JPP injured in fireworks accident

veritas

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In college I did some interning at a hospital doing medical records type stuff, so clearly I'm an expert in these matters.
 
All I have to add is; HIPAA is nothing to fuck with. And I saw quite a few patients far less famous than JPP checking themselves into hospitals under fake names. Not that we needed more evidence that he's not very smart.
 

dcmissle

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So it could be worse. Hospitals in Florida have been known to amputate the wrong limb.

Coughlin's reaction must be priceless, when it happened and now with this news. He has wonderful expressions, including a patented look of complete astonishment.

Where were the family and friends? People don't set off fireworks alone. If you have a posse, it needs to intervene when you are drunk.

I'm guessing a cherry bomb. Blockbuster would have taken the finger straight up, an M-80!perhaps the entire hand.
 

Ed Hillel

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Cellar-Door said:
Do you really need an index finger to play DL though?
I don't know that he was wrong. It doesn't sound career or probably even season ending unless there are complications.
I read it as him suggesting JJ would be ready week 1, and there were no short or long term implications. These are really serious injuries, and it would seem there's plenty of reason for concern. Losing an index finger, on its own, seems like it would at least hinder a 3 point stance, depending on if it's his dominant hand.
 

CoffeeNerdness

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On the upside, he's found a quick and dirty short-cut to one for the thumb. Unfortunately, he won't fully be the opposable force o-lineman once feared, and the Giants may struggle to win without a formidable pass rush.
 

djbayko

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Papelbon's Poutine said:
 
They could still go into the system and see who accessed the file without need to. 
Sure, they could. And if there isn't anyone? It could have been someone who does have need. It could have been someone who was passing by while the authorized party was distracted.

I'm not saying that's the case, but you're making a big assumption.
 

djbayko

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A lot of people are saying that publishing the screenshot is over the line. I'm not there at all and feel the anger is misplaced.

If they were going to release the information in the screenshot anyways, what difference does it make that they release the screenshot itself?

I, for one, find it refreshing to see a tweet with corroborating evidence in a sea of bullshit sports reports.

Edit: Twitter quote formatting sucks / spelling
 

twoBshorty

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djbayko said:
A lot of people are saying that publishing the screenshot is over the line. I'm not there at all and feel the anger is misplaced.

If they were going to release the information in the screenshot anyways, what difference does it make that they release the screenshot itself?

I, for one, find it refreshing to see a tweet with corroborating evidence in a sea of bullshit sports reports.

Edit: Twitter quote formatting sucks / spelling
 
Were they also going to release information on the 65-year-old man "FC", his patient ID number, his surgeon, his surgery time, and the fact that he was having an Open Reduction/Internal Fixation on his left radius? I can't think of a single excuse for not cropping that out at the very least. 
 

Tony C

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BigSoxFan said:
Which part?
 
the dubious part of the equation is the part about JPP getting his money back, per the following post and others:
 
Mystic Merlin said:
 
This is a distillation of a major pressing issue for the plaintiff's bar in privacy-related suits, especially class actions.  They have trouble proving damages unless the individual's information was misappropriated (e.g. identity theft).  It is true that medical records are way more valuable than financial records on the black market, which is why insurers and related companies are such tasty targets.
 
JPP could bring a number of causes of action, but I don't see how he sees much money out of this.  The hospital should be more worried about the bad press and potential enforcement actions.  If I was over at HHS/OCR or a state AG office, I'd be all over this layup.
 

djbayko

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twoBshorty said:
 
Were they also going to release information on the 65-year-old man "FC", his patient ID number, his surgeon, his surgery time, and the fact that he was having an Open Reduction/Internal Fixation on his left radius? I can't think of a single excuse for not cropping that out at the very least. 
No, I get that, and I agree it should have been blurred out or cropped. But that isn't the point the anti-release crowd is making - at least all of the ones I've read / heard from outside of this thread.
 

Papelbon's Poutine

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djbayko said:
No, I get that. But that isn't the point the anti-release crowd is making - at least all of the ones I've read / heard from.
The point I see people making is that someone made a pretty big violation of HIPPA laws and is going to get fired while the hospital will get sued. Yes, JPP is the bigger name and you can debate whether they can pin it on a particular person or not, but there is a second person involved that likely will file suit (assuming they are aware of it and their rights).

Now, whether the person fired is someone that can be IDed by log in info or by other means (as you speculated it could certainly be someone other than the person who had access if they were careless, but there are likely video cameras to check) is up for debate. But someone will lose their job over this and they likely deserve to.

Whether JPP ends up losing any money (which is yet to be determined but likely will happen, at the very least he hasn't signed his franchise tender and has already reportedly had a long term offer pulled; in part, I'm sure more because of the incident than the leak) is kind of beside the point. The employee that snapped that photo and sent it to ESPN was in pretty egregious violation of a basic tenet of their job description. A head will roll, be it the correct one or not. The timing of the information coming out is immaterial to the discussion, as is really any talk of dollar figures.

At the very least he could have signed his tender before the Giants found out he was losing a finger. Debate the morality of that on his part as you will, but it's a factor to be considered.
 

djbayko

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Papelbon said:
The point I see people making is that someone made a pretty big violation of HIPPA laws and is going to get fired while the hospital will get sued. Yes, JPP is the bigger name and you can debate whether they can pin it on a particular person or not, but there is a second person involved that likely will file suit (assuming they are aware of it and their rights).

Now, whether the person fired is someone that can be IDed by log in info or by other means (as you speculated it could certainly be someone other than the person who had access if they were careless, but there are likely video cameras to check) is up for debate. But someone will lose their job over this and they likely deserve to.

Whether JPP ends up losing any money (which is yet to be determined but likely will happen, at the very least he hasn't signed his franchise tender and has already reportedly had a long term offer pulled; in part, I'm sure more because of the incident than the leak) is kind of beside the point. The employee that snapped that photo and sent it to ESPN was in pretty egregious violation of a basic tenet of their job description. A head will roll, be it the correct one or not. The timing of the information coming out is immaterial to the discussion, as is really any talk of dollar figures.

At the very least he could have signed his tender before the Giants found out he was losing a finger. Debate the morality of that on his part as you will, but it's a factor to be considered.
Your answer was a bit long, so I feel like I might have missed your point in there somewhere.

All of the arguments I've seen were very primitive - ESPN wasn't bound by HIPAA to keep the information private, but they should have anyways. These same people don't have any issue with ESPN reporting the medical information. Again, if the info in the picture was going to be reported, I don't see how releasing the picture along with it is any worse.

That's the premise.
 

TheoShmeo

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As has been mentioned, someone might get sued to oblivion but finding the damages here isn't obvious.  Unless JPP is going to attempt to show emotional distress at having had his status revealed prematurely.  Or that being deprived the opportunity to message this to the Giants properly somehow cost him money.  And then there's the issue of whether those who acted improperly have the means to pay a large judgment, if one was imposed.
 
But putting aside the legal implications, I have a football question. Is the loss of a single finger (or whatever JPP's loss actually was) a big impediment for a player in JPP's role?  Asked differently, is this a career ending injury or something JPP will just have to work around?
 

Average Reds

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This is a rather blatant HIPAA violation and will lead to consequences for the Hospital and especially for whoever leaked this.  (If they offered the info in exchange for money, they could be looking at significant time if prosecutors want to make an example of them.)  But the lawsuit talk is a bit ridiculous.  JPP is not getting a huge settlement from the hospital because the leak really doesn't damage him.
 
I will say that the tweet from Cork Gaines was pretty ridiculous:  "Showing JPP's medical records was so unnecessary that I will demonstrate my outrage by doing the same!!!!"
 

lambeau

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NFL Network had ashow last week with some DE's saying hands are the most important aspect of pass rushing, getting around a tackle--they rated Justin Houston as having the best hands in the League.
JPP basically blew his hand apart, and I can't imagine him back before mid-season;  he can't lift weights for weeks, and he'll have painful physical therapy to regain finger mobility. Long road.
With Coughlin's short fuse, he must be doing a slow burn if he hasn't gone through the roof already.
 

twibnotes

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Missed opportunity for Schefter, who is arguably best in class for what he does (getting accurate information fast), to take the high road. Could have reported the information and indicated an unwillingness to show the actual records.
 

joe dokes

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I dont think JPP can sue the hospital under HIPAA.I dont think there is a private right of action under the statute.  That doesn't mean JPP has no other legal recourse, like a garden-variety invasion of privacy cause of action.
 
As for Schefter printing the record itself . . .  it will certainly make it considerably easier for the Hospital to figure out who did it. And not cropping out other patients is just stupid.
 

Detts

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Papelbon's Poutine said:
The point I see people making is that someone made a pretty big violation of HIPPA laws and is going to get fired while the hospital will get sued. Yes, JPP is the bigger name and you can debate whether they can pin it on a particular person or not, but there is a second person involved that likely will file suit (assuming they are aware of it and their rights).

Now, whether the person fired is someone that can be IDed by log in info or by other means (as you speculated it could certainly be someone other than the person who had access if they were careless, but there are likely video cameras to check) is up for debate. But someone will lose their job over this and they likely deserve to.

Whether JPP ends up losing any money (which is yet to be determined but likely will happen, at the very least he hasn't signed his franchise tender and has already reportedly had a long term offer pulled; in part, I'm sure more because of the incident than the leak) is kind of beside the point. The employee that snapped that photo and sent it to ESPN was in pretty egregious violation of a basic tenet of their job description. A head will roll, be it the correct one or not. The timing of the information coming out is immaterial to the discussion, as is really any talk of dollar figures.

At the very least he could have signed his tender before the Giants found out he was losing a finger. Debate the morality of that on his part as you will, but it's a factor to be considered.
 
There are 2 stages for an NFL team to sign a player:
 
1.  Sign the contract.
 
2,  Pass a physical.
 
His signing the contract at any time going forward doesn't mean squat unless he can pass the physical.
 

sodenj5

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twibnotes said:
Missed opportunity for Schefter, who is arguably best in class for what he does (getting accurate information fast), to take the high road. Could have reported the information and indicated an unwillingness to show the actual records.
 
He's been hanging out with Mortensen for too long. Seriously, though, I think part of the pressure of always having to be first breaking stories, and then having to back it up with tangible proof lead him to this bad decision. In light of how poorly ESPN handled the Deflategate story, Schefter probably felt obligated to provide his evidence to prove he wasn't just blowing smoke.
 

twibnotes

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Detts said:
 His signing the contract at any time going forward doesn't mean squat unless he can pass the physical.
Not to mention, actually signing the contract could be difficult for JPP.
 

Devizier

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djbayko said:
A lot of people are saying that publishing the screenshot is over the line. I'm not there at all and feel the anger is misplaced.
 
I dunno, people believe in laws that protect patient privacy?
 

OCST

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sodenj5 said:
 
He's been hanging out with Mortensen for too long. Seriously, though, I think part of the pressure of always having to be first breaking stories, and then having to back it up with tangible proof lead him to this bad decision. In light of how poorly ESPN handled the Deflategate story, Schefter probably felt obligated to provide his evidence to prove he wasn't just blowing smoke.
And now it blew up in his face.

Hands.

Whatever.
 

dcmissle

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Schefter did not have to "prove" anything.  Nobody is making decisions in real time based on Schefter reports.  He just needs to be right, which he usually is.  As it turns out, reportedly from PFT, the amputation had not occurred when Schefter's story came out; JPP was still in surgery.
 
As for playing impact, saw a report this morning that JPP typically has his index finger taped to his middle one and the last two fingers on his hand taped together as well.  That's probably to protect them.  That's one fewer to protect.
 
Pay no mind to what they Giants say; watch what they do.  I'll be greatly surprised if they pull the franchise tender, and if they do the number of teams after him will probably reach double digits.
 

Kenny F'ing Powers

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He's a defensive lineman with an explosive burst and he can blow up offensive tackles consistently. People are acting like the Giants will be playing shorthanded with him on the field. This is being overblown. 
 

glennhoffmania

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NortheasternPJ said:
 
Schefter should be ashamed of this level he's gone to though. Report on it, fine. Actually Tweeting screenshots from an EMR? Why doesn't he go work at TMZ?
 
Working at TMZ would be a step up from his current employer.
 

Comfortably Lomb

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joe dokes said:
I dont think JPP can sue the hospital under HIPAA.I dont think there is a private right of action under the statute.  That doesn't mean JPP has no other legal recourse, like a garden-variety invasion of privacy cause of action.
 
As for Schefter printing the record itself . . .  it will certainly make it considerably easier for the Hospital to figure out who did it. And not cropping out other patients is just stupid.
There is no private cause of action under HIPAA. There are other causes of action: invasion of privacy, negligence, etc. and sometimes HIPAA is used as a standard. But who really cares? JPP isn't going to get a $50m settlement out of this. The "OMG someone is going to be sued to oblivionz111!!" talk is weird.

Anyway, the hospital will audit JPP's medical record access (if they didn't already do so last night). It's likely the hospital knew who leaked this within minutes of finding out this was a news story. That person is also probably already toast.
 

epraz

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twibnotes said:
Missed opportunity for Schefter, who is arguably best in class for what he does (getting accurate information fast), to take the high road. Could have reported the information and indicated an unwillingness to show the actual records.
 
Would "reporting the information" be significantly different, from an ethical standpoint, than what he did?
 

KiltedFool

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Not a twitter user, but Schefter isn't on at least one player's Christmas list anymore
 
https://twitter.com/jharrison9292/status/618960110438625280
 
 
James Harrison ‏@jharrison9292 12h12 hours ago
.@AdamSchefter You're a real piece of sh*t for putting that picture up!
 
 
Would not be surprised if that sentiment is common.  And also won't be surprised if ESPN forces him to make an apology for it just to try and stem the outrage.
 

LuckyBen

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KiltedFool said:
Not a twitter user, but Schefter isn't on at least one player's Christmas list anymore
 

https://twitter.com/jharrison9292/status/618960110438625280
https://twitter.com/jharrison9292/status/618960110438625280

link to tweet
 
 
Would not be surprised if that sentiment is common.  And also won't be surprised if ESPN forces him to make an apology for it just to try and stem the outrage.

Like the one they made Mort offer?
 

Omar's Wacky Neighbor

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Leaving in a bit to the studio :)
The stupid was really coming out of the woodwork from the callers on the WFAN midday show: it was like performance art.  In succession (IOW, with no other calls in between):
 
1) male RN calls up and explains how patient privileged info is relayed to approved family members of the patient, esp with celebrity patients.  Went on to vehemently defend hospital workers w/r/t HPAA and said there was a good possibility it was NOT a hospital worker/MD/nurse who leaked the info.  He then intimated that JPP's family was somehow responsible for the leak of the photo (he stopped just short of invoking the Frank Burns logic of "those men couldnt have been gambling, as gambling is not allowed on the base");
 
2) Hot-under-the-collar caller says JPP using fireworks is the equivalent of doing 60 in a 55 zone, and  loudly defended that JPP should NOT be prosecuted/persecuted.  One problem there:  no one had even discussed prosecuting JPP. As per the hosts, the big issues are:  blowing his finger off, not accepting the tender previously, and the whole HPAA thing; who said anything about arresting him?;
 
3)  caller gives long winded explanation of and defines the word 'accident', and that according to reports, what happened to JPP met that definition and was likely an accident.
 
By the third call, Evan and Joe were practically wetting their pants from laughing so hard.....
 

kenneycb

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Kenny F'ing Powers said:
For those of you wondering, yes, it's a conscious decision that this thread has been left open.
 
It's a terrible, wonderful thread. 
 
Of course, someone will ruin it for the rest of us soon enough.
Who would have thought it would be HIPAA?
 

ivanvamp

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TheoShmeo said:
As has been mentioned, someone might get sued to oblivion but finding the damages here isn't obvious.  Unless JPP is going to attempt to show emotional distress at having had his status revealed prematurely.  Or that being deprived the opportunity to message this to the Giants properly somehow cost him money.  And then there's the issue of whether those who acted improperly have the means to pay a large judgment, if one was imposed.
 
But putting aside the legal implications, I have a football question. Is the loss of a single finger (or whatever JPP's loss actually was) a big impediment for a player in JPP's role?  Asked differently, is this a career ending injury or something JPP will just have to work around?
We've seen defensive players play with hands all taped up, arms in casts, everything. I'm sure losing a single finger really really sucks, and it'll be an adjustment for him, but I've gotta think he'll be able to keep playing like that.
 

snowmanny

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ESPN is within their first amendment rights to report illegally leaked information, of course. But if I ran the NFLPA I'd call ESPN and Schefter and threaten to freeze them out from interviews. It's totally crappy to sniff around hospitals trying to get private health information.
 

Papelbon's Poutine

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snowmanny said:
ESPN is within their first amendment rights to report illegally leaked information, of course. But if I ran the NFLPA I'd call ESPN and Schefter and threaten to freeze them out from interviews. It's totally crappy to sniff around hospitals trying to get private health information.
 
I think it's a bit presumptive to assume they were "sniffing around the hospital". I think it's much more likely that an excited employee snapped the pics and sent them in to ESPN to get their (albeit anonymous) 15 minutes.
 

snowmanny

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Papelbon's Poutine said:
 
I think it's a bit presumptive to assume they were "sniffing around the hospital". I think it's much
more likely that an excited employee snapped the pics and sent them in to ESPN to get their (albeit anonymous) 15 minutes.
Fair enough but I still think the union should discourage this type of reporting.
 

Papelbon's Poutine

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snowmanny said:
Fair enough but I still think the union should discourage this type of reporting.
 
Of course, but common decency should do that already. Trouble is there's no boundaries anymore. I just don't think some kind of attempted freeze out of all the players is possible or at all likely. The players aren't required to give interviews, but there are demands from the league for press conferences, etc. Like much else, it's collectively bargained that they make themselves available. Unless you enjoy Marshawn Lynch style enough to see everyone do it, that is. 
 

djbayko

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Devizier said:
 
I dunno, people believe in laws that protect patient privacy?
Did you miss the part about the information being reported without the screenshot? Is that why you only quoted part of my post?
 

Bigpupp

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If ESPN employees stopped throwing shit against the wall at every opportunity then maybe Schefter wouldn't have felt like it was necessary to "prove" his report. This is 100% on him and ESPN as a whole and I'm a little surprised the NFLPA hasn't issued an a statement regarding the matter.