Offseason rumors

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RS2004foreever

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It's now 2 days since there was a rumor that Soler was close to signing with the Giants. It seems when a report like that comes out and then the player doesn't sign he usually goes elsewhere. JDM is supposedly talking to the Mets. Spring training starts in 2 weeks. Hopefully we get some word in the next couple of days on the remaining free agents.
 

Big Papi's Mango Salsa

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sign Donovan Solano for our RHH. Solano has *much* less power than Soler, but he makes a lot of contact and at a moderate quality and provides a bit more defensive value. He's an older guy, and he can play a so-so 1B, 2B, and 3B.

My reasoning is that money is apparently tight, and Solano would come cheap, would lengthen the lineup, would presumably accept a somewhat weird role (splitting DH PA with Yoshida and being a RH backup at the corner infield spots), and is just a flat-out good hitter.

L Duran CF
R Solano DH
L Devers 3B
R Story SS
L Yoshida LF
R O'Neill RF
L Casas 1B
R Wong C
R Grissom 2B

That's, dare I say..., a good lineup?
This is an idea (Solano) that I really like (assuming, and taking your word for the fact that he plays passable defense at those positions). Provides days off for Devers, Casas and by extension Grissom and Story when needed (Solano could play 2b and Grissom SS for a day off every 15 for Story or whatever). Isn't an OF when the team already has 900 of them. Can easily be "sat" on days that Yoshida is the DH, whereas Soler and Yoshida are mostly redundant as "bat only corner OFs better suited for DH."

Also you're then just getting rid of either Reyes or Refsnyder, neither of which are particularly good anyway, and replacing them with a better fit.

Not the way I'd stagger the line up (nit picking) but to the idea of the player, I think he makes a ton of sense.

I'd still prefer:
L Duran - LF
R Grissom - 2b
L Devers - 3b
L Casas - 1b
R Story - SS
L Abreu - RF
L Yoshida - DH
R Wong - C
R Rafaela - CF

Sloalno as the "super sup" playing 7 games out of 10 sprinkled among 1b, 2b, 3b and DH. But the player (and positional profile) makes a lot of sense.
 

pjheff

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L Duran CF
R Solano DH
L Devers 3B
R Story SS
L Yoshida LF
R O'Neill RF
L Casas 1B
R Wong C
R Grissom 2B

That's, dare I say..., a good lineup?
Any lineup which can afford to bat Casas 7th would have to be a good one, but I can’t see him hitting that low. If Duran is right, he should be leading off, and the challenge is that arguably our three other best hitters are also lefthanded. With the current roster, Story would get first crack at breaking up that monotony, followed by O’Neil, but the addition of a RH slugger would really lengthen the lineup.

L Duran CF
L Devers 3B
R Soler DH
L Casas 1B
L Yoshida LF
R Story SS
L Abreu RF
R Wong C
R Grissom 2B
 

BringBackMo

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It's now 2 days since there was a rumor that Soler was close to signing with the Giants. It seems when a report like that comes out and then the player doesn't sign he usually goes elsewhere. JDM is supposedly talking to the Mets. Spring training starts in 2 weeks. Hopefully we get some word in the next couple of days on the remaining free agents.
I thought those reports were simply that they were "talking." I hadn't seen that a signing was imminent or close. (I may well be wrong!)
 

nvalvo

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Any lineup which can afford to bat Casas 7th would have to be a good one, but I can’t see him hitting that low. If Duran is right, he should be leading off, and the challenge is that arguably our three other best hitters are also lefthanded. With the current roster, Story would get first crack at breaking up that monotony, followed by O’Neil, but the addition of a RH slugger would really lengthen the lineup.

L Duran CF
L Devers 3B
R Soler DH
L Casas 1B
L Yoshida LF
R Story SS
L Abreu RF
R Wong C
R Grissom 2B
I just liked the idea of a really fast leadoff guy in Duran followed by a high-BA line drive hitter in Solano followed by SLG-first dudes like Devers and Story. But really, the point is that if we add one more good bat, there should be very few weak links.
 

RS2004foreever

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An album title that describes this offseason: something/anything?
There really has been nothing in the last 4 days about any of the top free agents.
 

soxhop411

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Since trading away Soto and Trent Grisham in early December, the Padres have exactly one starting-caliber outfielder — Fernando Tatis Jr. — on their 40-man roster. José Azocar, the only other rostered outfielder, has a career .633 OPS through two seasons. Free agents such as Michael A. Taylor and Adam Duvall are still out there, and the front office has been examining a variety of trade possibilities. Still, the Padres clearly intend to audition a few prospects in camp.

Those prospects are headlined by non-roster invitees Jackson Merrill, Graham Pauley and Jakob Marsee — three left-handed hitters bidding to join a 40-man roster that also is short on lefty bats. Their big-league readiness will be put to a stern test. Merrill, Pauley and Marsee have limited experience above Single A. Merrill and Pauley have limited experience in the outfield. Other non-roster invitees include Óscar Mercado, Cal Mitchell and Tirso Ornelas.

Accordingly, the Padres continue to be in the market for outfield additions. Teams with surpluses — the Milwaukee Brewers and Boston Red Sox, to name two — are potential trade partners.
https://theathletic.com/5259118/2024/02/08/where-will-the-padres-find-innings-san-diegos-biggest-spring-training-questions/
 

cantor44

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Any lineup which can afford to bat Casas 7th would have to be a good one, but I can’t see him hitting that low. If Duran is right, he should be leading off, and the challenge is that arguably our three other best hitters are also lefthanded. With the current roster, Story would get first crack at breaking up that monotony, followed by O’Neil, but the addition of a RH slugger would really lengthen the lineup.

L Duran CF
L Devers 3B
R Soler DH
L Casas 1B
L Yoshida LF
R Story SS
L Abreu RF
R Wong C
R Grissom 2B
If Grissom can hit like he did in AAA then you might wanna:

L Duran CF
R Grissom 2B
L Devers 3B
R Soler DH
L Casas 1B
L Yoshida LF
R Story SS
L Abreu/R O'Neill RF
R Wong C

Honestly, I think this could be a good line up.
 

pjheff

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If Grissom can hit like he did in AAA then you might wanna:

L Duran CF
R Grissom 2B
L Devers 3B
R Soler DH
L Casas 1B
L Yoshida LF
R Story SS
L Abreu/R O'Neill RF
R Wong C

Honestly, I think this could be a good line up.
I could see Grissom profiling as a #2 hitter in the future if he fully materializes. I think it's a lot to ask a 23 year old rookie who is switching leagues, teams, and positions to assume that kind of offensive responsibility out of the gate. Put him at the bottom of the order and let him get his feet underneath him.
 

allmanbro

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There are always prospects. Either to keep or to flip to a third team.
The deal also doesn't need to be big. If the Padres are also too left handed, and the Sox add a RHH, that might be a destination for Refsnyder.

Edit: I misread, it says they are SHORT on lefty bats. Still, a smaller deal is possible.
 

nighthob

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Thanks for sharing this one. I had never heard that before. It seems crazy that teams were able to do that but I suppose it’s not entirely different from teams being able to construct their ballparks to basically whatever dimensions they like.
Ford Frick was down right angery [sic] when Maris broke the home run record. So baseball essentially entered another dead ball era out of pique. But '68 convinced everyone that they had to do something because endless 1-0 and 2-1 games were boring.
 

BringBackMo

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Ford Frick was down right angery [sic] when Maris broke the home run record. So baseball essentially entered another dead ball era out of pique. But '68 convinced everyone that they had to do something because endless 1-0 and 2-1 games were boring.
This got me interested, so I started poking around. Frick was reportedly at the Babe's side when he passed away, so it's easy to believe he was aggrieved by his friend's loss of the record. Here is a related passage from Wikipedia (so take it for what it's worth).
Early in the 1960s, the individual achievements of the batter impressively ruled. Highlighted in all of this was, undoubtedly, Roger Maris’ aforementioned shattering of Babe Ruth's single-season home run record. Alarmed by such increased home run numbers across the Majors, Frick convinced the owners to agree to having the strike zone widened before the 1963 season. The change led to a significant decrease in batting averages and scoring. While it consequently resulted in a remarkable era for the decade's top pitchers, attendance stagnated. The trend reached its peak in 1968 when American League teams batted a collective .230. A year later, the strike zone was corrected back to its previous dimensions.
 

John Marzano Olympic Hero

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This got me interested, so I started poking around. Frick was reportedly at the Babe's side when he passed away, so it's easy to believe he was aggrieved by his friend's loss of the record. Here is a related passage from Wikipedia (so take it for what it's worth).
He also wrote (ghost wrote?) Ruth's biography. That dude loved Babe Ruth more than anyone.
 

SuperDieHard

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Having seen both eras my vote is for Pedro 99’ 00’ strictly due to his dominance relative to the rest of the sport at the time. Koufax’s stretch of dominance was incredible as well. Both of those rank above all others. Gibson was fantastic throughout his career and his numbers in ‘68 amazing but during that era many teams had great #1’s who would go the entire year with perhaps 1 or 2 starts where they just didn’t have it out of 35+. Seaver was my guy and that was typical for him. Pedro in those years was just so far above the rest of the league it puts what he did above the others in my eyes. Similarly, Koji’s stretch as closer in 2013 was the best relief stretch I’ve seen, even if, say, Papelbon had year’s with numbers just as good and a few years that were close to as dominant. I don’t have the stats you guys do but I would bet his strike percentage was as high as anyone historically for that run.
 

E5 Yaz

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Having seen both eras my vote is for Pedro 99’ 00’ strictly due to his dominance relative to the rest of the sport at the time. Koufax’s stretch of dominance was incredible as well. Both of those rank above all others. Gibson was fantastic throughout his career and his numbers in ‘68 amazing but during that era many teams had great #1’s who would go the entire year with perhaps 1 or 2 starts where they just didn’t have it out of 35+. Seaver was my guy and that was typical for him. Pedro in those years was just so far above the rest of the league it puts what he did above the others in my eyes. Similarly, Koji’s stretch as closer in 2013 was the best relief stretch I’ve seen, even if, say, Papelbon had year’s with numbers just as good and a few years that were close to as dominant. I don’t have the stats you guys do but I would bet his strike percentage was as high as anyone historically for that run.
Username checks out
 

nighthob

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This got me interested, so I started poking around. Frick was reportedly at the Babe's side when he passed away, so it's easy to believe he was aggrieved by his friend's loss of the record. Here is a related passage from Wikipedia (so take it for what it's worth).
The expanded strike zone, combined with baseball dropping enforcement of the mound regulations really demolished the hitting. It makes Yaz’s ‘67 season even more remarkable.
 

GaryPeters71

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Don't shoot the messenger. :)

https://theathletic.com/5259118/2024/02/08/where-will-the-padres-find-innings-san-diegos-biggest-spring-training-questions/

"Since trading away Soto and Trent Grisham in early December, the Padres have exactly one starting-caliber outfielder — Fernando Tatis Jr. — on their 40-man roster. José Azocar, the only other rostered outfielder, has a career .633 OPS through two seasons. Free agents such as Michael A. Taylor and Adam Duvall are still out there, and the front office has been examining a variety of trade possibilities. Still, the Padres clearly intend to audition a few prospects in camp.

Those prospects are headlined by non-roster invitees Jackson Merrill, Graham Pauley and Jakob Marsee — three left-handed hitters bidding to join a 40-man roster that also is short on lefty bats. Their big-league readiness will be put to a stern test. Merrill, Pauley and Marsee have limited experience above Single A. Merrill and Pauley have limited experience in the outfield. Other non-roster invitees include Óscar Mercado, Cal Mitchell and Tirso Ornelas.

Accordingly, the Padres continue to be in the market for outfield additions. Teams with surpluses — the Milwaukee Brewers and Boston Red Sox, to name two — are potential trade partners."
 

BringBackMo

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Don't shoot the messenger. :)

https://theathletic.com/5259118/2024/02/08/where-will-the-padres-find-innings-san-diegos-biggest-spring-training-questions/

"Since trading away Soto and Trent Grisham in early December, the Padres have exactly one starting-caliber outfielder — Fernando Tatis Jr. — on their 40-man roster. José Azocar, the only other rostered outfielder, has a career .633 OPS through two seasons. Free agents such as Michael A. Taylor and Adam Duvall are still out there, and the front office has been examining a variety of trade possibilities. Still, the Padres clearly intend to audition a few prospects in camp.

Those prospects are headlined by non-roster invitees Jackson Merrill, Graham Pauley and Jakob Marsee — three left-handed hitters bidding to join a 40-man roster that also is short on lefty bats. Their big-league readiness will be put to a stern test. Merrill, Pauley and Marsee have limited experience above Single A. Merrill and Pauley have limited experience in the outfield. Other non-roster invitees include Óscar Mercado, Cal Mitchell and Tirso Ornelas.

Accordingly, the Padres continue to be in the market for outfield additions. Teams with surpluses — the Milwaukee Brewers and Boston Red Sox, to name two — are potential trade partners."
Another messenger posted this very passage like ten posts above yours. No one shot him, either, because there doesn’t appear to be anything negative about the Sox in this write up.
 

RS2004foreever

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View: https://twitter.com/bossportsgordo/status/1755797533652140192?s=46&t=7XazH1NKZP26a4WUZikbkQ


Updates from @JonHeyman:

Red Sox could still be an option for Montgomery
Teams are asking about Jarren Duran
Sox are fielding calls on Kenley Jansen, and the Padres and Dodgers are suitors.
Heyman also suggested the Rangers could be simply waiting for a bankruptcy ruling before signing Montgomery.
My predictions based on nothing
Snell to the Yankees
Montgomery to the Rangers
Chapman to the Giants
Bellinger resigns with the Cubs
Soler to the Giants
Duvall to Boston
Boston does acquire one starting pitcher
 

BaseballJones

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Curt Flood's autobiography has great passages about Gibson. He would sit in the dugout and say "Score some runs you miserable bastards" and similar more R-rated things. Famously he told Tim McCarver when he dared to pay a visit to the mound "The only thing you know about good pitching is you can't hit it". The comparison of Pedro and Gibson is fun because they were very interesting and strong-willed guys. And they were both really really good.
We now return to our longstanding wait for ANY sort of news relating to the Red Sox and free agents, already in progress.
I mean yeah, I want some good Sox offseason rumors. But in the meanwhile, is there anything better to talk about than Pedro Martinez' greatness?
 

Daniel_Son

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TimScribble

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I’m of the opinion that Boston signs neither Monty or Snell. The later year money doesn’t line up with their current goals. I’d love to be wrong.
 

cantor44

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I could see Grissom profiling as a #2 hitter in the future if he fully materializes. I think it's a lot to ask a 23 year old rookie who is switching leagues, teams, and positions to assume that kind of offensive responsibility out of the gate. Put him at the bottom of the order and let him get his feet underneath him.
Yes, that's probably wise ...
 

TubeSoxs

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I feel like I'd be happy with a Duran for Thorpe+ trade.
Was going to say they have some interesting pitching prospects. I doubt they give up Snelling or Lesko but yeah, ending up with the Yanks two best potching prospects from just recent would be fun.
 

jon abbey

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Was going to say they have some interesting pitching prospects. I doubt they give up Snelling or Lesko but yeah, ending up with the Yanks two best potching prospects from just recent would be fun.
Fitts was never close to a top 2 pitching prospect for NY, 4th at best but probably lower.
 

Red(s)HawksFan

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I’m of the opinion that Boston signs neither Monty or Snell. The later year money doesn’t line up with their current goals. I’d love to be wrong.
I suspect that if either one ends up in Boston, it's because those later years on the contract won't exist. Either one on a four year deal would line up just fine.
 

Sandy Leon Trotsky

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If he gets scooped up for anything less than $110M by another team I'm legit going to be pissed at both Breslow and Henry. It seems so friggin obvious that the team just needs one more legit starter (even one with the flaws of Montgomery or Snell) to make them a playoff contender.
 

SouthernBoSox

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If he gets scooped up for anything less than $110M by another team I'm legit going to be pissed at both Breslow and Henry. It seems so friggin obvious that the team just needs one more legit starter (even one with the flaws of Montgomery or Snell) to make them a playoff contender.
He won’t be available to the Red Sox at a discount. Bad defense with low playoff odds.

The Red Sox will have to be the highest bidder by more than a small margin to get him.
 

Max Power

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E-Rod and Sonny Gray are looking pretty smart right now. Who would have guessed that the pitching market would collapse rather than explode after Yamamoto?
 

bernie carb 33

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He won’t be available to the Red Sox at a discount. Bad defense with low playoff odds.

The Red Sox will have to be the highest bidder by more than a small margin to get him.
IMO as tight as the Sox budget seems to be, there is no way they deal for Monty before they get a nice trade for Jansen beforehand.
 

Mueller Lite

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How to fix the offseason this week:

Trade Duran to the Padres for Snelling, Lesko or Thorpe
Sign Duvall for 1 year at like 8 mil
Trade Jansen to Dodgers for pitching depth and cash
Sign Montgomery for 5/140 with an opt out after 3 years

This solves your roster problems now and gives you the young and veteran rotation pieces needed for the future.

Hardest part of this is having SD give up one of their three best pitching prospects but if they're serious about getting a dynamic outfielder then Duran should be very intriguing to them.
 

Sandy Leon Trotsky

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E-Rod and Sonny Gray are looking pretty smart right now. Who would have guessed that the pitching market would collapse rather than explode after Yamamoto?
Well by the time YY went, the really big spenders either all already spent, addressed their needs or decided to reign in spending. We'll see what they end up getting and I'm sure it'll still be a crazy amount, just probably not what Boras wants teams to believe they're worth. The cost of losing a top paid starting pitcher for a season, or underperforming their contract can really cripple a team (See: Sale, Chris) while having ones that are developed within and under team control still can hurt but it's not a kick in the financial gonads. Both Snell and Montgomery have serious question marks- Snell's injuries and inconsistency and Montgomery's ceiling is lower.
Despite that Montgomery is still a perfect fit for the Sox and the team needs to overpay for him.
 

BringBackMo

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It seems so friggin obvious that the team just needs one more legit starter (even one with the flaws of Montgomery or Snell) to make them a playoff contender.
He won’t be available to the Red Sox at a discount. Bad defense with low playoff odds.

The Red Sox will have to be the highest bidder by more than a small margin to get him.
Summing up, it‘s obvious that Montgomery makes the Red Sox a playoff contender, but the Red Sox will have to make an extra big offer to land Montgomery, in part because the odds they make the playoffs are low.

Is it possible that none of us has any idea what’s going on here at all?
 

Jimbodandy

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If he gets scooped up for anything less than $110M by another team I'm legit going to be pissed at both Breslow and Henry. It seems so friggin obvious that the team just needs one more legit starter (even one with the flaws of Montgomery or Snell) to make them a playoff contender.
You'll be welcomed at the club of the pissed. I've moved on to low expectations.

I look forward to hearing why Monty made no sense anyway...because he didn't want to sign here because reasons, and well if you look more closely at his numbers, blah blah.
 

RS2004foreever

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Summing up, it‘s obvious that Montgomery makes the Red Sox a playoff contender, but the Red Sox will have to make an extra big offer to land Montgomery, in part because the odds they make the playoffs are low.

Is it possible that none of us has any idea what’s going on here at all?
As loath as I am to suggests this, I actually think it is extremely likely we don't know what is going.
 

Red(s)HawksFan

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Summing up, it‘s obvious that Montgomery makes the Red Sox a playoff contender, but the Red Sox will have to make an extra big offer to land Montgomery, in part because the odds they make the playoffs are low.

Is it possible that none of us has any idea what’s going on here at all?
Possible? It's more than possible. It's guaranteed we have no idea what's going on here at all. We're all guessing. Or hoping.
 

SouthernBoSox

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Curious where you’re getting this. Has there been any reporting that’s involved the terms of offers teams have submitted for Montgomery?
Tea reading. They have stated from the begging they were using Carlos Rodon as a comp (6/162) as a comp. The market has obviously rejected that.

The teams that need starting pitching now vs November has shrunk considerably. The only obvious team is the Red Sox, and they are operating like a cash strapped team.

So he’s going to have to settle for a team that would like him - as a luxury but now need - which is going to be discounted from ask OR the cheap Red Sox.
 
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