire process has been extremely frustrating and disconcerting. I will never understand why an initial erroneous report regarding the psi level of footballs was leaked by a source from the NFL a few days after the AFC championship game was never corrected by those who have the correct information. For four months, that report cast aspersions and shaped public opinion.
 
10:10:19 Yesterday's decision was released under an erroneous headline that read, Tom Brady destroyed his cell phone. This headline was designed to capture headlines across the country and obscure evidence regarding the tampering of air pressure in footballs. It intentionally implied nefarious behavior and minimized the acknowledgment that Tom provided the history of every number he texted during that relevant time frame.
 
10:10:58 And we had already provided the league with every cell phone of every NFL -- non-NFL PA employee that they requested, including head coach Bill Belichick. Tom Brady is a person of great integrity and is a great ambassador of the game, both on and off the field. Yet for reasons that I cannot comprehend, there are those in the league office who are more determined to prove that they were right rather than admit any culpability of their own or take any responsibility for the initiation of a process and ensuing investigation that was flawed.
10:11:44 I've come to the conclusion that this was never about doing what was fair and just. Back in May, I had to make a difficult decision that I now regret. I tried to do what I thought was right. I chose not to take legal action. I wanted to return the focus to football. I have been negotiating agreements on a global basis my entire life. I know there are times when you have to give up important points of principle to achieve a greater good.
 
10:12:21 I acted in good faith and was optimistic that by taking the actions I took, the league would have what they wanted. I was willing to accept the harshest penalty in the history of the NFL for an alleged ball violation because I believed it would help exonerate Tom. I have often said, if you want to get a deal done, sometimes you have to get the lawyers out of the room. I had hopes that Tom Brady's appeal to the league would provide Roger Goodell the necessary explanation to overturn his suspension.
 
10:13:06 Now the league has taken the matter to court, which is a tactic that only a lawyer would recommend. Once again, I want to apologize to the fans of the new England patriots and Tom Brady. I was wrong to put my faith in the league. Given the facts, evidence and laws of science that underscore this entire situation, it is completely incomprehensible to me that the league continues to take steps to disparage one of its all-time greatest players and a man for whom I have the utmost respect. Personally, this is very sad and disappointing to me.
 
10:13:58 Now, I know the real reason you came here was to hear coach Belichick. So I'll turn the podium over to him.
 
Q: Bob, can you change anything?
 
BILL BELICHICK
 
10:14:23 Good to see everyone back here. Got all the players back today for the start of training camp. Right now, we're in a long step-by-step process as we head into the beginning of the 2015 season. So we're just going to take it one day at a time. We've got some preparation work to do in terms of conditioning and going through some policies and things like that, trying to get everybody on the same page like we normally do. We'll try to have a good day today and then try to have another one tomorrow and just string them along day by day.
 
10:14:59 That's really where we're at. I think Robert took care of the other situation. Tom's had a statement. So there's nothing really to talk about there. Won't be dealing with that at all. Just try to get the team ready and prepare for the regular season as we always do and as we did all spring. So there's really no change for us on the football team.
 
Q: [ Inaudible question ].
 
10:15:36 We're going to take it day to day, just like we always do.
 
Q: Do you believe as Tom Brady says that he believes neither he nor anyone in the organization did anything wrong?
 
10:15:47 We'll start training camp today and get ready for the 2015 season starting today.
 
Q: Coach, is there something wrong about a system where these cheating [ inaudible ] --
 
10:16:02 It's already been addressed.
 
Q: Can you elaborate a little?
 
No.
 
Q: Why not?
 
Because it's already been addressed.
 
Q: People have a lot of questions, public demand --
 
10:16:17 You heard what Robert just said. It's already been addressed. Maybe you should go back and look at your notes. It's already been addressed.
 
Q: Were you surprised by Roger's decision?
 
10:16:28 We'll continue to get the team ready for the 2015 season.
 
Q: How difficult is getting ready when you may not know who your quarterback will be for the first four games?
 
10:36:39 All the players out there will practice like they always do.
 
Q:
 
10:16:53 We practice in training camp that’s what training camp’s for. That’s the way we’ve always done it. No different from any position.
 
Q:
 
10:18:12 We get ready for the football season, we start today, we start conditioning all players. Start the process to get ready for the regular season.
 
Q:
10:18:57 I think everyone learned a lot in the spring, the rookies learned a lot, the veterans learned a lot, it’s preparation for the training camp. Now is when we really go out there and execute it and work on it at a higher tempo.
 
Q: You’re obviously annoyed---
 
10:19:40 Right now we’re getting the team ready for the 2015 season.

 

[Mooch]

Sorry, the time to be reasonable has passed.
 
Sometimes there comes a time when the only way to fight back involves spreading gasoline and putting a torch to it. Everyone ends up burnt, but only one side will remain standing.

I would agree with this. The Patriots have mud all over them already. Time to dirty up everyone else.

Kraft: "For the record, it's my call. Dump everything you've got left on my pos. I say again, expend all remaining in my perimeter. It's a lovely fucking war."

 

[PedroKsBambino]

 
FOXBOROUGH, Mass. -- The following is New England Patriots owner Robert Kraft's statement from Wednesday morning from Gillette Stadium:
 
"In light of yesterday's league ruling, I thought it was important to make a statement today, prior to the start of training camp. After this, I will not be talking about this matter until after the legal process plays itself out, and I would advise everyone in the organization to do the same and just concentrate on preparation for the 2015 season.
 
"The decision handed down by the league yesterday is unfathomable to me. It is routine for discipline in the NFL to be reduced upon appeal. In the vast majority of these cases, there is tangible and hard evidence of the infraction for which the discipline is being imposed. And still the initial penalty gets reduced.
 
"Six months removed from the AFC Championship Game, the league still has no hard evidence of anybody doing anything to tamper with the PSI levels of footballs. I continue to believe and unequivocally support Tom Brady.
 
"I, first and foremost, need to apologize to our fans because I truly believe what I did in May - given the actual evidence of the situation, and the league's history on discipline matters - would make it much easier for the league to exonerate Tom Brady.
 
"Unfortunately I was wrong.
 
"The league's handling of this entire process has been extremely frustrating and disconcerting. I will never understand why an initial erroneous report regarding the PSI level of footballs was leaked by a source from the NFL a few days after the AFC Championship Game, and was never corrected by those who had the correct information.
 
"For four months, that report cast dispersons and shaped public opinion. Yesterday's decision by Commissioner Goodell was released in a similar manner, under an erroneous headline that read, 'Tom Brady destroyed his cell phone.' This headline was designed to capture headlines across the country and obscure evidence regarding the tampering of air pressure in footballs.
 
"It intentionally implied nefarious behavior and minimized the acknowledgement that Tom provided the history of every number he texted during that relevant time frame. We had already provided the league with every cell phone of every non-NFLPA employee that they requested, including head coach Bill Belichick.
 
"Tom Brady is a person of great integrity, and is a great ambassador of the game, both on and off the field. Yet for reasons that I cannot comprehend, there are those in the league office who are more determined to prove that they are right rather than admit any culpability of their own, or take any responsibility for the initiation of a process and ensuing investigation that was flawed.
 
"I've come to the conclusion that this was never about doing what was fair and just. Back in May, I had to make a difficult decision that I now regret.
 
"I tried to do what I thought was right. I chose not to take legal action. I wanted to return the focus to football. I have been negotiating agreements on a global basis my entire life, and I know there are times when you have to give up important points of principle to achieve a greater good. I acted in good faith and was optimistic that by taking the actions I took, the league would have what they wanted.
 
"I was willing to accept the harshest penalty in the history of the NFL for an alleged ball violation, because I believed it would help exonerate Tom.
 
"I have often said 'If you want to get a deal done, sometimes you have to get the lawyers out of the room.' I had hopes that Tom Brady appeal to the league would provide Roger Goodell the necessary explanation to overturn his suspension.
 
"Now the league has taken the matter to court, which is a tactic that only a lawyer would recommend.
 
"Once again, I want to apologize to the fans of the New England Patriots and Tom Brady. I was wrong to put my faith in the league.
 
"Given the facts, evidence and laws of science that underscore this entire situation, it is completely incomprehensible to me that the league continues to take steps to disparage one of its all-time great players and a man for whom I have the utmost respect.
 
"Personally, this is very sad and disappointing to me."
 

 
Keep in mind that legally, Kraft has exactly the same options open to him today that he had in May.  The few theories on which he can get into Federal Court (antitrust, most likely) still are open to him.   The NFL appeal process (to degree there was one for Pats, an open question) can't bar an antitrust claim.   The penalties the Pats would incur won't be felt until next year's draft---and thus, I can't see any reason he couldn't wait for this to play out and then litigate if he in fact wanted to.
 
Lawyers, anyone see a reason that is not the case?  He doesn't need to follow the CBA process (he's the team, not a player); while he is subject to the limitations of the agreement between the owners, I don't believe a non-litigation clause is enforceable in an antitrust action.

 

[matrixarchitect]

Preface: IAAL just not an employment one.
 
Given Kraft's harsh words towards the league I am going to be very interested in what role he has moving forward given the litigation. Does the NFL keep him abreast of the legal strategies as an owner and client? Does the NFLPA now have a mole? If Kraft has dirt, does he use it to help Brady and NFLPA?
 
Whoever called for the MJ pop corn .gif underestimated.

 

[pappymojo]

I said this in the original 17,000 page thread, I still have a copy of the Wells Report here, let me dig out the citations.

 
Thank you.  I wasn't doubting you.  My question is can Brady use this is his court case as a way to show that 1) the rule doesn't apply to players. 2) the rule applies to teams.  3) the Colts broke the rule.  4) the Colts were not penalized.  Therefore, my penalty should be completely absolved. 
 
And also, the Colts should be penalized. 
 
And also please release all communications between the NFL, the Colts and Wells. 

 

[Stitch01]

 
This really is incredible.  The Colts actually violated the rules regarding the footballs.  It's right there in the Wells report.  And the NFL is doing *nothing* about it.  How can ANYONE take them seriously on this "integrity of the game" issue?

I'm sure that dude from last night will be calling for a full year Andrew Luck suspension.

 

[uncannymanny]

The most fascinating thing I've seen in this saga is that people with brains still watch ESPN.

 

[SeoulSoxFan]

“@CharlesRobinson: #Patriots officials have long believed the reason #NFL didn’t correct erroneous ESPN ball inflation numbers is because #NFL leaked the info.”

 
As well as many of the posters here. Unfortunately, too few of the scribes out there "reporting" on the story. 

 

[PedroKsBambino]

Yeah, Robert, going forward you should start saying "When the other side is intent on screwing you, you better keep the lawyers IN the room, because you don't play hardball without good legal advice".

What a great idea in this circumstance, kicking out the lawyers.

 
A number of us said months ago the right move was to retain Brendan Sullivan or a similar wartime consigliere right away.    There are plenty of times lawyers get in the way of doing business---and, when you are being investigated, you need a wartime lawyer not a dealmaker.  Kraft, sadly, has learned this lesson the hard way now

 

[mwonow]

I'm sure that dude from last night will be calling for a full year Andrew Luck suspension.

 
Nope, there's actual evidence here. Isn't that life?

 

[RG33]

I think people are downplaying Kraft's comments as well. I think the pointed "I also advise everyone in the organization to do the same" with respect to not speaking to the matter until the legal stuff is played out is not only getting Belichick et al off the hook from commenting on things and allowing them to focus on football, but also a not-so-subtle mention to Goodell that this isn't over and that he is back in the game.

As much as the Patriots don't have any real legal recourse with respect to the punishment, they certainly can still take the nuclear option and keep questioning the NFL. What is to stop Kraft from demanding the NFL name who leaked information to Mortenson? All he has to do is float it out in the media, and all of a sudden the narrative starts to change again. Same thing with the issue with the Colts balls or the Panthers sideline antics, etc. Kraft doesn't have to sue the NFL to make this thing get a helluva lot messier for Goodell and to start to re-frame things again. He can also bring forward the challenge to test balls during the 2015 season to actually prove one way or another if the air pressure is affected by environmental conditions.

Now that he is come out and acknowledged his mistake, the media is going to jump on anything and everything that he says (directly or indirectly). The game is on again.

 

[rodderick]

I'm sure that dude from last night will be calling for a full year Andrew Luck suspension.

 
No, dude, see. The problem isn't deflating footballs. It's the cover up.
 
Just like when your girlfriend gets all over you for an innocuous comment, you say something dumb in frustration, and now she cries because of how you treated her, even though the original offense was minuscule at best. The league and opposite fans know that even if true, deflating footballs is something extremely minor, but now they have this supposed cover up by the Patriots to justify the hatred and the sanctions. 

 

[ivanvamp]

I'm sure that dude from last night will be calling for a full year Andrew Luck suspension.

 
Where are all the ESPN talking heads clamoring for league discipline for Luck?  He violated a rule regarding the footballs, in order to gain a competitive advantage.  Not only that, but we have actual, documented evidence in the Wells report of Luck doing this, per his own words.

 

[HomeBrew1901]

I think people are downplaying Kraft's comments as well. I think the pointed "I also advise everyone in the organization to do the same" with respect to not speaking to the matter until the legal stuff is played out is not only getting Belichick et al off the hook from commenting on things and allowing them to focus on football, but also a not-so-subtle mention to Goodell that this isn't over and that he is back in the game.

As much as the Patriots don't have any real legal recourse with respect to the punishment, they certainly can still take the nuclear option and keep questioning the NFL. What is to stop Kraft from demanding the NFL name who leaked information to Mortenson? All he has to do is float it out in the media, and all of a sudden the narrative starts to change again. Same thing with the issue with the Colts balls or the Panthers sideline antics, etc. Kraft doesn't have to sue the NFL to make this thing get a helluva lot messier for Goodell and to start to re-frame things again. He can also bring forward the challenge to test balls during the 2015 season to actually prove one way or another if the air pressure is affected by environmental conditions.

Now that he is come out and acknowledged his mistake, the media is going to jump on anything and everything that he says (directly or indirectly). The game is on again.

See, now I think this is far far more likely and practical than dropping dirt on other owners because he is far too smart and calculating to do that.
 
I can definitely see him being a thorn in Goodell's side at every turn going forward.

 

[nighthob]

OK, it was all in the ball preparation section, here are the footnotes.
 

Footnote 11 page 35
The guidelines stated that: “Prior to each game, a team‟s equipment manager will prepare 12 footballs to be used for non-kicking downs. The footballs will have the prior approval of the team‟s quarterback, who can briefly test them the preceding week, but the balls cannot be used during midweek or pregame practice sessions. These footballs will be delivered to the officials‟ locker room two hours and 15 minutes prior to game time. The Referee will insure that they are properly inflated and give final approval for their use. Game balls approved for a previous game can be submitted, provided they meet the standards of a new ball. The home team will prepare another 12 balls in the event of inclement weather or other reasons.” Under the current guidelines, a referee also may reject footballs in the course of a game if he determines that they are in “unsatisfactory condition.”

Footnote 21 page 41
During our investigation, we also obtained information concerning the football preparation process used by the Colts. Colts personnel informed us that, like the Patriots, they take new footballs and rub them with a wet or warm towel to remove the outer preservative, followed by brushing with the same brushes provided by Wilson. Footballs are then used during practice, with the expectation that normal wear and tear on the footballs, and their interaction with players‟ sweat, will help break in the balls. Sean Sullivan, the Colts Equipment Manager, explained that, in his view, the best way to soften the leather is for the footballs to interact with sweat during practice and then get baked in the sun. The Colts repeat the brushing and baking process, and continue to practice with the footballs as they are broken in, until they reach a certain point, when they will be set aside for potential game use. The footballs will be inflated to a pressure between 12.9 and 13.05 psi prior to being inspected by Colts quarterback Andrew Luck, who typically selects his game balls two days before each game. The designated balls are placed into ball bags and kept locked in the Colts equipment room until their pressure is checked again shortly before being delivered to the game officials.

 

[ivanvamp]

 
No, dude, see. The problem isn't deflating footballs. It's the cover up.
 
Just like when your girlfriend gets all over you for an innocuous comment, you say something dumb in frustration, and now she cries because of how you treated her, even though the original offense was minuscule at best. The league and opposite fans know that even if true, deflating footballs is something extremely minor, but now they have this supposed cover up by the Patriots to justify the hatred and the sanctions. 

 
In all honesty, there's a lot of truth to this.  Imagine if Brady had just said right at the beginning, "yeah I tell the ball guys I want them as low as possible, right to the 12.5 number the rulebook allows.  I guess it's possible that on occasion if the refs give the balls to them higher than that they may think, geez, Tom likes them at 12.5 so we need to do something about that.  If they did that that's unfortunate, and you'll have to talk to them about it, but obviously I never would have told them to do THAT."
 
If that was how Brady responded initially, there's probably a fair chance this blows over fairly quickly.  I'm not certain it would, but there's a fair chance of it.

 

[djhb20]

Was t the guy from last night just pointing out the hypocrisy of the NFL's position. If it is as bad as the NFL suggests, then hey should - to be consistent - vacate everything.

I mean, the NFL is treating this as akin to the Black Sox scandal, for gods sake. A team-wide (players and staff) conspiracy to gain a competitive advantage by breaking the rules and then lying repeatedly to hide said conspiracy. And the illegal advantage occurred (allegedly) in the AFC championship game. In many many contexts, a team that - for example - uses an illegible player in a game has to vacate victories in which he played. In that context, the punishment could be seen as inconsistent and under punishment, given the NFL's point of view.

Of course, that point of view is FUCKING INSANE, but that's the point.

 

[ivanvamp]

OK, it was all in the ball preparation section, here are the footnotes.
 
 

 
Great find nighthob.  Not that it will change a damned thing, but still.  I do think it's a good question as to whether Kessler could use this on Brady's behalf, to show that the league is not being impartial and fair, and is only applying rules in an ad hoc fashion.  Because it's patently obvious that's what's happening.

 

[HomeBrew1901]

 
In all honesty, there's a lot of truth to this.  Imagine if Brady had just said right at the beginning, "yeah I tell the ball guys I want them as low as possible, right to the 12.5 number the rulebook allows.  I guess it's possible that on occasion if the refs give the balls to them higher than that they may think, geez, Tom likes them at 12.5 so we need to do something about that.  If they did that that's unfortunate, and you'll have to talk to them about it, but obviously I never would have told them to do THAT."
 
If that was how Brady responded initially, there's probably a fair chance this blows over fairly quickly.  I'm not certain it would, but there's a fair chance of it.

Not a doubt in my mind that if this is what happened, even after the Superbowl, Brady would have been given a fine and this would be all over with.
 
Instead it turned into a battle of egos with both sides digging in and became a clown show that, realistically, everyone thinks is dumb.

 

[tims4wins]

 
Great find nighthob.  Not that it will change a damned thing, but still.  I do think it's a good question as to whether Kessler could use this on Brady's behalf, to show that the league is not being impartial and fair, and is only applying rules in an ad hoc fashion.  Because it's patently obvious that's what's happening.

 
As far as law of the shop goes, could this be admitted as evidence?

 

[drbretto]

 
In all honesty, there's a lot of truth to this.  Imagine if Brady had just said right at the beginning, "yeah I tell the ball guys I want them as low as possible, right to the 12.5 number the rulebook allows.  I guess it's possible that on occasion if the refs give the balls to them higher than that they may think, geez, Tom likes them at 12.5 so we need to do something about that.  If they did that that's unfortunate, and you'll have to talk to them about it, but obviously I never would have told them to do THAT."
 
If that was how Brady responded initially, there's probably a fair chance this blows over fairly quickly.  I'm not certain it would, but there's a fair chance of it.

 
Well, he did say that he likes his balls right at 12.5. The only thing he didn't do there was hypothetically throw the ballboys under the bus. I have no problem with anything Brady has said so far. There was nothing he could do to prevent all of this without admitting guilt. And if he's genuinely not guilty (which seems like the most likely option given all of the evidence), then there's no way he should have said anything like that. It's not ok all of a sudden that a wrongfully accused person wrongfully accuses someone else just so the heat is misdirected. If nothing happened, nothing happened and that should have been that.

 

[amarshal2]

[SIZE=10.5pt]Calling on you smart people of SoSH with your strong logical reasoning skills. [/SIZE]
 
[SIZE=10.5pt]I've thought a lot about the cell phone.  When I think critically about it, it’s so bad only an innocent person oblivious of what awaited them could make the mistake.  [/SIZE]
 
[SIZE=10.5pt]Largely, there’s only two types of people who destroy evidence:[/SIZE]
 
[SIZE=10.5pt]1.    [/SIZE][SIZE=10.5pt]People hiding something[/SIZE]
[SIZE=10.5pt]2.    [/SIZE][SIZE=10.5pt]People not hiding something[/SIZE]
 
[SIZE=10.5pt]Said differently…[/SIZE]
[SIZE=10.5pt]1. People who are trying to hide evidence they fear will come to light. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=10.5pt]2. And people who are ignorant of the fact that what they are doing will come back to haunt them. [/SIZE]
 
[SIZE=10.5pt]The only way #1 makes sense is if Brady knew he was going to be found guilty of influencing ball pressure by the league (despite knowing that they would have zero evidence linking him to it) and was afraid his phone would be discoverable thereby incriminating him.  But this requires him to be oblivious of the fact that he would never have to produce his phone.  He would clearly have to think there was something to be gained by destroying his phone or else he doesn’t do it.   Right?[/SIZE]
 
[SIZE=10.5pt]But it’s illogical to think that Brady didn’t consult his lawyers first.  The timing suggests that they had already told the NFL he was not going to produce his phone.  Therefore, it is illogical that he thought he was gaining something in a future legal battle by destroying his phone. [/SIZE]
 
[SIZE=10.5pt]Therefore, it’s really tough logic to put Brady in box #1.  He never would have had to turn over his phone unless he himself chose to sue the league for defamation.  For him, destroying his phone offered zero upside.  Only someone completely ignorant of what awaited them would make that choice.[/SIZE]
 
[SIZE=10.5pt]What's wrong with my logic?  What logic is more believable?[/SIZE]

 

[SeoulSoxFan]

Reading Kraft's statement does not do it full justice (no pun intended).
 
See the actual video. He is PISSED OFF:
 
http://www.patriots.com/video/2015/07/29/new-england-patriots-owner-robert-kraft-i-unequivocally-support-new-england

 

[Corsi]

Boston Herald Radio ‏@HeraldRadio  6m6 minutes agoBoston, MA
Exclusive:@realDonaldTrump says he told Brady to sue for $500 mil.Tom told him on the phone yesterday"You were right"

 

[Harry Hooper]

"I was wrong to put my faith in the league." Wow. Love this. 

 
Gee, Bob, what evidence did you have to believe these were trustworthy people?

 

[MuppetAsteriskTalk]

Not a doubt in my mind that if this is what happened, even after the Superbowl, Brady would have been given a fine and this would be all over with.
 
Instead it turned into a battle of egos with both sides digging in and became a clown show that, realistically, everyone thinks is dumb.

 
I'm sorry but you are naive.
 
All you need to do is look back at SPYGATE to see why you're wrong.

 

[nighthob]

No, dude, see. The problem isn't deflating footballs. It's the cover up.
 
Just like when your girlfriend gets all over you for an innocuous comment, you say something dumb in frustration, and now she cries because of how you treated her, even though the original offense was minuscule at best. The league and opposite fans know that even if true, deflating footballs is something extremely minor, but now they have this supposed cover up by the Patriots to justify the hatred and the sanctions.

In fairness to Brady the NFL went nuclear from the getgo, so I actually don't think there was a chance to defuse this. The NFL's leaking of incorrect data, and doubling down on it, and forbidding the Patriots from correcting it, I'm not sure there was ever a way out. In retrospect this looks an awful lot like the Artless Roger waking up to a shitbomb, and then realising that he had the perfect vehicle to pay Brady back for crossing the NFL during the lockout.

 

[HomeBrew1901]

 
I'm sorry but you are naive.
 
All you need to do is look back at SPYGATE to see why you're wrong.

Says the guy that expects Kraft to go scorched earth on the other 31 owners.

 

[dcmissle]

 
The Krafts are set for many generations, and their legacy is secured in their homeland. The NFL has already ruined the legacy of a team he's worked hard to bring to greatness, and that of his head coach and QB. It's possible, at this stage in life, that Bob doesn't feel that he needs to be an NFL owner anymore, especially given how the league has treated him after all he's done. Jonathan would obviously be his concern, but who knows what he wants, given his tempermental and apparently vengeful nature.
 
It has to at least be tempting to him, particularly as it pertains to Goodell. I assume he'd lay off the other owners.

If you are going to sell, you don't trash -- you get out quietly to maximIze asset value.

And how would this benefit us fans, apart from the ephemeral emotional satisfaction? Bob Kraft has been an ideal owner.! The only wart I can think of is his support of RG.

 

[Hoya81]

 
In all honesty, there's a lot of truth to this.  Imagine if Brady had just said right at the beginning, "yeah I tell the ball guys I want them as low as possible, right to the 12.5 number the rulebook allows.  I guess it's possible that on occasion if the refs give the balls to them higher than that they may think, geez, Tom likes them at 12.5 so we need to do something about that.  If they did that that's unfortunate, and you'll have to talk to them about it, but obviously I never would have told them to do THAT."
 
If that was how Brady responded initially, there's probably a fair chance this blows over fairly quickly.  I'm not certain it would, but there's a fair chance of it.

Brady has had the opportunity to sacrifice JJ and JM in order to save himself and has gone out of his way to avoid that.

 

[rodderick]

 
In all honesty, there's a lot of truth to this.  Imagine if Brady had just said right at the beginning, "yeah I tell the ball guys I want them as low as possible, right to the 12.5 number the rulebook allows.  I guess it's possible that on occasion if the refs give the balls to them higher than that they may think, geez, Tom likes them at 12.5 so we need to do something about that.  If they did that that's unfortunate, and you'll have to talk to them about it, but obviously I never would have told them to do THAT."
 
If that was how Brady responded initially, there's probably a fair chance this blows over fairly quickly.  I'm not certain it would, but there's a fair chance of it.

 
He probably asked the guys if they messed with the balls (why else would he contact Jastremski after the investigation started?), and they likely said they didn't. In that case, I don't want Tom to throw low level team employees under the bus to save his own ass.

 

[mt8thsw9th]

Not going to give this guy any clicks, and you can Google it if you'd like, but this is possibly the stupidest thing I've ever read about anything ever.
 

This cheating involved a needle, which supplies some symmetry. Brady was playing with a football on Nandrolone.
 

 

[MuppetAsteriskTalk]

Says the guy that expects Kraft to go scorched earth on the other 31 owners.

 
It's a fact that the Patriots handled Spygate in the manner in which you suggest would lead to no bog shits coming from it. What happened there Mr. Reasonable?

 

[LuckyBen]

Says the guy that expects Kraft to go scorched earth on the other 31 owners.

In fairness, you say Goodell and the NFL would've been fair and impartial which is far more outrageous. This is and has always been about damaging the Patriots b

 

[lexrageorge]

Anyone seriously thinking that Kraft's statements will somehow lead to his ouster is completely delusional.  Kraft has every right to say what he said.  
 
I doubt he's going to "do" anything, as there is really not much nothing he can do.  But I wouldn't be completely surprised if he tells Goodell to go F off next time there's a controversy.