#DFG: Canceling the Noise

[RedOctober3829]

 
Come on, get off of it.
 
I am neither a Pats fan nor a hater, although I lean more toward rooting for the Pats because I have so many friends, including many here, who are big Pats fans.
 
But the persecution complex reeeeeeallllly needs to get dialed down, like, a ton.  EVERYBODEY HAT5S US!11!! (the unspoken corollary: because we're sooo special)
 
I agree that Spygate was way overblown, but it's part of a pattern of hamhanded discipline (coupled with something-less-than-transparency) that is characteristic of the Goodell regime generally.  Go ask Sean Payton if the Pats are singled out by the league.
 
I mean this affectionately: you guys sound like SEC fans.

Fans being sensitive to this kind of thing is understandable given the amount of times these kind of idiotic claims are made.  It reeks of "well we weren't good enough to beat them so they must be doing something outside of the rules to do it".

 

[JimD]

At some point, I would hope Kraft throws his weight around with Goodell and tells the NFL to VERY STRONGLY refute this.

 
More importantly, Kraft or someone needs to remind Goodell that it does nothing good for the integrity of The ShieldTM if an ever-increasing number of fans and media are allowed to throw accusation after accusation against the league's most successful team of the 21st century, its all-time winningest playoff coach and its all-time leading playoff passing quarterback.  Nor is it any good to allow the perception to fester that game balls can be so easily doctored.  If there is nothing to this, a one-line statement will not do - he absolutely needs to send a clear and strong message that the league and its teams compete fairly.

 

[Infield Infidel]

 
Come on, get off of it.
 
I am neither a Pats fan nor a hater, although I lean more toward rooting for the Pats because I have so many friends, including many here, who are big Pats fans.
 
But the persecution complex reeeeeeallllly needs to get dialed down, like, a ton.  EVERYBODEY HAT5S US!11!! (the unspoken corollary: because we're sooo special)
 
I agree that Spygate was way overblown, but it's part of a pattern of hamhanded discipline (coupled with something-less-than-transparency) that is characteristic of the Goodell regime generally.  Go ask Sean Payton if the Pats are singled out by the league.  Edit: or Pete Carroll, for extra practices.
 
I mean this affectionately: you guys sound like SEC fans.

 
You can throw out everything that happened pre-2015 and still be annoyed that it's two consecutive weeks with this nonsense. 

 

[Hendu for Kutch]

 
Come on, get off of it.
 
I am neither a Pats fan nor a hater, although I lean more toward rooting for the Pats because I have so many friends, including many here, who are big Pats fans.
 
But the persecution complex reeeeeeallllly needs to get dialed down, like, a ton.  EVERYBODEY HAT5S US!11!! (the unspoken corollary: because we're sooo special)
 
I agree that Spygate was way overblown, but it's part of a pattern of hamhanded discipline (coupled with something-less-than-transparency) that is characteristic of the Goodell regime generally.  Go ask Sean Payton if the Pats are singled out by the league.
 
I mean this affectionately: you guys sound like SEC fans.

 
It's not the league, it's the media and by extension the fans (although Goodell is partially responsible for that with his Draconian "look how tough I am" bullshit back in '07).  How many stories have there been recently that either accused the Pats of cheating, doing something underhanded, or getting favorable treatment from the refs/league?  And I'm not talking about one crazy guy spouting off, I'm talking front page of Yahoo level stories?  Off the top of my head just this season:
 
- The ref moved Hightower to save the Patriots from a penalty!  (Not prominently mentioned, this happens multiple times every week across the league).
- The Patriots cheated by using an illegal formation to block a FG!  (not prominently mentioned, the formation was not at all illegal)
- The Patriots were running immoral formations that were deceptive!  (not prominently mentioned, 90% of football is about deception)
- The Patriots were messing with the game balls!  (not prominently mentioned - how they did this and why)

 

[PayrodsFirstClutchHit]

Breaking News:  Rolling Stone has hired Bob Kravitz to head their investigative reporting division.

 

[OCST]

 
More importantly, Kraft or someone needs to remind Goodell that it does nothing good for the integrity of The ShieldTMif an ever-increasing number of fans and media are allowed to throw accusation after accusation against the league's most successful team of the 21st century, its all-time winningest playoff coach and its all-time leading playoff passing quarterback.  Nor is it any good to allow the perception to fester that game balls can be so easily doctored.  If there is nothing to this, a one-line statement will not do - he absolutely needs to send a clear and strong message that the league and its teams compete fairly.

 

 

[Zomp]

Fans being sensitive to this kind of thing is understandable given the amount of times these kind of idiotic claims are made.  It reeks of "well we weren't good enough to beat them so they must be doing something outside of the rules to do it".

 
But the Colts haven't said anything

 

[johnmd20]

 

 
The facts listed are irrefutable, however. That wasn't hyperbole.

 

[pedroia'sboys]

Day after winning the AFC championship supposed to enjoy what the team accomplished, could watch highlights all day. No now I can't turn on the goddamn TV because of this bullshit.

 

[dcmissle]

Fans being sensitive to this kind of thing is understandable given the amount of times these kind of idiotic claims are made.  It reeks of "well we weren't good enough to beat them so they must be doing something outside of the rules to do it".

Right. But as we tell our kids, stupid shit you do can really come back to haunt you. Excellence is deeply resented, and what we have is beyond excellence. Just ponder that Mike McCarthy is League average and may even be better.

It's a perfect storm, with 24/7 coverage, space to fill and outfits like Deadspin looking for the scandal of the century. And the NFL Office contributes through sheer incompetence.

If I'm Goodell, I clean this up quickly and have every effing thing on lock down the next two weeks -- practices and who gets into them, filming, electronic communications, "ball security", you name it. I can't promise, though, that the NFL can do this to ensure a clean ending.

 

[soxfan121]

I think that hunters shot the balls that Luck threw up there.  They were mistaking them for ducks.

 

It was this fuckin guy.

 

[Norm Siebern]

I think the point is not that Patriots fans feel persecuted by the league, but that the way the media and other fan bases takes this and runs with it is over the top and absurd. Your very examples prove this. When Pete Carroll breaks rules, they are discussed for an hour, then go away. There is no constant harping after every game that the Seahawks win because they cheat. There were no headlines today claiming the Seahawks won yesterday because they benefitted from extra practice time, extra practice time that is against the rules, ergo the Seahawks cheated yesterday. The Seahawks success is not demeaned. The Seahawks are given credit for their win. But when to comes to the Patriots, that credit is denied. 
 
Does this make me, and I assume other Patriots fans hypersensitive? For me, yes. I am hypersensitive to these charges because it demeans the success of the Patriots, while other organizations skate with far worse offenses. 
 
 
 
 
Edit. Beacuse I can't type for shit.

 

[Drocca]

The games are fun as hell to watch. Everything else about the NFL, particularly the coverage and subsequent commentary on the coverage, is the worst aspect of any major American sport.

 

[Zomp]

 
You can throw out everything that happened pre-2015 and still be annoyed that it's two consecutive weeks with this nonsense. 

 
But who should you be annoyed at?  I don't think the media is at fault for the two consecutive weeks.  I think they've treated the Pats fairly on the Ravens story and until ESPN, SI, and  other major sports outlets do anything but report what's happening (and so far what I've heard on the radio is nothing but people dismiss the claim as anything but ridiculous) with this story I think any worrying about how the Pats are being persecuted is over the top.

 

[ifmanis5]

Here's the current AP story:
 

NEW YORK (AP) — NFL spokesman Brian McCarthy says the NFL is investigating whether the Patriots deflated footballs used in their AFC championship game victory over the Colts.
 
McCarthy said Monday morning he cannot provide any other information now.
The inquiry was first reported by the website for WTHR-TV in Indiana, citing an unnamed source.
The NFL rule book says "it is the responsibility of the home team to furnish playable balls at all times."
The game operations manual notes that people who alter footballs or allow an unapproved football to be used in a game can be disciplined with fines or other punishments.

 

 

[lexrageorge]

It is undeniably true that if there were reports about deflated balls in the Seattle-Green Bay game, the story would be buried at the bottom of a couple of wire reports.  The fact that it's the Pats gives it more legs, and the reasons are well known:  Pats long term success, the media's relationship with Belichick, and the whole Spygate fiasco.  And the media is lazy, so it's easy for them to make statements about "past history with this organization", "taped practices", and other nonsense that is either untrue or simply inflammatory.  
 
As things go, this story should be #98734 in the Top 10 list of daily annoyances.  But it's not, and some of that is because every mediot in every corner of the blogosphere has to weigh in and add their own tired reference to Spygate. 

 

[ObstructedView]

Shefter was just on ESPN and claimed that this all started during the regular-season Pats-Colts game, when the Colts felt after interceptions that the ball seemed under-inflated. Then after last night's pick they had the same thought and asked for it to be looked into. If true, this contradicts the notion that the Colts as a team had nothing to do with this. They may regret that it's become a big story, but they seem to have initiated it.

 

[teddywingman]

I don't really even give a shit; but my FB feed this morning is so much more intolerable than usual.
 
Even some of the people that I like are talking about how the cheaters don't deserve to play in the super bowl.
 
Edit: So I'm sorry if this has been mentioned before--but this story indicates to me--more than anything else--that the NFL is generating stories to increase the casual fan's interest level.

 

[Reggie's Racquet]

NFL now says Katy Perry will check all balls at halftime of the SuperBowl. This could get interesting.

 

[Smiling Joe Hesketh]

Shefter was just on ESPN and claimed that this all started during the regular-season Pats-Colts game, when the Colts felt after interceptions that the ball seemed under-inflated. Then after last night's pick they had the same thought and asked for it to be looked into. If true, this contradicts the notion that the Colts as a team had nothing to do with this. They may regret that it's become a big story, but they seem to have initiated it.

 
Eh, what? The regular season game was in Indy. Aren't the game balls supplied by the home team?

 

[dcmissle]

Here's the current AP story:

Again, I suspect they are testing the balls right now. Any delay just prolongs this and fuels an argument that the balls deflated with the passage of time.

 

[ObstructedView]

 
Eh, what? The regular season game was in Indy. Aren't the game balls supplied by the home team?

I've heard it explained a few times this morning that each team provides its own supply of balls. They're submitted, inspected and secured a couple hours prior to kickoff.

 

[CoffeeNerdness]

So they took out the first ball for the second half because the Colts complained and not because of any abnormality that Coleman perceived.

 

[Jnai]

 
Eh, what? The regular season game was in Indy. Aren't the game balls supplied by the home team?

 
No. Check this article:
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/11/24/sports/football/eli-mannings-footballs-are-months-in-making.html
 

EAST RUTHERFORD, N.J. — When Eli Manning drops back to throw his first pass Sunday against the Dallas Cowboys, the football in his hands will be as familiar as an old friend.

That is because the ball has been scoured, scrubbed, soaked and seasoned, a breaking-in process that takes months and ensures that every ball used by the Giants in a game will meet Manning’s exact preferences. The leather will have been softened, the grip enhanced and the overall feel painstakingly assessed.

There are no new balls thrown around in an N.F.L. game. A new ball, despised for its sheen and waxy gloss, is as popular as a late hit.

For every N.F.L. game, each team has 12 to 20 balls that it has meticulously groomed and prepared according to the needs of its starting quarterback. The balls, brushed and primed using various obvious and semisecret techniques, bear the team logo and are switched out from sideline to sideline depending on which team is on offense.

That means that from series to series, the ball in play can feel wholly different, but each team’s quarterback always has a ball prepped by his equipment staff the way he likes it.

 

[DJnVa]

 
Eh, what? The regular season game was in Indy. Aren't the game balls supplied by the home team?

 
NFL.com:
 

Per the NFL rulebook, game balls must be inflated with between 12.5-13.5 pounds of air. Each team must provide 12 primary balls for testing prior to the game.
 

 

 

[Kull]

The best part is that a (presumed) proclamation of innocence will come from Goodell. Who has very little credibility right now.

 

[DJnVa]

That means that from series to series, the ball in play can feel wholly different, but each team’s quarterback always has a ball prepped by his equipment staff the way he likes it.
 

 
So the Colts said they felt underinflated. Which may because within the range of legal inflation amounts, Brady prefers it a bit easier to grip than Luck so they're not used to that.
 
Just like in baseball, a complaint that a bat is corked doesn't make it so, but the league has to test.

 

[Omar's Wacky Neighbor]

What I don't get:  how did the officials not notice the ball(s) was repeatedly under-inflated?  I know dozens of pre-teen soccer players who can pick up a ball and tell you instantly if it's under-inflated or over-inflated.  But a group of 50 y/o men who have been doing this professionally for years and make insane money to officiate, didnt find anything odd with the balls.
 
Best comment I've seen at TGG.  In my heart of hearts, I want to believe this was a joke, but it's an odd world we live in:
 

Makes you wonder why they chose when they did to bring tampering charges against the Jets..did they know they would get caught here?
 

 

[Morning Woodhead]

Just so I'm clear.  Luck drops a perfect sideline pass to Hilton, that ball is just fine.  Luck floats a duck to Revis, it's been sabotaged. 

 

[OCST]

 
But who should you be annoyed at?  I don't think the media is at fault for the two consecutive weeks.  I think they've treated the Pats fairly on the Ravens story and until ESPN, SI, and  other major sports outlets do anything but report what's happening (and so far what I've heard on the radio is nothing but people dismiss the claim as anything but ridiculous) with this story I think any worrying about how the Pats are being persecuted is over the top.

 
This.
 
The only person that I know of who carped about the legality of the formation in the Ravens game was Harbaugh, and since we can agree that "Harbaugh" is Serbo-Croatian for "douchenozzle," that can be chalked up to him being a fool and a bad sport.  The consensus of the media I saw on the issue said that the Patriots did nothing wrong, that it was perfectly legal, that other teams had done the same thing, and good for the Patriots. There was no one in an official capacity, not a game official or a league official, who said anything to the contrary (that I'm aware of).  So if there were isolated media voices who said anything (and I'm not even aware of anything), who gives a shit?  There's not 100% unanimity on anything.  Every few months, some guy pops up saying things like slavery was good for the slaves, the Holocaust never happened, etc.
 
And on the inflation thing, there is A (singular) report of an (anonymous) source saying that there MAY have been underinflated balls used, and a possible instance of one ball being taken out of play in the third quarter, with an acknowledgement that a) sometimes balls lose pressure, just because; b) there is a procedure for checking and safeguarding balls, so any tampering would have been difficult; c) everyone acknowledges that the game was a complete asskicking, and there's no way that a deflated ball made a difference?
 
And this is persecution?
 
Really??????
 
Dumb shit from fans of other teams on Facebook really gives you that much of an owie?
 
You guys need some real problems. 

 

[kenneycb]

Just so I'm clear.  Luck drops a perfect sideline pass to Hilton, that ball is just fine.  Luck floats a duck to Revis, it's been sabotaged. 

You're not clear.  They're saying the balls the Patriots used on offense were deflated.

 

[Red(s)HawksFan]

You're not clear.  They're saying the balls the Patriots used on offense were deflated.

 
Yeah, so a TD pass to Nate Solder...deflated.  Incompletions in the end zone by Gronk...inflated.

 

[LuckyBen]

You're not clear.  They're saying the balls the Patriots used on offense were deflated.

Were all of the balls deflated? The game went on, so obviously the rest of the balls were fine.

 

[CallYaz]

On the punt that bounced off the Indy guys head would it be a Pats or Indy ball?

Anyone have a screen cap of that moment as I want to send to my Pat hater friend when he texts me later today.

 

[Jnai]

On the punt that bounced off the Indy guys head would it be a Pats or Indy ball?

Anyone have a screen cap of that moment as I want to send to my Pat hater friend when he texts me later today.

 
Either a Pats ball or Kicking ball, but I'm pretty sure Kicking ball.

 

[ScubaSteveAvery]

This reminds me of when the Patriots were accused of keeping the mic on defensive players so coaches could hear audibles, and tampering with sideline communications systems by making them malfunction for opposing teams. 
 
All accusations that were absurd and turned out to be false. 

 

[Youkilis vs Wild]

On the punt that bounced off the Indy guys head would it be a Pats or Indy ball?

Anyone have a screen cap of that moment as I want to send to my Pat hater friend when he texts me later today.

I think the rules are saying all balls in the kicking game are separate from the balls supplied for each team, right?

 

[rodderick]

 
This.
 
The only person that I know of who carped about the legality of the formation in the Ravens game was Harbaugh, and since we can agree that "Harbaugh" is Serbo-Croatian for "douchenozzle," that can be chalked up to him being a fool and a bad sport.  The consensus of the media I saw on the issue said that the Patriots did nothing wrong, that it was perfectly legal, that other teams had done the same thing, and good for the Patriots. There was no one in an official capacity, not a game official or a league official, who said anything to the contrary (that I'm aware of).  So if there were isolated media voices who said anything (and I'm not even aware of anything), who gives a shit?  There's not 100% unanimity on anything.  Every few months, some guy pops up saying things like slavery was good for the slaves, the Holocaust never happened, etc.
 
And on the inflation thing, there is A (singular) report of an (anonymous) source saying that there MAY have been underinflated balls used, and a possible instance of one ball being taken out of play in the third quarter, with an acknowledgement that a) sometimes balls lose pressure, just because; b) there is a procedure for checking and safeguarding balls, so any tampering would have been difficult; c) everyone acknowledges that the game was a complete asskicking, and there's no way that a deflated ball made a difference?
 
And this is persecution?
 
Really??????
 
Dumb shit from fans of other teams on Facebook really gives you that much of an owie?
 
You guys need some real problems. 

 
Is this the "I'm not a Pats fan, but I'm going to get on my soap box and tell all of you Pats fans how you are supposed to feel" hour?

 

[soxfanSJCA]

The Colts fans definitely experienced cheating yesterday- they were cheated by the Colts coaching staff, the Colts offense, the Colts defense and the Colts special team.
Colts fans were cheated in all 3 phases of the game yesterday.
They were cheated so badly, that the abundance of suck can not be contained internally, they have achieved critical-suck, and this is the "fallout"
There are more holes in the deflate story than the Colts plan of attack yesterday.
 
This does not taint the Patriots, it taints the Colts fans and the hysterical media.
 
I for one appreciate deflate gate, as now I don't have to feel bad about yesterday's score, or Indy fans kind and well informed or not.
 
Just like that, i can now completely enjoy yesterdays beatdown that much more.
As a value add, BB now has primo bulletin board material for the next 2 weeks:  The Patriots are not just competing in the SB, they are playing for Truth, Justice, and The American way.
 
 
 

 

[SidelineCameras]

What I'm gathering from all of this is that I have to change my handle to Sideline Air Deflators.

 

[DJnVa]

 
Really??????
 
Dumb shit from fans of other teams on Facebook really gives you that much of an owie?
 
You guys need some real problems. 

 

This is a message board where we all waste time talking about stupid shit. There's a fucking thread here about price fixing on contact lenses.

 

[DJnVa]

 
Either a Pats ball or Kicking ball, but I'm pretty sure Kicking ball.

 
 
So if you want to pull off a fake, you are using the harder kicking balls?
 

 

[Leather]

A

 

[Red(s)HawksFan]

 
 
So if you want to pull off a fake, you are using the harder kicking balls?
 

 
I would think so, otherwise an observant nose tackle is going to give the game away pretty quick.
 
You think Jon Ryan throws that floaty duck pass with a real game ball?

 

[Infield Infidel]

 
But who should you be annoyed at?  I don't think the media is at fault for the two consecutive weeks.  I think they've treated the Pats fairly on the Ravens story and until ESPN, SI, and  other major sports outlets do anything but report what's happening (and so far what I've heard on the radio is nothing but people dismiss the claim as anything but ridiculous) with this story I think any worrying about how the Pats are being persecuted is over the top.

 
For me, It's not really about the Pats being persecuted, it's about battling back nonsense week after week. The nonsense throwers usually either a) are blowhards (harbaugh), or b) know that it's nonsense and don't care. Since it's the Pats, it gets inflated in the sportsosphere to the nth degree, no matter how substantive it is.  As a fan, it makes it impossible to just sit back and enjoy a win. To think that fans can just laugh it off, when every aspect of our lives today are interconnected, is unrealistic. 
 
edit- Yes I'm happy the Pats won, but this isn't how I hoped the two weeks going into the super bowl would start

 

[ivanvamp]

Shefter was just on ESPN and claimed that this all started during the regular-season Pats-Colts game, when the Colts felt after interceptions that the ball seemed under-inflated. Then after last night's pick they had the same thought and asked for it to be looked into. If true, this contradicts the notion that the Colts as a team had nothing to do with this. They may regret that it's become a big story, but they seem to have initiated it.

The regular season game was in Indy, so if the home team is responsible for that would it be fair to accuse them of trying to cheat?

Good grief.

 

[Al Zarilla]

Maybe somebody said this already, but the last time the Patriots were accused of something, in 2007 (or was that the last time?), they came out and smoked 8 teams in a row. Do this to the Seahacks, please. Seahacks because Matt Chatham mistakenly called them that on NESN today. Tee hee.
 
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/nwe/2007.htm

 

[OCST]

 
Is this the "I'm not a Pats fan, but I'm going to get on my soap box and tell all of you Pats fans how you are supposed to feel" hour?

 
The consensus here (rightly) is that this is complete and total bullshit.  Correct?
 
Isn't the next logical step, then: "so how come you guys are so fucking wound up about it?"
 
As said before, on a 1-10 scale, with 1 being a Patriots hater and 10 a total Pats fanboy, you can probably call me a soft 6 1/2, so I'm not trying to crap on the Patriots.
 
From a relatively neutral and disinterested standpoint, I'm saying that the concerns I'm seeing here are way overwrought, and should pale next to your satisfaction over completely kicking ass in the AFCCG and going on to Seattle.  If that's "getting on a soapbox" and "telling you how you are supposed to feel," guilty as charged, I guess.
 
I'm not trying to troll, so I'll bow out.

 

[OCST]

A

 
Outstanding.

 

[DJnVa]

 
 
 
Isn't the next logical step, then: "so how come you guys are so fucking wound up about it?"

 

Because it would be nice to pull up websites that discuss sports and read about the actual game or matchup and not what the latest "-gate" is.
 
 

The regular season game was in Indy, so if the home team is responsible for that would it be fair to accuse them of trying to cheat?

Good grief.
 

 
 
 
No. Each team provides 12 balls.  http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000460728/article/nfl-looking-into-pats-possible-use-of-deflated-balls
 

Per the NFL rulebook, game balls must be inflated with between 12.5-13.5 pounds of air. Each team must provide 12 primary balls for testing prior to the game.