Spurs 22/23: So, do we have a manager?

SeoulSoxFan

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Makes sense to sack the manager and run out the exact same strategy. Nothing like getting out-possessed by a 10-man, relegation threatened team.
They had NO ONE in the box. They dropped Son outside of the box and basically left Kane alone (and not even all the time). The heatmaps tell a story of a broken team playing a losing strategy.

P. S. Son was in top form during the international week. He looked his best self from last year, against decent competition in Columbia and Uruguay.
 

Zososoxfan

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Well this is something!

We are delighted to announce the appointment of Scott Munn as Chief Football Officer. Scott will be joining the Club’s Board and will take charge of all footballing departments.

As referenced in the Chairman’s statement (Financial Results 2021/22 - 10 February 2023) there has been an ongoing review over the past six months of all of our footballing activities. Changes have been made and further improvements continue to ensure future progress and competitiveness.

Scott, former City Football Group Executive, has extensive experience within sporting organisations having started his career with the Sydney Organising Committee for the 2000 Olympic Games and then transitioning into the National Rugby League, before joining the Australia Football League. Scott joined Melbourne City FC as Chief Executive Officer in 2010. In 2019 he was appointed Chief Executive Officer of City Football Group China.

Daniel Levy, Chairman: “Scott has a unique and broad experience of running sporting organisations at the highest level and will take responsibility for the leadership and management of our football activities to instil best practice both on and off the pitch.”
https://www.tottenhamhotspur.com/news/2023/april/club-appoints-chief-football-officer/

From Reddit:

Some thoughts:
  • Levy is hiring Munn to handle footballing aspects of the club. The job title is a big tell as to the scope and seriousness. He’d be an “officer” of the company, meaning he’d have legal and fiduciary responsibility. (Likely some volume of equity, too.)
  • Levy would still be his superior, but this’d be more of an indication that he is creating improved infrastructure to allow for more autonomy within the different areas of the company. Firing an officer is much less straightforward than others and shows a real sign of intent.
  • Paratici or a DOF would report to Munn, which makes sense. If Munn is ostensibly the CEO of the footballing side of the company, he’d represent the science/hard tactics. The DOF would be more of the artistic side. I’d imagine this’d entail a world in which Munn would allocate a budget in partnership with the Xhairman/board and work with the DOF on transfers, for instance.
  • Levy, as chairman, would still have oversight. And they have a board structure for large decisions, like any other company. But this could represent a significant ceding of control, in theory.
  • The thinking that the club has had their “head in the sand” about Paratici is somewhat undone by this news. It was likely in motion for much of the back half of 2022. They were likely looking to plan a proper introduction for someone in this role and they’d make a determination on Paratici. (As he’d be their direct report.) Same goes for some other decisions around manager, etc.
https://old.reddit.com/r/coys/comments/12ek9ql/we_are_delighted_to_announce_the_appointment_of/
 

Jimy Hendrix

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I have no basis to judge whether this specific guy is the right guy for this job, but this is exactly the correct shape of the front-office restructuring that really needs to happen to help Spurs get out of the rut they're currently in, so on that level I am into it.
 

DJnVa

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Unchanged lineup for Spurs today, because why mess with a good thing?
 

Gunfighter 09

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So I keep telling myself the missed penalty call just balances out the bullshit at the end of the Southampton game and they got the 5 points they deserved out of those three games.
 

DJnVa

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So I keep telling myself the missed penalty call just balances out the bullshit at the end of the Southampton game and they got the 5 points they deserved out of those three games.
I can't believe that VAR didn't ask the ref to look at it. That seems crazy.
 

Kliq

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Spurs gave up a lot of possession to Brighton, allowed a lot of dangerous situations, but Kane and Son were ruthless on their goal scoring chances and they won. The players change, the managers change, the team is the exact same.
 

Zososoxfan

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It seems painfully clear that the odd choice to sack Conte but keep Stellini and staff was a horrid outcome. Nothing's changed except Levy and the club can say that they threw up the temperamental dickhead that said mean things. The defense is still appalling, although Son's renaissance is lovely.

There are reports out there that Dier's being offered a new 3-year deal. In a vacuum, having Dier as your 4th or 5th choice CB is probably fine, but for all the reasons obvious to supporters of this club it's time to move on. What happened to Dav on Saturday was also super sad and it should be very clear to everyone involved he needs to move on. I think he's actually decent but he and the club both need a change of scenery.

I also don't understand why Lloris is getting starts over Forster. The man has been a terrific servant to the club but he's past it. Just utter shambles all around.

I bet the club hire Brendan Rodgers.
 

Zososoxfan

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Paratici resigned after his ban was upheld. So now we have no permanent manager nor DOF. At this time, Levy decided it was a good idea to defend himself at a business-oriented lecture at Cambridge Univ. Dude is tone. deaf. And I'm truly a huge fan of what he's done.

I've kind of felt all along that going back to Poch was the wrong idea and they needed a fresh new face. But upon reconsidering, they really needed a shakeup right away to try and salvage this season. That doesn't preclude Potter or Nagelsmann either (I'd be thrilled with any of these 3 honestly). I mean, the math says it isn't over yet but if they don't win against Newcastle on Sunday, it's done and dusted. And it always made sense to me to bring in the next manager with a few low stakes games left on the schedule so the new manager could assess them before heading into the summer. As the COYS turns...
 

DJnVa

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Poch is apparently the leading candidate at Chelsea as Nagelsmann has pulled out. That'll go over well.

With Paratici gone there's no Poch vs. Paratici head-butting. Go get him. Is it fan service? Yes. It could also be the right move.
 

Zososoxfan

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Stellini has to go, even if it's just for the last handful of games. Keeping him was a disaster of an idea and now it's time to course-correct. I don't think Mason is the answer either. Just a competent EPL manager to maintain some dignity. Unless they'd rather drop out of European spaces completely if no UCL. A position that I strongly disagree with. I love the Europa league.
 

CodPiece XL

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When Conte left, Spurs were in relatively good shape as far as Spur’s standards and position. It was madness not to hire a proper manager until the end of season. Now we have an another caretaker manager who worked under the caretaker manager who worked under Conte. It reminds me of the fathers' fathers' fathers scene in Life of Brian. So .. Spursy.

meanwhile:

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/65389917
 
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Morgan's Magic Snowplow

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When Conte left, Spurs were in relatively good shape as far as Spur’s standards and position. It was madness not to hire a proper manager until the end of season. Now we have an another caretaker manager who worked under the caretaker manager who worked under Conte. It reminds me of the fathers' fathers' fathers scene in Life of Brian. So .. Spursy.

meanwhile:

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/65389917
63957
 

DJnVa

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This is either gonna be 5-0 ManU or 2-1 Spurs and frankly I'm here for either.
 

Zososoxfan

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View: https://twitter.com/FabrizioRomano/status/1651503782864252928


Rangnick as DOF + Nagelsman as manager, and with them given the time and resources to remake the football operations side of the club from the ground up, would be an A+ outcome here.
Yeah, I saw this story yesterday too and would absolutely prefer that we get Ralf + Julian as a package deal. They could set us up for years, and if Julian decides to leave but Ralf stays, it would be the way this is supposed to work.
 

Zososoxfan

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Paratici was pretty solid overall, and did help us quite a bit. Conte earned us UCL this season and that's worth a lot. It's on Levy for not picking one direction or another re Conte. The best example of this is overpaying for Porro at $40M specifically for Conte while not locking up Conte. Moreover, if you believe reports Levy was the one that pushed Paratici to dump Nuno and get Conte. Conte deserves a lot of blame here too, and it's hard to tease out how much slack to cut him for what's legitimately been a brutal year from him. But then you get back to Levy again, because he had to have known or should've known about Paratici's questionable past.
 

coremiller

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Was Patrici and Conte an A+ outcome too?
No, because Conte was never going to be a long-term fix. He's had 8 jobs and only one of them lasted longer than 2 years, and that one only lasted 3. The hope was that either Conte would win something while here or at least turn things around after the Mourinho/Nuno debacles so that the club would be in a better position when Conte inevitably imploded and quit in a fit of rage in a year or two. It didn't work out, and led to some serious strategic mistakes because Spurs tied their transfer strategy to Conte when he was never likely to stick around for long.
 

Kliq

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Yeah, I'm not against a Rangnick/Nagelsman combination and it's music to my ears that they view this as a long term plan that will need years of patience to really get the club going in a sustainable direction. It just feels like we heard the same thing about Conte arriving; with Conte saying the team has a lot of work to do and isn't ready to compete at the highest level--and the direction of the club remained largely the same, with a lot of spending that hasn't worked out and a lack of cohesion on the field.
 

Jimy Hendrix

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Yeah, I'm not against a Rangnick/Nagelsman combination and it's music to my ears that they view this as a long term plan that will need years of patience to really get the club going in a sustainable direction. It just feels like we heard the same thing about Conte arriving; with Conte saying the team has a lot of work to do and isn't ready to compete at the highest level--and the direction of the club remained largely the same, with a lot of spending that hasn't worked out and a lack of cohesion on the field.
The difference here to me is that we know Rangick was directly involved in building an effective, modern scouting and recruiting system from scratch which has outlived his involvement, while Paratici's signature accomplishment appears to have been financial crimes. They both tick the box of "A director of football" but their accomplishments are quite different in that role.
 

Zososoxfan

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Yeah, I'm not against a Rangnick/Nagelsman combination and it's music to my ears that they view this as a long term plan that will need years of patience to really get the club going in a sustainable direction. It just feels like we heard the same thing about Conte arriving; with Conte saying the team has a lot of work to do and isn't ready to compete at the highest level--and the direction of the club remained largely the same, with a lot of spending that hasn't worked out and a lack of cohesion on the field.
Conte may have said the right things (so did Mou) but we knew the deal going in.
 

Kliq

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I don't know what happened at half time but they came out and played like a completely different team and really took it to United for most of the second half. A lot more energy, especially from the midfield and fullbacks.

Richarlison did well I think, with his ability to win balls downfield adding a different dimension to the attack, especially with Kane slotted further back. Kulu coming off the bench seemed to put a pep in his step, he was as lively as he has been in a while.
 

Zososoxfan

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Mason's approach has exposed Spurs in an even more exaggerated way for what we already knew--very talented forwards with a terrible D and middling MF that can't help the D much. I appreciate Mason and he's made us an exciting mess (Spurs DNA!) instead of a boring one, but he can't work miracles here, nor should he be expected to. I think Spurs have enough left in the tank to finish 6th because Brighton's run-in is brutal even with the games in hand (they still have United, Arsenal, Newcastle, MANC, and Villa), but Spurs have no cakewalk either (including Palace, Villa, Brentford, Leeds).
 
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Kliq

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Porro feels good for at least one goal conceded per game because he doesn't do basic marking. Emerson is still out for a few more weeks with his meniscus injury. Davies is also probably coming back around that same time. It's been a huge weakness for Spurs and probably also led to some additional CB exposure.

Romero had a really poor game yesterday. Losing Diaz at the near post (also Dier's fault for not sticking closer to Gakpo) and then the sloppy challenge to concede the penalty. Why is he going to ground there?

On the bright side, I think over the past month or so Son has shown real signs of improvements for what has largely been a forgettable season for him. I think the fatigue from last year + World Cup really hurt him for a broad part of the season, but he's looked as pacey and lively as ever lately.
 

Zososoxfan

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Porro feels good for at least one goal conceded per game because he doesn't do basic marking. Emerson is still out for a few more weeks with his meniscus injury. Davies is also probably coming back around that same time. It's been a huge weakness for Spurs and probably also led to some additional CB exposure.

Romero had a really poor game yesterday. Losing Diaz at the near post (also Dier's fault for not sticking closer to Gakpo) and then the sloppy challenge to concede the penalty. Why is he going to ground there?

On the bright side, I think over the past month or so Son has shown real signs of improvements for what has largely been a forgettable season for him. I think the fatigue from last year + World Cup really hurt him for a broad part of the season, but he's looked as pacey and lively as ever lately.
I'm pretty shocked no manager has tried Deki at RWB and Danjuma at RW. You could put Richy at RW too, my bigger issue is the fact that we have options at RW but much fewer at RWB. Porro looks like a good player, but his defense is shambolic. I'd love to put Porro at RMF in an old-school 4-4-2 in front of Emerson (or Tanganga right now). Perisic at LMF ahead of Davies is about the same as as Perisic at LWB. Our left side was actually functional when it's Davies ahead of Lenglet.
 

Jimy Hendrix

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I'm pretty shocked no manager has tried Deki at RWB and Danjuma at RW. You could put Richy at RW too, my bigger issue is the fact that we have options at RW but much fewer at RWB. Porro looks like a good player, but his defense is shambolic. I'd love to put Porro at RMF in an old-school 4-4-2 in front of Emerson (or Tanganga right now). Perisic at LMF ahead of Davies is about the same as as Perisic at LWB. Our left side was actually functional when it's Davies ahead of Lenglet.
It's an underrated thread to the season how badly injuries hurt the team. They find a two that is somewhat functional in the wildly demanding Conte always outnumbered MF, Bentancur goes down for the season. They find a wingback pairing that really starts to click in Davies/Emerson, both get hurt. A top choice fully healthy and fit front 3, let alone all 4 top front guys, rarely all together.
 

Zososoxfan

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I'm pretty shocked no manager has tried Deki at RWB and Danjuma at RW. You could put Richy at RW too, my bigger issue is the fact that we have options at RW but much fewer at RWB. Porro looks like a good player, but his defense is shambolic. I'd love to put Porro at RMF in an old-school 4-4-2 in front of Emerson (or Tanganga right now). Perisic at LMF ahead of Davies is about the same as as Perisic at LWB. Our left side was actually functional when it's Davies ahead of Lenglet.
I mean, not bad!!
 

Zososoxfan

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The current state of play for Spurs' end of season run is down to whether they finish 6th, 7th, or 8th. Spurs aren't catching Liverpool in 5th, who are 5 points ahead, and Brentford aren't catching Spurs as they are 7 points behind.

Spurs currently sit 6th, Brighton 7th, and Villa 8th. Spurs are 2 points ahead of Brighton, and 3 ahead of Villa, but Brighton have 2 games in hand. Brighton have the GD tiebreaker over Spurs, and Spurs have it over Villa. The other big factor in play is that if MANC win UCL, I believe all of the European qualifying positions drop down an additional spot. So UCL would go to spots 2-5, UEL 6-7, and UCOL 8.

All 3 teams have pretty brutal stretches, and Brighton play Villa to end the season. Remaining schedules:

Spurs:
@Villa (8)
Brentford (9)
@Leeds (19)

Brighton:
@Arsenal (2)
@ Newcastle (3)
Southampton (20)
MANC (1)
@Villa (8)

Villa:
Spurs (6)
@Liverpool (5)
Brighton (7)

If Brighton finish ahead of Spurs, it will be earned, as they play the top 3 and hopefully finish with a Villa side fighting for a European spot (just not Tottenham's!).

Here's my take on Spurs' outcomes:
9 points - finish ahead of BHA
7 points - 50-50 whether BHA squeezes by them. GD very much in play.
6 points - BHA 70-30 to finish ahead.
5 points - BHA >80% to finish ahead.
4 points - BHA >90% to finish ahead.
3 points - I'll drink 3 pints.
2 points - "I want to thank Ryan for guiding the club and I have relieved him of his duties. Zososoxfan has been appointed as manager. We all wish Zoso the best of luck. COYS, Daniel."
1 point - Burn it down.
0 points - Burn it down and rename the club, Spursy AF FC.
 

Morgan's Magic Snowplow

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City winning the CL will not change the number of CL qualifying positions.

I think you are too pessimistic about Spurs' chances of finishing ahead of Brighton, who could very easily only pick up 3-6 points the rest of the way with that schedule.
 

Zososoxfan

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City winning the CL will not change the number of CL qualifying positions.

I think you are too pessimistic about Spurs' chances of finishing ahead of Brighton, who could very easily only pick up 3-6 points the rest of the way with that schedule.
Ah thanks for the correction. But didn't that happen a couple of seasons ago? With Spurs no less?

And I'll tolerate no logic when it comes to Spurs. I take my fandom with a whimsical shot of pessimism, thank you.
 

Morgan's Magic Snowplow

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Ah thanks for the correction. But didn't that happen a couple of seasons ago? With Spurs no less?

And I'll tolerate no logic when it comes to Spurs. I take my fandom with a whimsical shot of pessimism, thank you.
Spurs once got screwed (2011-12 season) when Chelsea won the CL while finishing 6th in the PL. Under the old rules, this took a CL spot away from Spurs (who had finished 4th) as you could have a max of four. They then changed the rule so that in this scenario five spots would be awarded. But this only holds for a scenario in which the CL winner finishes out of the 1-4 places domestically. If the CL winner finishes in a CL qualifying spot, nothing changes (this happened for example when Chelsea won CL in 20-21 while finishing 4th and when Liverpool won CL in 18-19 while finishing 2nd).
 

Kliq

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City winning the CL will not change the number of CL qualifying positions.

I think you are too pessimistic about Spurs' chances of finishing ahead of Brighton, who could very easily only pick up 3-6 points the rest of the way with that schedule.
Yep. at the surface level it would seem tough for Spurs to catch Brighton given Brighton has two games in hand, but the Brighton schedule is brutal and it's very possible they get nothing from the game against Arsenal, Newcastle and City. Spurs do have to on the road to Leeds and Villa, but those aren't impossible games to win.
 

OCST

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Yep. at the surface level it would seem tough for Spurs to catch Brighton given Brighton has two games in hand, but the Brighton schedule is brutal and it's very possible they get nothing from the game against Arsenal, Newcastle and City. Spurs do have to on the road to Leeds and Villa, but those aren't impossible games to win.
I'm still buzzing from yesterday, which is the best I've ever seen Everton play, and I don't want to detract from them. But I think Brighton are starting to come back to earth a bit, on the evidence not only of the Everton game but also their recent game against Forest and the other times I've got them. I don't think it's anything more nuanced than fatigue and injury. The length of the season is a brutal leveler. Mitoma has slowed down, Mac Allister had to run to the end of the world cup and he's not looking as fresh, gross actually pulled up lame late against Everton, grabbing his hammy.
 

Zososoxfan

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I'm still buzzing from yesterday, which is the best I've ever seen Everton play, and I don't want to detract from them. But I think Brighton are starting to come back to earth a bit, on the evidence not only of the Everton game but also their recent game against Forest and the other times I've got them. I don't think it's anything more nuanced than fatigue and injury. The length of the season is a brutal leveler. Mitoma has slowed down, Mac Allister had to run to the end of the world cup and he's not looking as fresh, gross actually pulled up lame late against Everton, grabbing his hammy.
Balance that with the fact that they outplayed and ultimately got the winner against United though. Should be a fun finish. If they grab 6 points and lose the other 3, that still puts a fair amount of onus on our slapdick Spurs.