Definitely. Kid's physicals are fantastic, and it's not like has been in a place that would develop him right. It's hard to expect guys that age to fully own their own development. Obviously some do, but man is Orlando kind of a black hole. Great buy low candidate.
ok, but that still compares favorably to more than half the league. Making the playoffs 6 years in a row (out of 8 years in charge; missed in the first 2) without a transcendent talent on the roster (I guess it was Gobert and Mitchell? Some Joe Ingles?) is an accomplishment most coaches don't achieve. It's a consistency that speaks well of team buy-in and health maintenance.
I agree. Making the playoffs 6 straight years *is* a solid job. The "conference semifinal" mention just struck me more like weirdly official NBA-speak (or Indy Colts banner-talk) than how most basketball fans see it (one then done). I know Snyder stepped away, but it seems like more coaches get fired for 6 straight 2nd round exits than get retained for 6 straight playoff appearances.
And this one may surprise some people here... except for Deuce's dad (LFG!)
Well that's a change from the reports yesterday. I don't agree that its a good fit. Atlanta just blew out their GM and coach in the midst of the same season and the chatter is the chemistry there is bad.
If I was the GM, I'd probably agree. It doesn't seem like most NBA organizations see it the same way, though.
The Bulls were 27-13 when he went down last January (and 1st in the conference) and are just 45-56 since then. They always seemed like fools gold so it probably wouldn't have lasted regardless, but that's a rough turnaround for the Bulls.
That Vucevic trade isn’t looking so hot now. Bulls traded Wendell Carter, the pick that became Franz Wagner, and their 2023 first (currently #7). Good thing for Bulls that Magic agreed to top 4 protection on the 2023 pick so the hope of Wembanyama magic is alive.
They did some decent moves in getting DeRozan, Caruso & Lonzo on the cheap.
just robbed them of 3 young, reasonable assets.
I have a hard time complaining about that trade if I’m a Bulls fan. It wasn’t the Vucevic deal that robbed them of assets, it was the heathy of Lonzo, LaVine and Caruso that derailed them from being in the contenders mix. I’d argue that with normal health they wouldn’t be picking 7th this year nor would they have selected Wagner being fully stocked at the wings…..and nobody beneath them would really have made a difference (unless they stretched and picked Sengun 8th).They did some decent moves in getting DeRozan, Caruso & Lonzo on the cheap.
BUT that Vucevic deal
They had no big on the roster and got one of the, if not the, best one available…..and it was working really well. A floor spacing 5 who was among the best at his position in scoring, rebounding and passing. I mean this isn’t some average JAG rotation piece.
Yeah, the Orlando youngs are fine but as complimentary guys, not franchise players. The Bulls rolled the dice on Lonzo and he’s basically done. Looked great when healthy though.
Orlando is definitely not complaining with Franzy, WCJ, and a TOP10 this year. I expect them to be a thorn in Boson's side for the next few seasons.
I think a lot of people around the league would disagree on Franz as a potential franchise guy; he's REALLY good.
Meh...they had Wendell Carter, Lauri Markkanen, Daniel Gafford, Thaddeus Young, Kornet & they landed Daniel Theis for free. A perfectly acceptable BIG rotation.
Yeah, I'm a fan. Of all the teams that where Wemby could [reasonably] land, there is none scarier than Orlando. A Wemby/Paolo/Franz front line for the rest of the decade is pretty scary to think about.
If you view it as “going all in on Vucevic” then feeling this way is natural as I would as well. The process as a whole however was going all in on DeRozan, Ball, Caruso and Vucevic joining LaVine which we saw how good they were pre-injuries.
The Bulls acquired Vuc at the deadline in 2021. They were 19-24 at the time. They didn't acquire Ball/Caruso/DeRozan until the offseason. Are you arguing that they knew they were going to get those guys when they decided to trade two firsts and a guy they had just drafted #7 overall 2 years prior?
Vucevic cannot defend at a position where defense is the most important skill. It's nearly impossible to have a quality defense without a quality big, let alone a sieve like Vuc. The traits you list make him a nice piece, not a foundation of your team.
Your points are fair except the last one. People think all sorts of things about transactions. They tend to remember the good takes and dismiss their bad ones.
I'm criticizing the asset cost (Wendell Carter Jr, Otto Porter, two 1sts) of going and getting Vucevic. I criticized it then and now. No revision is necessary, although some "folks" were pining for Danny to go use similar assets to go get Vucevic.
I would have to guess that they knew they were going be “going all in” for sure. Maybe not with that particular exact group but moving picks for veteran talent alongside LaVine is what I recall the talk being.
Yeah but those assets figured to be kinda crappy in the big picture. It wasn’t like they moved off an All-Star level player. They moved slightly more than hot garbage with only injuries preventing the draft pick from being low teen/20’s.
If this was directed at me - and I am on the record as liking Vuc as a player and I thought he might fit the Cs at the time (it didn't happen so you can credit me with a L for your research). That said, I cannot recall anyone here advocating for the Cs to trade "similar assets" to get Vuc. Maybe you have the post saved as part of your bookmarks?
how big of a piece was Vuceivic for those exciting months of basketball?
Dude I have no idea if you love/hate Vucevic? BUT you liking him isn't shocking.
DeRozan cost the bulls their '25 1st (top 10 protected), assuming their '23 1st conveys to the Magic this year (top 4 protected). Also, a '22 2nd & '25 2nd.
OK thanks. Nice correction on the DeRozan deal. I was always shocked he didn't end up with the Lakers (same with Caruso)
Nice. But par for the course for a moron, right?
You like points/offense, so it's not exactly shocking (hence your Bojan Bogdanovic interest earlier this year)
Again, I was only critical of the Vucevic trade.
That's not my argument at all.
