The Game Goat Thread: Week 16 at the Jets

[SeoulSoxFan]

No, Slater is not the goat.
He does not play defense that let Jets march down 80 yards for a score.
He is not Logan Ryan, who got torched by Marshall all game.
He is not Edelman, Amendola, McCourty, Chung, or Vollmer.

The goat is that it was a tough divisional matchup on the road. Yet Brady played inspirational 4th Qtr. football just to tie the game.

Least upsetting loss in a long time.

 

[H78]

Goat is Nink for not looking UP.

But even then, he's barely a goat. They played hard and it was closer than I thought it'd be. They're gonna roll people when they're healthy at skill positions in January.

 

[( . ) ( . ) and (_!_)]

Meh a lot of starters not starting and it still took a flukey overtime for the team to lose.

I don't like seeing the team limping into the playoffs but I'd still take a heathy pats teams vs the playoffs field at any stadium in America

 

[SeoulSoxFan]

@MikeGarafolo Slater says Belichick told them to kick off. Only confusion was whether they got to choose direction.

@MikeGarafolo Slater says he checked a few times with Belichick to make sure he wanted to kick if they won the toss. "There's not much to it."

@MikeReiss Matthew Slater says coach instructed Patriots to kick off at start of overtime. The only confusion was which direction they were kicking.

@cpriceNFL Slater says he double- & triple-checked with Belichick.

 

[smokin joe wood]

I didn't think Logan got 'torched all game'. Marshall made some tough catches. The third down defense and offense likely lost this game. Thompkins getting open repeatedly is a good reminder that the Pats don't have a reliable 3rd CB yet.

OL health and Edelman/Amendola will solve many issues.

Richards was probably the worst player on the field for the Pats from what I saw.

 

[dbn]

I asked in game thread but didn't get an answer. I'm out of market so wasn't watching. Who were playing on the O-line at the end of the game?

 

[SeoulSoxFan]

@RyanHannable The Jets are yelling around the locker room making fun of the Patriots for kicking to start OT

No problem with Jets celebrating a critical win. Next game at Buffalo will be epic.

 

[ShaneTrot]

Was the long completion in overtime the result of a pick? I never got a good angle to see it.

 

[Mystic Merlin]

The goat is the injury to Vollmer, which would appear to be season-ending based on the fact he was carted off.

Their tackle situation could hardly be worse.

 

[Byrdbrain]

I asked in game thread but didn't get an answer. I'm out of market so wasn't watching. Who were playing on the O-line at the end of the game?

L to R: Cannon, Stork, Andrews, Jackson, Fleming

 

[JohnnyK]

No pick, Wilson ran into Johnson.

 

[dbn]

L to R: Cannon, Stork, Andrews, Jackson, Fleming

Thanks.

 

[86spike]

The goat is the injury to Vollmer, which would appear to be season-ending based on the fact he was carted off.

Their tackle situation could hardly be worse.

NE and Denver could be the 1 and 2 seeds in the AFC and may also have dogfight competition to determine which has the worse Tackles in the conference. Crazy bad injury luck for both units.

 

[CaptainLaddie]

This has been the strangest day of football in a while.

 

[shawnrbu]

Bill Belichick

You have the best QB in the NFL and you declined to give him a chance to win you the game in OT.

Turtling prior to the 1st Half was also a poor decision.

 

[Tony C]

Gutsy loss -- feel good about this team after that game. Goats? Not really feeling that, but maybe the Brown, Branch, Siliga, Hicks rotation that has been so strong but really got gashed today.

 

[PseuFighter]

just to be clear, they've done this before:

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap2000000287894/article/bill-belichick-explains-why-patriots-took-wind-in-ot-win

 

[scotian1]

I vote for BB for having no faith in the offense at the end of the first half or in overtime.

 

[rodderick]

Coaches refused to give the offense a shot to win the game. The give up drive to end the first half with 1:53 on the clock and two timeouts was inexcusable. Kicking the ball off in overtime after the offense puts a drive together to tie the game late makes zero sense, unless the elements were a MUCH bigger factor. Unnecessary caution.

 

[j44thor]

Goat would be the coaches not getting James White more than 5 touches and flip flopping Ryan/Butler in coverage. Last matchup was Ryan on Decker and Butler on Marshall. No idea why they switched them this time but it clearly didn't work.

 

[Eddie Jurak]

But they didn't take the wind, they elected to kick (and then the Jets elected to take the wind). Big difference, and one that makes no sense whatsoever.

 

[Hoodie Sleeves]

Goat would be the coaches not getting James White more than 5 touches and flip flopping Ryan/Butler in coverage. Last matchup was Ryan on Decker and Butler on Marshall. No idea why they switched them this time but it clearly didn't work.

The defense worked fine - they held the opponent to 20 points and provided 7 points on their own despite an anemic offence giving the Jets good field position and many possesssions.


This loss is completely on the offense, who scored 6 points in the first 56 minutes of the game. The O-Line is terrible, the receivers are terrible, and Brady is doing a combination of holding onto the ball too long, and forcing it into bad coverages. It's mostly caused by injuries, but there's not much to be done.

Blaming the defense is lazy.

(and yes, Belichick is being way too conservative - the 1:53 before the half was criminal, and the 33 seconds in the second half was really short, but a couple things go right and that's enough to score a field goal. Going conservative only makes sense if you have a huge talent advantage, and with the injuries, they don't)

 

[DeadlySplitter]

Shame defense let down BB in OT. Way too many bad run, YAC plays allowed

Gronk and Sheard get my ups for the week

Let the Jets be cocky heading into Foxboro and see what happens

 

[ShaneTrot]

All went the Jets way today and they still went to OT. Would love to see the Pats play these guys in the Razer in the play offs. What are the odds that the Jets lose to Buffalo next week?

 

[steveluck7]

Fouts. It's always Fouts.
It seemed pretty obvious what the confusion on the OT flip was and he just ran with a completely ridiculous idea. You'd figure someone working the broadcast would have half a brain and explain what happened. Instead, they came back from commercial and doubled down

 

[ragnarok725]

Coaches refused to give the offense a shot to win the game. The give up drive to end the first half with 1:53 on the clock and two timeouts was inexcusable. Kicking the ball off in overtime after the offense puts a drive together to tie the game late makes zero sense, unless the elements were a MUCH bigger factor. Unnecessary caution.

Fully agree with this. I usually like to give BB the benefit of the doubt, but you've gotta trust the offense enough to not lose you the game, even if you don't believe they'll win it for you. The give-up drive was maddening, and then replicated by kicking the ball away in OT.

 

[BigSoxFan]

As bad as the offense looked, at the end of the day I'd rather give Brady and Kowski boys a chance to win it. I always wanted Bird to take the game winning shot and I always want Brady to get the ball with a chance to win.

Now that we lost, I think we're all rightfully scared of the OL going forward. Even if Dola/Edelman come back 100%, it might not matter if Brady is getting swarmed every play. Obviously, we'd be more effective in the short passing game with those guys, which would help. The defense should be fine and they played another solid game. Hopefully things break right and we get home field throughout the playoffs. It won't be easy for anyone in the AFC to go into Foxboro and win.

 

[ragnarok725]

All went the Jets way today and they still went to OT. Would love to see the Pats play these guys in the Razer in the play offs. What are the odds that the Jets lose to Buffalo next week?

Disagree that everything went the Jets' way. They had a number of inexcusable drops and near-misses on wide open deep balls that would have made the game lopsided. On the scoop and score, a Jets player had a chance to fall on the ball and it squirted out.

Not saying the Pats were lucky per se, but I wouldn't say everything in this game fell the Jets' way.

 

[Al Zarilla]

Bill Belichick

You have the best QB in the NFL and you declined to give him a chance to win you the game in OT.

Turtling prior to the 1st Half was also a poor decision.

I agree with this post. Hey Bill, come on, man!

 

[Silverdude2167]

I went into this game afraid of meeting the Jets in the playoffs and left the game feeling like if they meet the Jets in the playoffs they will roll them.

The Jets could not get constant pressure when the Pats were down two LT's for more than one drive, the Jets put up 3 points when the Pats decided to play more than a very basic defense (excluding overtime, which was due to two rub routes working well.) The Jets barely beat a team that was very injured and should be much healthier in the postseason.

If the Pats face the Jets in the postseason, I will be confident.

 

[TheoShmeo]

I also put this game on Bill.

Because it was Bill, I tried hard to rationalize and understand the decision. After all, he is the best coach/manager in sports.

So I guess the idea is that the D is playing well and it's harder for them to go 80 yards for 6 than it its for us to go to the 30-35 for 3. Makes some sense.

But stop thinking so fucking hard and give Tom Fucking Brady the ball.

 

[Hoodie Sleeves]

Now that we lost, I think we're all rightfully scared of the OL going forward. Even if Dola/Edelman come back 100%, it might not matter if Brady is getting swarmed every play.

I don't think the line matters nearly as much as Edelman does - Brady's release time has gone up almost a second since those two started missing games (and the O-line was already in pretty tough shape at that point). Before that he was getting swarmed, but he was getting the ball out fast because there were always guys open.

Martin did a pretty decent job, but LaFell doesn't seem to be able to get open quickly at all.

 

[schillzilla]

All went the Jets way today and they still went to OT. Would love to see the Pats play these guys in the Razer in the play offs. What are the odds that the Jets lose to Buffalo next week?

Not sure I agree that all went the jets way. They had several open receivers that they just missed by inches. Not super easy plays, but certainly plays that could have been made. If the pats see them again, history says it will be close.

Damn - just wanted to make it through a game without another big injury

 

[DennyDoyle'sBoil]

You have to decide if your priority is to kick or if your priority is to pick the direction. If you win the toss and elect to kick, your opponent can choose direction. If you win the toss and elect direction, your opponent gets to choose kick/receive and can choose to kick. So if kicking is what you really want, then Slater did the right thing by prioritizing kick. If you are agnostic about kicking or receiving, or you are certain your opponent will choose to receive then you should choose direction first, but if you do that you risk your opponent will choose to kick and you will have outsmarted yourself.

The only "mistake" here was Slater thinking even if he followed BB's direction, he could ALSO choose direction. If he had chosen direction, the Jets could have elected to kick. Doubt that would have happened. But if kicking was the priority, Slater was not permitted to also pick direction and it went exactly the way it should have.

I think what BB probably wanted was to choose direction, assuming the Jets would then choose to receive but who knows if that was communicated to Slater.

 

[H78]

Get Edelman back next week in Miami (who could use some game time anyways), win, and none of this matters. The only goats from today's game would be anyone who are the goats in next week's game, because if they blow it next week then they should have done more to win it this week.

This team is going to go 13-3 and be the #1 seed. Rest easy.

 

[DegenerateSoxFan]

If Belichick really wanted to kick, then he's the goat all the way. I get that they were holding things together with spit and baling wire, but give TFB the goddamn ball. End of first half was inexplicable. I really wanted them to be able to put everyone important under bubble wrap next week.

Edit: And if Vollmer is really hurt, Stork will be at tackle for certain, with Andrews at center.

 

[BigSoxFan]

I still don't understand the end of the first half decision. Down only 7 points and get the ball to start the 2nd half. This is a team that almost never gets blown out and shows fight nearly every time they see a double digit deficit. In a game where you knew possessions would be at a premium, it was very strange to see the Pats turtle.

 

[Ralphwiggum]

Keep in mind they only got points on the last drive of regulation because they converted two do-or-die fourth downs. In a normal game situation they punt there.

Maybe I'm the only one who watched a game in which the Pats o-line was allowing free rushers way, way too often, and Brady had nobody to throw to on the plays in which he got protection. I didn't have an issue with the knee at the end of the first half and regulation. I probably would have taken the ball in OT but the decision isn't the reason they lost.

No goats for me. They need to figure out a rotation on the o-line that is at least serviceable and they desperately need Edelman and Amendola back if they have any shot of doing anything in the playoffs. Tough loss, but health of some key players is basically the only thing that matters at this point.

 

[soxhop411]

“@kguregian: According to a source, Sebastian Vollmer is ”hopeful it’s a sprain“ but will know more after tests tomorrow”

 

[Corsi]

I vote for BB for having no faith in the offense at the end of the first half or in overtime.

They scored one touchdown all game. Why should he have had confidence in the offense?

They were far more likely to be able to stop the Jets and muster enough of a drive to kick a game-winning field goal.

 

[H78]

I really wanted them to be able to put everyone important under bubble wrap next week.

I don't know. I think three weeks off is too long for key players. Remember how poorly they played in the first half against a very mediocre Baltimore team in the Divisional Round last year? I think things like that happen when you give guys too much time to get out of "football shape," so to say. When you remove someone from the speed and intensity of the game that long I think it takes them a little while to readjust.

Two weeks is fine (and even then, sometimes you see a little rust), but I want to see some guys play, take a week off to rest, then get right back at it. Playing, taking a week off, then another week off, then playing seems to take some guys out of any rhythm they established throughout the season.

 

[rodderick]

They scored one touchdown all game. Why should he have had confidence in the offense?

They were far more likely to be able to stop the Jets and muster enough of a drive to kick a game-winning field goal.

If they receive the ball and punt they still have a chance of stopping the Jets and kicking a game winning field goal. There's a reason why even teams with weak offenses never kick off in OT.

 

[H78]

They scored one touchdown all game. Why should he have had confidence in the offense?

They were far more likely to be able to stop the Jets and muster enough of a drive to kick a game-winning field goal.

This. This is what they were trying to do and I get it. It just didn't work out like they had hoped, though I think it was a worthwhile gamble.

Also, Brady was getting hit a lot. Look at the bright side: you didn't have that Jets DL coming after Brady, fighting for their playoff lives, in a 5th quarter. You want to win, but sometimes it's better to take what could be a meaningless loss and get your key players home healthy for what's important.

 

[Jed Zeppelin]

I don't think the line matters nearly as much as Edelman does - Brady's release time has gone up almost a second since those two started missing games (and the O-line was already in pretty tough shape at that point). Before that he was getting swarmed, but he was getting the ball out fast because there were always guys open.

Martin did a pretty decent job, but LaFell doesn't seem to be able to get open quickly at all.

Was going to post the exact same thing. Edelman is open in no time and generally makes the first guy miss to make up for not running many downfield routes. Amendola can replicate it, but Martin is a step down and Lafell simply isn't that kind of player.

Wish they did more to get White the ball in space. Our best offensive plays were in the middle of the field, needed to do more to get White out there against linebackers.

 

[Dollar]

The players weren't great today, but they definitely showed some fight after falling behind by a couple touchdowns. I place the blame on the coaching staff for this loss. The offensive play-calling in the first half was terrible, they just laid down with plenty of time and timeouts before the half when a few points would have been huge, and they never made the proper adjustments to stop the inside run game and the short crossing patterns that killed them all day. Rest up and destroy Miami and it doesn't even matter.

 

[Al Zarilla]

They scored one touchdown all game. Why should he have had confidence in the offense?

They were far more likely to be able to stop the Jets and muster enough of a drive to kick a game-winning field goal.

Why not take the ball, move it enough to get a field goal, kick off, and then strangle the Jets' offense? When you flat out give the ball to any decent team, they can muster one TD drive, which we saw. As for wind, the flow goes:

Kick or receive? NE kicks.
Direction? Jets picked the wind at their back.

Pats got the worst of both.

 

[H78]

Why not take the ball, move it enough to get a field goal, kick off, and then strangle the Jets' offense? When you flat out give the ball to any decent team, they can muster one TD drive, which we saw. As for wind, the flow goes:

Kick or receive? NE kicks.
Direction? Jets picked the wind at their back.

Pats got the worst of both.

I think that's where there was a mistake. It wasn't possession related, it was them thinking they could pick the direction, but apparently could not.

 

[lexrageorge]

Makeshift OL was a problem all game. Brady never had any time to find his receivers. It's been a concern for a few games now; I'm not as confident as others that simply getting Edelman/Amendola back will solve all those issues. But there's also nothing that can be done about it.

I don't care if the Pats win or lose against Miami; I'd much rather sit Brady and accept the #2 seed than take any more unnecessary hits at this point. I realize that will be sacrilege to some, but I hate meaningless games in Week 17. I'll hate meaningless games in Week 19 even more once Goodell gets his way....

 

[alydar]

Given the very conservative play calling, such as the end of the first half and not wanting the ball to start OT, might have made sense to go for 2 after the 'tying' TD. Either way the game ends in regulation that way. So I guess that is a backhanded goat to Belichick.

 

[Super Nomario]

NE and Denver could be the 1 and 2 seeds in the AFC and may also have dogfight competition to determine which has the worse Tackles in the conference. Crazy bad injury luck for both units.

Let's not forgot Pittsburgh, too, who are down Beachum and Mike Adams. Tough to argue tackle is a premium position these days.