Elite 8 Thread

Marciano490

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I remember. You’re the only person I ever met who didn’t love life as an undergrad in C’ville.
Eh, I lived in some international dorm like a mile and a half from campus and I didn’t drink in college because of boxing. I liked second year better when I was in Lambeth, but by then I’d committed to transferring because there were no good boxing gyms down there.
 

VORP Speed

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Eh, I lived in some international dorm like a mile and a half from campus and I didn’t drink in college because of boxing. I liked second year better when I was in Lambeth, but by then I’d committed to transferring because there were no good boxing gyms down there.
You were just 75 years too late. UVA dominated college boxing when that used to be a big deal way back when. They used to pack the house up to the rafters every week in the old mem gym.
 

Kliq

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I have no skin in the game but people have been delighted today in using yesterday's loss as a reason to dunk all over Coach K. I get it, but I want to push back on the notion that K had an unbelievably talented team that somehow bottled it across the finish line. Yes Duke had a great recruiting class, and may have three of the top five picks in the draft, but I was never blown away by Duke's talent. They were a very shallow team, relying on Alex O'Connell and Jack White and other limited players to play big minutes. While Reddish came in highly touted, the fact is he wasn't a particularly outstanding player this season and I'm not sure how much that can be pinned on Coach K. Yes they had Zion and Barrett, but the team that often has the best player in college basketball also doesn't win the championship.

It wasn't that long ago that a lot of people assumed you couldn't win a championship with a team built around freshmen players, but that changed a few years ago. Now people seem to expect that having a few top NBA picks makes you the prohibitive favorite, even if you are a team like Duke that really only had four or five above average players.
 

tims4wins

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Not too many freshmen led teams have won it all really. I think UK did it once and Duke did it once. Pretty much every other title team has been older, right?

Edit: correct me if I am wrong:
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2003 Syracuse veteran* + Melo
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No point really going back beyond that. The top recruited classes rarely win, it is veteran teams for the vast majority of titles.
 
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Kliq

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Not too many freshmen led teams have won it all really. I think UK did it once and Duke did it once. Pretty much every other title team has been older, right?
Yes, the Davis-led Kentucky team and then the Okafor/Winslow/Allen Duke team are the only ones I can think of. It just isn't as easy to win with freshmen as I think some people think; so I don't really see yesterday as a colossal failure for K.
 

tims4wins

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Yes, the Davis-led Kentucky team and then the Okafor/Winslow/Allen Duke team are the only ones I can think of. It just isn't as easy to win with freshmen as I think some people think; so I don't really see yesterday as a colossal failure for K.
The failure for K is not getting Zion more touches late in the game, but at the end of the day Barrett got to the line down by 2 points. He is a better FT shooter than Zion. If Zion had driven and gotten fouled you'd probably expect a similar result, 1-2 from the line.
 

jon abbey

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I’d say it’s a recruiting failure more than a coaching failure, not sure how you can’t get better complementary players to put around the primary 3 or 4 guys.
 

Kliq

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I’d say it’s a recruiting failure more than a coaching failure, not sure how you can’t get better complementary players to put around the primary 3 or 4 guys.
It is probably pretty difficult to balance playing time for depth guys. With so many career options in basketball now (better G league contracts, more interest overseas, etc.) I think any Top 100 recruit is going to be thinking about what college situation is going to be the best to propel them towards a professional career. If you are say, the 65th ranked player in the Class of 2016, you probably wouldn't be that enthusiastic being the 7th man on a Duke team for four years, as a revolving door of top ranked freshmen play in front of you. You are probably better off going to a school like Michigan State, were you can still play a big program but also have the option to climb the depth chart and play really meaningful minutes. Once you get the perception of being THE school for one-and-done players, it is probably difficult to land rotation pieces.
 

tims4wins

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I’d say it’s a recruiting failure more than a coaching failure, not sure how you can’t get better complementary players to put around the primary 3 or 4 guys.
Maybe. Both Jack White and Bolden got hurt late in the year and missed postseason games, as did Reddish. Duke actually had 9 or 10 guys that were playable, they weren't particularly healthy though.
 

Marciano490

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Not too many freshmen led teams have won it all really. I think UK did it once and Duke did it once. Pretty much every other title team has been older, right?

Edit: correct me if I am wrong:
2018 Villanova veteran
2017 UNC veteran
2016 VIllanova veteran
2015 Duke FRESHMEN
2014 UConn veteran
2013 Louisville veteran
2012 UK FRESHMEN
2011 UConn veteran
2010 Duke veteran
2009 UNC veteran
2008 KU veteran
2007 Florida veteran
2006 Florida veteran
2005 UNC veteran
2004 UConn veteran
2003 Syracuse veteran* + Melo
2002 Maryland veteran
2001 Duke veteran
2000 MSU veteran
1999 UConn veteran

No point really going back beyond that. The top recruited classes rarely win, it is veteran teams for the vast majority of titles.
Wasn’t there a rule change though that’s important to note? It’s not like Garnett, Kobe or LeBron played college ball.
 

tims4wins

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Wasn’t there a rule change though that’s important to note? It’s not like Garnett, Kobe or LeBron played college ball.
LeBron was the same year as Luol Deng and Carmelo I think.

Durant didn’t win a title. Or even reach the Sweet 16 I don’t think. Ben Simmons didn’t even make the tournament.

The rule change is irrelevant IMO.