NFL: News and transactions

Kliq

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Leatherwood started all 17 games last season and had an AV of 8 (solid for a rookie). That has got to be a personnel issue.
 
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Leatherwood started all 17 games last season and had an AV of 8 (solid for a rookie). That has got to be a personnel issue.
I read something a few days ago that said he struggled in camp and pre-season and was likely to be cut or traded. Seems performance based, but I had no idea he had started 17 games as a rookie. Weird situation.

Edit: Updated "likely to be cut" to "cut or traded" which is actually what I had read.
 
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E5 Yaz

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Leatherwood started all 17 games last season and had an AV of 8 (solid for a rookie). That has got to be a personnel issue.
Well new coaching staff, so new blocking schemes? Couldn't catch onto Josh's system?
 

kenneycb

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PFF had Leatherwood as the third worst pass-blocking tackle last year with a 31.3 grade. Apparently he was adequate in run-blocking. And he's struggled a ton this preseason per reports.
 

cornwalls@6

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I mean, he's taken them deep two out of the last three years. It kinda blows my mind that nobody wants him more than this already, and it's a little hard for me to understand why he'd be worth a big contract this time next year and not even worth a punt at this point.

I do not understand teams behaviour regarding QBs at all.
I suspect the soft market for him(if that’s what happened) is largely attributable to health concerns. Agree that his resume would seemingly generate more interest around the league, but a throwing shoulder injury is likely a big red flag for many GMs. I can see where he might need a sustained stretch of good, healthy performance to restart the demand for his services.
 

Mooch

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That's a hell of a run of first round picks wasted by the Raiders the last two seasons:

Ruggs - waived
Arnette - waived
Leatherwood - waived
 

Cellar-Door

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PFF had Leatherwood as the third worst pass-blocking tackle last year with a 31.3 grade. Apparently he was adequate in run-blocking. And he's struggled a ton this preseason per reports.
I noticed him in a bad way in our pre-season matchup, Patriots backups were having good success on him, and I was watching a Raiders' broadcast stream and they mentioned he'd been really struggling all camp/pre-season
 

Old Fart Tree

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That's a hell of a run of first round picks wasted by the Raiders the last two seasons:

Ruggs - waived
Arnette - waived
Leatherwood - waived
There is a little OVB here on one of these picks - ie, wasn’t a scouting issue I don’t think - but yeah that’s a shit run of outcomes. I just think you don’t usually expect your first round draft picks to commit vehicular homicide while drunk as a skunk doing 154 on surface streets. Usually the scouting focuses more on “can he get separation,” etc.


what a waste.
 

Cellar-Door

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The Jets had 4 DB's that they cut and were claimed by other teams? That's crazy depth I guess.
Yeah Guidry, young undersized but FAST Nickle corner, 28 games played (5 starts) over the last 2 years, but was better in 2020 than last year
Pinnock is a real surprise... their 5th last year, played 12 games (started 2) and seemed decent
Dunn... nothing special UDFA who stuck last year
Wildgoose was a 6th for the Bills last year, they snuck him to the PS, but the Jets signed him off it.
 

luckiestman

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Yeah Guidry, young undersized but FAST Nickle corner, 28 games played (5 starts) over the last 2 years, but was better in 2020 than last year
Pinnock is a real surprise... their 5th last year, played 12 games (started 2) and seemed decent
Dunn... nothing special UDFA who stuck last year
Wildgoose was a 6th for the Bills last year, they snuck him to the PS, but the Jets signed him off it.
Pinnock is who I would have liked to keep
 

Rudy's Curve

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That’s hilarious. Any idea why they’re giving up on him so quickly?
He's played two years, the coach (and possibly de facto GM) who drafted him is gone and he was among the handful of worst receivers in football last year. I don't think his pedigree could've saved him at this point.
 

Cellar-Door

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That’s hilarious. Any idea why they’re giving up on him so quickly?
They traded for AJ Brown, drafted Devonta Smith in the top 10, have some depth (Watkins, Pascal) and they have a lot of draft picks traded away going for it now. He wasn't going to get snaps (because he's been pretty bad) so his value was only going down.
 

Super Nomario

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Leatherwood started all 17 games last season and had an AV of 8 (solid for a rookie). That has got to be a personnel issue.
AV doesn't really tell us much here: https://www.sports-reference.com/blog/approximate-value-methodology/

team_points_for_o_line = 5 / 11 * team_offense_points
individual_points = [(games played) + 5*(games started)*(pos_multiplier)] * (all_pro_multiplier),

So basically, Leatherwood's AV reflects a) that he played and started all 17 games and b) the Raiders had a decent O. Andre James also started 17 games on the OL, also had an AV of 8. Kolton Miller, also 17 games, also AV 8. AV uses only basic box score statistics, and since there are none for OL, it really can't be used to let us know if a given lineman on a given team is crappy or not.
 

wibi

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https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/34500536/russell-wilson-denver-broncos-agree-5-year-extension-worth-245-million-including-165-million-guaranteed-sources-say

The megadeal is the third-most lucrative contract in NFL history in terms of guaranteed money, behind only Browns quarterback Deshaun Watson's $230 million and Cardinals quarterback Kyler Murray's $189.5 million.

Wilson, 33, is now under contract with the Broncos through the 2028 season for $296 million. The extension pays Wilson, who has two years remaining on his previous deal signed with the Seahawks, an average salary of $49 million. He is set to make $24 million this season and $27 million next year before the extension kicks in.
I will take a year or two of suck from Seattle over what the back end of this contract looks like
 

Sandwich Pick

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He's played two years, the coach (and possibly de facto GM) who drafted him is gone and he was among the handful of worst receivers in football last year. I don't think his pedigree could've saved him at this point.
His only real standout ability is running in a straight line very fast. They already have a guy who can do that in Quez Watkins, and Quez doesn't have all of Reagor's downsides.

Everywhere they tried Reagor last year ended up not working out. He had some promise as a punt returner due to his speed but he had a bad game on a very big stage in Tampa. He would also be better served staying off social media, as he was prone to getting snippy with people who criticized him.

Eagles fans were really hard on Nelson Agholor. But what they thought Agholor was, Reagor actually was.
 

Cellar-Door

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His only real standout ability is running in a straight line very fast. They already have a guy who can do that in Quez Watkins, and Quez doesn't have all of Reagor's downsides.

Everywhere they tried Reagor last year ended up not working out. He had some promise as a punt returner due to his speed but he had a bad game on a very big stage in Tampa. He would also be better served staying off social media, as he was prone to getting snippy with people who criticized him.

Eagles fans were really hard on Nelson Agholor. But what they thought Agholor was, Reagor actually was.
I didn't watch all the Eagles games, but I remember a couple where he kept getting open... then dropping the ball, or drifting into the sideline and not staying in. Now maybe a bit of that was Hurts, but yeah he seemed to have awful hands and awareness
 

scott bankheadcase

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No perfect thread for this stat but I kinda liked it:

This opening weekend is the first time in 15 years that not a single team will start a rookie QB (barring any very last minute injuries).
 

Dogman

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Unless Baltimore has altered their gameplans and will not let Jackson run the ball, this has the potential to cost him a lot of money.
 

BigSoxFan

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Unless Baltimore has altered their gameplans and will not let Jackson run the ball, this has the potential to cost him a lot of money.
Yeah, this could be bad for a guy who already doesn’t have an agent.
 

Dogman

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I totally forgot he doesn't work with an agent. A teammate or mentor need to pull him aside and talk with him about the risks he is taking.
 

BigJimEd

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Why assume Lamar doesn't know or understand the risks?

I'd guess he's well aware of them. Just because Jackson doesn't have an agent doesn't mean he doesn't have someone that he doesn't discuss things with.

You can disagree with his decision but I dying think there's any reason to suggest Lamar is doing this blindly.

Do we even have a good idea what Baltimore is offering?
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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Why assume Lamar doesn't know or understand the risks?

I'd guess he's well aware of them. Just because Jackson doesn't have an agent doesn't mean he doesn't have someone that he doesn't discuss things with.

You can disagree with his decision but I dying think there's any reason to suggest Lamar is doing this blindly.

Do we even have a good idea what Baltimore is offering?
They reportedly offered the Kyler Murray contract and then upped it after RW's contract so I imagine the guaranteed money was in the $170M to $180M range.

It may not have just been the amount as Lamar apparently wanted his whole contract guaranteed, and that would be a problem for BAL cap-wise.
 

johnmd20

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I totally forgot he doesn't work with an agent. A teammate or mentor need to pull him aside and talk with him about the risks he is taking.
Kirk Cousins was working on one year deals for a while for the Washington Football Team. I guess you could say Lamar runs a lot, so he's a bigger risk to get hurt, but Dak had his ankle absolutely explode and he still got a humongous deal in the offseason.

Unless Lamar tears his achilles (which does seem to be the achilles heel for NFL player injuries), most injuries can be fixed and he'll be fine.

The reverse of the risk of a one year deal is that Lamar has an incredible season and makes even more money going forward.

edit - with that said, if they offered him RW kind of money, Lamar is an idiot for not taking that deal.
 

snowmanny

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If I were Lamar I'd not settle for a dollar less than Watson got in Cleveland.
That Watson contract is a killer for these negotiations. Same division. One is an MVP and a perfect citizen (as far as we know). The other is neither.
 

bibajesus

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Kirk Cousins was working on one year deals for a while for the Washington Football Team. I guess you could say Lamar runs a lot, so he's a bigger risk to get hurt, but Dak had his ankle absolutely explode and he still got a humongous deal in the offseason.

Unless Lamar tears his achilles (which does seem to be the achilles heel for NFL player injuries), most injuries can be fixed and he'll be fine.

The reverse of the risk of a one year deal is that Lamar has an incredible season and makes even more money going forward.

edit - with that said, if they offered him RW kind of money, Lamar is an idiot for not taking that deal.
RG3 seems like a cautionary tale Lamar might want to consider.
 

E5 Yaz

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RG3 seems like a cautionary tale Lamar might want to consider.
A career-threatening injury to a player "betting on themselves" in contact negotiations seems like an inevitability, but I think many such players could fall for the "it won't happen to me" line of thinking.
 

Cellar-Door

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I get the idea that he might get injured, but.... how much of a discount do you take? Rumored offer was 170-180 guaranteed... Watson got 230M guaranteed... Lamar probably says... "I'm better than Watson" so you're asking him to take in his mind a 50-60M discount? something like 25% less? Yeah, for that kind of gap you bet on yourself... he could have a pretty bad injury and still get 150M guaranteed without breaking a sweat.. Dak had a major injury and isn't as good and got $126M guaranteed. The odds on an injury that loses him a TON is pretty low, and if he doesn't suffer one, his upside is... $250M guaranteed? 275M? If 180M guaranteed is what was offered turning it down makes sense, somebody will pay him.
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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ESPN reporting that Lamar turned down Ravens' offer of 5 year extension worth over $250M. https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/34569529/lamar-jackson-declined-baltimore-ravens-250m-extension-offer-wants-deal-fully-guaranteed-signing-sources-say

Ravens offer had $133M guaranteed at signing, which was higher than both Wilson's ($124 million) and Murray's ($103.3 million) but obviously short of Watson's. In addition, the report does not mention any other guaranteed money, which I presume make the total guaranteed money be higher than Wilson/Murray.

However, Jackson is again holding out for a fully guaranteed contract.

I get the idea that he might get injured, but.... how much of a discount do you take? Rumored offer was 170-180 guaranteed... Watson got 230M guaranteed... Lamar probably says... "I'm better than Watson" so you're asking him to take in his mind a 50-60M discount? something like 25% less? Yeah, for that kind of gap you bet on yourself... he could have a pretty bad injury and still get 150M guaranteed without breaking a sweat.. Dak had a major injury and isn't as good and got $126M guaranteed. The odds on an injury that loses him a TON is pretty low, and if he doesn't suffer one, his upside is... $250M guaranteed? 275M? If 180M guaranteed is what was offered turning it down makes sense, somebody will pay him.
I'm sure you're capturing what Lamar is thinking but I don't get it because even if the total contract isn't guaranteed, it's not like Lamar isn't going to earn every penny of it (and a lot more) unless he has a major injury. And as the article notes, he has taken a lot of hits.

OTOH, professional sports athletes have to have an extra gear (or three) of competitiveness to make it that far and I know that goes to contracts as well for a lot of players. Lamar wants to be paid like the best player in the NFL; let's see what kind of season he puts up.
 

Cellar-Door

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ESPN reporting that Lamar turned down Ravens' offer of 5 year extension worth over $250M. https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/34569529/lamar-jackson-declined-baltimore-ravens-250m-extension-offer-wants-deal-fully-guaranteed-signing-sources-say

Ravens offer had $133M guaranteed at signing, which was higher than both Wilson's ($124 million) and Murray's ($103.3 million) but obviously short of Watson's. In addition, the report does not mention any other guaranteed money, which I presume make the total guaranteed money be higher than Wilson/Murray.

However, Jackson is again holding out for a fully guaranteed contract.


I'm sure you're capturing what Lamar is thinking but I don't get it because even if the total contract isn't guaranteed, it's not like Lamar isn't going to earn every penny of it (and a lot more) unless he has a major injury. And as the article notes, he has taken a lot of hits.

OTOH, professional sports athletes have to have an extra gear (or three) of competitiveness to make it that far and I know that goes to contracts as well for a lot of players. Lamar wants to be paid like the best player in the NFL; let's see what kind of season he puts up.
More guaranteed up front matters not only for injury protection but also re-works and extensions very few guys even QBs just play out the deal without adjustments
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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More guaranteed up front matters not only for injury protection but also re-works and extensions very few guys even QBs just play out the deal without adjustments
I understand that deals get adjusted all of the time but whether it's in bonuses or salaries or a combination, if Jackson stays healthy enough to play, he'd earn every penny of that $250M contract the Ravens offered and add a multiplier to that for his career earnings. If he doesn't, well that's why there's guaranteed money.

Even Cousins has earned $250M over his lifetime. https://sports.yahoo.com/deshaun-watsons-fully-guaranteed-deal-is-absolutely-factoring-into-lamar-jacksons-next-contract-193842212.html

It will be interesting to see what Burrow and Herbert do. Burrow in particular since it is my understanding that teams have to put all guaranteed money into escrow when the contract is signed and CIN is not as cash rich as, say, CLE is.
 

luckiestman

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I understand that deals get adjusted all of the time but whether it's in bonuses or salaries or a combination, if Jackson stays healthy enough to play, he'd earn every penny of that $250M contract the Ravens offered and add a multiplier to that for his career earnings. If he doesn't, well that's why there's guaranteed money.

Even Cousins has earned $250M over his lifetime. https://sports.yahoo.com/deshaun-watsons-fully-guaranteed-deal-is-absolutely-factoring-into-lamar-jacksons-next-contract-193842212.html

It will be interesting to see what Burrow and Herbert do. Burrow in particular since it is my understanding that teams have to put all guaranteed money into escrow when the contract is signed and CIN is not as cash rich as, say, CLE is.
People are “joking” that this is why Bengals finally sold naming rights for their stadium.
 

Cellar-Door

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I understand that deals get adjusted all of the time but whether it's in bonuses or salaries or a combination, if Jackson stays healthy enough to play, he'd earn every penny of that $250M contract the Ravens offered and add a multiplier to that for his career earnings. If he doesn't, well that's why there's guaranteed money.

Even Cousins has earned $250M over his lifetime. https://sports.yahoo.com/deshaun-watsons-fully-guaranteed-deal-is-absolutely-factoring-into-lamar-jacksons-next-contract-193842212.html

It will be interesting to see what Burrow and Herbert do. Burrow in particular since it is my understanding that teams have to put all guaranteed money into escrow when the contract is signed and CIN is not as cash rich as, say, CLE is.
So the point was.. when you renegotiate/adjust, you have to give the players something, usually it's more guarantees, but the more that is already guaranteed the more likely you get more money. Jackson knows he'll make every penny, and that tells him it's a bargain, instead he wants most of it guaranteed, so if the team wants him to adjust they have to give him more.
 

amfox1

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Unfortunately client Micah Hyde will be put on IR today due to his recent neck injury. Fortunately, we expect a healthy return for #23 in 2023 #BillsMafia #NFL
 

jsinger121

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Unfortunately client Micah Hyde will be put on IR today due to his recent neck injury. Fortunately, we expect a healthy return for #23 in 2023 #BillsMafia #NFL
Thats a massive blow for the Bills.