Patriot Force One

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PaulinMyrBch

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MYRTLE BEACH!!!!
Aren't the charters that teams currently take also old?

I'm just surprised no one did this earlier in the NFL. But then I'm surprised NFL teams still make rookies sleep two to a room when on the road.
Yes apparently this was need based as well. The airlines that provide the charters this size are retiring the planes and have no financial interest in converting newer planes to this purpose. So the big jet charters were becoming harder to reserve. Still blows my mind, college and pro football would seem to be a large customer market. College teams travel with larger rosters.
 

jsinger121

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Any concerns that they're flying 26 year old planes?
My guess is both planes are going to get overhauled and inspected thoroughly before getting back in the air to extend the planes shelf life.
 

PaulinMyrBch

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You seriously think this would happen? I mean, other teams are freaked out enough being in the visiting locker room.
Yes. this is an owner decision. So my guess our plane is a convenient rental option for nearby teams and then the football staff will be the ones paranoid about secret cameras.
 

tims4wins

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Guessing the backup plane would be used to bring staff, families, etc. - the rest of the Super Bowl traveling party
 

Harry Hooper

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If it's all first-class seating, I wonder how many seats there will be. We'll ignore an onboard trainer's room and TB12 recovery salon for the moment.
 

Curt S Loew

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Yes. this is an owner decision. So my guess our plane is a convenient rental option for nearby teams and then the football staff will be the ones paranoid about secret cameras.
My guess is there is no way the Jets/Giants/Bills use the Patriots plane. They might booby trap it.
 

loshjott

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The Pats would never allow this, but it would be a superb troll by fans of the non-Pats AFC champion to charter those for the Super Bowl.

When it happens in the distant future, that is.
 

Hoya81

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Any concerns that they're flying 26 year old planes?
If they're maintained well, aircraft have surprisingly long lifetimes. The last B-52 rolled off the assembly line in 1962 and the Air Force is planning on flying them until 2045.
 

Valek123

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I see this as a clear sign the London expansion remains on the table. Change before you need to, if they perfect the recovery aircraft trips to London will be no big deal.
 

jsinger121

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If they're maintained well, aircraft have surprisingly long lifetimes. The last B-52 rolled off the assembly line in 1962 and the Air Force is planning on flying them until 2045.
Agreed. They also are going to see the serious mileage and wear and tear if this plane was still in commercial service.
 

Reverend

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Guessing the backup plane would be used to bring staff, families, etc. - the rest of the Super Bowl traveling party
Given that one of the reasons given for the purchase is the difficulty of finding charter options, I suspect the backup plane is so that they can still make it to their game if something happens to the first plane.

I'm not sure how long they'll be able to keep the second plane though, especially if other teams start seeing the value of having such a plane. There's the possibility of slapping a franchise tag on it, but otherwise it's not clear if it will get enough use to justify the expense, but then again, what do you do if something happens to the first plane...
 

InstaFace

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Given that one of the reasons given for the purchase is the difficulty of finding charter options, I suspect the backup plane is so that they can still make it to their game if something happens to the first plane.

I'm not sure how long they'll be able to keep the second plane though, especially if other teams start seeing the value of having such a plane. There's the possibility of slapping a franchise tag on it, but otherwise it's not clear if it will get enough use to justify the expense, but then again, what do you do if something happens to the first plane...
 

AB in DC

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Yes apparently this was need based as well. The airlines that provide the charters this size are retiring the planes and have no financial interest in converting newer planes to this purpose. So the big jet charters were becoming harder to reserve.
I'm still missing something here. If it's no longer economical for charters to keep flying these planes, why is it cost-effective for the Patriots to do so on their own?
 

Byrdbrain

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If it's all first-class seating, I wonder how many seats there will be. We'll ignore an onboard trainer's room and TB12 recovery salon for the moment.
A typical Delta 767 has 10 rows of Delta One seats and 32 rows of economy seating, that can differ slightly based on the type of 767 but it is in that ballpark. Let's assume those 32 rows of economy seats become 20 rows more first class seating you are looking at 30 rows total of four across seating so about 120 seats. My guess is they need about 100 seats for the team, coaches, support staff and various hangers on so they could afford to lose a couple of rows for a trainers area which I assume they will have.
 

joe dokes

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Given that one of the reasons given for the purchase is the difficulty of finding charter options, I suspect the backup plane is so that they can still make it to their game if something happens to the first plane.

I'm not sure how long they'll be able to keep the second plane though, especially if other teams start seeing the value of having such a plane. There's the possibility of slapping a franchise tag on it, but otherwise it's not clear if it will get enough use to justify the expense, but then again, what do you do if something happens to the first plane...
Valid concern. Small sample size, but i recall the team having to use a third plane and doing Ok even though that plane was flying with a broken wing.
 

NortheasternPJ

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Also Gillette was funded entirely by Kraft so the point is moot anyway
I agree for the most part, but he did demand the Commonwealth pay for infrastructure upgrades as part of it. In terms of stadiums go, that's about as little help as you can get compared to most of these other deals. Greater Boston is the only city in the US that has all their major stadiums / arenas privately funded.
 

singaporesoxfan

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Valid concern. Small sample size, but i recall the team having to use a third plane and doing Ok even though that plane was flying with a broken wing.
Yeah but that first plane should never have been grounded in the first place. The cabin was properly pressurized.
 

singaporesoxfan

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I'm still missing something here. If it's no longer economical for charters to keep flying these planes, why is it cost-effective for the Patriots to do so on their own?
The Patriots aren't doing this to save money, they're doing this because the charter options are dwindling plus they can customize the planes in ways to aid recovery.
 

Saints Rest

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The Patriots aren't doing this to save money, they're doing this because the charter options are dwindling plus they can customize the planes in ways to aid recovery.
That last statement is the real key and one I alluded to many posts ago. Think about the ramifications if technology and medical research means that a chartered plane can alleviate the issues associated with cross-country flights, or a move to a high-altitude city (not like the Pats don't have two such flights this year).
 

McBride11

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That last statement is the real key and one I alluded to many posts ago. Think about the ramifications if technology and medical research means that a chartered plane can alleviate the issues associated with cross-country flights, or a move to a high-altitude city (not like the Pats don't have two such flights this year).

Can they mess with the cabin pressurization? Commercial airliners pressure is like being around 8k feet meaning people dont get as much oxygen. Not great for recovery.
Not sure if that increased pressure differential (if they set the cabin to like 3k feet) will affect the airframe?
Or could thet just pump more O2 into the cabin?
 

singaporesoxfan

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That last statement is the real key and one I alluded to many posts ago. Think about the ramifications if technology and medical research means that a chartered plane can alleviate the issues associated with cross-country flights, or a move to a high-altitude city (not like the Pats don't have two such flights this year).
Agree, but it doesn't even have to be that advanced, to be honest. The fact that right now huge burly players are seated on planes with standard 2-3-2 seat configurations and presumably standard airline pitch and that the best they get is giving the largest guys first class seats and the other guys multiple economy class seats means the ability to configure the plane with proper lay-flat international business class seats could be a huge improvement in comfort and rest.
 

Reverend

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That last statement is the real key and one I alluded to many posts ago. Think about the ramifications if technology and medical research means that a chartered plane can alleviate the issues associated with cross-country flights, or a move to a high-altitude city (not like the Pats don't have two such flights this year).
Hell, they could do IVs, couldn't they? They mentioned hydration monitoring toilets...
 

Blue Monkey

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Commercial airplanes operate in auto mode when it comes to pressurization. After takeoff the cabin pressure altitude will slowly climb as the aircraft's altitude increases. The cabin pressure altitude will increase until it reaches approximately 8,000' and then it will hold steady as the airplane climbs. Pilots do have the ability to manually override auto mode. However, it's a bit of a tedious process to continually monitor and adjust the cabin altitude as the plane climbs and descends. Manual control of the cabin pressure is usually reserved for emergency/irregular operations.

As far as affecting the structural integrity of the airplane I'm not certain if it would negatively affect it that much. The airframe always expands and contracts as the pressure changes and over many flights (>20,000 flights) eventually the structurally integrity will be compromised. These are 25 year old airplanes already, however they won't see anything close to the typical airline workload with the Pats operating them. So any effect on going between auto and manual mode would probably have minimal impact on the structural integrity. I think the bigger problem is that most aircraft are programed to drop the oxygen masks when the cabin altitude exceeds ~14,000' so that would be an issue. I'm not certain what the FAA (regulations are a bitch) would have to say about operating an aircraft on manual mode all the time. My guess is that it would be highly frowned upon... not to mention that you could kill off the entire organization from oxygen deprivation if the pilots were careless.

edit... Ahh you we're pondering increasing the cabin pressure to a lower altitude... eh, I think the FAA wouldn't approve of those operations but I could be wrong. Also I'm not sure if the pressurization system would be strong enough to hold a differential pressure that great between inside and outside the aircraft. I just fly em, I don't design em. We need an aeronautical engineer!
 
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DeJesus Built My Hotrod

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The Patriots aren't doing this to save money, they're doing this because the charter options are dwindling plus they can customize the planes in ways to aid recovery.
This is a fancy way of saying the planes will have Brady's special hyperbaric chamber replete with blood spinners, white blood-cell injectors and the latest in German platelet-rich-plasma treatments.

Oh, and a really kick ass juicer for green drinks!
 

Reverend

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This is a fancy way of saying the planes will have Brady's special hyperbaric chamber replete with blood spinners, white blood-cell injectors and the latest in German platelet-rich-plasma treatments.

Oh, and a really kick ass juicer for green drinks!
You forgot the anti-gravity treadmill.
 

bakahump

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if NFL teams can buy jets how come they can't build their own stadia?
While I laughed A stadium costs $500 Million to a Billion dollars. A plane costs 20 million ish.

Its like saying "If eustis can buy a new toyota, why cant he buy a Bugatti Veyron".
 

soxfan121

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Given that one of the reasons given for the purchase is the difficulty of finding charter options, I suspect the backup plane is so that they can still make it to their game if something happens to the first plane.
This was, almost word-for-word, Jonathan Kraft's answer when asked on TSH's pregame show. He added that Bill has things planned to the minute and that any delay was unacceptable, so having a second plane to bring off the bench instead of wait for a repair was why they went for 2.

And the next question was about Garoppolo, and Kraft deftly made an organizational planning point that implied "that's why we also bought two planes."
 

jose melendez

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He cares enough about the issue to fly all of these kids up here, but he also is a prop for guy who among many unforgivable positions, is loudly against everything these kids are for.
 

Koufax

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So you'd prefer that he not use the plane for this laudable purpose?
 
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