Kirk and Callahan: Done

TheoShmeo

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There's no prctical difference between saying that Asian women are not attractive and that "I'm not attracted to them" other than the latter is more socially acceptable and the former sounds like a pronouncement rather than an opinion.  Those trying to parse these statements or comments like them are drawing lines that are just too fine; both are different ways of expresing the speaker's opinion (even if the speaker thinks it's not a matter of debate). 
 
That said, Callahan said what he said to either get a rise out of us or because he's absolutely tone deaf and doesn't appreciate that a man in his position shouldn't be saying things like that.  Not everything that runs through your mind needs to come out of your mouth and that's doubly true when your mouth is speaking into a radio microphone.
 
It's too bad D&C have such dickish tendencies.  I like their interviews and wish that there wasn't so much noise in between them.
 

joe dokes

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I dont find many Asian women attractive. I dont think it makes me racist, because I dont think its my choice on what I find attractive or not. Unless we're deciding its a persons choice as to what they find attractive(which I think we can all agree is nonsense.)

That isnt to say I find them all unattractive, but I find a much smaller % of Asian women attractive then white, spanish, and black girls.

I do think thats different then saying "shes a butterface because shes Asian", but Im OK with being wrong.
 
 
If you're describing your history, then your point is a good one.
 
But if you change it slightly.....
Here's the problem (as I see it.)  If I say, "I'd like you to meet my friend Mary;  she's smart, funny and good looking."  You say, "how do you know her?"  I say, "She was just transferred here from our office in Seoul, which she started from the ground up. She grew up there.  Really impressive."  If you then say, "I dont think I'll find her attractive, because I dont find Asians attractive,"  that IS a pretty offensive/ignorant/racist statement, IMO. You haven't even seen her. But it doesn't matter because "they all look the same."  I dont know if that makes the person a racist in the sense of you have "something against" Asians.  But no matter how its parsed, most collective generalizations like that are, at best, lazy, and at worst (depending on the speaker and the context) are racist. ("I wont let any of them into my house because they all steal."). 
 

CantKeepmedown

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I apologize if people think I misrepresented what Callahan said.  The way I heard it was Dennis talking about how hot Wie is and he was happy she missed her last putt so they could have one more chance to watch her bend over.  Minnihane responds with the butterface comment, and I guess it was just the way Gerry responded. Like, of course she's a butterface! She's Asian!  
 
It certainly could have been totally innocent and just a personal preference for Gerry. I prefer to give him no leeway, but can understand the other side.  My bad.  
 

Kenny F'ing Powers

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joe dokes said:
 
If you're describing your history, then your point is a good one.
 
But if you change it slightly.....
Here's the problem (as I see it.)  If I say, "I'd like you to meet my friend Mary;  she's smart, funny and good looking."  You say, "how do you know her?"  I say, "She was just transferred here from our office in Seoul, which she started from the ground up. She grew up there.  Really impressive."  If you then say, "I dont think I'll find her attractive, because I dont find Asians attractive,"  that IS a pretty offensive/ignorant/racist statement, IMO. You haven't even seen her. But it doesn't matter because "they all look the same."  I dont know if that makes the person a racist in the sense of you have "something against" Asians.  But no matter how its parsed, most collective generalizations like that are, at best, lazy, and at worst (depending on the speaker and the context) are racist. ("I wont let any of them into my house because they all steal."). 
 
I'm just not smart enough to tiptoe through the misogynist, racist, and sexist minefield to defend my position on this, so I'm not going to. What I will say is that the reason I don't find most Asian women attractive isn't because "they're Asian". It's because, just as any other nationality or ethnicity, they have certain physical features that I don't often find appealing. I've made it clear that there are Asian women I find attractive. I'm also very aware that, just because I don't find them attractive, it doesn't make them unattractive. I don't think there's anything wrong to having a preference.
 

joe dokes

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Kenny F'ing Powers said:
 
I'm just not smart enough to tiptoe through the misogynist, racist, and sexist minefield to defend my position on this, so I'm not going to. What I will say is that the reason I don't find most Asian women attractive isn't because "they're Asian". It's because, just as any other nationality or ethnicity, they have certain physical features that I don't often find appealing. I've made it clear that there are Asian women I find attractive. I'm also very aware that, just because I don't find them attractive, it doesn't make them unattractive. I don't think there's anything wrong to having a preference.
 
I think we're in heated agreement about your intent here. You have nothing to defend. It wasn't my intent to suggest otherwise. Its easy to be clumsy here. And someone with Callahan's track record can't afford to be clumsy.
 

Reverend

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TheoShmeo said:
There's no prctical difference between saying that Asian women are not attractive and that "I'm not attracted to them" other than the latter is more socially acceptable and the former sounds like a pronouncement rather than an opinion.  Those trying to parse these statements or comments like them are drawing lines that are just too fine; both are different ways of expresing the speaker's opinion (even if the speaker thinks it's not a matter of debate). 
 
That said, Callahan said what he said to either get a rise out of us or because he's absolutely tone deaf and doesn't appreciate that a man in his position shouldn't be saying things like that.  Not everything that runs through your mind needs to come out of your mouth and that's doubly true when your mouth is speaking into a radio microphone.
 
It's too bad D&C have such dickish tendencies.  I like their interviews and wish that there wasn't so much noise in between them.
 
Quite right. And, of course, this is a very old story:
 

While I was intent on improving my language, I met with an English grammar (I think it was Greenwood's), at the end of which there were two little sketches of the arts of rhetoric and logic, the latter finishing with a specimen of a dispute in the Socratic method; and soon after I procur'd Xenophon's Memorable Things of Socrates, wherein there are many instances of the same method. I was charm'd with it, adopted it, dropt my abrupt contradiction and positive argumentation, and put on the humble inquirer and doubter. And being then, from reading Shaftesbury and Collins, become a real doubter in many points of our religious doctrine, I found this method safest for myself and very embarrassing to those against whom I used it; therefore I took a delight in it, practis'd it continually, and grew very artful and expert in drawing people, even of superior knowledge, into concessions, the consequences of which they did not foresee, entangling them in difficulties out of which they could not extricate themselves, and so obtaining victories that neither myself nor my cause always deserved. I continu'd this method some few years, but gradually left it, retaining only the habit of expressing myself in terms of modest diffidence; never using, when I advanced any thing that may possibly be disputed, the words certainly, undoubtedly, or any others that give the air of positiveness to an opinion; but rather say, I conceive or apprehend a thing to be so and so; it appears to me, or I should think it so or so, for such and such reasons; or ,I imagine it to be so; or it is so, if I am not mistaken. This habit, I believe, has been of great advantage to me when I have had occasion to inculcate my opinions, and persuade men into measures that I have been from time to time engag'd in promoting; and, as the chief ends of conversation are to inform or to be informed, to please or to persuade, I wish well-meaning, sensible men would not lessen their power of doing good by a positive, assuming manner, that seldom fails to disgust, tends to create opposition, and to defeat every one of those purposes for which speech was given to us, to wit, giving or receiving information or pleasure. For, if you would inform, a positive and dogmatical manner in advancing your sentiments may provoke contradiction and prevent a candid attention. If you wish information and improvement from the knowledge of others, and yet at the same time express yourself as firmly fix'd in your present opinions, modest, sensible men, who do not love disputation, will probably leave you undisturbed in the possession of your error. And by such a manner, you can seldom hope to recommend yourself in pleasing your hearers, or to persuade those whose concurrence you desire. Pope says, judiciously:
 
"Men should be taught as if you taught them not, 
And things unknown propos'd as things forgot;"
 
farther recommending to us
 
"To speak, tho' sure, with seeming diffidence."
 
And he might have coupled with this line that which he has coupled with another, I think, less properly,
 
"For want of modesty is want of sense."
 
If you ask, Why less properly? I must repeat the lines,
 
"Immodest words admit of no defense, 
For want of modesty is want of sense."
 
Now, is not want of sense (where a man is so unfortunate as to want it) some apology for his want of modesty? and would not the lines stand more justly thus? 
 
"Immodest words admit but this defense, 
That want of modesty is want of sense."
 
This, however, I should submit to better judgments.
 
 

- Benjamin Franklin, The Autobiography of Ben Franklin
 
tl;dr version:
Most talk radio does, by design, literally the opposite of what Benjamin Fucking Franklin advised for promoting effective discourse.
 

joyofsox

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CantKeepmedown said:
... he was happy she missed her last putt so they could have one more chance to watch her bend over.  
 
So they are exactly like the fans they (presumably) ridicule who go to baseball games solely because they think certain players are cute?
 

grimshaw

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I've been lurking forever and would say I check out this thread more often than the A-Rod to Boston rumors in late 2003 in the very slim hope that either JD or GC say something offensive enough to get kicked off the air.  I do the same with the mercilessly amateur Shoe and Joe.
 

ForKeeps

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Buffalo Head said:
Nothing worse than getting a shitty haircut.
 
I remember what I said about haircuts but I still don't get it. Was probably funnier in your head huh.
 

Buffalo Head

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Nothing funny about it. You only post like, what, an average of three times a year? And one of those rare times you do grace us with your wit and wisdom, people were just outright poopy to you. Sucks, man.
 

kajana141

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Jul 31, 2006
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Analysis of USA VS Germany on Felger and Mazz yesterday:
Went through the last 20 years of Germany's results in opening group play.
Went through last 20 years of Germany's game 3 results of opening group play.
Mentioned Germany has won at least 2 games in opening group play since 1994.
Discussed Klinsmanns history with German team and how he is now perceived in Germany.
Outcome: Germany will probably not just play for a tie and would love to embarrass Klinsmann and the US team
 
Analysis of USA VS Germany on D&C this morning:
Callahan, Germany just needs to tie to advance so they will not try to win.
Great effort!!
 

MyDaughterLovesTomGordon

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I wanted to listen to the Sam Kennedy interview, so I stayed on for a bit. 
 
Was graced with a discussion of a "Ghanorean" player's hot girlfriend. 
 
Minihane reading from her Wiki page, "ooooh, she's had like 9 'partners.' She's dirty!"
 
Seriously, though. Repeatedly Ghanorean. Not Ghanian or anything like it. Not a mistake. On purpose.
 

joe dokes

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Radio on EEI when I started the car. Before I even get out of the garage:  "........but it's so, unAmerican to celebrate after losing the game . . . " Aargh...where are the CDs.
 

Patriot_Reign

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Did the Globe call them out today?  They mentioned something to that effect while I was listening to the open this morning, but couldn't find anything on boston.com that seemed to correlate. 
 

joe dokes

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Patriot_Reign said:
Did the Globe call them out today?  They mentioned something to that effect while I was listening to the open this morning, but couldn't find anything on boston.com that seemed to correlate. 
 
finn in his ratings piece:
http://www.bostonglobe.com/sports/2014/06/26/soccer-world-cup-ratings-success/hbODgFL5C9ns7VhKFrMwBO/story.html
 
Perhaps the World Cup isn’t for everyone who considers themselves a conventional sports fan in the United States. One diehard’s nuance is a novice’s boredom, and dismissive commentary such as this tweet Thursday from WEEI’s John Dennis still speaks to an element of the audience:
“Honest to God. Can SOMEBODY tell me when the EXCITING part begins? God Awful Dull. #sorrySOCCERphants”
The skepticism of the sport tends to skew toward older demographics — the ratings for younger viewers are massive. But ignoring the appeal of this is foolish if you work in sports media, especially in New England. Boston (11.5), Hartford/New Haven (11.3), and Providence (11.2) were the fourth-, fifth-, and sixth-rated markets for the US-Portugal match, and the order should be similar for US-Germany.
 
 

Hendu for Kutch

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If they don't like soccer, that's fine.  The problem is, and it looks like this creeps into everything they talk about, is that it's not simply OK to have a different opinion or take on things. 
 
I never played soccer, so much of the strategy is lost on me.  I enjoy the World Cup for the stakes involved and the environment surrounding it, but I don't see myself ever watching an MLS or Premier League game.  But I don't feel the need to act as if anyone who sees soccer differently is inherently inferior, flawed, or "faking". 
 
It's such a myopic world view (mixed with a healthy amount of xenophobia), but that seems to be a neo-conservative source of pride for some reason.  I mean, look at this gem: http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/jun/26/ann-coulter-any-growing-interest-soccer-can-only-b/
 
Edit: Please, for the love of all that is holy, do not read the comments below that article.  Someday I'll learn, but goddamnit I really feel like part of a lesser species when I read that shit.
 

MyDaughterLovesTomGordon

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I've seen that Ann Coulter column already - it reads like a Colbert joke column, but it appears to be serious. I read some of the comments, too. 
 
I just don't understand how a literate person can actually hold those opinions. 
 
They make D&C look like rational people. I guess it's a lesson that things could be worse?
 

bosoxsue

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It's funny how she and Shaughnessy (as noted in his thread, he self-plagiarized repeatedly to do it) both make the same "use of hands/opposable thumbs" argument against soccer in their ignorant rants.
 

ForKeeps

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Funny, I just checked out their Theo interview from this morning and I didn't hear any questions about how he's basically the worst GM ever and was the sole cause of all of the Red Sox issues up to and including 2012. Did they not get Larry's talking points memo this morning?
 

HomeBrew1901

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Back up in New England and gave D&C a shot while commuting since I was out of range for the Sports Hub.  I wasn't offended but it was just bad bad radio and I was dumbfounded that people find this entertaining.  Jerry Thorton as Minihane's stand in?  wow
 

teddykgb

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bluefenderstrat said:
Minihane/Meter & rotating 3rd man has been surprisingly listenable this week. 
 
I haven't been much of a fan.  Minihane seems to think he needs to be ultra controversial without his nutjob brethren, so he's constantly just saying even more outlandish shit than usual.
 

Patriot_Reign

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Yesterday during the news segment it was brought up how Anthony Cumia had been fired from the O&A show and how they'd never heard of them before.
Just randomly going  through youtube videos tonight I had favorited and found this from about 6 years ago:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n-nuZF3t4I0&list=FLihx1a0LZjPqXSdBJUDn08Q&index=16
Similar to the Howard Stern bit
 
edit: the fat john dennis photo is priceless
 

J.McG

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Looks like Dino got himself embroiled in another twitter battle tonight:
 
https://twitter.com/johndennisweei/status/489246476447789056
 
https://twitter.com/SethDavisHoops/status/489250665638940673
 

Hendu for Kutch

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It doesn't even make sense.  Obsequious?  He's saying that someone challenging him is deferential?  And he, as a sports talk radio host, is challenging the vocabulary of a many-times published author?  In the same message he calls Pearlman a "butthole licker"?  Really?
 
It's just astounding someone can be SO tone deaf and lacking in self-awareness.  Astounding.
 
I despise Jonn Dennis.  He's scum.  But how were his comments racist?  Misogynistic and moronic?  Sure.  But calling out the First Lady's weight is now racist?  
 
And Seth Davis should STFU.  He's the guy who mocks MMA fighters with gay slurs.
 "Maybe I’m a prude on this but I’m also a dad. I don’t mind my sons watching boxing, but I wouldn’t want them watching a UFC bout.  Looking on news sites showing pictures of two muscular bloody men in homoerotic fighting pose….Sorry, I’ll never get this UFC thing."
 
PS - I think Dennis is a racist for all his previous remarks but I think Pearlman is playing the race card a little to quickly here.  
PPS - I had no idea what a BHL was.  Am I ignorant or is that fairly new thing?
 

J.McG

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BannedbyNYYFans.com said:
 PPS - I had no idea what a BHL was.  Am I ignorant or is that fairly new thing?
Based on Pearlman's political leanings and defense of the FLOTUS, I took "BHL" to mean "bleeding heart liberal". "Butthole licker" would definitely be funnier though, and would fit in with Dennis' creepy scatology obsession.
 

Hendu for Kutch

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J.McG said:
Based on Pearlman's political leanings and defense of the FLOTUS, I took "BHL" to mean "bleeding heart liberal". "Butthole licker" would definitely be funnier though, and would fit in with Dennis' creepy scatology obsession.
 
That makes a lot more sense.  I had no idea what BHL meant so went to Urban Dictionary and "butthole licker" was the only thing that fit.
 
BannedbyNYYFans.com said:
I despise Jonn Dennis.  He's scum.  But how were his comments racist?  Misogynistic and moronic?  Sure.  But calling out the First Lady's weight is now racist?  
 
And Seth Davis should STFU.  He's the guy who mocks MMA fighters with gay slurs.
 
PS - I think Dennis is a racist for all his previous remarks but I think Pearlman is playing the race card a little to quickly here.  
PPS - I had no idea what a BHL was.  Am I ignorant or is that fairly new thing?
 
I think the argument is that when given the original photo and hearing it questioned on its racial overtones, Dennis didn't bother to say why it wasn't racist, just that it was OK because she's got a big ass too.
 
I don't think the original picture is necessarily racist, if only because I've seen the same thing done with Hilary Clinton.  It's stupid, though, there's no arguing that.  Who would guess that someone would look more dignified in a posed setting than when you take their worst outtake picture during a physical activity?  Anyone who looks at that picture and nods in agreement as if it actually meant something should probably do the human race a favor and light themselves on fire.  Not for being racist, but for being an incredible moron.
 

soxfan121

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BannedbyNYYFans.com said:
And Seth Davis should STFU.  He's the guy who mocks MMA fighters with gay slurs.
 
Link? I read the pull quote and then searched it but didn't see any 'gay slurs'. 
 
And I've decided that I'm most upset with WEEI management for denying us, the public, of the spectacle that will be John Dennis, post-employment. Really, no job to hold him back, lots of time and a persecution complex? THAT has far more entertainment potential than every D&C show combined. 
 
soxfan121 said:
 
Link? I read the pull quote and then searched it but didn't see any 'gay slurs'. 
 
And I've decided that I'm most upset with WEEI management for denying us, the public, of the spectacle that will be John Dennis, post-employment. Really, no job to hold him back, lots of time and a persecution complex? THAT has far more entertainment potential than every D&C show combined. 
 
Maybe I'm overly sensitive to the MMA/gay thing.  I've been a hard core fan of the sport for well over 10 years and I've heard that crap so many times from boxing fans.  Here is the link:
 
http://www.sportsgrid.com/ncaa-basketball/college-basketball-writer-seth-davis-is-sorry-for-calling-mma-homoerotic/
 
Sherdog also quoted him from an interview years ago saying (paraphrasing) "Is it really macho if two half naked men are hugging each other?" or something stupid like that.  I couldn't find the quote and I've been searching for 15 minutes...maybe I'm confusing that quote with somebody else but I could have sworn it was from Davis.  Fwiw, Davis constantly calls out Belichick for being "classless"....so maybe that makes me even more biased.  
 
As far as Dennis, I feel dirty for even defending him an ounce.  I take my earlier post back. 
 

Gambler7

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Did anyone catch Callahan nearly calling someone "homo" this morning? He literally got the "ho" out and then stopped and laughed. I couldn't get 98.5 where I was so I had it on as background noise. I can't remember what the conversation was about but it was between 6:30 to 7:30 or so.
 

jose melendez

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Has Michael Holley after addressed in public how he feels working with those guys?  I can't imagine it feels good to be a minority (or any one else) working for the same company.
 

wutang112878

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Gerry couldnt pass up this dig, I mean who cares about making the dig using the tragedy.  Keep it classy Gerry.  There's a special place in hell saved for you
 
[twitter]@GerryCallahan[/twitter]

This was his retweet:
 
Tammy Bruce @HeyTammyBruce  ·  3h

295 lost souls. 23 dead Americans. Possible Russian act. Obama? Fundraising schedule tonight right on track.

 
 
 

Sparky Lyle

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I did.  I've just become inured to shit like that from him.  Today, Steve Buckley was on the show.  How he can sit there and be so chummy with Callahan remains a puzzlement to me.
 

YTF

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Gambler7 said:
Did anyone catch Callahan nearly calling someone "homo" this morning? He literally got the "ho" out and then stopped and laughed. I couldn't get 98.5 where I was so I had it on as background noise. I can't remember what the conversation was about but it was between 6:30 to 7:30 or so.
 
I caught it as well and like you can't remember the content of the conversation. It was Wed. morning and though I may be misremembering, I think it was during conversation about the Jeter love fest Tuesday night and MAY have been directed at Jeter.
 

doctormoist

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Buck called out D&C for making a lame crack about "29 seconds of outrage" after a brief clip with Obama commenting about the plane tragedy.  Of course, they ganged up on him and blew off his annoyance that they would use this to rag on the Prez.
 

John Marzano Olympic Hero

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Listening for a few moments, a caller was talking to Open-Minded Three about Dungy's comments about Michael Sam and said, "Well, it sounds that Dungy doesn't believe in same-sex marriage" to which Callahan spits back in disgust, "YEAH, so what's wrong with that?"
 
For a little while I thought that Callahan was so good at his job (writing and talking sports) that while his political views are disgraceful, when he talked sports he did a really good job. And I suppose that's still true, but I can't get past his way of thinking and compartmentalize it anymore. The dude really makes my skin crawl.